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"Anyone who does not pray to the Lord prays to the devil." Homily of the Holy Father Pope Francis
Vatican.VA ^ | March 14, 2013 | Pope Francis

Posted on 03/15/2013 8:17:53 PM PDT by PanzerKardinal

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It is apparent that the Holy Spirit has given us a pope...

who is a man who will speak the truth, however hard.

who is preparing us for spiritual warfare.

who is faithful.

1 posted on 03/15/2013 8:17:53 PM PDT by PanzerKardinal
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To: PanzerKardinal

I think your right. May not be perfect but who is except the Lord himself.


2 posted on 03/15/2013 8:23:49 PM PDT by Bigtigermike
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To: PanzerKardinal
"When we do not profess Jesus Christ, we profess the worldliness of the devil, a demonic worldliness."

So why does he also state, “I deeply hope to contribute to the progress of the relations that Jews and Catholics hold since the Vatican Council II, through a spirit of renewed collaboration put to the service of a world more and more in harmony with the will of the Creator.” (emphasis mine)

3 posted on 03/15/2013 8:33:58 PM PDT by ebb tide
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To: PanzerKardinal

From the last lines, sounds like Mary is the most important piece in getting things done in the Catholic Church. The queen of heaven in Jeremiah 7 and 44 is good reading in thethe bible compared to the fifth glorious mystery coronation in the instruction manual for how to pray the rosary.

My prayer for all of us is that the Holy Spirit,through the intercession of the Blessed Virgin Mary,our Mother,will grant us this grace: to walk,to build,to profess Jesus Christ crucified. Amen.


4 posted on 03/15/2013 8:34:49 PM PDT by delchiante
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To: PanzerKardinal

“It is apparent that the Holy Spirit has given us a pope...”

Indeed it does. Praise God. And thank you Jesus.

Pope Francis is having an effect locally, I can vouch for that.


5 posted on 03/15/2013 8:38:57 PM PDT by MichaelCorleone (A return to Jesus and prayer in the schools is the only way.)
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To: delchiante
Queen of Heaven?

Are you nuts?

The Queen of Heaven is not Mary...it is Semiramis.

6 posted on 03/15/2013 8:41:39 PM PDT by RoosterRedux (Get armed, practice in the use of your weapons, get physically fit, stay alert!)
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To: PanzerKardinal

Thank God He Said Jesus, Ye must be Born again.


7 posted on 03/15/2013 8:46:28 PM PDT by factmart
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To: RoosterRedux
The Queen of Heaven is not Mary...it is Semiramis.

The entity Jeremiah was mocking was Ashtoreth or Astarte. She, if she exists, is not in heaven.

The Mother of the Lord is very much in heaven. She is a Queen (the Hebrew term is "gebirah", great lady) because she is the Mother of the King. (Martin Luther agreed with me on that.)

8 posted on 03/15/2013 8:52:46 PM PDT by Campion ("Social justice" begins in the womb)
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To: MichaelCorleone

Really? Cool.

What effect is he having? Also, where is “local”?


9 posted on 03/15/2013 9:03:39 PM PDT by married21
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To: PanzerKardinal

I pray to an old poster of kathy Ireland. Does that count?


10 posted on 03/15/2013 9:31:10 PM PDT by BigCinBigD (...Was that okay?)
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To: RoosterRedux

EFifth glorious mystery from -the how to pray the rosary manual
The Coronation
Let us reflect:
The Blessed Virgin Mary is crowned QUEEN OF HEAVEN and Earth. She is Mother of all men, and mediatrix of all graces...etc
Right there in that Catholic pamphlet that I got in my hands..
The church may want to revisit that phrasing in their next publication..


11 posted on 03/15/2013 9:50:16 PM PDT by delchiante
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To: Campion

He had told a crowd of some 100,000 people packed in rain-soaked St. Peter’s Square just after his election that he intended to pray to the Madonna “that she may watch over all of Rome.”

“You shall not make for yourself a carved image—any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. For I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.” Exodus 20:4-6


12 posted on 03/15/2013 10:14:16 PM PDT by delchiante
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To: delchiante
The church may want to revisit that phrasing in their next publication..

More likely they'll ignore your advice :) We know from parallels between Luke 1 and 2 Sam 6 (chart here if you like) that Mary is the Ark of the New Covenant. The fifth glorious mystery is scriptural (Rev 11:19-12:1).

