Posted on 05/06/2013 5:51:53 PM PDT by Former Fetus
The Women of the Wall would have us believe that they are defending the Western Wall for everyone.
Considering that after 25 years and massive public relations efforts the group can hardly gather 100 women on a good month, the assertion sounds ludicrous.
Can you imagine so small a fringe group demanding to do as it pleases at the Vatican? Westminster Abbey? St.Patrick’s Cathedral in New York? Mecca? At any place of worship in the world? That’s not freedom of religion, that’s anarchy! The Women of the Wall can argue all they want that the Kotel is not a synagogue and has no tradition.
The claim is patently false.
There is a 1,700-year-long documented history of Jewish prayer along the Western Wall and at least 500 years of a prayer tradition at the current location. Lest you think the Jews prayed in the Reform fashion until the evil haredim (ultra-Orthodox) showed up and usurped the power, think again. There is ample photographic evidence to prove it.
The time has come to state the truth, simple and unadorned: The Western Wall doesn’t belong to the Women of the Wall. The Western Wall belongs to its 10 million visitors a year, who respect the sanctity and decorum of the site. The Western Wall belongs to millions of Jewish women and men, who come to pray here every day and oppose introducing any changes to the site. These people come to reaffirm their connection with the spiritual, to unburden themselves of their troubles, to reconnect with God on His terms, following the footsteps of their ancestors for generations.
(Excerpt) Read more at jpost.com ...
Dome of the Crock! LOL!
The Western Wall has been the symbol of the holy Temple since its destruction by the Romans in 70 CE. Since that time, religious Jews have prayed to come back to it. After its liberation in 1967 the Western Wall (renamed from the Wailing Wall) has become one of the most highly-visited sites in Israel. Secular and religious Israelis as well as tourists from other countries make it a point to visit, to pray there, to feel in touch with their spirituality and to leave notes in the wall expressing how they feel. There is a rabbi appointed over the Western Wall and its plaza.
The only requirements imposed on visitors are that they wear modest clothing, broadly defined (a woman in a short dress will be given a shawl to wrap around her legs), that men and women pray in separate sections, that in the women’s section there are no organized prayer services, since in Orthodox Judaism it takes a group of 10 men in order to permit them to pray together, and that women not wear a tallit and tephilin, which by Jewish custom are deemed men’s garb, and therefore it would violate a commandment in the Torah for women to wear them.
The women of the wall are nothing more than leftist provocateurs denigrating the religious feelings and praxis of the thousands of visitors to the wall, making a public disturbance that prevents the other women in the women’s section from being able to lose themselves in their own spiritual journey.
Nevertheless, there has been a section of the Wall made available for them. Unfortunately, the women of the wall refuse to utilize that space, instead forcing their behavior on those women in the regular women’s section who want nothing more than to be left alone to pray in peace.
It’s part of the left’s war on tradition, and nothing more.
never heard that before,do you have proof that it was a roman stable?
I like your thinking.
The emperor Julian the Apostate reportedly planned to rebuild the temple but died before he had a chance.
Israel and the Jewish people.
Like using CE for dates?
The Maccabees ...
I actually give some people a pass on this. If I was a serious believer in a religion other than Christianity, I would be painfully aware that AD does not mean “After the birth of Christ” but “Year of OUR Lord”. It’s only when you get nominal agnostics who don’t give two figs about religion using it to be disagreeable that I get nerked off.
The choice of which designating abbreviation to use cuts to the core difference between Jews and Christians. I assume that both of you are Christians and would prefer to see AD and not CE. AD, short for Anno Domini, is an acknowledgement that Jesus is the Messiah, which is a point of disagreement and historical contention between us. CE, on the other hand, is short for Common Era, which is an acknowledgement of the times in which we live. It is not intended as a disparagement of your faith in any respect. Actually, I grew up with the CE designator and didn’t even think about it when I posted my comment.
The choice of which designating abbreviation to use cuts to the core difference between Jews and Christians. I assume that both of you are Christians and would prefer to see AD and not CE. AD, short for Anno Domini, is an acknowledgement that Jesus is the Messiah, which is a point of disagreement and historical contention between us. CE, on the other hand, is short for Common Era, which is an acknowledgement of the times in which we live. It is not intended as a disparagement of your faith in any respect. Actually, I grew up with the CE designator and didn’t even think about it when I posted my comment.
