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Coming Home
Catholic Lane ^ | June 1, 2013 | Marie Trebeh

Posted on 06/01/2013 2:23:13 PM PDT by NYer

Eucharist

I was Protestant for a time. I sang modern Christian music and swayed and held up my hands and loved the other members of the church. I found it difficult when there were divisions in the congregation and when some of my “family” decided to “plant a church” of their own. The trust was broken and there were allegations of “sheep stealing.”

In retrospect, I often wonder why it is “sheep stealing” to invite someone to another protestant church, but luring people away from the Catholic Church is encouraged. I always felt like something was missing there, but I didn’t know what was missing. I had been born and raised Catholic, but I was so poorly catechized that I had no idea that I was missing the Eucharist, the true presence of Christ. I didn’t realize what Catholics believe about the Eucharist, and I was raised IN THE CHURCH.

It wasn’t until I was reading an article in a free copy of Catholic Answers magazine that I came across the fact that the Church teaches that Christ is truly present, body, blood, soul and divinity in the Eucharist. It was an “aha” moment for me. Next I listened to Scott Hahn’s testimony about his conversion to the faith. I read Rome Sweet Home. I listened to more talks by Scott Hahn about reading the New Testament in light of the Old Testament. It was really only through the testimony of this Biblical scholar that I returned to the Church.

I am divorced and remarried. My first marriage was annulled, but my current husband’s first marriage was not. I am outside the fullness of Grace. This tears at my heart. I long for Christ in the Eucharist and for the graces of the Sacraments in which I cannot participate. I pray for my husband’s heart to change and I wait. Everything in God’s time, though.

My heart breaks for friends who have left the church because they, like I, were poorly catechized. They do not have the understanding of the truths the Church teaches to return. They have been changed by the time they have spent listening to protestant friends and protestant preachers who twist what the church is and does. Perhaps they have read a few too many Jack Chick tracts.

I try to direct them back to the Church, but I am not a very good apologist, despite knowing which scripture verses support what the Church teaches. I am afraid I am even less of an evangelist, so I pray. I pray that they will turn their hearts towards Christ’s words in the gospels and that they will listen with their hearts to His call. I know when I turned my heart toward Him, I came home. I try to live the Corporal Works of Mercy in my life.

I have been in both Catholic and protestant churches when there was no one there. The protestant churches were empty and FELT empty. While no other human person was in the Catholic Church with me, it never felt empty. I always felt and feel His presence there. I came home despite my exclusion from the sacraments because He is there. I offer to Him my imperfection and brokenness and pray that He will use me despite my flaws. I thank Him for His love and mercy. I continue to teach my children and attend Mass and to be an imperfect party of the Body of Christ.


TOPICS: Apologetics; Catholic; Evangelical Christian; Worship
KEYWORDS:

1 posted on 06/01/2013 2:23:13 PM PDT by NYer
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To: netmilsmom; thefrankbaum; Tax-chick; GregB; saradippity; Berlin_Freeper; Litany; SumProVita; ...

Scott Hahn was a Presbyterian minister, the top student in his seminary class, a brilliant Scripture scholar, and militantly anti-Catholic ... until he reluctantly began to discover that his "enemy" had all the right answers. Kimberly, also a top-notch theology student in the seminary, is the daughter of a well-known Protestant minister, and went through a tremendous "dark night of the soul" after Scott converted to Catholicism.

Their conversion story and love for the Church has captured the hearts and minds of thousands of lukewarm Catholics and brought them back into an active participation in the Church. They have also influenced countless conversions to Catholicism among their friends and others who have heard their powerful testimony.

ROME SWEET HOME

2 posted on 06/01/2013 2:24:14 PM PDT by NYer ( "Run from places of sin as from the plague."--St John Climacus)
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To: NYer

thanks for posting. appreciated!


3 posted on 06/01/2013 2:26:26 PM PDT by uncitizen (Brown skin is not a get away with treason free card!)
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To: NYer

How many times must Christ be sacrificed in order to atone for sin?


4 posted on 06/01/2013 2:55:09 PM PDT by tbpiper
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To: tbpiper

Christ died for sins once, but the Catholic mass is a rememberence of Christ’s sacriface on the cross.


5 posted on 06/01/2013 4:18:09 PM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: tbpiper

Hey TB

Of course, there is only ONE sacrifice — Our Lord’s sacrifice on Calvary.

The Holy Sacrifice of the Mass is a RE-presentation of that self-same sacrifice. Not a representation. The ONE sacrifice is RE-presented at every Catholic Mass.

I think of it as kind of a time machine — remember the TV program “You Are There”?

