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Deseret News Exclusive: ABC '20/20' special on 'Heaven' will include Mormon perspective [Surprises?]
Deseret News ^ | July 3, 2012 | Jeff Benedict

Posted on 07/04/2012 1:09:48 PM PDT by Colofornian

Mitt Romney's presidential bid has generated unprecedented interest in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, prompting the media to dub this the "Mormon moment."

This week, the church will open up on network television's biggest stage about the subject of heaven.

The church dispatched Elder William R. Walker, a general authority who oversees the temple department, to New York City for a historic sit-down interview with Barbara Walters near the Manhattan Temple last month. The interview will be part of a two-hour special titled "Heaven: Where is it? How do we get there?" that will air on ABC stations throughout the country Friday night at 8 p.m. MDT.

The "Heaven" special originally aired back in December 2005 and featured interviews with religious leaders from virtually all of the leading world religions. But the LDS Church was not among those featured.

With nine out of 10 Americans claiming to believe in heaven, the show was one of the most-watched programs in the history of network television.

"We felt the program was so good and so strong we wanted to rerun it," Walters said. "And with Gov. Romney running for president, we felt it was very important to include the Mormon point of view this time."

Elder Walker definitely delivered the Mormon point of view in a wide-ranging exchange with Walters that covered everything from what goes on in Mormon temples to the practice of baptizing for the dead to the concept of eternal marriage. The interview was groundbreaking and showcases the Mormon faith to millions of Americans through a mainstream television program. It also marks the first time that Walters has interviewed a Mormon about Mormonism.

(Excerpt) Read more at deseretnews.com ...


TOPICS: Current Events; Other non-Christian; Religion & Politics; Theology
KEYWORDS: abc; heaven; lds; mormon
From the article: Mitt Romney's presidential bid has generated unprecedented interest in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, prompting the media to dub this the "Mormon moment." This week, the church will open up on network television's biggest stage about the subject of heaven...The interview will be part of a two-hour special titled "Heaven: Where is it? How do we get there?" that will air on ABC stations throughout the country Friday night at 8 p.m. MDT. The "Heaven" special originally aired back in December 2005 and featured interviews with religious leaders from virtually all of the leading world religions. But the LDS Church was not among those featured. With nine out of 10 Americans claiming to believe in heaven, the show was one of the most-watched programs in the history of network television. "We felt the program was so good and so strong we wanted to rerun it," Walters said. "And with Gov. Romney running for president, we felt it was very important to include the Mormon point of view this time."
1 posted on 07/04/2012 1:09:58 PM PDT by Colofornian
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To: Colofornian

who cares? I don’t.


2 posted on 07/04/2012 1:10:57 PM PDT by Perdogg
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To: Perdogg

Why didn’t media care about Harry Reid being a Mormon? Oh, because he is a Dem?


3 posted on 07/04/2012 1:13:42 PM PDT by shalom aleichem
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To: Colofornian
Up

By Jesus

No other way, no other One.

And it IS that simple.

4 posted on 07/04/2012 1:13:46 PM PDT by knarf (I say things that are true ... I have no proof ... but they're true)
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To: Colofornian

this is just objective journalism at work. Don’t you remember when they ran specials on Jeremiah Wright’s perspectives?


5 posted on 07/04/2012 1:15:12 PM PDT by the invisib1e hand (A Dalmation was spotted wagging its tail.)
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To: All
From the article: Elder Walker definitely delivered the Mormon point of view in a wide-ranging exchange with Walters that covered everything from what goes on in Mormon temples to the practice of baptizing for the dead to the concept of eternal marriage. The interview was groundbreaking and showcases the Mormon faith to millions of Americans through a mainstream television program. It also marks the first time that Walters has interviewed a Mormon about Mormonism.

Sounds to me like "Elder Walker" soft-pedaled "baptism of the dead"...But Mormon "heaven" theology involves a LOT more intricacies than that!!!!

And, unfortunately, while Barbara Walters may be well-known for her interviewing skills, frankly when it comes to bizarre religions -- she and her ABC journalistic research team simply lacks competence.

Therefore, there won't be much -- if ANYTHING -- "surprising" in what you might see on the ABC show this week.

Therefore, I have brought to you...

THE TOP TEN MOST SURPRISING 'MORMON TEACHINGS' ABOUT MORMON HEAVEN and AFTER-LIFE (Most of which Barbara Walters would have flunked in covering for this week's special)!!!

