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Episcopal Church Votes to Allow Transgender Ministers
Christian Post ^ | July 8, 2012 | Anugrah Kumar

Posted on 07/08/2012 1:45:39 PM PDT by NYer

July 8, 2012|10:00 am A day after a legislative body of the Episcopal Church voted to sell the denomination's New York headquarters amid budget cuts and declining membership, church leaders on Saturday adopted legislation to give transgenders the right to become lay and ordained ministers.

At the church's ongoing week-long General Convention in Indianapolis, Ind., the House of Bishops approved proposal that would amend two canons to prohibit discrimination based on "gender identity or expression" in the lay and ordained ministry discernment process and in the overall life, worship and governance of the church, Episcopal News Service reported.

The House of Deputies, the other legislative body of the bicameral General Convention of the Episcopal Church, must approve the legislation to pass at the convention.

The bishops' move overlooks the fact that 200,000 members and 300 parishes have left the denomination in the past few years partly due to the church's leftist policies on social and political issues. Nine years ago, the church approved its first openly gay bishop.

For many in the church, Saturday's resolution was about "inclusion."

"I am pleased that these resolutions did pass in that they have the very significant effect of validating, in the eyes of the church, the humanity of those who are transgender," the Rev. Carolyn Woodall of the Diocese of San Joaquin was quoted as saying. "We are greatly misunderstood and there is a widespread lack of knowledge about what it means to be transgender."

The Rev. Susan Russell, a deputy from the Diocese of Los Angeles and a lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender activist, said the resolution brings the church "another step closer to making all the sacraments available to all the baptized."

"The courageous witness of our transgender brothers and sisters has been an extraordinary gift to the church as we continue to grow in understanding and appreciation of the diversity of God's beloved human family," Russell added.

Some church leaders opposed the resolution.

"I believe we need to have more discussion in the church, in our congregations, in order to be able to speak in a way that is theologically sound, that gives a deeper understanding of what it means to be a transgender person," said Bishop Andrew Waldo of the Diocese of Upper South Carolina.

"We are entering into a time of individualized eros … the freedom of every individual to self-define every aspect of who they are in such a way that we no longer have any kinds of norms. We are entering into the chaos of individuality," said Bishop Mark Lawrence of the Diocese of South Carolina. "It's an idol that will break us," he warned.

Leaders of the church are also scheduled to vote on a liturgy for same-sex weddings during the convention, which concludes on Thursday.

In recent years, the membership of the Episcopal Church, which is rooted in the Church of England, has declined to below two million, and the average Sunday attendance is as low as 657,831.


TOPICS: Current Events; Mainline Protestant; Ministry/Outreach; Religion & Science
KEYWORDS: episcopal

1 posted on 07/08/2012 1:45:43 PM PDT by NYer
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To: NYer

As they wither away into irrelevance...


2 posted on 07/08/2012 1:46:51 PM PDT by Elpasser
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To: NYer

bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaahahahahahahawhahahahahahah!


3 posted on 07/08/2012 1:49:18 PM PDT by the invisib1e hand (A Dalmation was spotted wagging its tail.)
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To: NYer

“In recent years, the membership of the Episcopal Church, which is rooted in the Church of England,...”

Who else is going to lead the charge in the downfall of Western Civ? Jolly old England will do it!

I say we take off and nuke the entire island from orbit. It’s the only way to be sure.


4 posted on 07/08/2012 1:49:44 PM PDT by Jack Hydrazine (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine!)
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To: NYer

JUST DUCKY!!


5 posted on 07/08/2012 1:53:30 PM PDT by evad (It's a tax, it's a tax, it's a tax, It's a tax, it's a tax, it's a tax)
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To: NYer

They probably still can’t figure out what is causing the “declining membership”. Doh!