It’s kind of like that.

At the moment of consecration, you are there! — at the foot of the Cross — with Holy Mother Mary and Saint John — uniting yourself and your suffering with Jesus on the cross.

The word Eucharist mean thanksgiving — and we can never thank Him enough for what He did for us.

God bless you. (Some more.)


6 posted on 06/01/2013 4:19:03 PM PDT by Ua Ruairc of Brťifne
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To: Ua Ruairc of Bréifne
The Holy Sacrifice of the Mass is a RE-presentation of that self-same sacrifice.

That's exactly my point. If Christ died once for all and totally paid our debt to a righteous God, why would it be necessary to re-sacrifice Him again?

I ask this with the understanding that your church considers the Eucharist to be a true but un-bloody sacrifice of the actual body and blood of Jesus.

As far as being at the cross with Him, I've gotten way past that. I've been raised with Him and seated with Him in the heavenly realms. (ref Ephesians 2:6)

7 posted on 06/01/2013 5:15:34 PM PDT by tbpiper
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To: NYer

All churches do not feel “empty” like you said. I do not understand why Catholics hate Protestants so much. Maybe it is just those on here. You would get more respect if people did not spout so much hatred. I really, really can not respect other points of view when hate is showed instead of love. I grew up going to many different churches and they all taught from the Bible. Try love instead of hate.


8 posted on 06/01/2013 5:27:35 PM PDT by MamaB
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To: Biggirl
Christ died for sins once, but the Catholic mass is a rememberence of Christ’s sacriface on the cross.

Wrong! If the Catholic church really believes in transubstantiation, then it is actually a re-sacrificing of Christ at every mass and not just a "rememberance".
9 posted on 06/01/2013 6:19:18 PM PDT by Old Yeller
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To: Ua Ruairc of Bréifne

lPlease read post number 6, does a better presentation of what the mass is all about.


10 posted on 06/01/2013 6:22:36 PM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: tbpiper
to re-sacrifice Him again?

The Holy Mass is not a different sacrifice but the same sacrifice.

11 posted on 06/01/2013 6:53:43 PM PDT by annalex (fear them not)
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To: annalex
The Holy Mass is not a different sacrifice but the same sacrifice.

Are you saying it's a continuation of the original crucifixion? If that is so, what was Jesus referring to when He said "It is finished"?

12 posted on 06/01/2013 7:26:33 PM PDT by tbpiper
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To: tbpiper

I said RE-presentation, not RE-sacrifice, TB.

In the Holy Mass, you are PRESENT at that VERY moment that happened on Calvary 2000 years ago.

What is happening on the altar at that moment of Consecration is not Calvary happening AGAIN, it is Calvary happening STILL.

How can this be?

Because Christ’s sacrifice is ETERNAL, — eternally PRESENT to the Father — and to you, too, at that moment of Consecration in the Holy Mass.

Eternity is a concept beyond our understanding.

It doesn’t mean “forever” nor a long period of time. It means “outside of time itself”; a perpetual present, a never-ending now. God apprehends all events in time in a single glance of “now”. The “thousand years is a single day” suggests how different the Divine Perspective is from ours.

The sacrifice of Christ is not time-bound. That’s why the institution of the Holy Eucharist was possible at the Last Supper — hours before Calvary. It anticipates the Sacrifice on Calvary, because the future is PRESENT from God’s eternal perspective. Easy-peasy for God.

The Catholic Church believes, as you do, that there is no need for a subsequent sacrifice since the first is infinitely more than sufficient in itself.

And infinitely more than we deserve.


13 posted on 06/01/2013 7:54:45 PM PDT by Ua Ruairc of Brťifne
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To: NYer

Happy feast of Corpus Christi!!!


14 posted on 06/01/2013 7:57:55 PM PDT by surroundedbyblue (Why am I both pro-life & pro-gun? Because both positions defend the innocent and protect the weak.)
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To: tbpiper

As far as being at the cross with Him, I’ve gotten way past that. I’ve been raised with Him and seated with Him in the heavenly realms. (ref Ephesians 2:6)

................

+1


15 posted on 06/01/2013 7:58:34 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion (Gone rogue, gone Galt, gone international, gone independent. Gone.)
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To: tbpiper

You are misinterpreting the words. “Do this in remembrance of me.”

Each Mass is a re-presentation of the MEMORY of the Last Supper. We are following Christ’s instructions.

Do you have a problem with Judaisim REMEMBERING the Passover by having a special meal? Same thing.


16 posted on 06/01/2013 8:08:16 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: NYer

When Jesus comes back, this is one of the things he’s just gonna slap us upside the head with and say “do you guys just not get the concept of metaphor? Really???”