RANK

SURPRISING MORMON AFTERLIFE BELIEF

EXPLANATION/SOURCE

10. Upon death, ALL -- Mormon and non-Mormon alike -- enter a godless intermediate place called the "spirit world." This Mormon "spirit world" is "the place of residence for all those who have died and are awaiting the resurrection and the inseparable connection of their spirits and bodies. Thus, it is not the place where God the Father, the resurrected Lord, and other resurrected beings dwell. Rather, it is an intermediate condition or state where people await the resurrection—a sphere where disembodied spirits live in one of several conditions according to what their mortal lives have merited." (Source: The Spirit World, Our Next Home -- official magazine of the Mormon church, published December of 1977 by Dale C. Mouritsen) Also: Note that where you live -- ghetto-wise in this "spirit world" -- depends upon mere merit. (See also #4 below for more on "merit" status)
9. This Mormon 'spirit world' is actually tied to this earth, where Mormon "missionaries" earthlings die and then become Mormon "spirit missionaries" on the other side of death The Mormon spirit world is "on this earth." Lds "prophet" Ezra Taft Benson declared that “the spirit world is not far away. Sometimes the veil between this life and the life beyond becomes very thin." (Source: The Spirit World, Our Next Home -- official magazine of the Mormon church, published December of 1977 by Dale C. Mouritsen). This Mormon "spirit world" is no place of rest as the Bible describes heaven. Yup, for Mormons "...the spirit world is the place where disembodied spirits go. It is a tangible, substantial sphere incorporated with our earth, the focal point of a massive missionary effort in which we share." (Source: The Spirit World, Our Next Home -- official magazine of the Mormon church, published December of 1977 by Dale C. Mouritsen). Thus, Lds get to continue to earn their way to heaven by trying to bump up others along the way -- becoming "saviors" in the process! See #8 for more on this!
8. And where does Baptism of the dead intersect with the alleged activity of disembodied Mormon "spirit missionaries?" Those spirit missionaries are going to those in temporary spirit prison to tell them they've been proxy baptized, which, in turn fulfills the very purpose of EVERY Mormon coming to planet earth from the planet Kolob. And what was that purpose, per Lds third "prophet" John Taylor -- as repeated in an official LDS church book published in 2001? 'Twas simple: "We came here to be saviors. 'What, saviors?' 'Yes.' 'Why, we thought there was only one Savior.' 'Oh, yes, there a great many.'" Source of Taylor quote: Deseret News, Feb. 11, 1873, as quoted in 2001 in the official Lds church book, Teachings of Presidents of the Church: John Taylor, p. 187 (For similar such quotes that regard Mormons as competing "saviors" to Jesus Christ, see: Are Mormon people LITERAL saviors of dead Jews, others?)
7. Mormon leaders tell us hell's going to be cancelled like some bad Fall TV program. Hence, Mormon baptism of the dead then becomes a sort of 'get out of hell' card (into a low-degree of heaven) -- like Monopoly's 'Get out of jail card.' The wicked go to "spirit prison," which is not eternal hell. Mormon leaders tell us hell's going to "...hell...is a temporary state in which spirits will be taught the gospel and have the opportunity to repent and accept ordinances for them that are performed." (Official Lds publication, True to the Faith, 2004, p. 81) Boy is that getting out of hell free or what? Or how about Doctrine & Covenants 19:16-18, which says that hell/outer darkness is for the few? Yet they are still "saved": "After suffering in full for their sins they will be allowed to inherit the lowest degree of glory which is the telestial kingdom. The hell in the spirit world will not continue forever." (Official Lds publication, Gospel Principles, p. 280)
6. The Book of Mormon is actually closer to the Bible on describing the eternality of hell than current Mormon teachings!!! * Helaman 6:28 and Moroni 8:13 in the Book of Mormon describe hell as being "everlasting" and "endless." * Mormon leaders, why does Mosiah 2:38-39 in the Book of Mormon say hell is a never-ending torment? An unquenchable fire? * Why does the Mormon book within the Book of Mormon describe a condition as a “misery that NEVER dies”??? (Mormon 8:38) * Why does Alma 42:16 in the Book of Mormon say that eternal punishment is as eternal as the life of the soul? [Since the life of the soul is NOT temporary, what implications does that leave?] * Why does Alma 34:32-35 in the Book of Mormon say there's no second chance: For behold THIS LIFE is the time for men to prepare to meet God...do not procrastinate the day of your repentance until the end; for after this day of life...then cometh the night of darkness wherein THERE CAN BE NO LABOR PERFORMED. Ye CANNOT say, when ye are brought to that awful crisis, that I will reprent, that I will return to my God. Nay, ye CANNOT say this; for that same spirit which doth possess your bodies at the time that ye go out of this life, that same spirit will have power to possess your body in that eternal world. (I cited parts of vv. 32-34) [Please see also Alma 12:24 that says that "life is a time to prepare for eternal state after resurrection" -- not the after life!!!] * Why does both Mosiah 16:11 & 1 Nephi 15:35 in the Book of Mormon say there's only TWO destinations post-death (not a third called "spirit prison"). And the BoM knows only heaven & hell -- no temporary spirit prison (Mormn 9:23; Ether 4:18; Hel. 14:18-19; Alma 3:26; Alma 40:26; 2 Nephi 2:28-29; 2 Nephi 9:16; Alma 41:4; 3 Nephi 27:11,17; 2 Nephi 28:21-22). * Very early in Joseph Smith's theology, Joseph did an "about face" on the eternality of hell and tried to claim that hell was described as "eternal" because God was eternal; that hell was described as "everlasting" because God was everlasting. IOW, he tried to change it to an adjective description of God -- of the type of punishment. But we have other verses in the Book of Mormon -- like Helaman 7:16 -- where it just doesn't "work" as an adjective: "Yea, how could you have given way to the enticing of him who is seeking to hurl away your souls down to everlasting misery and endless wo." Is "wo" just a "type" of wo because of who issued it? Sorry...'tis quite plain -- and you can't play with words...Anybody speaking plain English would interpret the above as "without end." Don’t you get the feeling that Mormon leader propaganda has the effect that even their BoM verses are subject to scissors – being cut out – if it doesn’t fit with what their leaders say?
5. "Eternal life" is redefined to be an exclusive term that applies to temple Mormons ONLY! "Eternal life" is thus reserved for legalistically abiding Mormons ONLY. "Eternal life" does NOT = ALL living forever with Heavenly Father; 'tis ONLY applies for those who EARN exaltation...and "exaltation" is a Mormon by-word for becoming a god!Hence, to the Mormon, resurrection alone does not = eternal life. Yes, Mormons believe that just about all people become immortal due to the resurrection. But "eternal life" is ONLY for those who live in the presence of Heavenly Father -- and become "gods" themselves (what Mormons call "exaltation"...To Mormons, "exaltation" and "eternal life" are interchangeable terms...but "eternal life" and heaven-as-a-residence for non-Mormons are not interchangeable terms..."eternal life" is ONLY for Mormons! * Eternal life is a term which always means ‘exaltation,’ when used in the Scriptures (John 3:15; Romans 6:23; 1 John 1:2; 2 Nephi 2:28; D&C 5:22; 18:8; 131:5; 138:51; Moses 1:39).” (David R. Ridges, Mormon Beliefs and Doctrines Made Easier, p. 88) Sub-title: “WHAT IS EXALTATION? Exaltation is eternal life, the kind of life that God lives.” (Older 1970s version, p. 289) * ”Exaltation is a synonym for eternal life. Exaltation comes only to those who inherit the highest degree within the celestial kingdom…it consists in the continuation of the family unit throughout eternity; it is the type of life that is lived by our Heavenly Father.” (Daniel H. Ludlow, A Companion to Your Study of the Doctrines and Covenants, 2:85) * Exaltation is eternal life, the kind of life God lives. He lives in great glory. He is perfect. He possesses all knowledge, and all wisdom. He is the Father of spirit children. He is a creator. We can become like our Heavenly Father. This is exaltation.” (Gospel Principles, 1997, p. 302) * “Eternal life…In fact…means exaltation. He who receives the greatest portion of eternal life becomes a God.” (Milton R. Hunter, an LDS Seventy, The Gospel Through the Ages, p. 11) * Exaltation means godhood, creatorship. ‘As man now is, God once was; as God now is, man may be (The Teachings of Spencer W. Kimball, p. 53) * “Exaltation is the greatest of all the gifts and attainments possible. It is available only in the highest degree of the Celestial Kingdom and is reserved for members of the Church of the Firstborn. This exalted status, called eternal life, is available to be received by a man and a wife. It means not only living in God’s presence, but receiving power to do as God does, including the power to bear children after the resurrection.” (Encyclopedia of Mormonism, 2:479 Quote for resurrection alone not = 'eternal life': * “…resurrection alone does not qualify us for eternal life in the presence of God…we need His grace to purify and perfect us ‘after all we can do’ (2 Nephi 25:23).” (Truth to the Faith: A Gospel Reference, Intellectual Reserve, 2004, p. 77)
4. Trusting in Jesus Christ and relating to Jesus Christ for the Mormon thereby only amounts to what your life MERITS. Yup. You're ONLY a cosmic Boy Scout! The final quote in the previous row was: “…resurrection alone does not qualify us for eternal life in the presence of God…we need His grace to purify and perfect us ‘after all we can do’ (2 Nephi 25:23).” (Truth to the Faith: A Gospel Reference, Intellectual Reserve, 2004, p. 77) Hence -- for MORMONS -- heaven isn't a gift...it's based upon "all you can do" and merits: * Each of us has been sent to earth by our Heavenly Father to merit eternal life (Lds apostle Robert D. Hales, “Personal Revelation: The Teachings and Examples of the Prophets,” Ensign (Conference Edition), Nov. 1985, p. 20) * “…immortality is to live forever in the resurrected state, and by the grace of God all men will gain this unending continuance of life. But ONLY THOSE who obey the fullness of the gospel law will inherit eternal life. (D&C 29:43-44)…it is the kind, status, type, and quality of life that God himself enjoys. Thus those who gain eternal life receive exaltation; they are sons of God, joint-heirs with Christ…they overcome all things, have all power, and receive the fullness of the Father. THEY ARE GODS.” McConkie, p. 237, 1979 ed. [My note: Of course, McConkie cites D&C 29:43-44…but these verses say no such thing…v. 43 actually says that ”immortality unto eternal life” is given to ”as many as would BELIEVE”…’shifty’ McConkie…trying to pull a rabbit when no hat exists] * “The…gift of eternal life…is conditional. In order to qualify, one must deny oneself of ungodliness and honor the ordinance and covenants of the temple.” (Lds apostle Russell M. Nelson, “Divine Love,” Ensign, Feb. 2003, p. 24 * "Very gladly would the Lord give to everyone eternal life, but since that blessing can come only on MERIT -- through the faithful performance of duty - ONLY those who are WORTHY shall receive it." (Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, 2:5) These citations are outright heresy taught by heretics! If you don't believe Mormons teach you have to "work" for eternal life vs. Jesus giving it to us NOW in a relationship with Him that starts now, then may I suggest you first read John 17:3 -- and then compare to these above citations from Lds leaders! For another thread on this topic, please see: what qualifies people to live with heavenly father for all eternity? (MormonISM - open)
3. If you qualify for Mormon full grown-up godhood status, you will have everything that our Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ have—all power, glory, dominion, and knowledge. Yup...temple Lds believe they will have the SAME creative power their god, who was once a man, had; and that they will receive prayers as well as worship, glory, adoration, etc. Both the 2009 Lds Gospel Principles book -- see Exaltation (The Plan for Our Progression)-Mormon (OPEN)...and one who reaches out to Lds, Pastor Mark Cares, see “As man is God once was; as God is, man may become.” [Infamous couplet highlights Lds polytheism] ...highlight these five supposed "blessings" that temple Mormons ALONE are to receive: a. They will live eternally in the presence of Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ (see D&C 76:62). (My note: And this is for TEMPLE Mormons only...which, right now, is only 15-20% of all Mormons!) b. They will become gods (see D&C 132:20–23). (My note: See McConkie quote above as well) c. They will be united eternally with their righteous family members and will be able to have eternal increase. (My note: "Elder Walker" does discuss this on Barbara Walters' upcoming special...as Lds think this is some sort of trump card of their 'gospel' that's attractive) d. They will receive a fulness of joy. e. They will have everything that our Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ have—all power, glory, dominion, and knowledge (see D&C 132:19–20).” (Yup...temple Lds believe they will have the SAME creative power their god, who was once a man, had; will receive prayers; worship, glory, adoration, etc.)
2. You -- if you're a tithing married Mormon in good standing ONLY with the Mormon church -- get to not only be a 'god' -- but a god of your own world!!!!! (This, of course, includes eternal physical sex with either your wife or wives in order to propagate that world with 'spirit children') Some Mormons deny that Lds teach that you "get your own world as a god." For the scoop, see Mormon Professors Confuse Doctrine and Rumor (especially note post #5 of that thread) Here is a sample quotation from a Mormon "prophet": “To become like him we must have ALL the powers of godhood; thus a man and his wife when glorified will have spirit children who eventually will go on an EARTH LIKE THIS ONE WE ARE ON and pass through the same kind of experiences, being subject to mortal conditions, and if faithful, then they also will receive the fullness of exaltation and partake of the same blessings. There is no end to this development; it will go on forever. We will become gods and HAVE JURISDICTION OVER WORLDS, AND THESE WORLDS WILL BE PEOPLED BY OUR OWN OFFSPRING. WE WILL HAVE AN ENDLESS ETERNITY FOR THIS." Source: Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, 2:48, as cited by The Mormon Church’s annual Melchizedek Priesthood Personal Study Guide, 1978-79, p. 131
1. Mormon theology about heaven says it's a place -- at least for the 99% of people who would live there -- where Christians don't get to live with Heavenly Father forever!!!!! When Mormons talk about eternal life & exaltation, they're not just talking about "heaven" What's the "rest of the story"? * Mormons believe that only their “Melchizedek priests” (D&C 76:57) are the ones eligible for “dwell[ing] in the presence of God and his Christ forever and ever.” (D&C 76:62) In the Mormon view of heaven, ONLY those entering into Mormon "covenants" and obeying fully Mormon laws get to live forever in God's presence: * Eternal life is living with Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ in the celestial kingdom. This blessing--which is also called exaltation--comes only to those who keep the commandments and make the necessary covenants (Source: Preparing for Exaltation Teacher's Manual, p. 4, 1998) * ”Immortality is to live forever as a resurrected being. Through the Atonement of Jesus Christ, everyone will receive this gift. Eternal life, or exaltation, is to inherit a place in the highest degree of the celestial kingdom, where we will live in God’s presence and continue as families.” (same source, p. 52) * “’Eternal life’ is a higher state than immortality alone and means to live forever in a resurrected condition in the presence of God, and to become like God…Eternal life is exaltation into the type and quality of life that God lives. Receiving eternal life is conditional, predicated upon obedience to the fullness of gospel law and ordinances (D&C 29:43-44; 130:20-21). It requires voluntary obedience to all of the ordinances and principles of the gospel…continuing through…the covenants of the Endowment and marriage in the temple…” (Encyclopedia of Mormonism, 2:677-678)