6 posted on 07/08/2012 1:54:56 PM PDT by FlingWingFlyer (Help reduce voter fraud in America! If you see something, say something!)
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To: NYer

Goodbye Episcopal , Hello Despicable. Don’t bother calling it the Church anymore. Might as well join the covens of the Druids.


7 posted on 07/08/2012 1:55:51 PM PDT by tflabo (Truth or tyranny)
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To: Jack Hydrazine
heh...great line from a great movie...
and entirely apropos.
8 posted on 07/08/2012 1:55:53 PM PDT by evad (It's a tax, it's a tax, it's a tax, It's a tax, it's a tax, it's a tax)
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To: Jack Hydrazine

Episcopalians are Americans, Anglicans are British. They are both wondering why their church is withering away. We don’t need the Brits to lead the charge. The lead is coming from this side of the Atlantic.


9 posted on 07/08/2012 1:56:09 PM PDT by La Lydia
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To: NYer

So what religous book is the Episcopal church going to reference if not the Holy Bible, Ru Paul Does LA?


10 posted on 07/08/2012 1:56:33 PM PDT by EGPWS (Trust in God, question everyone else)
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To: NYer

Not so good foro young families.

Mommy, why does that man have a dress on?

Daddy, why is that woman dressed up like a man? Can’t everyone see she is wearing lipstick. And she doesn’t have any whiskers!

Find another church — fast!


11 posted on 07/08/2012 1:58:49 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: NYer
Scientology boasts 8,000,000 members. Mormons have 14,000,000 members. The Unification Church (Moonies) boast over 3,000,000.

At what point do we start to treat the Episcopalians as cultists? After all they are the ones embracing all manor of sinful sexual acts and depravity and holding up those with these proclivities as exemplary. ‘

What next ordained pedophiles?

12 posted on 07/08/2012 2:01:47 PM PDT by Jim from C-Town (The government is rarely benevolent, often malevolent and never benign!)
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To: NYer

Maybe next week they can vote to change their name from Episcopalians to Cesspoolians.


13 posted on 07/08/2012 2:01:57 PM PDT by Nervous Tick (Trust in God, but row away from the rocks!)
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To: NYer
"We are entering into a time of individualized eros … the freedom of every individual to self-define every aspect of who they are in such a way that we no longer have any kinds of norms. We are entering into the chaos of individuality," said Bishop Mark Lawrence of the Diocese of South Carolina. "It's an idol that will break us," he warned.

Your church just officially embraced yet another form of perversion! With all due respect, Bishop, I'd say you're already done broke!

14 posted on 07/08/2012 2:04:29 PM PDT by workerbee (June 28, 2012 -- 9/11 From Within)
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To: NYer
there is a widespread lack of knowledge about what it means to be transgender

Actually, I think most people correctly understand that 'transgender" means "insane." Although Christianity (unlike liberalism) rightly treats people with profound mental illness as persons worthy of respect and care, all reasonable people would agree that the insane are generally not qualified as pastors and teachers of religion.

15 posted on 07/08/2012 2:05:10 PM PDT by Tax-chick ("If I want someone without merit, I'll simply vote for the Moslem ferret!" ~Da Coyote)
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To: NYer

I fgured they would.

The Homosexuals have a strong hold on that bunch.

Anyone with good sense will find a real Church to go to.

God wasn’t playing when he destroyed Sodom.


16 posted on 07/08/2012 2:06:21 PM PDT by Venturer
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To: NYer
So, when all gather in the Church Hall; which bathroom does 'the' transgender use?

Do they guide the women on Retreat; or go with the Men's Weekend Retreat getaway? And when with the boys - and girls - who/which are they? Men's shoes or high heels; under their robes for Sunday Service?

17 posted on 07/08/2012 2:07:43 PM PDT by cricket (Narcissism IS the 'heart' of Liberalism . . .)
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To: Jim from C-Town

>> What next ordained pedophiles?