17 posted on 06/01/2013 8:12:23 PM PDT by Ramius (Personally, I give us one chance in three. More tea anyone?)
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To: Ramius

Apparently, the early Christians so disliked metaphors that they left Christ due to not liking the metaphor.


18 posted on 06/01/2013 11:13:28 PM PDT by rbmillerjr (We have No Opposition to Obama's Socialist Agenda:)
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To: MamaB

A gentle correction is in order.

First of all, there is no hatred at all coming from the Christian Catholics in regards to the form of worship, just explaining what takes place.

Second, any attacking that does take place comes from those who accept the Bible. Love is not being shown when Bible based Christian Protestants attack their Christian Catholic brothers and sisters.

Please do not forget that it is one common baptism that unite us as Christians.


19 posted on 06/02/2013 3:15:59 AM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: Ramius

No, the King of Kings will not do that.


20 posted on 06/02/2013 3:17:04 AM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: tbpiper

The article above is an excellent example of RCC error as pointed out in the below link.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/3026316/posts?page=25#25


21 posted on 06/02/2013 3:25:29 AM PDT by Cvengr (Adversity in life and death is inevitable. Thru faith in Christ, stress is optional.)
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To: Old Yeller
"Christ died for sins once, but the Catholic mass is a rememberence of Christ’s sacriface on the cross."

Wrong! If the Catholic church really believes in transubstantiation, then it is actually a re-sacrificing of Christ at every mass and not just a "rememberance".

I was thinking the same thing, and you have said it well. There is an eternity of difference between a re-presentation and a remembrance---between the idolatry of the Mass and true worship of a Savior who once offered Himself, once He died, and once He was resurrected to live forevermore.

22 posted on 06/02/2013 4:18:58 AM PDT by good1 (Valiant for the Truth)
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To: Salvation
Each Mass is a re-presentation of the MEMORY of the Last Supper.

Do then it's not a real and true sacrifice, just a memorial?

23 posted on 06/02/2013 5:20:26 AM PDT by tbpiper
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To: Ua Ruairc of Bréifne
Because Christ’s sacrifice is ETERNAL...

One act of disobedience brought sin into the world and one act of obedience provided a way out. The acts of Adam's sin and Christ's crucifixion were singular events with eternal results. Wouldn't it be better to celebrate the fact that we can now approach the Throne of Grace boldly without anyone between us and God, having been clothed in the righteousness of Christ?

Jesus is currently and eternally seated at the right hand of the Father. Why does the Catholic church keep Him perpetually nailed to the cross?

24 posted on 06/02/2013 5:36:16 AM PDT by tbpiper
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To: tbpiper; Ua Ruairc of Bréifne
Are you saying it's a continuation of the original crucifixion?

No it is not continuation. I am saying what I, and Ua Ruairc of Bréifne, said to you already: it is the same sacrifice that we become part of across time.

25 posted on 06/02/2013 8:27:51 AM PDT by annalex (fear them not)
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To: annalex
it is the same sacrifice that we become part of across time

Why does the church require you to continually be part of the act of sacrifice since the scriptures say Christ died once for all?

26 posted on 06/02/2013 8:52:33 AM PDT by tbpiper
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To: tbpiper

Because of the COMMAND of Christ that says “do this in rememberence of me.”


27 posted on 06/02/2013 9:30:45 AM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: tbpiper

Since He died once for all, that includes me today. That is why.


28 posted on 06/02/2013 11:15:20 AM PDT by annalex (fear them not)
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To: tbpiper; Old Yeller
Are you saying it's a continuation of the original crucifixion? If that is so, what was Jesus referring to when He said "It is finished"?

Read your Old Testament! The death of the sacrificial victim at the hands of the priest *begins* the sacrificial liturgy, it doesn't conclude it. The victim still has to be offered to God at the altar, and then parts are consumed by the priest and the layperson making the offering.

Hebrews makes it clear that the "offering" part of Christ's sacrifice is taking place (and has taken place, and will take place tomorrow) in heaven, which is eternal and therefore outside of time. The Mass makes this sacrificial offering present to us on earth, in time.

The Catholic Church does not teach, and has never taught, that Jesus is "re-sacrificed" or "sacrificed again" in the Mass. That's a calumny invented by John Calvin. It's a lie, pure and simple. Who does Jesus identify in Scripture as the "father of lies"?

29 posted on 06/02/2013 12:09:05 PM PDT by Campion ("Social justice" begins in the womb)
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To: tbpiper
Why does the church require you to continually be part of the act of sacrifice since the scriptures say Christ died once for all?

