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To: Alberta's Child; Salvation; highpockets; marshmallow
I am shocked and saddened by the Pope stepping down. Non-Catholics have complained in the past that the Pope was "too old" and should call it quits. For years I told non-Catholics that a Catholic Pope would NEVER "retire", and this week I have egg on my face. I'm at a loss to explain it. The Catholic Church has always valued church tradition and precedent and abides by it.

While it's true that Pope have resigned in the past, and there's no question whether it's possible for a Pope to step down (probably at least 5 or 6 have done) -- there is NO record of ANY Pope -- in the 2000 year history of the church, stepping down because of advanced age or fatigue. It's simply NOT done. (For similar reasons, the Queen of England, who is older than Benedict XVI, will never "retire" and will remain in office until she dies)

The last Pope to resign did so 600 years ago, and that was because there was a major crisis in the church and he needed to do so in order to end a schism and have a new Pope elected that all the warring factions would accept.

The Papacy is considered a lifetime job for the obvious reason that it would create a serious problem in the church if the "former" Pope and the "current" Pope were alive simultaneously and made conflicting statements about a current issue. I believe that's partially the reason the last Pope who stepped down because a voluntary prisoner of the Vatican and never made public appearances after stepping down. The Pope physically deteriorating or becoming very old and slow to respond has never been grounds for a Pope to "leave office". John Paul II suffered from advanced stages of Parkinson's and was in much worse physical shape than Benedict XVI towards the end of his reign, and never "retired" despite repeated calls from the secular media to do so. One pope in the 1700s continued to reign even though he was physically bedridden and blind for the last 10 years of his papacy.

If the Pope had suffered an extreme medical condition that left him completed unable to function (say a major stroke), THAT might be grounds to break with tradition and have him resign because the office would be defacto vacant as long as he remained alive, but that hasn't happened in this case. Benedict XVI's mind is fully functional, he is not an invalid, and has not been diagnosed with dementia, Alzheimer's Disease, etc., and there is claim from the Vatican or speculation that he's "dying" (and if he was "dying", he wouldn't resign but would rather inform the Cardinals of the situations so they could stand by to arrange a conclave once he did pass away). The only statement from the Vatican is he feels too old and fatigued to carry on.

I think this sets a very bad precedent for future Popes, if they can just "retire" because they're past 65 and feel tired, future Popes could treat the "job" the same they would a secular institution.

23 posted on 02/17/2013 8:47:04 PM PST by BillyBoy ( Impeach Obama? Yes We Can!)
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To: BillyBoy

There’s a disease that eats away at one’s body. A person at our church had it. He was fine and could walk. Next time I saw him he was on crutches.

Then he was using a walker and eventually ended up in a wheelchair before his body was totally riddled by this disease.

Could something like this be happening. If I remember correctly, this disease eats away at either the muscles or the nerves.

As I said above, the tailors were having a difficult time downsizing his vestments and keeping up with his loss of weight.

Puzzling.

Anyone know what it is called?


24 posted on 02/17/2013 8:55:06 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: BillyBoy
You raise a lot of very good points here, but I'm going to take issue with one important item in your post:

Benedict XVI's mind is fully functional, he is not an invalid, and has not been diagnosed with dementia, Alzheimer's Disease, etc. ...

You and I have no idea what his physical or mental condition is. Everything anyone says in the media is really nothing more than pure speculation or is based on public statements from people who are not medical professionals and have no knowledge of any medical issues that may be in play here.

62 posted on 02/18/2013 8:29:54 AM PST by Alberta's Child ("I am the master of my fate ... I am the captain of my soul.")
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To: BillyBoy
I think this sets a very bad precedent for future Popes, if they can just "retire" because they're past 65 and feel tired, future Popes could treat the "job" the same they would a secular institution.

I've been thinking along the same lines. The "bad" precedent being set for future Popes - and many Catholics - is that it is no longer seen as a Divinely-appointed position but something decided by a popularity contest of sorts. If this authority is God-ordained - and, presumably, a God-enabled anointing - then, how is it that such a person decides he no longer wants the job and "retires"? Did the Apostle Peter retire? Did Paul? If God truly is behind the appointment of every Pope and it has historically been a lifelong anointing, then is God not able to empower such a man and overcome any and all impediments to fulfilling his purpose? This retirement, to me, has the appearance of a man who, as we know never really wanted to be the Pope, now has an "out" so he can spend whatever time he has left in luxurious comfort and ease getting to sleep in every day he wants, never lacking for anything.

As a former Roman Catholic and now a born-again Christian, I don't accept or recognize the Pope's authority over myself or all Christians. It is times like these that only reinforces my sense of the rightness of my decision to come out of Catholicism and into the light of the Gospel of the grace of God.

71 posted on 02/21/2013 11:27:29 PM PST by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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