You’re asking that as a rhetorical question, I know — but the fact is, mainstreaming pedophilia will be one of the next milestones in our cultural march to depravity. Along with polygamy, bestiality, necrophilia, sado-masochism... you name it, they’ll clamor for it. Hide and watch.

And the Church will be under constant pressure to ordain *all* of these. Full inclusion, don’t you know.

Jesus come quickly!


18 posted on 07/08/2012 2:07:56 PM PDT by Nervous Tick (Trust in God, but row away from the rocks!)
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To: Elpasser
Indeed, 'whiter away into irrelevance'. . .No problem, of course. Islam will be there; ready to pick up the pieces and refashion 'the spiritual' into their image.
19 posted on 07/08/2012 2:11:30 PM PDT by cricket (Narcissism IS the 'heart' of Liberalism . . .)
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To: NYer

And they wonder why they are loosing Membership and have to sell their Headquarters? DUH! Why should good Christians have to have their Leaders inform them that they must follow the Teachings of SATAN and Ignore the Teachings of the Bible and Jesus? Note that the Evangelical Churches are bursting at the seams and rolling in generous Tithes!


20 posted on 07/08/2012 2:17:32 PM PDT by True Republican Patriot (May GOD SAVE OUR AMERICA from ALLAH and his Prophet, HUSSEIN OBAMA!!)
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To: NYer

Where’s the morality???
Guess they’ve lost any pretence of that.
Little more than a feel good church..


21 posted on 07/08/2012 2:18:11 PM PDT by Joe Boucher ((FUBO) Hey Mitt, F-you too pal)
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To: Jim from C-Town

At what point do we start to treat the Episcopalians as cultists?

Spirited: How about the mystery religion cult of Sodom?


22 posted on 07/08/2012 2:24:24 PM PDT by spirited irish
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To: NYer


23 posted on 07/08/2012 2:27:48 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: NYer

Jesus told us in the last days that doctrines of demons and seducing spirits would invade the church. He called it the ‘falling away’. The apostate church that traded the truth for lies. And He said he abandons them to do their evil. They have fast tracked to that wide road that leads to eternal destruction.


24 posted on 07/08/2012 2:28:27 PM PDT by BigFinn (The King is coming and He isn't riding a donkey this time.)
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To: Joe Boucher

“A feel good church” sums it up.

Anything for a genital tickle is worshipped and glorified.


25 posted on 07/08/2012 2:34:36 PM PDT by plangent
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To: NYer

Id anyone who posts here on a regular basis surprised by this?


26 posted on 07/08/2012 2:47:07 PM PDT by upchuck (FACEBOOK... Share pointless stuff with friends you don't know. Beg for intrusion into your life.)
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To: Jack Hydrazine

““In recent years, the membership of the Episcopal Church, which is rooted in the Church of England,...””
_____________________________________________________

Most of the founding fathers had roots in England.
Should we dig them up and ship them back?
Just because the Episcopal Church descended from the Anglican Church, that is no reason to blame the current problem on England.
The gays targeted the Episcopal church because it is relatively small, and does embrace the pomp and ceremony practiced by the church.
The National Cathedral in Washington is Episcopal.
Many of the disenfranchised Episcopalians have been moving to the Anglican church.

I do agree, however, that England has become a cesspit, but the USSA is not far behind.


27 posted on 07/08/2012 2:57:24 PM PDT by AlexW
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To: AlexW

Our Founding Fathers risked their lives and everything they owned to free us from the tyranny of the Crown. No need to ship them back. They earned the right to the title of “Founding Fathers” for doing so. What they started has been a blessing to us all.

Today the UK has become a curse and blight on the world and, yes, the USA is following close behind. The one big dif between the US and the UK is the citizenry of the US has guns as a last resort to the tyranny those in government are implementing. The subjects of the UK have spitballs.


28 posted on 07/08/2012 3:45:26 PM PDT by Jack Hydrazine (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine!)
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To: NYer

I believe the Episcopal Church’s liberals are being as provocative as they can, in the hopes of driving off the Christians, so a tiny group of radicals can control the billions of dollars of real-estate assets.


