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To: uncommonsense

Learn something about words, please.

Veneration means honor. We routinely venerate people,humans. I venerate my mother and you should too because it’s one of the Ten Commandments: Venerate your father and mother that your days will be long in the earth.””

Thats ALL veneration means.

Worship comes from worthship, ascribing worth. Originally it was applied both to humans and God. BUT with the difference that the worth you ascribe to God is different from the worth you ascribe to humans. Even “worship” can properly be offered to humans if by that you merely mean what the word once meant: give the worth they deserve. My father deserves father-worth, my dog deserve dog-worth, God deserves God-worth or dignity.

Elites, not merely kings (magistrates) etc. were called “worshipful gentlement” etc. “Your Worship” was a human title 400 years ago and no one thought the speaker was worshiping the human as God.

But in modern English worship has come to be restricted to ascribing divine worth to the Divine, to God.

So we restrict our honor of Mary to veneration. You will NEVER find the term worship applied to Mary in any modern Catholic writing. If you find it in archaic writings, but read it in a modern way, you are a fool and an idiot, ignorant of history and language.

We venerate Mary as a human being who said Yes to God and carried Him in her womb and nursed him and changed His diapers.

Jesus himself honored his mother. Had Jesus not honored (venerated) His mother, He would have sinned, broken one of the Ten Commandments and he would not be your Savior and mine.

So stop it with the falsehoods you spread about us.

Luther honored and venerated Mary to the end of his life. Wesley did, and believed in her perpetual virginity. Calvin honored (venerated) her. They all did what the woman in the crowd did, whom Jesus endorsed but also used as a teaching moment and in the teaching honored his own mother as one who more than any other heard and kept the word of God.

You are the odd man out. You are the one defying centuries of the life of the Church, both East and West, Protestant and Catholic.

You know better than Wesley,Luther, Calvin, I’m sure. You know so much better than they because you never bothered even to learn what they had to say about Mary.


97 posted on 03/16/2013 10:37:11 PM PDT by Houghton M.
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To: Houghton M.

Yet, you do. Amazing. You know what God has written in any given persons’ heart. How is that?


100 posted on 03/16/2013 10:44:35 PM PDT by RedHeeler
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To: Houghton M.

“Thats ALL veneration means.”


I’ll need to go grab a Rosary so I can start saying Hail Rosies (her name is Rosy) to my mother.


103 posted on 03/16/2013 10:46:37 PM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans
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To: Houghton M.
In my original post, I asked

"Where in the Bible does it say that anyone should venerate "Our Lady" in order to respect her son?".

Then I got a response that completely ignored the question. Why? The answer is that the Bible does not require some outward sign of "veneration" of Mary in order to respect Jesus. I found it quite unscriptual to accuse the the Pope of disrespecting Mary AND THEREFORE Jesus because he didn’t genuflect after consecration.

Mary’s righteousness and faith are without question. But she is not the path to Jesus or The Father according to Jesus own words.

"So we restrict our honor of Mary to veneration"

Where in the Bible does it command, or even allow for veneration of a dead person as if they are still alive? That leads to praying to another other than The Father. That got king Saul into a lot of trouble trying to communicate with the prophet Samuel.

II Tim 3:16 "All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness". Mary and all others are in the Bible for "training in righteousness" - some very positive like Mary, others negative like Cain.

136 posted on 03/17/2013 9:34:04 AM PDT by uncommonsense (Conservatives believe what they see; Liberals see what they believe.)
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