Posted on 08/23/2012 8:20:55 PM PDT by delacoert
Edited on 08/23/2012 8:26:36 PM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]
In recent decades the Republican Party has made a person’s religious beliefs an issue for election to political office, despite the First Amendment to the Constitution explicitly forbidding this.
For the Republicans, that requirement is a person must be a Christian. Mitt Romney has chosen staunch Roman Catholic Paul Ryan as his running mate. That should help divert some of the concern about Romney himself being a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints — a Mormon.
There has been debate, including in The Herald-News’ OpenLine, about whether or not Mormons are true Christians. Most people don’t know what Mormons believe, so I thought I would publicize some of their basic precepts, all of which can be easily confirmed.
Mormons believe that “God” created multiple worlds with people living on them. Multiple gods exist but each has its own universe. All people existed as pre-mortal spirit children of God and are then physically born on this earth and are subject only to our specific “God.” If you follow God and his law (the precepts of the LDS Church) you can reach the highest level of heaven and become a “God” also.
Our “God” was a mortal on another planet who reached this highest level and became “God.” He had a mortal wife who also became a “Goddess.” He physically had sexual relations with Mary and Jesus became mortal from his spirit life as the eldest son of “God.”
Mormons recognize God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit, but all three are not one substance but completely different beings forming one “godhead.”
They feel the early Christian Church became corrupted by pagan influences at the Council of Nicea. The Church was finally “restored” through appearances by God, Jesus and some of the apostles to Joseph Smith, beginning in 1820 at age 14. (Smith and his mother and father all believed in “visions, prophecies and folk magic.”) Joseph Smith viewed himself as the “prophet” of God who spoke to the people through him. The LDS still has a “prophet” who can have visions from God and announce new Church beliefs, such as the acceptance of African Americans into the “priesthood” in 1978.
Further beliefs: When people die, the “spirit” is separated from the body and either goes to “spirit heaven” or “spirit prison” waiting for the second coming; Jesus appeared to the people of America after his resurrection; and God, Jesus, and “resurrected beings” have bodies of flesh and bone.
They believe there is no salvation outside the LDS Church, there is no salvation without accepting Joseph Smith as a prophet, and Satan originated the idea that belief in Jesus Christ alone is all that is needed for salvation.
Mormons believe the entire world must be converted to Mormonism, and they proselytize aggressively.
The final item is their belief in “temple garments,” often referred to as “Mormon underwear.” These are worn day and night, and are required to be worn to enter a temple. They are believed to be a constant reminder of the LDS covenant with God and are a “source of protection from evil.”
These are some of the beliefs of Mitt Romney, the man who would be president; beliefs he does not want to discuss. What do you think?
“No you missed the point. A Christian is saved by belief alone. Nothing else. What else do you think is necessary? Is John 3:16 an error? is it a lie? You don’t think water baptism is necessary do you? none of the Disciples were water baptized. zero. Paul was baptized IN THE SPIRIT. Not water. You don’t think the thief on the cross was baptized —do you? . You don’t think he did “good legalistic works — go you? Mormons are saved if they accept steadfastly that Jesus is the Son of God. That is it.Same as the Catholics or the Methodists.”
But Mormons don’t believe He is the Son of God. They believe he is the son of god, brother of you and me and Lucifer, had multiple wives, and demanded we obey Joseph Smith and the LDS. The scripture I provided from Paul is quite clear that anyone who teaches a different Christ is in danger of hell fire.
Gal 1:6-9 I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: (7) Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. (8) But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. (9) As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.
They call the Christ of the bible a liar when they promote stuff like this:
“Joseph Smith holds the keys of this last dispensation, and is now engaged behind the vail in the great work of the last days. I can tell our beloved brother Christians who have slain the Prophets and butchered and otherwise caused the death of thousands of Latter-day Saints, the priests who have thanked God in their prayers and thanksgiving from the pulpit that we have been plundered, driven, and slain, and the deacons under the pulpit, and their brethren and sisters in their closets, who have thanked God, thinking that the Latter-day Saints were wasted away, something that no doubt will mortify them—something that, to say the least, is a matter of deep regret to them—namely, that no man or woman in this dispensation will ever enter into the celestial kingdom of God without the consent of Joseph Smith. From the day that the Priesthood was taken from the earth to the winding-up scene of all things, every man and woman must have the certificate of Joseph Smith, junior, as a passport to their entrance into the mansion where God and Christ are—I with you and you with me. I cannot go there without his consent. He holds the keys of that kingdom for the last dispensation—the keys to rule in the spirit-world; and he rules there triumphantly, for he gained full power and a glorious victory over the power of Satan while he was yet in the flesh, and was a martyr to his religion and to the name of Christ, which gives him a most perfect victory in the spirit-world. He reigns there as supreme a being in his sphere, capacity, and calling, as God does in heaven. Many will exclaim—”Oh, that is very disagreeable! It is preposterous! We cannot bear the thought!” But it is true.”
(Second Prophet of the LDS, Brigham Young, JOD 7:288-9)
Aye, but for me it shall be Sarah Palin, a true Christan woman.
That is simply not true. There is a long list of things Mormons must do to be saved.
I won't reply any further because I hate to get into theological arguments; no one is ever able to convince the person on the other side of the debate.
But are you sure Romney is just denying your personal view of Christ, and not Christ himself?
I really don't need, or want, an answer. It's just something to think about.
I'm also reminded of the fall of Constantinople. The Christian leaders in Europe argued among themselves instead of uniting. Result: the islamic armies besieged, then captured, on of the the greatest Christian cities on earth.