29 posted on 07/08/2012 3:50:29 PM PDT by dangus
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To: FlingWingFlyer
They probably still can’t figure out what is causing the “declining membership”. Doh!

I agree! However, when you are hell-bent as they are, you aren't trying to be godly, just a little superior to others, i.e., politically correct.

30 posted on 07/08/2012 4:03:49 PM PDT by ThirstyMan
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To: NYer

is it bad that I that I thought they already allowed this?


31 posted on 07/08/2012 4:12:37 PM PDT by Conservaliberty (25 and conservative. I guess I have no heart, Oh, well, makes shooting the bad guys easier.)
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To: NYer

The Left insists that homosexuals are “born that way”, and since they are made by God in that way, absolutely cannot, should not, and should not be expected to change. However, they cannot explain to me how this concept can dovetail with the idea that in the case of the poor, misguided souls who want to get transgendered “God made a mistake” in their gender, and they absolutely should be surgically mutilated into a new form (on my insurance dime.) Do you take the stand that God intends people to be who they are born as, or that He is fallible and must be overruled?


32 posted on 07/08/2012 4:54:27 PM PDT by 50sDad (A Liberal prevents me from telling you anything here.)
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To: Jack Hydrazine

“Our Founding Fathers risked their lives and everything they owned to free us from the tyranny of the Crown.”
___________________________________________________

Well, your reply has zero to do with my post or the subject.
We all know the history of the establishment of the USA, and it has little to do with the Anglican or Episcopal church.

I explained how and why the ECUSA was co-opted by the gays and leftist. That was my only point.

As a note, however, the idea that you will save America with your guns and bullets is a fallacy, unless you are totally joined by the military.
The takers now far outnumber the givers.
That, along with the Marxist takeover of the media and education, explains why America is in the mess that it is.


33 posted on 07/08/2012 4:55:12 PM PDT by AlexW
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To: Jim from C-Town

England, home to Gilbert and Sullivan, The Bard, and Britcoms, has some spectacular empty churches which are great examples of beautiful architecture. And has walked away from all I once thought of as British as they have allowed their culture to be diluted by wave after wave of Godless foreigners and panty-waisted liberal idiots. God help them.


34 posted on 07/08/2012 4:58:36 PM PDT by 50sDad (A Liberal prevents me from telling you anything here.)
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To: NYer
Anyone know if Jan Nunley, the flaming lesbian, still runs the Episcopal News Service? Her and Susan Russell together is quite a sight. A lot of hate in those two.
35 posted on 07/08/2012 5:11:19 PM PDT by Gabrial (The nightmare will continue as long as the nightmare is in the White House)
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To: 50sDad

“The Left insists that homosexuals are “born that way”
____________________________________________________

That makes for an interesting question...What makes one a homo, or attracted to homos? Is it just genetic?
The miscreant that became a minister in the ECUSA, and put in charge of my historic church, was the son of a Baptist country preacher.
As a child he suffered some damage to his testicles in a bicycle accident. I do not, however, know if he was homosexual.
I had known him for almost 20 years before he became involved with any church, and I do not know how or when he found the Episcopal church.


36 posted on 07/08/2012 5:23:31 PM PDT by AlexW
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To: Mad Dawg; BenKenobi; xzins; lightman
from the article "We are entering into a time of individualized eros … the freedom of every individual to self-define every aspect of who they are in such a way that we no longer have any kinds of norms. We are entering into the chaos of individuality," said Bishop Mark Lawrence of the Diocese of South Carolina. "It's an idol that will break us," he warned.

err.. Bishop, it's already broken you.

the ECUSA serves as a stark warning to every one of us. You let one foot slip (women pastors)and you step straight into a mud-slick that you can't recover from

Let us not gloat, but let us learn from their mistakes.