13 posted on 03/15/2013 10:31:25 PM PDT by PeevedPatriot
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To: delchiante
Campion can answer you better than I can. In the meantime, I submit to you that in Ex 25:18 God commands that "two cherubim of gold" be fashioned. A few verses later he says he will meet Moses between those two images and speak further with him. In Ex 21:33-34 God commands that images and adornments be placed on priestly vestments. In Num 21:8 God commands Moses to make an image of a serpent. That serpent is later broken, but only after it was used as an idol (2 Kg 18:4). In the 6th chapter of 1st Kings we find Solomon's temple filled with carvings and graven images yet a few chapters later (9:3) we read that God has consecrated this temple and promises "my heart will be there for all time." Would he consecrate a temple of idols?
14 posted on 03/15/2013 10:38:23 PM PDT by PeevedPatriot
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To: PanzerKardinal

According to his own criteria, I guess “pope” Francis was praying to Satan when, according to Roman Catholic sources, his very first act as “pope” was to go to the largest cathedral in the world dedicated to the worship of Mary, bow before an ancient idol of her and pray to her not to the Lord Jesus Christ. He then proceeded to lay flowers at the base of the idols image! Talk about getting off to a great start, he literally admitted by his own words and actions that he was praying to Satan!


15 posted on 03/15/2013 10:47:40 PM PDT by Jmouse007 (Lord deliver us from evil, in Jesus name, amen.)
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To: Jmouse007
Talk about bearing false witness. The pope wasn't doing as you allege any more than I worship a hunk of stone when I kneel at my dad's marker to pray in the cemetery after placing flowers on his grave.

And when he asks Mary to pray for him he isn't worshiping her any more than he'd be worshiping you if he asked you for your prayers. The only difference is that you're on earth and she isn't. She's alive in heaven with our other brothers and sisters in the faith who preceded us there.

I don't mind you disagreeing with Catholic beliefs although I'd be inclined to take your criticisms more seriously if you accurately stated the Catholic belief or practice with which you disagree. Peace be with you.

16 posted on 03/16/2013 12:22:02 AM PDT by PeevedPatriot
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To: PanzerKardinal
"Anyone who does not pray to the Lord prays to the devil." Homily of the Holy Father Pope Francis

This is refreshing! I wonder if it will upset those confused people who pray to Mary, or statues of saints?
Anyway, I am liking this pope already.

17 posted on 03/16/2013 12:28:25 AM PDT by Lancey Howard
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To: PanzerKardinal

Thank you for this post.


18 posted on 03/16/2013 12:32:57 AM PDT by johngrace (I am a 1 John 4! Christian- declared at every Sunday Mass , Divine Mercy and Rosary prayers!)
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To: PeevedPatriot

Great answers.


19 posted on 03/16/2013 12:33:27 AM PDT by johngrace (I am a 1 John 4! Christian- declared at every Sunday Mass , Divine Mercy and Rosary prayers!)
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To: delchiante; Campion; PeevedPatriot; PanzerKardinal; MichaelCorleone
Genesis 1:25 And God made the beasts of the earth according to their kinds, and cattle, and every thing that creepeth on the earth after its kind. And God saw that it was good.
Genesis 1:26 And he said : Let us make man to our image and likeness : and let him have dominion over the fishes of the sea, and the fowls of the air, and the beasts, and the whole earth, and every creeping creature that moveth upon the earth.

God made man in His own image so by the same reasoning the anti-Catholic crowd who worship their own Most High and Holy Self selectively apply to a portion of the Luther Subset of the Bible they want to distort, all representations of a human are graven images and idols. No more movies, television, DVDs of speakers assuring you that following Eve is the same as following Christ, no more pictures of your family, and smack the Satan out of those rug rats when they draw little stick figures of their family or friends.

People who don't even accept the entire Bible telling others how to interpret Scripture are clearly not led by the author of all Scripture, Jesus Christ. Nowhere does Scripture say someone can pick out a subset of His Word and ignore the rest. Nowhere does Scripture say individuals should interpret Scripture to suit their own agenda by taking text out of context to generate a pretext for their slanders and lies. Nowhere did Jesus Christ ever even hint that portions of the Septuagint were not inspired Scripture. Nowhere did any Apostle ever say that each individual should decide on what subset of Scripture they wanted to accept. Nowhere did Christ or the Apostles ever say that the Luther Subset of the Bible was an acceptable substitute for the entire Word of God. Yet, those who worship their Self Alone, who don't even accept the entire Bible, who follow Eve rather than Christ, show up now and then to tell others they're wrong about His Word.

It's interesting how the anti-Christ anti-Christian garbage starts and stops in absolute lock step with the democrat propaganda machine attacks on Christians. I hope people take note of how the anti-Catholic crowd stays absolutely in sync with the anti-Christ democrat propaganda machine increasing posts or backing off in lock step with what the democrat anti-Christ media is doing at the moment.