6 posted on 07/04/2012 1:20:35 PM PDT by Colofornian (Saying Mitt would keep past political promises is like prophesying that Gumby won't bend anymore)
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To: All
In my previous (chart) post, I listed the #1 MOST SURPRISING 'MORMON TEACHINGS' ABOUT MORMON HEAVEN and AFTER-LIFE as being this:

Mormon theology about heaven says it's a place -- at least for the 99% of people who would live there -- where Christians don't get to live with Heavenly Father forever!!!!!

Hence, the "Mormon" view of heaven -- at least for the 99% of people who would live there -- means a Heavenly Fatherless "heaven."

Along these lines, here's a sample dialogue -- which you can utilize with a Mormon co-worker, relative, or acquaintance, to yield some clarification -- especially if they accuse you of "condemning them to hell":

JOE MORMON: "Why do you condemn me to hell?"

N. CHRISTIAN: "You believe in three degrees of glory, do you not?"

JOE MORMON: "You know I do."

N. CHRISTIAN: "And don't you therefore believe, that Jesus can reside in two of these three glories?"

JOE MORMON: "You know I do."

N. CHRISTIAN: "And how many of these glories does Heavenly Father reside in?"

JOE MORMON: "One. The celestial one."

N. CHRISTIAN: "Do Christians get to reside there?"

JOE MORMON. "No. Only members of the church of the Firstborn do."

N. CHRISTIAN: "And Christian churches. Do Mormon leaders regard them as part of the 'church of the firstborn?'"

JOE MORMON: "Uh, no. 'Fraid not. But, you'll still be saved. Just a different degree of glory."

N. CHRISTIAN: "And so you're telling me that 'salvation' in your eyes includes NEVER being reconciled to Heavenly Father? NEVER, EVER able to live in His Presence again = 'salvation'...equals 'heaven' to you??? REALLY???"

JOE MORMON (now looking for a place to hide, in a stumble-mumble): "Uh...Uh...Uh..."