37 posted on 07/09/2012 2:14:50 AM PDT by Cronos (**Marriage is about commitment, cohabitation is about convenience.**)
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To: cricket

there will have to be unixes bathrooms...


38 posted on 07/09/2012 2:17:16 AM PDT by Cronos (**Marriage is about commitment, cohabitation is about convenience.**)
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To: dangus; D-fendr; Mad Dawg; xzins
I believe the Episcopal Church’s liberals are being as provocative as they can, in the hopes of driving off the Christians, so a tiny group of radicals can control the billions of dollars of real-estate assets.

you hit the nail on the head with a sledge-hammer...

39 posted on 07/09/2012 2:49:39 AM PDT by Cronos (**Marriage is about commitment, cohabitation is about convenience.**)
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To: 50sDad; AlexW
50s dad And has walked away from all I once thought of as British as they have allowed their culture to be diluted by wave after wave of Godless foreigners and panty-waisted liberal idiots

Not correct. Most of the foreigners have more God than the native English -- whether those are Irish or Polish or Russian or Coptic. Also the Hindus and Moslems are more religious than the natives.

the decaying factor was the 60s -- just as in the USA

40 posted on 07/09/2012 2:54:34 AM PDT by Cronos (**Marriage is about commitment, cohabitation is about convenience.**)
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To: AlexW

you talking about Gene Robinson? his parents are members of the Disciples of Christ


41 posted on 07/09/2012 3:01:06 AM PDT by Cronos (**Marriage is about commitment, cohabitation is about convenience.**)
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To: Cronos

“you talking about Gene Robinson?”
__________________________________________

I do not understand your question, or which of my post you are referring to.
I do know about Vicky Gene, but I made no reference to him.
I did reference a young priest in west Tennessee.
Also keep in mind, I have been out of the loop and the USSA since 2004.


42 posted on 07/09/2012 3:17:45 AM PDT by AlexW
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To: NYer

The Episcopal church is bisexaphobic.


43 posted on 07/09/2012 3:26:48 AM PDT by Yaelle
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To: 50sDad
"The Left insists that homosexuals are “born that way”,"

Everyone is born with a corrupted sinful nature. That's the whole reason we need a Savior. That doesn't, however, make sin normative - to the contrary. We're not sinners because we sin, we sin because we're sinners.

44 posted on 07/09/2012 4:05:22 AM PDT by circlecity
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To: Cronos; dangus; D-fendr; Mad Dawg

There is some truth to property values being the objective of radicals, but I’m just as willing to admit that an old church building is useless for the most part except as a church building. Those with decent location will always be sitting on a valuable lot, but to demolish an old church building, particularly those preferred by 19th & 20th century episcopals, is not an inexpensive project. There are also tons of buildings they own that are not on high demand property.

So, they sit empty, they increase in decay, they become eyesores.

One dastardly deed that could be accomplished by bodies of believers considering moving from that denonination would be to declare their buildings the level of historic site that doesn’t qualify for public money but does make it much harder to move on the real estate market.

The son-in-law of a fellow church member has Lithuanian parents who fled the Russian invasion. Recently the son was able to return to that home town in Lithuania and to the church building his parents had remembered fondly. It had ceased being a church building under the Russians and been used for grain storage and is now a dilapidated old building, useless to everyone.

Thus shall it be for all of these. Cathedrals don’t care for themselves.


45 posted on 07/09/2012 5:11:40 AM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! Those who truly support our troops pray for their victory!)
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To: AlexW

ah, ok. For some reason I thought you were talking about Vicky Gene..


46 posted on 07/09/2012 6:51:36 AM PDT by Cronos (**Marriage is about commitment, cohabitation is about convenience.**)
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To: xzins; Cronos; dangus; D-fendr
Since y'all have so courteously pinged me, I thought I'd inflict my two cents on the conversation.