Christ warned us about such folks here,

Matthew 7:15 Beware of false prophets, who come to you in the clothing of sheep, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
Matthew 7:16 By their fruits you shall know them. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles ?
Matthew 7:17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit, and the evil tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
Matthew 7:18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can an evil tree bring forth good fruit.
Matthew 7:19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit, shall be cut down, and shall be cast into the fire.
Matthew 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits you shall know them.
Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith to me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven : but he that doth the will of my Father who is in heaven, he shall enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Matthew 7:22 Many will say to me in that day: Lord, Lord, have not we prophesied in thy name, and cast out devils in thy name, and done many miracles in thy name ?
Matthew 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, you that work iniquity.

20 posted on 03/16/2013 12:40:56 AM PDT by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)
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To: Rashputin
Rashputin, I appreciate your zeal but I have to disagree with you on several levels here. Please take my comments in the charity with which they are intended :)

the anti-Catholic crowd who worship their own Most High and Holy Self

Those who dislike us don't worship themselves any more than we worship Mary, statues, or the saints. Please, let's not return the false accusations.

People who don't even accept the entire Bible telling others how to interpret Scripture are clearly not led by the author of all Scripture, Jesus Christ.

Again, let's stick to teachings of our faith please. CCC 818-819 tell us that there are elements of truth and sanctification outside the Catholic Church. Yes some nonCatholics overlook parts of scripture but that doesn't mean they are without the leading of Christ and his Holy Spirit. Others don't overlook but simply interpret them differently.

Of course we have differences with our nonCatholic brethren. Those differences don't give us license to treat them poorly though. Even if they refuse to give us the same consideration.

Peace be with you. Thanks for taking time to consider my comments :)

21 posted on 03/16/2013 1:11:11 AM PDT by PeevedPatriot
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To: PeevedPatriot

“And when he asks Mary to pray for him he isn’t worshiping her any more than he’d be worshiping you if he asked you for your prayers.”

Thanks for that image. As a Protestant I am slowly learning that the language the Catholics use with regard to Mary (and other things) are probably not what I take them to mean. And with the new Pope, I am learning more about the traditions and the meanings behind them. Most traditions can look rather silly I suppose from the outside (or the inside for that matter!) if one doesn’t know what they are all about, and their deeper meanings.


22 posted on 03/16/2013 1:25:57 AM PDT by 21twelve ("We've got the guns, and we got the numbers" adapted and revised from Jim M.)
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To: PanzerKardinal; posterchild; ColdOne; navymom1; Pat4ever; RIghtwardHo; Reaganite Republican; ...

My soul magnifies the Lord,
And my spirit rejoices in God my Savior.
For He has regarded the low estate of His handmaiden,
For behold, henceforth all generations shall call me blessed.
For He who is mighty has done great things for me, and holy is His name. And His mercy is on those who fear Him from generation to generation.
He has shown strength with His arm:
He has scattered the proud in the imagination of their hearts.
He has put down the mighty from their thrones,
and exalted those of low degree.
He has filled the hungry with good things;
and the rich He has sent empty away.
He has helped His servant Israel, in remembrance of His mercy;
As He spoke to our fathers, to Abraham and to His posterity forever.

Glory be to the Father and to the Son and to the Holy Spirit.
As it was in the beginning, is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen

Magníficat ánima mea Dóminum,
et exsultávit spíritus meus
in Deo salvatóre meo,
quia respéxit humilitátem
ancíllæ suæ.

Ecce enim ex hoc beátam
me dicent omnes generatiónes,
quia fecit mihi magna,
qui potens est,
et sanctum nomen eius,
et misericórdia eius in progénies
et progénies timéntibus eum.
Fecit poténtiam in bráchio suo,
dispérsit supérbos mente cordis sui;
depósuit poténtes de sede
et exaltávit húmiles.
Esuriéntes implévit bonis
et dívites dimísit inánes.
Suscépit Ísrael púerum suum,
recordátus misericórdiæ,
sicut locútus est ad patres nostros,
Ábraham et sémini eius in sæcula.

Glória Patri et Fílio
et Spirítui Sancto.
Sicut erat in princípio,
et nunc et semper,
et in sæcula sæculórum.

Amen.

She became the Mother of God, in which work so many and such great good things are bestowed on her as pass man’s understanding. For on this there follows all honor, all blessedness, and her unique place in the whole of mankind, among which she has no equal, namely, that she had a child by the Father in heaven, and such a Child . . . Hence men have crowded all her glory into a single word, calling her the Mother of God . . . None can say of her nor announce to her greater things, even though he had as many tongues as the earth possesses flowers and blades of grass: the sky, stars; and the sea, grains of sand. It needs to be pondered in the heart what it means to be the Mother of God.

