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Joe Biden and Nancy Pelosi will represent the United States at Pope Francisí Inaugural Mass
http://www.catholicvote.org ^ | March 15, 2013 | Stephen Kokx

Posted on 03/15/2013 7:44:34 PM PDT by NKP_Vet

Vice President Joe Biden, Minority leader Nancy Pelosi, New Mexico Governor Susana Martinez and Georgetown University President John J. DeGioia will represent the United States at the Mass of Inauguration for Pope Francis on March 19th, according to the Daily Caller.

I sincerely hope Pope Francis denies Communion to Nancy Pelosi and Joe Biden. Not because I’m a jerk, but because it’s for their own good.

In order to receive Communion worthily you must 1) be in a state of grace 2) have made a good confession since your last mortal sin 3) believe in transubstantiation 4) observe the Eucharistic fast and 5) not be under an ecclesiastical censure such as excommunication.

(Excerpt) Read more at catholicvote.org ...


TOPICS: Current Events; Moral Issues; Religion & Culture; Religion & Politics
KEYWORDS: obamainsultsnewpope
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To: Jim Noble
latae sententiae
121 posted on 03/16/2013 10:12:07 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Rashputin
And this one is meaningless, Vatican Chief Justice: Pro-Abortion Politicians Must Not Receive Holy Communion

From that article:

In 2004, as archbishop of St. Louis, Burke said he would not serve Communion to then-presidential candidate John Kerry (D-Mass.), now the secretary of State, because of his pro-abortion views.

And from the Papal mass in 2008:

Unless everybody's on the same page, words are meaningless.

122 posted on 03/16/2013 10:23:47 PM PDT by Jeff Chandler (WHAT DIFFERENCE DOES IT MAKE?)
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To: ansel12; dangus
The strategy to reach Catholic voters with "public humiliation" and  "flash and dazzle" (comment #71) is sounding a lot like a broken record.
123 posted on 03/16/2013 10:23:59 PM PDT by PeevedPatriot
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To: NKP_Vet

Between the two of them, they should have a lot of confessing to do.


124 posted on 03/16/2013 10:34:32 PM PDT by Rocky (Obama is pure evil.)
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To: PeevedPatriot
Don't be silly, how can a single post be a broken record?

We have to figure out a way to reach the average Catholic voter, and I think that some highly visible cases of public humiliation and rejection, and even excommunication, or in Law’s case, removal from the hierarchy and being reduced to normal citizen status and mere pew sitter, would receive massive publicity and would penetrate into the Catholic rank and file and the immigrants.
We need some flash and dazzle, some heavy public battles and publicity to reach the average people who don’t keep up with much media and make them realize that they better get with the program and start voting as Christians.
71 posted on 3/15/2013 4:15:18 PM by ansel12

It can't be a broken record since it isn't a strategy at all, but it was something that sounded exciting on this thread and was posted once.

If pro-life conservatives don't figure out a way to change the Catholic vote to a conservative, pro-life vote, then we are doomed.

We have to figure out a way to reach those voters, when everyone was talking about all the bold actions this Pope was going to take, like embarrassing America's top Catholic figures who also happen to be pro-abortion democrats, I got a little hopeful.

Don't worry, as the thread progressed, I realized that nothing is going to change, it never does.

125 posted on 03/16/2013 10:41:34 PM PDT by ansel12 ( August 29,2008 A Natural Born Reformer inadvertently unleashed within palace walls, change ensues.)
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To: ansel12

There is nothing to figure out. Those that are pro-life and stand by that principle, good. Those that are not, there is no changing. God is not involved with changing evil nature.


126 posted on 03/16/2013 11:07:44 PM PDT by RedHeeler
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To: RedHeeler

We have already seen success in changing the white Catholic vote in the most recent elections, we need to try and penetrate into the Catholic vote even more if we want to win elections.


127 posted on 03/16/2013 11:13:55 PM PDT by ansel12 ( August 29,2008 A Natural Born Reformer inadvertently unleashed within palace walls, change ensues.)
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To: ansel12
Numerous comments about Cardinal Law on multiple threads sounds like a broken record. But it's late and I've no interest in quibbling :)

We have to figure out a way to reach those voters,

I agree with you but not on a strategy of humiliation and rejection.

when everyone was talking about all the bold actions this Pope was going to take, like embarrassing America's top Catholic figures who also happen to be pro-abortion democrats, I got a little hopeful.

I think I understand your sentiments. I have no idea what to expect from this pope. What I hope for is sincere public repentance from these politicians and an end to the scandal they cause. I wouldn't say nothing will change but I think change is likely to happen more slowly than either of us would like :(

As for reaching Catholic voters, my perspective is that a call to personal holiness is less flashy but probably likely to be more effective in the long run than holding up humiliated figures for them to identify with. I don't know about you, but for me, I find it easier to change my ways when I'm motivated to achieve something good than when I'm trying to eliminate something undesirable. Just my two cents.

128 posted on 03/16/2013 11:33:57 PM PDT by PeevedPatriot
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To: ansel12

Ansel12, I truly beleive that reuniting Our Nation, is not by cajoling any group/bloc to short term gain. True growth will only come through, hard fought for establishment of traditional values/culture. Our current society will never allow that, until given no choice, by their own choices.


129 posted on 03/16/2013 11:52:16 PM PDT by RedHeeler
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To: PeevedPatriot

Oh for crying out loud, when the rumor was that this new Pope kicked out Law, then there was a couple of days about Law with Catholics piling on him, someone that I had never paid attention to before, but I came to accept the general catholic view here and assumed that he had done something wrong.

I never said anything about “a strategy of humiliation and rejection” of Catholic voters, that was about (again) the Catholic claims that this new Pope might humiliate and reject the two representatives of the United States, who also just happen to be our most prominent Catholics and the leaders of the Catholic political party in America.