N. CHRISTIAN: "Let me go 'on the record' here to make myself 'perfectly clear': Whatever you regard as part of the afterlife that excludes the Presence of Heavenly Father, you can take that Mormon ghettoized false-gospel of yours and you can shove it to hell where it belongs! If you consider a Heavenly Fatherless 'heaven' to be 'heaven,' I don't want it! If you consider a Heavenly Fatherless 'heaven' to be FUTURE ETERNAL 'salvation,' then that ain't it!"

N. CHRISTIAN (continuing): "You, Joe Mormon! You of all people! One who believes that EACH of us was spirit-born to Heavenly Father in the pre-existence. And who desires for us to be reconciled to Him. You, who puts such emphasis on the divine family! You actually deem it to be a 'family reunion' when the 'family reunion' excludes the ULTIMATE PATRIARCH of the Family! Wow! How offensive can your false gospel get???!!! After all, what's a 'Christian' who won't live with Heavenly Father eternally?" (See John 17:3)

7 posted on 07/04/2012 1:28:13 PM PDT by Colofornian (Saying Mitt would keep past political promises is like prophesying that Gumby won't bend anymore)
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To: shalom aleichem

Why didn’t media care about Harry Reid being a Mormon? Oh, because he is a Dem?


Yeah, i was thinking the same thing, why is the media ( the Children of hell ) by their own doctrine wondering about heaven.

Harry reed being a Mormon probably don,t count in the eyes of the media because he is that unimportant.


8 posted on 07/04/2012 1:34:37 PM PDT by ravenwolf
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To: Colofornian

I remember that exclusive 20/20 ran on Obama’s church. Oh, wait...that never happened.


9 posted on 07/04/2012 1:38:10 PM PDT by The Iceman Cometh (Proud Teabagging Barbarian Terrorist Hobbit Son-of-a-Bitch!)
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To: Colofornian
I advised way last Fall to be expecting this kind of attention from the whorehouse media this summer and Fall. I imagine this will be the opening chapter in a continuing campaign of hate against the Mormon Church.

In coming weeks we will be treated to the liberal view of Mormon marriage, temple secrets, history of racism, what ever other exotic minutiae they can exploit to make idiots think "Those Mormons--they're strange--not like us."

It will be instructive however to watch the liberal media, the bastions of "tolerance," play the politics of divisiveness and hate, and to use their own favorite drugstore paperback terminology, "fear of the other."

10 posted on 07/04/2012 1:40:48 PM PDT by hinckley buzzard
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To: Colofornian

What would ABC know about heaven? 99% of these religious shows are HIT PIECES. I never watch them anymore. I won’t be watching this one.


11 posted on 07/04/2012 1:40:48 PM PDT by faucetman ( Just the facts, ma'am, Just the facts)
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Oh good grief the THX 1138 march continues.


12 posted on 07/04/2012 1:46:10 PM PDT by svcw (If one living cell on another planet is life, why isn't it life in the womb?)
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To: Colofornian

I know next to nothing about Mormon’s or their religion but I do know Baba and ABC News - there is no way this will turn out well or, in Mitt’s favor.


13 posted on 07/04/2012 1:56:12 PM PDT by capydick (''Life's tough.......it's even tougher if you're stupid.'')
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To: capydick; All
I know next to nothing about Mormon’s or their religion but I do know Baba and ABC News - there is no way this will turn out well or, in Mitt’s favor.

Well, let's see. Barbara Walter's parents were refugees from the former Russian empire. And Mormons have baptized by proxy the ancestor of Jewish Holocaust victims and other European Jews.

What could go wrong when a Mormon rep talks about baptizing those (and other) who are deceased?

Since it was taped last month, I would have hoped that Barbara Walters could have somehow worked in the following analogy:

So if you were a Jewish mortician who got a network of worldwide morticians to circumcize dead people...to make them supposed afterlife Jews...why, they think they are doing a "good thing"...would they not? And who would know? (Therefore, in the book of those who claim "no-harm-no-foul" re: necro-baptism, what harm would they be doing?)

***************************

Discussing the "harm" of Mormons baptizing the dead:

Millions of Mormon man-hours -- Genealogy -- is rooted in baptizing dead people. Now, genealogy for "roots-searching" is fine, but when "genealogy as ultra time consuming religious obsession" takes over, wouldn't you say it might be good to consider what the apostle Paul has to say about this?

Or do some just want to ignore the New Testament?

...stay there in Ephesus so that you may command certain men not to teach false doctrines any longer nor to devote themselves to myths AND ENDLESS GENEALOGIES. THESE PROMOTE CONTROVERSIES RATHER THAN GOD'S WORK—which is by faith." (1 Timothy 1:3-4)

But AVOID FOOLISH CONTROVERSIES AND GENEALOGIES...because these are unprofitable and useless. (Titus 3:9)

(Paul says it's useless, provokes controversy, and is not faith-promoting. So even the controversy ignited by protagonist Mormons is distracting)

As for the question, "Does this 'hurt' anyone?" yes it does -- in two prominent ways...

(a) It hurts the living because over-focusing on the dead distracts what we can do in relating to & in caring for the living!.

We can all agree that Jesus talked much about serving the living -- the poor, the widow, the orphan, the lost sheep, right?

So what would happen in the world if all religions obsessed with the dead as much as Mormons do? Obviously, we're not going to "end poverty in our lifetime" (Jesus said, "the poor will always be with you")...but since countless LDS leaders have called the Mormon people self-saviors and saviors of the dead, it's not only a distraction from the poor but delusional.

(b) Since countless LDS leaders have called the Mormon people self-saviors and saviors of the dead, it's not only a distraction from the poor but delusional.

We already have a "Savior of the world" -- we don't need millions more trying to bump Jesus out of that limelight:
* And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent his Son to be THE Savior of the world. (1 John 4:14)
* They said to the woman, "We no longer believe just because of what you said; now we have heard for ourselves, and we know that this man really is THE Savior of the world." (John 4:42)

Last time I looked in the Bible, Christians were supposed to object to idolatry in their culture. And if you don't think that Mormons make baptizers of the dead "saviors" who rival Jesus Christ, you haven't read their leaders' comments on baptism of the dead. For those citations, see: Are Mormon people LITERAL saviors of dead Jews, others? (The OTHER World Series: Vanity)

If you're a Christian or Jew and you conclude "this doesn't harm anyone," you're catering to idolatry -- substitute "saviors" pretending to act in his name.

14 posted on 07/04/2012 2:18:49 PM PDT by Colofornian (Saying Mitt would keep past political promises is like prophesying that Gumby won't bend anymore)
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To: Colofornian
ABC '20/20' special on 'Heaven' will include Mormon perspective [Surprises?]

Why wait??

(Only about 15% of WORTHY Mormons will EVER get to the HIGHEST level of 'their' heaven, as they have NO TR card!)

15 posted on 07/04/2012 2:36:05 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Colofornian
Why wait??