(Commentary on the Magnificat, 1521; in Luther’s Works, Pelikan et al, vol. 21, 326)


23 posted on 03/16/2013 1:43:37 AM PDT by narses
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To: 21twelve
Thanks for your kind comment. We believe that the body of Christ is composed of earthly Christians like you and me as well as those who preceded us in heaven. When I was Protestant I misunderstood the saint thing. It isn't worship of saints but rather worship of God IN UNION WITH those who preceded us. We also believe those who preceded us to heaven are more closely united to God now in his presence. That's why we ask for their prayers on our behalf. Peace be with you :)
24 posted on 03/16/2013 1:45:07 AM PDT by PeevedPatriot
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To: PeevedPatriot
". . . the anti-Catholic crowd who worship their own Most High and Holy Self"

I see no way around concluding that anyone who relies on their own personal judgment to interpret Scripture for their self by denying all of what was taught by the Apostles and for the fifteen hundred years up to the Self Alone Rationalization, is placing them self above the Scripture they claim to interpret. Especially when they begin by throwing out a portion of the Bible and only then claim to believe in the Bible. When someone claims their own interpretation of Scripture is inerrant and that everyone from Jesus Christ, through the Apostles, and up to their favorite rationalizer is wrong, they are worshiping their Self as The Word, not Jesus Christ who is the Word. That is following Eve, not following Christ.

There are elements of the Truth outside the Catholic Church, no doubt, and pursuing those portions of the Truth rather than deciding what I wanted to believe and interpreting Scripture to suit my preferences is what led me to the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church Jesus Christ Himself founded after being Lutheran most of my life.

It's nice to be ecumenical, but those who obstinately deny the Truth by denying the real presence of Christ in the Eucharist and who constantly lie about what the One True Church teaches aren't overlooking something, they're deliberately denying His Word, deliberately telling lies, and deliberately slandering His Church. People who who the Holy Spirit is working on do not resist the Truth when it's explained to them. They pray, open their heart, and at the very least admit that they can see why there is as much reason to accept what the Catholic Church teaches as to accept what they belive contradicts it. They don't lie and slander pretending that lies and slanders are part of spreading His Word.

Making nice with those who lie about and slander the Catholic Church is not ecumenicism towards those who "overlook but simply interpret things differently", it's refusing confront those who are under a powerful delusion. A powerful delusion that blinds them with the glory of their Self and keeps them from seeing how they're being used to attack Christ and Christianity. Their very manner, in fact, slanders all of Christianity and ignoring such folks only leads others to believe there is no answer to the lies and slander and not much reflection of Christ in those who claim to be Christian whatever they claim to believe.

People who lie about the Catholic Church are confronted with the facts, that's not treating them poorly. I'd be treating them very poorly indeed if I left them to stew in their own lies and funky delusional wastes. More importantly, I'd be treating His Word poorly if I constantly threw pearls before such swine rather than obeying Scripture and letting them be anathema after they've been confronted with the Truth. Only the Holy Spirit can lead them away from the broad highway to destruction they're on so I pray for them. I also make it clear to them they're heading towards hearing, "I never knew you" from the very same Jesus Christ they in essence call a liar.

Such folks are not just slandering the Catholic Church, they're slandering all of Christianity and Christ Himself.

They pretend to "only" be attacking the Catholic Church but if the Catholic Church has for two thousand years been wrong about how to interpret Scripture and wrong about the canon, then there's no real reason to believe that the Luther Subset of the Bible is the inspired Word of God, either. Especially since Luther also wanted to throw out the parts of the New Testament he found it difficult to argue his way around. Disagreeing with an interpretation or doctrine is one thing, slandering His Word, His Church, and Christ Himself, is another matter.

I'm sorry, but I don't see it the way you do. I don't know of any nice way to point out that someone is denying what His Word says, refusing to accept a portion of the Bible, essentially calling Jesus Christ a liar by denying what Christ Himself clearly said, and repeating slanderous lies that have been shown to be lies over and over for five centuries since they were first spun out of thin air.

Look at CCC 1753 & 1754 then tell me that a desire to be ecumenical is a reasonable response to lies about His Bride and His Word. I see no way around confronting lies and no way around pointing out a situation where someone is denying Christ while pretending to be Christian. Doing that is claiming that the ends, being nice and ecumenical, justifies means that include silently ignoring lies and slanders against Christ and His Bride. The angel Michael didn't say, "I beg to differ", he confronted Lucifer by saying, "who is like God".

I feel sure Jesus Christ expects to likewise be confrontational when someone is deliberately slandering His Bride.

Regards

25 posted on 03/16/2013 3:18:39 AM PDT by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)
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To: ebb tide

Can you not see a reconciliation of Jews to Jesus? Even the Apostle Paul speaks of it. It may yet be distant. And their doctrine will still be now against that of Christ, but that doesn’t mean bridges should not be built. It certainly should mean that pledges of no harm would be made.


