Skip to comments.Penn Jillette Destroys Modernist Cafeteria "Catholic" Piers Morgan
Posted on 03/07/2013 3:20:53 PM PST by NKP_Vet
The outspoken atheist Penn Jillette destroys the modernist Piers Morgan in a debate on Catholicism and the papacy.
Penn Jillette is intellectually honest.
He’s also intellectually gifted, and an awesome debater.
Even an atheist can see through that crap
he was wrong on the Boy Scouts I think
Well, I’m not a Catholic - I’m Jewish, but from this exchange I think it is pretty clear that Piers Morgan is not a Catholic either.
That was my assessment as well.
I don’t think Jillette “destroyed” Morgan but, rather, he simply brought him back to the substance of what a confessing Catholic ought to believe. If not, then they are not Catholic. The lie exists when deceivers are allowed to enter into a body and “co-opt” the purpose and direction of that body. Fools like Morgan (not really smart enough to understand subversion) simply provide useful idiot static that resonates with other thoughtless and oh-so-smarmy dolts that want their cake and eat it, too.
they don't call it dogma for nothing, so stop trying to bastardize it and just quit already
I see many ‘Piers Morgans’ as Sunday Morning Mass as well as a few on the Altar at some of the Churches I’ve attended.
Penn Jillette is one of the few public atheists who’s not in a constant state of misery or outrage.
I’ve been telling my Cafeteria Catholic acquaintances this for years. Funny to see the same point articulated by an atheist on CNN.
This video is helpful for understanding and I find myself in agreement with what I heard from Jillette. Otoh, I have heard many Catholics and atheists alike echoing Morgan almost verbatim.
The Morgans are all too common in this world, but I am surprised to find out he could be so relevant, though perhaps it wasn't him so much as his guest who was relevant.
With the patience of a saint. (or someone saint-like).
Seriously, I saw him on a clip from ... I'm going to say "The View", but they're all alike ... and the women kept interrupting and jumping on his statements and he kept to his message and his argument, neither taking the bait nor raising his voice to match their shrillness. He stayed cool throughout. You have to admire that in an age when every debate is a shout-fest of zingers.
Yup. If Piers Morgan doesn’t like what the Catholic church teaches, he’s more than free to leave. No one is stopping him.
Come to think of it, the same could be said to him about his opposition to our Constitutionally protected guns...
Just my two bits.
It is abundantly clear that Morgan cannot think critically or rationally at all on any topic.
Morgan’s thinking that the Eternal Church should change with the times is in line with his thinking that the Second Amendment can be ‘reinterpreted’ out of existence.
Yup. That’s Progressivism for ya’; Through force, bullying, and fiat, they want to change everything to their own liking, without any regard for those who are happy with the way things are.
Absolutely. Bright guy, but horribly wrong on some issues.
Yes but if all athiests were like Penn Jillette, I would want to live in that world.
Piers makes a career out of getting destroyed. The only reason anyone watches him is to see him jumping off the cliff once again.
Exactly! I don’t get people who do that. It’s like joining the chess club then bringing a pack of cards and trying to start a poker game.
Worse, people like Morgan want the chess club to say “poker has always been part of playing chess or should have been.”
First, Penn recognizes that the Pope does not always speak at the highest level of infallibility. Then, he accepts Piers’ misrepresentation of the church’s social teachings as being at the highest level of infallibility. In fact, several of the things Piers throws out there, e.g., celibate priesthood, have been described as honored traditions of the church. I don’t hold Penn responsible either for knowing the difference between honored traditions and infallible teachings, or for knowing the nuance between degrees of infallibility. It could be that Penn was simply engaging Piers in banter on Piers’ terms.
I think it is entirely acceptable for Catholics to pray for the church in matters that are merely tradition, as long as they also pray for patience. Possibly one Pope will discuss celibacy as a honored tradition so that a subsequent Pope, a century later, might make some exceptions to the rule of celibacy in certain extraordinary condition, so that yet another Pope might regularize the matter. When you’re in the church business for a couple thousand years, you don’t have to rush into anything.
I think it is also acceptable for Catholic to pray for the church in matters that have a less than the highest level of infallibility. Through two thousand years, there are only a small number of pronouncements deemed to have this highest level of infallibility. For example, the doctrine that Jesus was fully man and was fully God. Interestingly, none of these involve the social teachings of the church, upon which Piers dwells.
But Piers is not showing any consideration for the importance of tradition in leading a flock of a billion people, of wide ranging education and economic circumstances. People who don’t need the church, personally, to lead happy and productive lives should not be so critical of the church. Rather, they should be helpful.
Getting back to Penn, he kind of misrepresented Luther by ascribing to him an individual interpretation of the Bible. Luther did indeed support the widespread dissemination of the Bible, and the teaching of reading to every child capable of learning. But, he also taught disobedience to the state was a mortal sin. His freedom of consciousness was, shall we say, limited.
I heard a story once where when Teller was signing autographs or some such thing a man walked up to him and told him he was a big fan and a christian and asked if he did not mind if he could give him a gospel tract that detailed his christan testimony. Teller said that no he did not mind and in fact according to the story Teller said he does not mind people who are christians who believe Christ is the only way to God sharing their testimony.
Beck has been working on him. He said that when they first met, Penn was very hostile. Now, not so much.
Here is Penn’s take on that story. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZhG-tkQ_Q2w
When Morgan said Jesus never said anything about women not being ordained he was showing his ignorance again of the faith, if he has any at all. JP2 was asked the same thing a few years ago ago; was asked why there are no women priests, and could he might change that doctrine. His answer was he could not change what Christ had started. He said Christ chose 12 men to be the his first apostles, and the church has no authority to change what Christ has instituted. End of discussion.
“I avoid Morgan religiously.”
Your unintentional pun made me chuckle.
More on interview. Read the comments.
And among these 12, at least one was a married men. Thus, a celibate priesthood is only an honored tradition in the Catholic Church. John Paul II affirmed both that the unmarried priest helps to represent Christ who was himself unmarried, and that this being unmarried is not essential to the priesthood.
As to whether the reservation of priesthood to male is inviolate, it is a matter of church doctrine and, hence, a much more serious matter, and no movement can be expected any time soon. But, it is not the highest level of church law. Conceivably, the issue might be addressed in the future. But, it would be wrong to be anxious about the matter.
“And among these 12, at least one was a married men”
I didn’t mention this. Priests could intend be married and many Catholic priests are, depending on the circumstances. This is not dogma of the Church, just a determination made hundreds of years ago. But there will be no women priests, for the reason that JP2 articulated.
I’m praying that a “Little Bird” is working on Penn Jillette. And maybe the scales will fall from his eyes.
Yet see the comments on the video (Penn’s description of the person who gave him a new testament - nothing vile). The most angry comments were from other angry atheists.
Wow, you heard Teller speak? ... Kool
No, my pastor told this stoet in a sermon and as I recall he showed a video. It was probably the one referenced.
Teller doesn’t speak during his act... but he is capable of speech.
My point was that Teller was not playing a part at that time. When he speaks he’s being the really great down-to-earth guy he is at heart. To get to expereince that side of men like Teller, or Penn Jillette for that matter, is a special occasion.