HEAVEN-The Mormon church teaches there are three levels of heaven (three "degrees of glory"):


16 posted on 07/04/2012 2:37:54 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Colofornian


 

Temple Recommend Questions



1 Do you have faith in and a testimony of God the Eternal Father, His Son Jesus Christ, and the Holy Ghost?

2 Do you have a testimony of the Atonement of Christ and of His role as Savior and Redeemer?

3 Do you have a testimony of the restoration of the gospel in these the latter days?

4 Do you sustain the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as the Prophet, Seer, and Revelator and as the only person on the earth who possesses and is authorized to exercise all priesthood keys? Do you sustain members of the First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles as prophets, seers, and revelators? Do you sustain the other General Authorities and local authorities of the Church?

5 Do you live the law of chastity?

6 Is there anything in your conduct relating to members of your family that is not in harmony with the teachings of the Church?

7 Do you support, affiliate with, or agree with any group or individual whose teachings or practices are contrary to or oppose those accepted by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?

8 Do you strive to keep the covenants you have made, to attend your sacrament and other meetings, and to keep your life in harmony with the laws and commandments of the gospel?

9 Are you honest in your dealings with your fellowmen?

10 Are you a full-tithe payer?

11 Do you keep the Word of Wisdom?

12 Do you have financial or other obligations to a former spouse or children? If yes, are you current in meeting those obligations?

13 If you have previously received your temple endowment:

Do you keep the covenants that you made in the temple?
Do you wear the garment both night and day as instructed in the endowment and in accordance with the covenant you made in the temple?

14 Have there been any sins or misdeeds in your life that should have been resolved with priesthood authorities but have not been?

15 Do you consider yourself worthy to enter the Lord's house and participate in temple ordinances?

17 posted on 07/04/2012 2:39:11 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Colofornian
He will be a god, he will rule over a planet with his wives and spirit children.


The Doctrine and Covenants

Section 132

Revelation given through Joseph Smith the Prophet, at Nauvoo, Illinois, recorded 12 July 1843, relating to the new and everlasting covenant, including the eternity of the marriage covenant, and also the plurality of wives (see History of the Church, 5:501–7). Although the revelation was recorded in 1843, it is evident from the historical records that the doctrines and principles involved in this revelation had been known by the Prophet since 1831.

1–6, Exaltation is gained through the new and everlasting covenant; 7–14, The terms and conditions of that covenant are set forth; 15–20, Celestial marriage and a continuation of the family unit enable men to become gods; 21–25, The strait and narrow way leads to eternal lives; 26–27, The law is given relative to blasphemy against the Holy Ghost; 28–39, Promises of eternal increase and exaltation are made to prophets and Saints in all ages; 40–47, Joseph Smith is given the power to bind and seal on earth and in heaven; 48–50, The Lord seals upon him his exaltation; 51–57, Emma Smith is counseled to be faithful and true; 58–66, Laws governing the plurality of wives are set forth.

 


 

 16Therefore, when they are out of the world they neither marry nor are given in amarriage; but are appointed angels in bheaven, which angels are ministering cservants, to minister for those who are worthy of a far more, and an exceeding, and an eternal weight of glory.

 17For these angels did not abide my law; therefore, they cannot be enlarged, but remain separately and singly, without exaltation, in their saved condition, to all eternity; and from henceforth are not gods, but are aangels of God forever and ever.

 18And again, verily I say unto you, if a man marry a wife, and make a covenant with her for time and for all eternity, if that acovenant is not by me or by my word, which is my law, and is not sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise, through him whom I have anointed and appointed unto this power, then it is not valid neither of force when they are out of the world, because they are not joined by me, saith the Lord, neither by my word; when they are out of the world it cannot be received there, because the angels and the gods are appointed there, by whom they cannot pass; they cannot, therefore, inherit my glory; for my house is a house of order, saith the Lord God.

 19And again, verily I say unto you, if a man amarry a wife by my word, which is my law, and by the new and beverlasting covenant, and it is csealed unto them by the Holy Spirit of dpromise, by him who is anointed, unto whom I have appointed this power and the ekeys of this priesthood; and it shall be said unto them—Ye shall come forth in the first resurrection; and if it be after the first resurrection, in the next resurrection; and shall inherit fthrones, kingdoms, principalities, and powers, dominions, all heights and depths—then shall it be written in the Lamb’s gBook of Life, that he shall commit no hmurder whereby to shed innocent iblood, and if ye abide in my covenant, and commit no murder whereby to shed innocent blood, it shall be done unto them in all things whatsoever my servant hath put upon them, in time, and through all eternity; and shall be of full force when they are out of the world; and they shall pass by the angels, and the gods, which are set there, to their jexaltation and glory in all things, as hath been sealed upon their heads, which glory shall be a fulness and a continuation of the kseeds forever and ever.

 20 Then shall they be gods, because they have no end; therefore shall they be from aeverlasting to everlasting, because they continue; then shall they be above all, because all things are subject unto them. Then shall they be bgods, because they have call power, and the angels are subject unto them.

 21Verily, verily, I say unto you, except ye abide my alaw ye cannot attain to this glory.

 22For astrait is the gate, and narrow the bway that leadeth unto the exaltation and continuation of the clives, and few there be that find it, because ye receive me not in the world neither do ye know me.

 23But if ye receive me in the world, then shall ye know me, and shall receive your exaltation; that awhere I am ye shall be also.

 24This is aeternal lives—to bknow the only wise and true God, and Jesus Christ, whom he hath csent. I am he. Receive ye, therefore, my law.

 25aBroad is the gate, and wide the way that leadeth to the bdeaths; and many there are that go in thereat, because they creceive me not, neither do they abide in my law.


18 posted on 07/04/2012 2:40:12 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: capydick
I know next to nothing about Mormon’s or their religion...

Then hang on tightly; as the facts will be coming fast and furious!!!

19 posted on 07/04/2012 2:43:25 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Colofornian
Since countless LDS leaders have called the Mormon people self-saviors and saviors of the dead, it's not only a distraction from the poor but delusional.


 

"He (Joseph Smith) is the man through whom God has spoken... yet I would not like to call him a savior, though in a certain capacity he was a god to us, and is to the nations of the earth, and will continue to be."
 - Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses 8:321
 
 
"You call us fools; but the day will be, gentlemen and ladies, whether you belong to this Church or not, when you will prize brother Joseph Smith as the Prophet of the Living God, and look upon him as a god..."
- Herber C. Kimball, Journal of Discourses 5:88
 
 
"If we get our salvation, we shall have to pass by him [Joseph Smith]; if we enter our glory, it will be through the authority he has received. We cannot get around him [Joseph Smith]"
- (as quoted in 1988 Melchizedek Priesthood Study Guide, p. 142)
 
 
There is "no salvation without accepting Joseph Smith. If Joseph Smith was verily a prophet, and if he told the truth...no man can reject that testimony without incurring the most dreadful consequences, for he cannot enter the kingdom of God"
- Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 1, p.190
 
 
"I tell you, Joseph holds the keys, and none of us can get into the celestial kingdom without passing by him. We have not got rid of him, but he stands there as the sentinel, holding the keys of the kingdom of God; and there are many of them beside him. I tell you, if we get past those who have mingled with us, and know us best, and have a right to know us best, probably we can pass all other sentinels as far as it is necessary, or as far as we may desire. But I tell you, the pinch will be with those that have mingled with us, stood next to us, weighed our spirits, tried us, and proven us: there will be a pinch, in my view, to get past them. The others, perhaps, will say, If brother Joseph is satisfied with you, you may pass. If it is all right with him, it is all right with me. Then if Joseph shall say to a man, or if brother Brigham say to a man, I forgive you your sins, "Whosoever sins ye remit they are remitted unto them;" if you who have suffered and felt the weight of transgression—if you have generosity enough to forgive the sinner, I will forgive him: you cannot have more generosity than I have. I have given you power to forgive sins, and when the Lord gives a gift, he does not take it back again."
 - Orson Hyde, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 6, p.154-155
 