26 posted on 03/16/2013 3:20:44 AM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! True supporters of our troops pray for their victory!)
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To: PanzerKardinal

“It is apparent that the Holy Spirit has given us a pope...
who is a man who will speak the truth, however hard.

who is preparing us for spiritual warfare.

who is faithful.”

I believe you are right. He may actually be a Jesuit in the mold of Saint Ignatius


27 posted on 03/16/2013 5:31:47 AM PDT by paterfamilias
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To: RoadGumby

PFL


28 posted on 03/16/2013 5:46:19 AM PDT by RoadGumby (This is not where I belong, Take this world and give me Jesus.)
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To: Rashputin; PeevedPatriot; NYer

I admire the spirit behind your approach, PP, and generally agree that we should strive to be kind, smiling evangelists in the mold of John Paul II (NYer comes to mind - a wonderful ambassador of the Church!) Considering the vitriol and outright disrespect that Catholic Christians are afforded by many on this forum, hijacking our threads and forcing their twisted, tortured personal interpretations of our beliefs into the discussion...well, let’s just say that I think Rashputin hit the nail squarely on the head.


29 posted on 03/16/2013 7:07:07 AM PDT by HoosierDammit (St. Vincent de Paul, pray for us!)
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To: xzins; ebb tide; PanzerKardinal
Can you not see a reconciliation of Jews to Jesus?

I just posted another letter from Robert Moynihan in which he writes:

Francis greets Rome’s Jewish community

Also today, Pope Francis sent a letter to the head of Rome’s Jewish community.

POPE FRANCIS TO RABBI OF ROME: “I HOPE TO CONTRIBUTE TO THE PROGRESS OF RELATIONS BETWEEN JEWS AND CATHOLICS WHICH BEGAN WITH VATICAN COUNCIL II”

Vatican City, 15 March 2013 (VIS) – The Holy Father has sent a message to Dr. Riccardo Di Segni, the Chief Rabbi of Rome, the oldest Jewish community of the diaspora. “On this day of my election as Bishop of Rome and Pastor of the Universal Church,” reads the text, “I send you my cordial greetings, informing you that the solemn inauguration of my pontificate will take place on Tuesday, 19 March.”

“Trusting in the protection of the Most High,” the Pope continues, “I strongly hope to be able to contribute to the progress of the relations that have existed between Jews and Catholics since Vatican Council II in a spirit of renewed collaboration and in service of a world that may always be more in harmony with the Creator’s will.”

BTW, Pope Peter does not have a personal secretary! He writes his own letters.

30 posted on 03/16/2013 7:19:09 AM PDT by NYer (Beware the man of a single book - St. Thomas Aquinas)
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To: Jmouse007
Why else do you think the Roman Catholic Ten Commandments differ from the Old Testament Commandments (contained in Hebrew scripture, and non-Catholic scriptures). There was a little rewrite, so as to allow prayers to icons, statues, and saints.

After all, according to Roman Catholics, Latin is the language of Heaven, not Aramaic,(which the Lord spoke), Greek (in which the New Testament was written), or Hebrew (in which the Old Testament was written and prophets spoke). All must bow to Rome, and Roman Catholic pronouncements, and worship Mary, pray to priests for forgiveness of sins, pray people out of Purgatory, and kiss a ring that was a pagan symbol, rather than follow G_d’s Word.

31 posted on 03/16/2013 7:53:55 AM PDT by Yulee (Village of Albion)
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To: ebb tide
First, I don't think Pope Francis is saying it's simply OK for Jews (or anybody else) to be and remain far from Jesus.

But if we, seeing them far, wish to bring them near, a pledge to treat each other with respect would be a good start. St. Paul is all about giving honor when honor is due. Everyone is "due" a cooperative spirit and a genuine appreciation, especially if this can build bonds which facilitate peace and a closer walk with Our Lord.

Tagline.

32 posted on 03/16/2013 9:35:49 AM PDT by Mrs. Don-o ("If possible, so far as it depends on you, be at peace with all men." Romans 12:18)
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To: RoosterRedux
You think Semiramis is the Queen of Heaven?

Wow.

There are some gals down the street from me who do yoga and honor Shakti, but I've never met a Semiramis devotee before.

Free Republic sure is getting diverse!

33 posted on 03/16/2013 9:39:27 AM PDT by Mrs. Don-o
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To: Yulee

You’re wrong on all counts but take for example, your personal opinion on the languages of the New Testament, how did you find out the (dis)information you’re spewing forth?