The Episcopalians have gone nuts -- on purpose. You know the hymn,"The Spacious Firmament on High"? It's a paraphrase of the first part of Ps. 19. After a description and praise of the heavens it says, [they have no voice but] In reason's ear they all rejoice."

In the '70's in seminary, we were allowed to 'design' services, and I put together a celebration of St. Francis Day (Oct 4) with some good music 'n stuff, and that hymn. A bunch of the faculty complained about the exaltation of reason.

It certainly can be said that's it's a tendentious paraphrase, but there was more to their complaint. The seminary was going through a neo-Calvinist phase and they saw a HUGE gulf between reason and revelation, this despite the Anglican "three-legged stool" of "Scripture, reason, and tradition."

More recently, my FIL, former Pepsicola bishop of Maryland said I was "too rational." (Me! Can you imagine?)

If you read, as I do, with horrified fascination, reports from General Convention, you see that the debate is scarcely a debate at all! Having jettisoned reason, what is left for them but to babble at one another? they use words like 'inclusivity' and the rest like magic and incantatory words.

And here's another thing: Lewis is very good about this.
(1) One of Satan's favorite tricks is to get everybody to run over to the side of the boat whose gunwale is already almost under water. Even if there were some good reason to ordain practicing homosexuals, prudence would suggest that the Pepsicolas 'digest' that move for a decade or two or three before launching off into new gender theories. But having sacrificed something like a third of their membership to one kind of inclusivity, they're still afraid they're not inclusive enough.

(2) To take one virtue -- one of the lesser ones at that -- and to exalt it while depreciating others just won't work. You simply cannot DO justice or courage without prudence and temperance. Justice become severe condemnation (or lackadaisical 'mercy') and courage becomes recklessness. Similarly, without justice and courage, temperance and prudence become fussiness and timidity.

But the Episcopal Church is all about bold new initiatives into unexplored realms of "tolerance" and "inclusivity."

Look: Justin Martyr, in the 2nd century or so, reported (he did not PREscribe, he DEscribed) that the unbaptized were not admitted to Communion. But the Pepsicolas are in many places practically ignoring that -- despite canons prescribing the exclusion -- and are now asking that the canons be changed to make their disobedience obedient.

They do not follow their own tradition nor their own law. How can they justify this disobedience?

Why should they "justify"? They have already rejected reason. How COULD they justify? By the exchange of mantic babble at their diocesan councils or General Convention?

They thought, like Icarus, to fly to the sun rather than to travel, as the Church must,between earth and heaven in deep humility. Like Icarus, now they begin to fall into the sea.

47 posted on 07/09/2012 11:38:27 AM PDT by Mad Dawg (Depone serpentem et ab veneno gradere.)
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To: aberaussie; Aeronaut; aliquando; AlternateViewpoint; AnalogReigns; Archie Bunker on steroids; ...
In August of 2001 the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America (ELCA) estabalished a "Full Communion Partnership" with The Episcopal Church through the adoption of "Called to Common Mission".

Therefore:



Lutheran (EL C S*A) Ping!

* as of August 19, AD 2009, a liberal protestant SECT, not part of the holy, catholic and apostolic CHURCH.

Be rooted in Christ!

48 posted on 07/09/2012 12:48:04 PM PDT by lightman (Adjutorium nostrum (+) in nomine Domini--nevertheless, Vote Santorum!)
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To: NYer; Chode; All

“day after a legislative body of the Episcopal Church voted to sell the denomination’s New York headquarters amid budget cuts and declining membership, church leaders on Saturday adopted legislation to give transgenders the right to become lay and ordained ministers.”

I say we start placing wagers on how long it takes for the Episcopal church to completely go belly-up.

I wager one year from now they will be in serious trouble and in two years they will be closing parishes across the country.

I also wager more of their nuns will leave and join our convents.

any takers?


49 posted on 07/09/2012 8:39:28 PM PDT by Morgana (This space for rent. Cheap.)
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