 
 
"It is because the Lord called Joseph Smith that salvation is again available to mortal men.... If it had not been for Joseph Smith and the restoration, there would be no salvation,"
 - Bruce McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, p. 396, 670
 


They succeeded in killing Joseph, but he had finished his work.
He was a servant of God, and gave us the Book of Mormon.
He said the Bible was right in the main, but, through the translators and others, many precious portions were suppressed, and several other portions were wrongly translated; and now his testimony is in force, for he has sealed it with his blood.
As I have frequently told them, no man in this dispensation will enter the courts of heaven, without the approbation of the Prophet Joseph Smith, Jun.
Who has made this so?
Have I?
Have this people?
Have the world?
No; but the Lord Jehovah has decreed it.
If I ever pass into the heavenly courts, it will be by the consent of the Prophet Joseph.
If you ever pass through the gates into the Holy City, you will do so upon his certificate that you are worthy to pass.
Can you pass without his inspection?
No; neither can any person in this dispensation, which is the dispensation of the fulness of times.
In this generation, and in all the generations that are to come, everyone will have to undergo the scrutiny of this Prophet.
They say that they killed Joseph, and they will yet come with their hats under their arms and bend to him; but what good will it do them, unless they repent?
They can come in a certain way and find favor, but will they?
 Brigham Young,

--JOURNAL OF DISCOURSES, vol. 8, p. 224

20 posted on 07/04/2012 2:44:39 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Colofornian

I view their proxy baptising the way i view kosher food, or Amish woodworking styles. I think it’s pure silliness,,BUT, i get to take advantage of it.
Their superstition provides me with a damned good hot dog and pickle, some cool furniture, and in the case of the mormons,, some very accurate geneological records i can use for my family tree.

I visited one of their centers one time and they’ll happily help you learn about how to accurately trace a family tree. When they try to start preaching,,,i just told ‘em be patient, maybe you’ll get a relative of mine 200 years from now then you can claim us all.
The look was priceless,,,


21 posted on 07/04/2012 2:45:02 PM PDT by DesertRhino (perI was standing with a rifle, waiting for soviet paratroopers, but communists just ran for office.)
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To: Colofornian
Amazing isnt' it?

How (and WHY) is it that NONE of the biased, corrupt lame-stream Media has taken any interest whatsoever, in the "Religion of Pieces" which Dear Leader defends, appeases and often supports?

Moreover, why is it that the handful of Freeps who hate Mittens and MORMONS (and constantly post anything detrimental, dismissive or derisive about Mormonism) never, EVER, have anything to say about Islam or Sharia,...you know that which seeks to DESTROY our Republic and force all of we (AND YOU) Kafur to either SUBMIT, (convert) live as "Dhimmis" (SLAVES) or be killed?

Care to show me where Mormonism adheres to same tenets???

22 posted on 07/04/2012 2:56:12 PM PDT by Conservative Vermont Vet
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To: Conservative Vermont Vet

Well, you are NOT refererencing me re your “never, ever” comment re negativity of islam. In april I was the lone freeper who pieced together and linked 11 FR threads going back to 2008 re apparent muslim ties tween islam and obama. Have you done something similar to that? If I post the link, will you post any ANY any any indepth post you have made on islam? Since you are not referencing me, what phantom poster are you talking about? Is this just another straw point?


23 posted on 07/04/2012 4:00:25 PM PDT by Colofornian (Saying Mitt would keep past political promises is like prophesying that Gumby won't bend anymore)
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To: DesertRhino
...some very accurate geneological records i can use for my family tree.

Then there is the OTHER 85%!

24 posted on 07/04/2012 5:44:24 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: hinckley buzzard

And yet, we Conservatives were told Romney was the most electable and just hold our nose and vote for him.


25 posted on 07/04/2012 7:15:04 PM PDT by 5thGenTexan
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To: hinckley buzzard; 5thGenTexan
In coming weeks we will be treated to the liberal view of Mormon marriage, temple secrets, history of racism, what ever other exotic minutiae they can exploit...

(Anytime educators have covered racism within history -- recent...and past...either with you, your children, or your (forthcoming?) grandchildren, you don't tell your kids that this topic is mere "exotic minutiae," do you?)

When you watch a movie like Men of Honor (here's a bio of Carl Brashear -- the subject of the movie -- Gale Contemporary Black Biography: Carl Maxie Brashear) & see the racism he endured ... or say, Jackie Robinson of the Brooklyn Dodgers and what he went thru, those realities are hardly "exotic minutiae."

26 posted on 07/05/2012 4:13:45 AM PDT by Colofornian (Saying Mitt would keep past political promises is like prophesying that Gumby won't bend anymore)
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To: Colofornian; hinckley buzzard; 5thGenTexan
In coming weeks we will be treated to the liberal view of Mormon marriage, temple secrets, history of racism, what ever other exotic minutiae they can exploit...

In the past on FR, as well as in the coming weeks, we will be treated to the actual MORMON accounts, from it's very own printing presses, of Mormon marriage, temple secrets, history of racism, and what ever other things they wish would stay tucked safely away until the slimy grasp of deception has a really firm hold on a victim.

27 posted on 07/05/2012 4:44:56 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Elsie

Boy that D&C 132 is a real doozy isn’t it?

;)


28 posted on 07/05/2012 7:55:43 AM PDT by freedomlover (Make sure you're in love - before you move in the heavy stuff)
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To: freedomlover
Boy that D&C 132 is a real doozy isn’t it?

That was just a SNIPPET!

Here's the WHOLE thing:

The Doctrine and Covenants

Section 132

Revelation given through Joseph Smith the Prophet, at Nauvoo, Illinois, recorded 12 July 1843, relating to the new and everlasting covenant, including the eternity of the marriage covenant, and also the plurality of wives (see History of the Church, 5:501–7). Although the revelation was recorded in 1843, it is evident from the historical records that the doctrines and principles involved in this revelation had been known by the Prophet since 1831.

1–6, Exaltation is gained through the new and everlasting covenant; 7–14, The terms and conditions of that covenant are set forth; 15–20, Celestial marriage and a continuation of the family unit enable men to become gods; 21–25, The strait and narrow way leads to eternal lives; 26–27, The law is given relative to blasphemy against the Holy Ghost; 28–39, Promises of eternal increase and exaltation are made to prophets and Saints in all ages; 40–47, Joseph Smith is given the power to bind and seal on earth and in heaven; 48–50, The Lord seals upon him his exaltation; 51–57, Emma Smith is counseled to be faithful and true; 58–66, Laws governing the plurality of wives are set forth.