Two books of the Old Testament - Wisdom and II Machabees - were written in Greek. The rest of the Old Testament was written in the Hebrew language. The New Testament was written in Greek, with the exception of St. Matthew’s Gospel which - according to the unanimous testimony of Catholic antiquity - was written in Hebrew or Aramaic. St Jerome corrected the Latin version of the Old Testament by the Greek there was also revisions by St. Peter Damian and Lanfranc in the 11th century....as clearly noted below...there was nothing covert going on...

Wasn’t the Catholic Christian movie The Passion of Christ spoken in Aramaic?

Early History of the Bible:

The original writings from the Apostles themselves (the autographs) no longer exist.

This is due partly to the perishable material (papyrus) used by the writers, and partly to the fact that the Roman emperors decreed the destruction of the sacred books of the Christians (Edict of Diocletian, A.D. 303).

Before translating the Bible into Latin, St. Jerome had already translated into more common languages enough books to fill a library. (Saint Jerome, Maisie Ward, Sheed & Ward; A Companion to Scripture Studies, Steinmuller.)

In the year 383, he revised the Latin New Testament text in accordance with some Greek manuscripts. Between the years 390 and 406 he translated the Old Testament directly from the Hebrew, and this completed work is known today as the “Old Latin Vulgate”. The work had been requested by Pope Damasus, and Copies of St. Jerome’s Latin Vulgate appeared uncorrupted as late as the 11th century, with some revisions by St. Peter Damian and Lanfranc. (Catholic Encyclopedia, “Place of the Bible in the Church”, C.U.A.)

Pope Benedict XV wrote about St. Jerome’s translation in his 1920 encyclical, Spiritus Paraclitus, “Nor was Jerome content merely to gather up this or that teacher’s words; he gathered from all quarters whatever might prove of use to him in this task. From the outset he had accumulated the best possible copies of the Bible and the best commentators on it,” . . . “he corrected the Latin version of the Old Testament by the Greek; he translated afresh nearly all the books of the Old Testament from Hebrew into Latin; . . . he discussed Biblical questions with the brethren who came to him, and answered letters on Biblical questions which poured in upon him from all sides; besides all this, he was constantly refuting men who assailed Catholic doctrine and unity.”

The first person known with certainty to apply the term canon to the Sacred Scriptures was St. Athanasius, about 350 A.D., although his private estimate of the number of canonical books differed from the books he quoted in his writings. Like him, a few other early fathers doubted some of the deutero-canonical books, but would cite them. (A Companion to Scripture Studies. Steinmueller.)

The Council of Carthage (397) was the first Council to publish a list of all the inspired books of the Bible. The Council of Florence repeated the canon of the Bible, and it was restated at the Council of Trent. (No action of the Church causes a book to be inspired. The Church exercises its infallible judgment to certify post factum that a particular book was inspired when it was written. The fact that God is its Author makes a book to be inspired. The Holy Spirit prevents the Church from erring in judging which books are inspired and included in the Bible.)

Versions of the whole or parts of the Bible in the language of the common people first appeared in Germany in the eighth century, in France and Hungary in the twelfth, and Italy, Spain, Holland, Poland and Bohemia in the thirteenth century. (Catholic Encyclopedia.)......

continued:
http://www.cathtruth.com/catholicbible/earlyhis.htm

You can’t go around making things up to suit yourself when there’s documentation passed down from antiquity which is where you got your information in the first place to use in order to abuse it. BTW: This is the very same Holy Bible Martin Luther had in his hands.


34 posted on 03/16/2013 10:01:08 AM PDT by bronxville (Margaret Sanger - “We do not want word to go out that we want to exterminate the Negro population,)
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To: NYer

Who’s Pope Peter?


35 posted on 03/16/2013 10:12:57 AM PDT by ebb tide
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To: ebb tide

Sorry ... typographical error ... or was it ; - )


36 posted on 03/16/2013 10:19:41 AM PDT by NYer (Beware the man of a single book - St. Thomas Aquinas)
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To: Rashputin; PeevedPatriot

Thank you both for your comments.


37 posted on 03/16/2013 10:25:50 AM PDT by crusadersoldier
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To: Mrs. Don-o

“First, I don’t think Pope Francis is saying it’s simply OK for Jews (or anybody else) to be and remain far from Jesus.”

On the contrary, I think he is saying it. He declares the current situation, since the Second Vatican Council, to be “more and more in harmony with the will of the Creator”.

Just today at a meeting with the secular press, he did not profess the Social Reign of Christ the King. Instead, he merely described the role of Christ as “pastor of the church”. At the end of meeting, he gave his apostolic blessing in silence so as not to offend any non-Catholics. I think this Pope has very little intention to convert people to the Catholic Church.


38 posted on 03/16/2013 10:28:18 AM PDT by ebb tide
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To: Mrs. Don-o
I was indelicate and not thoughtful toward those of whom Mary is such an important part of their lives.