One more time: your fundamental error is confusing the death of the sacrificial victim with the offering of the sacrifice. If a priest in the Jerusalem Temple had just slaughtered a Lamb or a bull & walked away, he would have just made a bloody mess, not offered a sacrifice to God according to the regulations set forth in the Law.

30 posted on 06/02/2013 12:14:47 PM PDT by Campion ("Social justice" begins in the womb)
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To: tbpiper

http://www.fisheaters.com/mass.html


31 posted on 06/02/2013 12:19:58 PM PDT by johngrace (I am a 1 John 4! Christian- declared at every Sunday Mass , Divine Mercy and Rosary prayers!)
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To: johngrace

Thanks, pretty much confirms what I thought.


32 posted on 06/02/2013 1:39:17 PM PDT by tbpiper
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To: tbpiper

Your Welcome.


33 posted on 06/02/2013 1:46:46 PM PDT by johngrace (I am a 1 John 4! Christian- declared at every Sunday Mass , Divine Mercy and Rosary prayers!)
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To: Campion
One more time: your fundamental error is confusing the death of the sacrificial victim with the offering of the sacrifice.

How many times does the blood of a sacrifice have to be offered up be before it's atoning work is done?

I'm going to trust that Jesus, as my High Priest, offering his own blood was sufficient to cover all my sins, past, present, and future and that His promise of the gift of His righteous for my sin would allow me to stand in His presence today perfect in Him, spotless and clean.

34 posted on 06/02/2013 1:48:03 PM PDT by tbpiper
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To: tbpiper

Wouldn’t it be better to celebrate the fact that we can now approach the Throne of Grace boldly without anyone between us and God, having been clothed in the righteousness of Christ?
_________

Would be great?!? It IS great! You should try it! Because that’s exactly what happens at Holy Mass every day — and six times on Sunday.

Not only that, but we “consume” God — “the Bread come down from Heaven” — in Holy Communion — “without anyone between us and God”. (How much closer can you get? I mean, He’s physically inside of you.)

_______

Jesus is currently and eternally seated at the right hand of the Father. Why does the Catholic church keep Him perpetually nailed to the cross?
____
I think Christ said to do that at the Last Supper, didn’t He? It is an act of obedience to God to “Do this in remembrance of Me.”

He didn’t want the most epic event in all of history — the Redemption of Man by the Crucifixion of the God-Man — to EVER be forgotten or neglected.

Nor did He want the absolute horror of sin to be forgotten.
Nor the humbling reality that the race of men would kill God, given half a chance, AND IT DID!

We adore Christ on the Cross because His grace pours through those five wounds every moment of our lives.

To borrow a phrase: “Never forget, never forget, never forget.”

A Blessed Feast of Corpus Christi to you and yours.


35 posted on 06/02/2013 2:33:24 PM PDT by Ua Ruairc of Brťifne
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To: tbpiper
 photo dali-last-supper.jpg

"YE SHALL KEEP IT a FEAST to the LORD Throughout Your Generations; ye shall keep it a FEAST by An ORDINANCE FOREVER. "

Yes and no. It is complicated. I do not know how to maybe fully explain but hopefully I will get the gist of it across.

Remember God's reply to Moses. "I Am" He is in the Eternal present. We are not. We were not there at the Cross. We are in the time space continuum of creation. Time is created from the movement of Planets. The earth moves around a full day(24 hours) then 365 days are a year. A decade is 10 years. Then 100 years is past. 1000 years are past too. So on and so forth.

While all this is happening God is still not bound by time like we are. He is outside of his creation. So when he declares "I Am" he is constant there is no beginning, middle or end. He is the Alpha and Omega as in the Book of revelation.

The bloody sacrifice has been done.

"Christ is not recrucified; the Sacrifice of the Mass is unbloody -- after the order of Melchizedek. Christ died once at a FINITE POINT IN HISTORY; but God is Outside of Time and His offering of Himself is eternal. The Grace Christ offers in the Divine Liturgy and what He offered on the Cross are of the same sacrifice; therefore, in no way can the liturgical Sacrifice be a "repetition" of the Crucifixion. His sacrifice is re-presented ("made present again in some way"). As the Council of Trent put it, "The fruits of that bloody sacrifice, it is well understood, are received most abundantly through this unbloody one, so far is the latter from derogating in any way from the former."