So if you live in Nevada, vote him out!
Sad fasce, no flag on your homepage.
A man’s belief isn’t what saves. We are saved by grace through the means of faith (see Ephesians 2). The object of our faith is the One who saves, so it matters very much who the object of our faith is. While Mormons believe certain true facts about Christ, their Jesus is not the Jesus Christ of Scripture. Mere belief in a man named Jesus Christ is not salvific belief. Consider Matthew 7 where Christ taught that on the day of judgment there would be many who said “Lord Lord” (meaning they will be many who had claimed Him as Lord) to whom He would say ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’
Mitt Romney won’t gain Heavenly access with his adherence to Mormon theology. I just hope by holding my nose and voting for him he will gain awhile House access over the current occupant.
Who would bring it up? He is a member of the anti-Christian political party, his potential voters don't care.
Reid is a devout, and devoted Mormon though. He is issued a special ID card proving that he has been interviewed and examined, and that he has paid the proper amount, a card that he is required to renew each year.
Mitt Romney won’t gain Heavenly access with his adherence to Mormon theology. I just hope by holding my nose and voting for him he will gain White House access over the current occupant.
Not only that, but the religious test applies to legal qualifications for office. Members of a political party can impose any qualifications they desire on candidates they select to run for office.
Mormons believe he is the son of God, brother of Lucifer, and that believing in Jesus Christ is not enough. One must be baptized Mormon . . . . .
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The problem with all this discussion is that different books of the Bible describe Jesus quite differently than the orthodox Christian model today. First century Christians would not seem very out of place in a LDS church.
Don’t misunderstand me. I’m not saying that Mormons are Christians, at least if Christian means descended from the councils held at Nicea. Mormons do however follow Christ, that may not be popular but they do follow Christ and His teachings. Perhaps Mormons are a little more serious about that following than some other denominations.
To me it would be hard to argue that Presbyterians are are not Christian but to allow queers to hold the priesthood and lead congregations, to me, that is not following Christ. Then perhaps the closest church to THE Christian church, (namely Roman Catholic church) is the Episcopal church who now has queer bishops. If Episcopal and Presbyterians are Christian then I say the heck with it let the Mormons be Christian, they are a lot closer than either of the others.
This thing about Lucifer being the brother of Christ is just silliness. Christ says he is a son of God, Christ says that all us humans are sons of God. If Lucifer is a son of God then we are all brothers. If Lucifer is not a son of God where did he come from? I realize that your argument is that Christ is not a son of anybody, he is the all eternal God, but that is not what He says, He says he is Gods and man’s son, brothers, silly but I’m not offended by it.
Most of the Mormons I talk to don’t really care what they are called as long as it is known that they follow Christ.
Regarding the question of whether Mormonism is Christian though, there is no disagreement among the different Christian denominations.
Greek Orthodox, Baptist, Methodist, Roman Catholic, Presbyterian, and so on, they are all on the same page in regards to the question of this thread topic, Mormonism is a new 'religion' created by Joseph Smith, it is not Christian.
“But are you sure Romney is just denying your personal view of Christ, and not Christ himself?
I really don’t need, or want, an answer. It’s just something to think about.”
You tell me. The scripture is clear.
John 1:1-3 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. (2) The same was in the beginning with God. (3) All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
John 10:30 I and my Father are one.
Joh 8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.
Joh 8:56-59 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad. (57) Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham? (58) Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am. (59) Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.
The Teachings of Spencer W. Kimball, Pg.163
“The importance of not accommodating temptation in the least degree is underlined by the Savior’s example. Did not he recognize the danger when he was on the mountain with his fallen brother, Lucifer, being sorely tempted by that master tempter? He could have opened the door and flirted with danger by saying, “All right, Satan, I’ll listen to your proposition. I need not succumb, I need not yield, I need not accept — but I’ll listen.”
http://bible-truth.org/jesusbro.htm
Truly, I don’t care that he is a Mormon, I care that he is a lunatic and the leader of the senate. I don’t think being a Mormon made him a lunatic. Probable just old fashion greed and drugs among others things did the trick for him.
James 3:17....something about faith without corresponding works is without merit....
3:18 something like show me faith without works and I will show faith by works.....just saying.
Nope...not Nevada. :-)
You keep bring him up though.
“The problem with all this discussion is that different books of the Bible describe Jesus quite differently than the orthodox Christian model today. First century Christians would not seem very out of place in a LDS church.”
The first century New Testament greatly disagrees with you.
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“This thing about Lucifer being the brother of Christ is just silliness. Christ says he is a son of God, Christ says that all us humans are sons of God. If Lucifer is a son of God then we are all brothers. If Lucifer is not a son of God where did he come from? I realize that your argument is that Christ is not a son of anybody, he is the all eternal God, but that is not what He says, He says he is Gods and man’s son, brothers, silly but I’m not offended by it.”
Jesus Christ is the Son of God, and the Son of God is God eternal. Anyone with any knowledge of the Old and New Testament knows this:
Dan 7:13-14 I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. (14) And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.
Isa_9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
You cannot deny what is essential. Satan is never once called one of God’s children, though he was created by God. Neither are those who do not believe in Jesus Christ. They are called children of the devil. There is no “brotherhood” here, and you cannot claim that the Mormons do not deny the essential and eternal fact that Jesus Christ is God.
nonsense....Satan believes that Jesus Christ is the savior....he is not saved by his belief...
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