Forgive me.

I was speaking to the ancient goddess worship (Semiramis, Astarte, Venus) that has always tried to elbow its way back into Christianity by way of syncretism.

In this case, goddesses are demons who seek to be worshiped and, in the view of many, are not mythological at all but quite real and dangerous.

And yes, as a Christian, I believe demons and spiritual powers of darkness/sin/evil are, indeed, real.

39 posted on 03/16/2013 11:11:25 AM PDT by RoosterRedux (Get armed, practice in the use of your weapons, get physically fit, stay alert!)
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To: ebb tide
"He declares the current situation, since the Second Vatican Council, to be “more and more in harmony with the will of the Creator."

One would be obliged to seek a clarification of just WHY in "the current situation" is more and more in harmony with the will of God. If he means "peaceful and respectful relations between Jews and Catholics," --- as contrasted with the hostilities of earlier eras --- he would be right. If he means "religious indifferentism," he would be wrong.

As you know, rash judgment consists in making a negative judgment without evidence, with insufficient evidence, or against evidence. I think charging that the Pope "has very little intention to convert people to the Catholic Church" is based on little to no evidence --- so far. I would need more information before I would risk the sin of false witness against the Holy Father on that score.

That's still forbidden by the Ten Commandments.

I don't expect the man to detail the whole plan of his mission in the first week of his ponitificate.

Keep in mind thats the Left is going berserk in hatred for him at present (charges of "Fascist!" "and "Homophobic bigot!" flying through the blogosphere) because he held the line against sexual unchastity and Liberation Theology among the Jesuits. Plus, he took the name of two saints (Francis of Assisi and Francis Xavier) who vowed the conversion of the Muslims.

I do not like anti-Francis animus. I will not tolerate it. Be well advised of that.

40 posted on 03/16/2013 11:12:48 AM PDT by Mrs. Don-o
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To: Mrs. Don-o

What hostilities existed between Catholics and Jews just prior to the Second Vatican Council?


41 posted on 03/16/2013 11:27:38 AM PDT by ebb tide
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To: Yulee; Jmouse007

42 posted on 03/16/2013 11:34:21 AM PDT by Mrs. Don-o (You can observe a lot just by watchin'. - Yogi Berra)
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To: ebb tide

Did I say “just prior”?


43 posted on 03/16/2013 11:35:01 AM PDT by Mrs. Don-o (You can observe a lot just by watchin'. - Yogi Berra)
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To: PanzerKardinal
There is one way or the other. No vacuum. Which is why no one should listen to the "logic" of atheism's culture of death. Listen to the ethics of the athieists' Pope, Dawkins, devolve; now claiming that humans are pigs... Atheists - humanists- used to name humans, apes. Their pope is digressing to atheism's natural outcome. Atheist governments (communists) mass murder and oppress humans the best of all the monsters in power than humanity has witnessed.
44 posted on 03/16/2013 11:36:42 AM PDT by SaraJohnson
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To: Mrs. Don-o
"I think charging that the Pope "has very little intention to convert people to the Catholic Church" is based on little to no evidence --- so far."

You want evidence. Here's a photo of him kneeling and bowing his head to receive the blessing of Protestant ministers along with Fr. Raniero Cantalamessa.

Do you consider this an attempt to convert those ministers by either Cantalamessa or the future pope to the Catholic Church?

By the way, I know the Ten Commandments and I recommend you practice them more diligently rather than castigate others. I made no charge, as you stated; I merely stated my thoughts.

45 posted on 03/16/2013 11:44:58 AM PDT by ebb tide
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To: Mrs. Don-o

Thank-you for making my point. So what was so special about that Council that Pope Francis had to mention it as a turning point in the relationship with Jews?


46 posted on 03/16/2013 11:52:08 AM PDT by ebb tide
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To: ebb tide
The Council did not represent rupture in this regard; it represented continuity and clarification. Charity and peace toward Jews as well as toward erring fellow Christians has been our Catholic law since St. Paul; and further, since Our Lord Jesus Christ --- may He have mercy on me, a sinner.

You say I made a charge against you. Read more carefully: if you put subject and verb together, you'll see I did not. I as consciously making an effort not to.

This conversation hinges too much on extrapolation. If I have committed an offense, I ask pardon. Now I'm going off to a different thread. So, see you later, ebb tide.

47 posted on 03/16/2013 12:06:16 PM PDT by Mrs. Don-o (Pax Vobiuscum.)
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To: Rashputin; HoosierDammit; crusadersoldier
Hi again, Rashputin. Again, I ask you to consider my comments as stated in charity. Sometimes I don't choose my words well.