Also remember Moses reminded the Israelites that the passover which contains eating the lamb forever decreed by God. Exodus 12

Exodus 12:1-14 And the LORD spake unto Moses and Aaron in the land of Egypt saying, This month shall be unto you the beginning of months: it shall be the first month of the year to you. Speak ye unto all the congregation of Israel, saying, In the tenth day of this month they shall take to them every man a lamb, according to the house of their fathers, a lamb for an house: And if the household be too little for the lamb, let him and his neighbour next unto his house take it according to the number of the souls; every man according to his eating shall make your count for the lamb. Your lamb shall be without blemish, a male of the first year: ye shall take it out from the sheep, or from the goats: And ye shall keep it up until the fourteenth day of the same month: and the whole assembly of the congregation of Israel shall kill it in the evening. And they shall take of the blood, and strike it on the two side posts and on the upper door post of the houses, wherein they shall eat it. And they shall EAT THE FLESH in that night, roast with fire, and unleavened bread; and with bitter herbs they shall eat it. ............... it is the LORD's PASSOVER................................................And this Day Shall Be Unto You for a Memorial; and YE SHALL KEEP IT a FEAST to the LORD Throughout Your Generations; ye shall keep it a FEAST by An ORDINANCE FOREVER.

"YE SHALL KEEP IT a FEAST to the LORD Throughout Your Generations; ye shall keep it a FEAST by An ORDINANCE FOREVER. "

Gee How is it still going on as promised. Never ending.

Christ introduced on the FEAST OF PASSOVER the everlasting body and everlasting blood. He just by chanced put this at Passover where it is promised by Moses that we will eat the Lamb forever? HMMM....

Moses is not a liar. The Jewish today do not have sacrifices so what in the world is going on with this promise by MOSES. HMMM.....

Could it be that CHRIST REPLACED IT with THE TRUE LAMB WITHOUT Taking away the Eating the BODY the LAMB by BENIGN PRESENCE. HMMMM.....

Otherwise we make Moses a LIAR. HE is not a Liar.

There is no more evidence of this promised continuum except for the Mass.

http://www.fisheaters.com/mass.html

36 posted on 06/02/2013 3:11:11 PM PDT by johngrace (I am a 1 John 4! Christian- declared at every Sunday Mass , Divine Mercy and Rosary prayers!)
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To: NYer
I pray that they will turn their hearts towards Christ’s words in the gospels and that they will listen with their hearts to His call.

If this is a sincere prayer, then some will have to admit that God HAS turned hearts to Christ's words in the Gospel and His call and it was NOT back to the Roman Catholic Church. It's a real shame that this person is being used like a tool to try and pry souls away from the Gospel and she doesn't even realize it yet she is doing so while excluded from the one thing she thinks can give her salvation!

37 posted on 06/02/2013 5:35:25 PM PDT by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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To: tbpiper
If Christ died once for all and totally paid our debt to a righteous God, why would it be necessary to re-sacrifice Him again?

Because that is what He directed His disciples to do, and those who have been following in their footsteps have continued to do so.

38 posted on 06/02/2013 5:49:03 PM PDT by SuziQ
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To: johngrace

There is no more need for any sacrifice for sin. If you’re doing the mass as a memorial, fine. If you’re doing it for the remision of sin then you’ve missed the point of the crucifixion. “The fruits of that bloody sacrifice” are received by faith alone. Otherwise you put God in the position of owing you fogiveness because you did a religious work.


39 posted on 06/03/2013 3:21:56 AM PDT by tbpiper
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To: tbpiper

Nonsense. But don’t worry God is in control.


40 posted on 06/03/2013 12:07:21 PM PDT by johngrace (I am a 1 John 4! Christian- declared at every Sunday Mass , Divine Mercy and Rosary prayers!)
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To: tbpiper

I should clarify there is one bloody sacrifice. It a reposition of it. http://www.fisheaters.com/mass.html


41 posted on 06/03/2013 12:08:55 PM PDT by johngrace (I am a 1 John 4! Christian- declared at every Sunday Mass , Divine Mercy and Rosary prayers!)
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To: NYer

The whole business of annulments bothers me, as it probably bothers many a faithful Catholic.

One old friend of mine was on her second marriage and it was her husband’s second marriage too. Both brought up Catholic. When the guy found out he had cancer, he spent his last remaining time and energy on trying to get his first marriage annulled, so he could die in a state of grace. I don’t think such niceties bothered my friend that much.

The entire subject of atonement and forgiveness was abandoned in favor of a ritual exculpation.

I’m not judging anyone, although it may sound as if I am. I just think the whole concept is bogus.


42 posted on 06/03/2013 12:20:28 PM PDT by firebrand
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To: johngrace
Nonsense.

No, it is scripture.

43 posted on 06/03/2013 2:21:21 PM PDT by tbpiper
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