 

1 Verily, thus saith the Lord unto you my servant Joseph, that inasmuch as you have inquired of my hand to know and understand wherein I, the Lord, justified my servants Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, as also Moses, David and Solomon, my servants, as touching the principle and doctrine of their having many awives and bconcubines

2 Behold, and lo, I am the Lord thy God, and will answer thee as touching this matter.

3 Therefore, aprepare thy heart to receive and bobey the instructions which I am about to give unto you; for all those who have this law revealed unto them must obey the same.

4 For behold, I reveal unto you a new and an everlasting acovenant; and if ye abide not that covenant, then are ye bdamned; for no one can creject this covenant and be permitted to enter into my glory.

5 For all who will have a ablessing at my hands shall abide the blaw which was appointed for that blessing, and the conditions thereof, as were instituted from before the foundation of the world.

6And as pertaining to the new and aeverlasting covenant, it was instituted for the fulness of my bglory; and he that receiveth a fulness thereof must and shall abide the law, or he shall be damned, saith the Lord God.

7And verily I say unto you, that the aconditions of this law are these: All covenants, contracts, bonds, obligations, boaths, cvows, performances, connections, associations, or expectations, that are not made and entered into and dsealed by the Holy Spirit of promise, of him who is eanointed, both as well for time and for all eternity, and that too most holy, by frevelation and commandment through the medium of mine anointed, whom I have appointed on the earth to hold this gpower (and I have appointed unto my servant Joseph to hold this hpower in the last days, and there is never but one on the earth at a time on whom this power and the ikeys of this priesthood are conferred), are of no efficacy, virtue, or force in and after the resurrection from the dead; for all contracts that are not made unto this end have an end when men are dead.

8Behold, mine house is a house of aorder, saith the Lord God, and not a house of confusion.

9Will I aaccept of an offering, saith the Lord, that is not made in my name?

10Or will I receive at your hands that which I have not aappointed?

11And will I appoint unto you, saith the Lord, except it be by law, even as I and my Father aordained unto you, before the world was?

12I am the Lord thy God; and I give unto you this commandment—that no man shall acome unto the Father but by me or by my word, which is my law, saith the Lord.

13And everything that is in the world, whether it be ordained of men, by athrones, or principalities, or powers, or things of name, whatsoever they may be, that are not by me or by my word, saith the Lord, shall be thrown down, and shall bnot remain after men are dead, neither in nor after the resurrection, saith the Lord your God.

14For whatsoever things remain are by me; and whatsoever things are not by me shall be shaken and destroyed.

15Therefore, if a aman marry him a wife in the world, and he marry her not by me nor by my word, and he covenant with her so long as he is in the world and she with him, their covenant and marriage are not of force when they are dead, and when they are out of the world; therefore, they are not bound by any law when they are out of the world.

16Therefore, when they are out of the world they neither marry nor are given in amarriage; but are appointed angels in bheaven, which angels are ministering cservants, to minister for those who are worthy of a far more, and an exceeding, and an eternal weight of glory.

17For these angels did not abide my law; therefore, they cannot be enlarged, but remain separately and singly, without exaltation, in their saved condition, to all eternity; and from henceforth are not gods, but are aangels of God forever and ever.

18And again, verily I say unto you, if a man marry a wife, and make a covenant with her for time and for all eternity, if that acovenant is not by me or by my word, which is my law, and is not sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise, through him whom I have anointed and appointed unto this power, then it is not valid neither of force when they are out of the world, because they are not joined by me, saith the Lord, neither by my word; when they are out of the world it cannot be received there, because the angels and the gods are appointed there, by whom they cannot pass; they cannot, therefore, inherit my glory; for my house is a house of order, saith the Lord God.

19And again, verily I say unto you, if a man amarry a wife by my word, which is my law, and by the new and beverlasting covenant, and it is csealed unto them by the Holy Spirit of dpromise, by him who is anointed, unto whom I have appointed this power and the ekeys of this priesthood; and it shall be said unto them—Ye shall come forth in the first resurrection; and if it be after the first resurrection, in the next resurrection; and shall inherit fthrones, kingdoms, principalities, and powers, dominions, all heights and depths—then shall it be written in the Lamb’s gBook of Life, that he shall commit no hmurder whereby to shed innocent iblood, and if ye abide in my covenant, and commit no murder whereby to shed innocent blood, it shall be done unto them in all things whatsoever my servant hath put upon them, in time, and through all eternity; and shall be of full force when they are out of the world; and they shall pass by the angels, and the gods, which are set there, to their jexaltation and glory in all things, as hath been sealed upon their heads, which glory shall be a fulness and a continuation of the kseeds forever and ever.

20 Then shall they be gods, because they have no end; therefore shall they be from aeverlasting to everlasting, because they continue; then shall they be above all, because all things are subject unto them. Then shall they be bgods, because they have call power, and the angels are subject unto them.

21Verily, verily, I say unto you, except ye abide my alaw ye cannot attain to this glory.

22For astrait is the gate, and narrow the bway that leadeth unto the exaltation and continuation of the clives, and few there be that find it, because ye receive me not in the world neither do ye know me.

23But if ye receive me in the world, then shall ye know me, and shall receive your exaltation; that awhere I am ye shall be also.

24This is aeternal lives—to bknow the only wise and true God, and Jesus Christ, whom he hath csent. I am he. Receive ye, therefore, my law.

25aBroad is the gate, and wide the way that leadeth to the bdeaths; and many there are that go in thereat, because they creceive me not, neither do they abide in my law.

26Verily, verily, I say unto you, if a man marry a wife according to my word, and they are sealed by the aHoly Spirit of promise, according to mine appointment, and he or she shall commit any sin or transgression of the new and everlasting covenant whatever, and all manner of blasphemies, and if they bcommit no murder wherein they shed innocent blood, yet they shall come forth in the first resurrection, and enter into their exaltation; but they shall be destroyed in the flesh, and shall be cdelivered unto the buffetings of dSatan unto the day of eredemption, saith the Lord God.

27The ablasphemy against the Holy Ghost, which shall bnot be cforgiven in the world nor out of the world, is in that ye commit dmurder wherein ye shed innocent blood, and assent unto my death, after ye have received my new and everlasting covenant, saith the Lord God; and he that abideth not this law can in nowise enter into my glory, but shall be edamned, saith the Lord.

28I am the Lord thy God, and will give unto thee the alaw of my Holy Priesthood, as was ordained by me and my Father before the world was.

29aAbraham received all things, whatsoever he received, by revelation and commandment, by my word, saith the Lord, and hath entered into his exaltation and sitteth upon his throne.

30aAbraham received promises concerning his seed, and of the fruit of his loins—from whose bloins ye are, namely, my servant Joseph—which were to continue so long as they were in the world; and as touching Abraham and his seed, out of the world they should continue; both in the world and out of the world should they continue as innumerable as the cstars; or, if ye were to count the sand upon the seashore ye could not number them.

31This promise is yours also, because ye are of aAbraham, and the promise was made unto Abraham; and by this law is the continuation of the works of my Father, wherein he glorifieth himself.

32Go ye, therefore, and do the aworks of Abraham; enter ye into my law and ye shall be saved.

33But if ye enter not into my law ye cannot receive the promise of my Father, which he made unto Abraham.

34God acommanded Abraham, and Sarah gave bHagar to Abraham to wife. And why did she do it? Because this was the law; and from Hagar sprang many people. This, therefore, was fulfilling, among other things, the promises.