What is the difference between "Orthodox" and "ultra-Orthodox"? Do Orthodox Jews strongly support the "women of the Wall" and only the "ultra-Orthodox" oppose them?
They are anti-democratic
As am I. I support a republican form of representative government - not a plebiscitary democracy. I stand with Washington, Hamilton and Madison on this point.
draft dodge the army en masse
Maybe a fair criticism - do the "Women of the Wall" oppose all forms of conscientious objection?
Also, is forced conscription of the population democratic or anti-democratic?
no longer wanted in the government
Should they be excluded from the government? If they were, would this be democratic?
massively unpopular among the general population
At current rates of growth, it would seem that they are becoming the "general population."
and all these women request are their basic rights as citizens, which they are entitled to
There is a "basic right" to deliberately provoke other citizens by mocking their religion in its holiest place?
While Unitarians in the USA, say, would have a First Amendment right to mock and belittle Eastern Orthodox Christians by imitating their liturgy - and let's say they were rude enough to do it on the sidewalk in front of the Cathedral of St. John the Baptist - the local government would likely tell them (1) they need to a permit to protest so consistently and provocatively in that precise location and (2) then move to deny them a permit.
And the courts would uphold that.
Why? Because both sides have a right to freedom of speech and freedom of religion - and the Orthodox were there first.
Well put. I would not want to make a false declaration of faith. To me, using the designator AD is like taking communion as a non-Catholic.
Here’s the latest on this issue. Bennett’s party represents mainstream Orthodox.
http://www.timesofisrael.com/bennett-steps-into-western-wall-prayer-fray/
The Orthodox are Zionists. They will do what the courts say, which have now recognized the women’s rights, and come to an accommodation.
The ultra-Orthodox march to their own drummer, which they are entitled to, as long they don’t infringe on other people’s rights.
Perhaps saying anti-democratic was too strong. They don’t recognize diversity. It’s their way or the highway. In a democracy you have to accommodate others who are not violating any law.
The ultra-Orthodox do not oppose the draft of their young men on the grounds of conscience objection. They see themselves as a special case. The courts have struck down their arguments and in the last election, that was a big issue. They won’t even be asked to go to the army if they don’t want; civil volunteer work will be enough. But they resist that as well.
This is only the second government in the history of the state that they weren’t asked to join. The main parties who joined Netanyahu refused to sit with them mainly because of the issue of the draft.
The ultra-Orthodox are no more than 10 per cent of the population. The more the merrier but they’ll never be more than a small minority.
Thanks. In all the arguments I have heard, the rights of the other women praying at the wall were not mentioned. That is a very valid point, and after all the Women of the Wall were offered another section in the southern part of the wall IIRC. Which they hurried to turn down! It seems to prove my point, and I am a woman speaking, but when women start asking for “equal rights” in any religion, this (religion) is the least of their concerns!
As a born again Christian, my first priority is to witness to others. However, let me say in Christian love, that your comment comes across as aggressive, in your face. Hardly the best way to win hearts for Christ!
I guess I feel the same everytime I see CE instead of AD,I view that as an In youre face attack saying Christ didnt matter.My hackles rise everytime I see CE.If the differet event that caused CE to be CE is the birth of Christ why try so hard to deny it?
The thing is, you have to separate out the use of CE by virulently anti-religion elitists who want to erase Christianity from Western Culture and the use of CE by believing Jews who feel funny about referring to dates as belonging to a Lord they do not recognize.
Words have meaning. I’m a serious Christian. I don’t go around saying “PBUH” when I mention Mohammed, I write “God” instead of “G*d”, and I give people who are equally serious about their religion a pass on avoiding terms they find theologically upsetting.
In my experience, most people who use CE are either university professors (i.e. liberals) or Jews. I don’t know how to best deal with the liberal ones, but I do feel a burden towards the Jewish people. They are Jesus’ people, I am sure they matter very much to Him in a way that is different from the way Christians matter... Anyhow, I have found many Jews to be very defensive, sometimes aggressive, when Christianity is mentioned. I have a temper, but am doing my best to be as non-confrontational as possible, and instead try to engage them in conversation. Have I been successful? Only the Lord knows, but I have worked very hard at getting the soil ready before planting a seed. And that’s all I know to do.
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