Catholics have been voting democrat since they came here, and they evidently always will, a day or two of hope has been erased as this thread returns to the usual, for a few hours Catholics here were saying something different about Law, and Biden, and Pelosi, and how this Pope was punishing them and confronting them, then everyone got back in line.


130 posted on 03/16/2013 11:54:50 PM PDT by ansel12 ( August 29,2008 A Natural Born Reformer inadvertently unleashed within palace walls, change ensues.)
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To: RedHeeler

The democrats have the Catholic vote forever, and changed the immigration laws in 1965 to import them by the tens, even hundreds of millions, and their hope for the future is to continue importing as many Catholic voters as they can.

I had a days worth of hope that this Pope was going to send a message to America that would give life a chance.


131 posted on 03/17/2013 12:01:55 AM PDT by ansel12 ( August 29,2008 A Natural Born Reformer inadvertently unleashed within palace walls, change ensues.)
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To: Jeff Chandler
Well, when there's a Pope who makes it crystal clear which is the required page I believe everyone will turn to that page rather than singing their own song.

I just happen to believe Pope Francis is the sort of Pope who will do that, you don't think so, and we'll both soon know whether or not my expecting the Pope to be Catholic is too much to ask.

132 posted on 03/17/2013 12:17:19 AM PDT by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)
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To: ansel12

your Hope, is more than all the days. you live/send the message of life, please never forget that fact


133 posted on 03/17/2013 12:32:14 AM PDT by RedHeeler
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To: ansel12
I never said anything about “a strategy of humiliation and rejection” of Catholic voters

You advocated a strategy of REACHING "the average Catholic voter" via "highly visible cases of public humiliation and rejection." And "massive publicity" to "penetrate into the Catholic rank and file and the immigrants." Is this not holding up disgraced Catholics for them to identify with? Did you not specify a need for "flash and dazzle, some heavy public battles and publicity to reach the average people who don't keep up with much media?" With a purpose to "make them realize they better get with the program?"

My suggestion was a call to something positive, like personal holiness, as a stronger motivator than holding up a pariah. My mistake. Negative narratives don't accommodate positive strategies.

134 posted on 03/17/2013 1:08:29 AM PDT by PeevedPatriot
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To: PeevedPatriot

You don’t want Vice president Biden and Ex-speaker Nancy Pelosi refused communion as was first declared that this new Pope was going to do on this thread?

I never proposed a “strategy”, I thought that was what you guys wanted and were saying that this “new” Pope was going to do, I merely expressed hope at the result.

The Catholic vote is killing us and supports the pro-abortion movement and the democrat party, what I am learning here is that there is no Catholic desire to change it.

Do you know that Catholics have only voted republican five times in history, and that non-Catholic Christians (Protestants) have only voted democrat, 3 times in history (1932, 1936, and 1964)?


135 posted on 03/17/2013 1:19:09 AM PDT by ansel12 ( August 29,2008 A Natural Born Reformer inadvertently unleashed within palace walls, change ensues.)
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To: ansel12
You don’t want Vice president Biden and Ex-speaker Nancy Pelosi refused communion as was first declared that this new Pope was going to do on this thread?

I want it handled by the cardinals so they don't present themselves for communion in the first place. They should be instructed to stay in their seats and it shouldn't even get to the point of a refusal. The Mass is an occasion of solemn worship and it shouldn't be turned into a spectacle.

The Catholic vote is killing us and supports the pro-abortion movement and the democrat party, what I am learning here is that there is no Catholic desire to change it.

Now see, this is the kind of statement that perturbs me. Disagreement about methods isn't disagreement about need for change. As for supporting the proabortion movement, only ONCE in the last 5 years have I met a nonCatholic on the sidewalks outside the abortuary. But Catholics are there freezing, roasting, getting soaked, sunburned, and parched. While I can appreciate your frustration I don't appreciate being painted with the wide proabortion brush.

As for stats, it's been a long time since my stats and surveying courses, but I remember enough to look at them with a grain of salt. I don't deny that many Catholics are leaving the faith outside the voting booth. But I don't believe the data is as pure as some would have us believe. My cousin's St Bernard would be classified Catholic in some of those polls!

Bottom line, there is hope on a number of fronts but I'm too tired to get into it just now. Maybe if all of us spent more time praying for each other instead of tearing into each other we'd be making more progress ;)

136 posted on 03/17/2013 2:03:47 AM PDT by PeevedPatriot
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To: PeevedPatriot

Always the same, life and conservatism, truth and reality, means nothing, pretending that the Catholic vote is the opposite of what it is, is everything.

Obama, call to your people, send Pelosi and Biden to represent the Catholics as you should, it would be weird to send anyone other than the two most prominent Catholics in America, and the two Catholic leaders of the party of the majority of Catholic voters.

The Catholic vote is exactly what it is supposed to be evidently.


137 posted on 03/17/2013 2:32:23 AM PDT by ansel12 ( August 29,2008 A Natural Born Reformer inadvertently unleashed within palace walls, change ensues.)
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To: NKP_Vet

Look for a BIG rebuilding and clean-up of the Church to start once Pope Francis gets installed on Tuesday, inlcuding down the road going after politicos who are pro-abort/euthinasia types.


138 posted on 03/17/2013 4:08:02 AM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: Rashputin
I believe everyone will turn to that page rather than singing their own song.

You have no idea how much I hope you're right.

139 posted on 03/17/2013 6:43:41 AM PDT by Jeff Chandler (WHAT DIFFERENCE DOES IT MAKE?)
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To: Jeff Chandler

That is not Cardinal Burke giving communion to Lurch Kerry,


140 posted on 03/17/2013 9:35:21 AM PDT by NKP_Vet
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