I see no way around concluding that anyone who relies on their own personal judgment to interpret Scripture for their self .... is placing them self above the Scripture

I don't see this as self-worship but as a matter of usurpation of authority. I see it as claiming for self the authority we as Catholics ascribe to the papacy and magisterium. That's not the same thing as self-worship from my perspective.

they are worshiping their Self as The Word, not Jesus Christ who is the Word.

When I was Protestant I did not see it this way. Nor do I now although I respect your right to your own views. My situation was worse than you describe. I worshiped a god of my own creation not myself. I adhered to the scripture passages and bits of theology that suited me. I don't think that's self-worship but idolatry because I had a god of my own making.

There are elements of the Truth outside the Catholic Church, no doubt, and pursuing those portions of the Truth rather than deciding what I wanted to believe and interpreting Scripture to suit my preferences is what led me to the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church Jesus Christ Himself founded after being Lutheran most of my life.

I didn't know you were a convert too. My situation sounds similar but I'm guessing I was a lot more stubborn than you :) I agree with you that Catholicism is scriptural. And I love how it ties the OT and New together so well.

It's nice to be ecumenical, but those who obstinately deny the Truth by denying the real presence of Christ in the Eucharist and who constantly lie about what the One True Church teaches aren't overlooking something, they're deliberately denying His Word, deliberately telling lies, and deliberately slandering His Church.

There's a difference between deliberately lying about Catholic teaching and sincerely believing something different than Catholic teaching. It's broad characterizations that I object to.

People who who the Holy Spirit is working on do not resist the Truth when it's explained to them.

I did.

They pray, open their heart, and at the very least admit that they can see why there is as much reason to accept what the Catholic Church teaches as to accept what they belive contradicts it.

Getting to this stage can be long and difficult. It was for me anyway. I don't presume to know how the Holy Spirit is working in someone else's life. Nor am I bold enough to claim I know how he should be.

They don't lie and slander pretending that lies and slanders are part of spreading His Word.

Here I agree with you that these aren't works of the Holy Spirit. Once someone has been given an accurate description of Catholic teaching and continues to misrepresent it in comments, this is another matter, yes. Scripture tells us that we will be held accountable for our words. And that accountability will be to God, not me. Likewise, I am accountable if I slander them, am I not?

Making nice with those who lie about and slander the Catholic Church is ... refusing confront those who are under a powerful delusion.

Does confrontation of falsehood necessarily have to be done uncharitably?

Their very manner, in fact, slanders all of Christianity and ignoring such folks only leads others to believe there is no answer to the lies and slander ....

I don't worry too much if someone slanders me. It's Christ who lives in me. He can fight his battles :) IMHO speaking the truth to someone in courteous fashion isn't ignoring them. I don't know about you, but when someone insults me, they've pretty much lost the argument as far as I'm concerned. I'm not inclined to view their comment as reflective of the Spirit if there's not much fruit of the Spirit in it. Some may be called to harsh confrontation. I'm not. You must do as the Spirit bids you.

People who lie about the Catholic Church are confronted with the facts, that's not treating them poorly.

Did I say that speaking the truth is poor treatment? I consider false accusations and unnecessarily harshness as poor treatment.

I'd be treating them very poorly indeed if I left them to stew in their own lies and funky delusional wastes.

Is it up to you where people stew, or do they choose this for themselves? You can speak the truth but you can't control what another does with it, can you? The only part IMHO that you get to control is whether you attract or repel.

I'm sorry, but I don't see it the way you do.

No need to apologize. Your style and my style are different. My point was that the catechism calls us to see our separated brethren as Christians. And I don't buy your self-worship perspective although I respect your right to your own views. My own experience probably biases my view. Had you accused me of self-worship you'd have been off the mark. Had you accused me of idolatry you'd have been correct but ineffective in attracting me toward Catholicism.

Look at CCC 1753 & 1754 then tell me that a desire to be ecumenical is a reasonable response to lies

I don't see anything there that requires me to be harsh or unnecessarily accusatory.

I feel sure Jesus Christ expects to likewise be confrontational when someone is deliberately slandering His Bride.

I'll leave what Jesus does up to him. I'm more concerned that he doesn't find me deliberately slandering any of his children. Peace be with you.

48 posted on 03/16/2013 1:57:42 PM PDT by PeevedPatriot
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To: PanzerKardinal

Does that include anyone that prays to dead “saints” and Mary?


49 posted on 03/16/2013 2:03:36 PM PDT by Old Yeller
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To: Old Yeller

—— Does that include anyone that prays to dead “saints” and Mary? -——

I thought people in heaven were fully alive. Silly me.

OTOH, your religion, where the saints are dead, isn’t very appealing.


50 posted on 03/16/2013 2:06:31 PM PDT by St_Thomas_Aquinas
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