Posted on 07/12/2012 8:09:26 PM PDT by marshmallow
Of course we attacked over oil. Do you think anyone would give a damn about the Middle East if it wasn’t for the oil? I’m perfectly fine with that. Trying to teach them how to be us is where we failed miserably, because we are far better than they are. And I don’t give a damn what AQ thinks about our presence over there. And I don’t care if you or your buddies think that US service members are likely to “do something we’ll regret.”
I know who we are and what we did, and I’m proud of it.
I appreciate your candor, but throwing AQ and “terrorist” into discussions about Iraq is absurd.
My concern was for a particular family friend doing something HE would regret; I don’t have to answer for what other people do. I’ve never viewed the actions of our government as a reflection on myself in any case. At least you don’t even try to cloak it in anything noble; your logic is much the same as the hijackers - they did it because they could.
I can't possibly imagine what you mean by that.
They are completely unrelated, and you know it. Aghanistan was a war both parties (and the general public) could support because it was the source of the 9/11 attacks; Iraq was and is a completely separate thing, which is why many allies in Afghanistan didn’t participate in it. It overthrew the most stable, pro-Western government in the region, and turned it into a hotbed of Islamic fundamentalism (which had always been successfully suppressed by Saddam - that is why we “liked” him in the 1980s).
What I know is that I fought AQ in Iraq. I also know that AQ felt that Iraq was it’s decisive effort—that came from their COO, Zawahiri. AQ was highly active in Iraq, I hit many targets with AQI personnel and they took some shots at me along the way as well. Destroying AQI was a tremendous setback for the entire organization. It will take them decades to rebuild from that loss.
And calling Iraq “pro-Western” shows just how off-the-reservation you really are. We supported Iraq in the 1980s because they weren’t Iran—they were killing our enemies for us. It was as simple as that.
Al Qaeda never showed up in Iraq until the man who kept them out was overthrown; stop pretending that was the reason for attacking them to begin with. After we invaded, it became a convenient place for AQ to kill Americans (and they did; so much so that we had a midnight retreat to avoid a repeat of any of those famous 1975 Saigon photos). If we really wanted to kill radical Muslims at this point, Iraq is the perfect place to do it - but we won’t; they’ve already won there (hardly destroyed). Iraq was a setback for the US, not Al Qaeda, and it delivered the White House to Obama.
I’ll let the Iraqis that fled to the US after Saddam was overthrown attest to his “pro-Western” stance; they can once again worship in peace here since Saddam’s protection of their churches died with his government. Unlike our beloved “allies” the Saudis, non-Muslims were allowed to worship freely in Iraq.
I must have missed that midnight retreat. When was this?
they’ve already won there (hardly destroyed). Iraq was a setback for the US, not Al Qaeda, and it delivered the White House to Obama.
Really? Fascinating...you must be privvy to all kinds of intel and operational details that I'm not.
Your lame attempts to rewrite history won't work, especially since I was actually there and witnessed this stuff.
I want to axe of what faith will then be our future pale white RINO POTUSes once this country club denomination goes bah-bye?
This dyke Jefferts Schori is quite a number, isn’t he?!
I think the lead sentence answers the question. The Episcopal Church has become among Christian denominations what the Berkeley City Council or the San Francisco supervisors have become to governments, that is, more interested in following their own fancies than getting their business done, certainly more so than in preaching the old-time Christian faith. The layfolk have said, forget this nonsense, and either joined the Catholics, the evangelicals, the Orthodox, another Lambeth church, an independent Anglican church or just punched out of religion completely. And the remaining flock really can’t afford to keep the church at large in the manner to which it was accustomed when it was the (rich, patrician) Republican Party at prayer. I say this as an outsider, but if anybody can correct me on that, go ahead.
And speaking of corrections...Henry didn’t break away from Rome because Rome wouldn’t let him behead his wives. He broke away because Rome wouldn’t annul his marriage to Catherine of Aragon. He was already out, for all intents and purposes, by the time he started beheading wives.
Why don’t you look at ANY news story of the last US troops pulled out of Iraq; they left in convoys under cover of darkness (they were actually afraid of being attacked by the IRAQI ARMY - the one that WE TRAINED). If you watched ANY news, they had the soldiers describing their apprehension as they were pulling out (after they’d left the media blackout zone).
No intel or operational details needed; it was front-page news for a few days.
Apparently being there didn’t do anything for you if you missed that bit; I guess we didn’t pull out because of unacceptable casualties in the face of impossible goals? We lost; accept it.
I have read the accounts of Soviet soldiers in Afghanistan. There is a book called “The Forgotten War”. I read it in the 90’s and remember thinking “We armed a bunch of people who will kill us!”
The Soviet arming of Vietnam didn't have Vietnamese firing back at the Soviets....
Vietnam later fought a nasty war with China, and won.
They turned against the USSR, and went their own way.
Red China invaded North Vietnam as a “punitive expedition” for their role in overthrowing the Khmer Rouge, and turned back after they felt the lesson had been learned. It was hardly an effort for Red China, who penetrated some distance into North Vietnam.
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