35Was Abraham, therefore, under condemnation? Verily I say unto you, Nay; for I, the Lord, acommanded it.

36Abraham was acommanded to offer his son Isaac; nevertheless, it was written: Thou shalt not bkill. Abraham, however, did not refuse, and it was accounted unto him for crighteousness.

37Abraham received aconcubines, and they bore him children; and it was accounted unto him for righteousness, because they were given unto him, and he abode in my law; as Isaac also and bJacob did none other things than that which they were commanded; and because they did none other things than that which they were commanded, they have entered into their cexaltation, according to the promises, and sit upon thrones, and are not angels but are gods.

38David also received amany wives and concubines, and also Solomon and Moses my servants, as also many others of my servants, from the beginning of creation until this time; and in nothing did they sin save in those things which they received not of me.

39aDavid’s wives and concubines were bgiven unto him of me, by the hand of Nathan, my servant, and others of the prophets who had the ckeys of this power; and in none of these things did he dsin against me save in the case of eUriah and his wife; and, therefore he hath ffallen from his exaltation, and received his portion; and he shall not inherit them out of the world, for I ggave them unto another, saith the Lord.

40I am the Lord thy God, and I gave unto thee, my servant Joseph, an aappointment, and restore all things. Ask what ye will, and it shall be given unto you according to my word.

41And as ye have asked concerning adultery, verily, verily, I say unto you, if a man areceiveth a wife in the new and everlasting covenant, and if she be with another man, and I have not appointed unto her by the holy banointing, she hath committed cadultery and shall be destroyed.

42If she be not in the new and everlasting covenant, and she be with another man, she has acommitted adultery.

43And if her husband be with another woman, and he was under a avow, he hath broken his vow and hath committed adultery.

44And if she hath not committed adultery, but is innocent and hath not broken her vow, and she knoweth it, and I reveal it unto you, my servant Joseph, then shall you have power, by the power of my Holy Priesthood, to take her and agive her unto him that hath not committed badultery but hath been cfaithful; for he shall be made ruler over many.

45For I have conferred upon you the akeys and power of the priesthood, wherein I brestore all things, and make known unto you all things in due time.

46And verily, verily, I say unto you, that whatsoever you aseal on earth shall be sealed in heaven; and whatsoever you bbind on earth, in my name and by my word, saith the Lord, it shall be eternally bound in the heavens; and whosesoever sins you cremit on earth shall be remitted eternally in the heavens; and whosesoever sins you retain on earth shall be retained in heaven.

47And again, verily I say, whomsoever you bless I will bless, and whomsoever you curse I will acurse, saith the Lord; for I, the Lord, am thy God.

48And again, verily I say unto you, my servant Joseph, that whatsoever you give on earth, and to whomsoever you agive any one on earth, by my word and according to my law, it shall be visited with blessings and not cursings, and with my power, saith the Lord, and shall be without condemnation on earth and in heaven.

49For I am the Lord thy God, and will be awith thee even unto the bend of the world, and through all eternity; for verily I cseal upon you your dexaltation, and prepare a throne for you in the kingdom of my Father, with Abraham your efather.

50Behold, I have seen your asacrifices, and will forgive all your sins; I have seen your bsacrifices in obedience to that which I have told you. Go, therefore, and I make a way for your escape, as I caccepted the offering of Abraham of his son Isaac.

51Verily, I say unto you: A commandment I give unto mine handmaid, Emma Smith, your wife, whom I have given unto you, that she stay herself and partake not of that which I commanded you to offer unto her; for I did it, saith the Lord, to aprove you all, as I did Abraham, and that I might require an offering at your hand, by covenant and sacrifice.

52And let mine handmaid, Emma Smith, areceive all those that have been given unto my servant Joseph, and who are virtuous and pure before me; and those who are not pure, and have said they were pure, shall be destroyed, saith the Lord God.

53For I am the Lord thy God, and ye shall obey my voice; and I give unto my servant Joseph that he shall be made ruler over many things; for he hath been afaithful over a few things, and from henceforth I will strengthen him.

54And I command mine handmaid, Emma Smith, to abide and acleave unto my servant Joseph, and to none else. But if she will not abide this commandment she shall be bdestroyed, saith the Lord; for I am the Lord thy God, and will destroy her if she abide not in my law.

55But if she will not abide this commandment, then shall my servant Joseph do all things for her, even as he hath said; and I will bless him and multiply him and give unto him an ahundredfold in this world, of fathers and mothers, brothers and sisters, houses and lands, wives and children, and crowns of beternal lives in the eternal worlds.

56And again, verily I say, let mine handmaid aforgive my servant Joseph his trespasses; and then shall she be forgiven her trespasses, wherein she has trespassed against me; and I, the Lord thy God, will bless her, and multiply her, and make her heart to brejoice.

57And again, I say, let not my servant Joseph put his property out of his hands, lest an enemy come and destroy him; for aSatan bseeketh to destroy; for I am the Lord thy God, and he is my servant; and behold, and lo, I am with him, as I was with Abraham, thy father, even unto his cexaltation and glory.

58Now, as touching the law of the apriesthood, there are many things pertaining thereunto.

59Verily, if a man be called of my Father, as was aAaron, by mine own voice, and by the voice of him that bsent me, and I have endowed him with the ckeys of the power of this priesthood, if he do anything in my name, and according to my law and by my word, he will not commit dsin, and I will justify him.

60Let no one, therefore, set on my servant Joseph; for I will justify him; for he shall do the sacrifice which I require at his hands for his transgressions, saith the Lord your God.

61And again, as pertaining to the law of the priesthood—if any man espouse a virgin, and desire to espouse aanother, and the first give her consent, and if he espouse the second, and they are virgins, and have vowed to no other man, then is he justified; he cannot commit adultery for they are given unto him; for he cannot commit adultery with that that belongeth unto him and to no one else.

62And if he have aten virgins given unto him by this law, he cannot commit adultery, for they belong to him, and they are given unto him; therefore is he justified.

63But if one or either of the ten virgins, after she is espoused, shall be with another man, she has committed adultery, and shall be destroyed; for they are given unto him to amultiply and replenish the earth, according to my commandment, and to fulfil the promise which was given by my Father before the foundation of the world, and for their exaltation in the eternal worlds, that they may bear the souls of men; for herein is the work of my Father continued, that he may be bglorified.

64And again, verily, verily, I say unto you, if any man have a wife, who holds the keys of this power, and he teaches unto her the law of my priesthood, as pertaining to these things, then shall she believe and administer unto him, or she shall be destroyed, saith the Lord your God; for I will destroy her; for I will magnify my name upon all those who receive and abide in my law.

65Therefore, it shall be lawful in me, if she receive not this law, for him to receive all things whatsoever I, the Lord his God, will give unto him, because she did not believe and administer unto him according to my word; and she then becomes the transgressor; and he is exempt from the law of Sarah, who administered unto Abraham according to the law when I commanded Abraham to take aHagar to wife.

66And now, as pertaining to this law, verily, verily, I say unto you, I will reveal more unto you, hereafter; therefore, let this suffice for the present. Behold, I am Alpha and Omega. Amen.

29 posted on 07/05/2012 9:41:37 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Elsie

marker


30 posted on 07/06/2012 9:58:58 PM PDT by BlueMoose
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