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Millions of Muslims Devoted to Our Lady and Eager for Exorcism
AsiaNews ^ | 7/26/13 | Samir Khalil Samir

Posted on 07/26/2013 7:56:13 PM PDT by marshmallow

Fatima, Harissa, Damascus, Samalut, Assiut, Zeitun and many other places where the Virgin appeared are the destination of incessant pilgrimages from Lebanon, Syria, Egypt, Iran. Pilgrims in search of physical but also spiritual healing; spontaneous and mystical prayer and not the schematic and formal verses of official Islam. The iconoclast Salafists destroy places of pilgrimage every year. But the devotion to Mary is growing, also fueled by the stories of the Koran. The spiritual dialogue between Christians and Muslims is much more promising than cultural, theological or political dialogue.

Beirut (AsiaNews) - Each year millions of Muslims come on pilgrimage to the Catholic Marian shrines. Not only to the major shrines such as Fatima in Portugal or Harissa in Lebanon, but also to Egypt, Syria, Iran. Muslims - especially Muslim women - go to give thanks to the Madonna or great Christian saints, like St. Charbel or St. George.

In the eyes of many Westerners these gestures seem ridiculous or false: they speak of apparitions, of prayers, but then there are massacres, killings, violence in the name of religion!

Like it or not, the religious phenomenon is alive in Latin America, in Africa, in Asia. When you see millions of Hindus go to bathe in the dirty water of the sacred river it may seem like a ridiculous thing. Yet for those who do it is an act of purification, of prayer. The West is tolerant and benevolent towards other religions, but its attitude towards Christians is increasingly hypercritical. The West is not post-Hindu, post-Islam. It is only post-Christian!

The point is that in the West, the supernatural is considered outdated, it is branded as mythology, illusion, instead the West is forever denouncing the difficulties that neither miracles nor pilgrimages can erase.

But in the rest of the world the spiritual.....

(Excerpt) Read more at asianews.it ...


TOPICS: Catholic; Islam; Theology
KEYWORDS: chrislam
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1 posted on 07/26/2013 7:56:13 PM PDT by marshmallow
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To: marshmallow

This seems kind of weird considering how moslems treat their own women.


2 posted on 07/26/2013 8:04:54 PM PDT by bigheadfred (INFIDEL)
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To: marshmallow

Satan appearing as an angel of light, healing Muslims so that they worship Mary, a woman, rather than Jesus.


3 posted on 07/26/2013 8:06:36 PM PDT by A Formerly Proud Canadian (I once was lost but now I'm found; blind but now I see.)
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To: A Formerly Proud Canadian

Not quite. Try Christ, the son of Mary, reaching millions of Muslims with the truth of His resurection and saving grace.


4 posted on 07/26/2013 8:10:59 PM PDT by Louis Foxwell (This is a wake up call. Join the Sultan Knish ping list.)
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To: marshmallow

“If the world hates you, know that it has hated me before it hated you”

- Jesus Christ

The West is purging its lungs of air. It’s only afterwards that it will find it is unable to breathe. Sad to see Thailand is attempting to do the same with its Buddhism.


5 posted on 07/26/2013 8:13:42 PM PDT by Viennacon
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To: marshmallow

Gentiles of all persuasions hijacking worship of the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob for worship of fatima..... these Muslims go from one pagan practice to another if fatima is credited....


6 posted on 07/26/2013 8:16:58 PM PDT by delchiante
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To: marshmallow
"The point is that in the West, the supernatural is considered outdated..."

I don't recall the exact quote, or even which book he wrote it in, but CS Lewis pointed out that the use of the term, "supernatural," is a vain presupposition that the user has a complete, thorough knowledge and understanding of all that is natural. Seven or eight hundred years ago, people thought a solar eclipse was the result of a dragon eating the sun. We of course look at such beliefs as primitive, ignorant or even savage. We don't give much thought to the notion that almost certainly, seven or eight hundred years from now, much of our "knowledge," will most likely be viewed in the same light.

We like to think of the Divine and His workings as "supernatural," but in as much as He existed before all else, there actually is nothing that is more, "natural."

7 posted on 07/26/2013 8:17:50 PM PDT by Joe 6-pack (Qui me amat, amat et canem meum.)
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To: WXRGina

read the original story ping as I can’t take it.

http://www.asianews.it/news-en/Millions-of-Muslims-devoted-to-Our-Lady-and-eager-for-exorcism-28577.html


8 posted on 07/26/2013 8:22:51 PM PDT by logitech (It is time.)
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To: Louis Foxwell

Devotion to Mary, instead of worship of the Lord is idol worship, an effective weapon of the Deceiver.


9 posted on 07/26/2013 8:25:10 PM PDT by A Formerly Proud Canadian (I once was lost but now I'm found; blind but now I see.)
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To: bigheadfred
This seems kind of weird considering how moslems treat their own women.

Perhaps this movement is led by Muslim women (??)

10 posted on 07/26/2013 8:25:36 PM PDT by PGR88
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To: PGR88

Just so. I am sure many of them would renounce Islam if they could.


11 posted on 07/26/2013 8:28:34 PM PDT by bigheadfred (INFIDEL)
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To: logitech

You’re right. I can’t stomach catholic idolatry, either.


12 posted on 07/26/2013 8:35:44 PM PDT by WXRGina (The Founding Fathers would be shooting by now.)
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To: WXRGina

Protestant ignorance is what bothers me.


13 posted on 07/26/2013 8:40:36 PM PDT by St_Thomas_Aquinas ( Isaiah 22:22, Matthew 16:19, Revelation 3:7)
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To: Joe 6-pack

Interesting! I didn’t quote Lewis, but the evening before last, I was writing about the same subject to my grieving friend, Mimi. It involved the afterlife, deviled eggs, potato salad, fried chicken, and Jesus. :-)


14 posted on 07/26/2013 8:43:43 PM PDT by floralamiss ("For the sake of His sorrowful passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world.")
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To: marshmallow

Mary appears in the Koran, but she is not the Mary we know and love as the Mother of Jesus.

Jesus also appears in the Koran (Named Issa), but He is NOT the Jesus we know and love as the Member of the Godhead and Messiah.

Even Judas appears in the Koran, but ...get this...Judas is portrayed as a last-minute substitute for Jesus on the cross, as the author of this parody of Scripture couldn’t bear to portray The Innocent Lamb of God being executed for our sins. It just did not fit the character of the impersonal and inscrutable allah to Love the World so much That He Would Send His Only Begotten Son that we might not perish but have everlasting life.

Mel Gibson’s film “The Passion of the Christ” was very popular in muslim countries. At the time, we Christians rejoiced at the thought that muslims “were hearing the Gospel” and we expected a huge influx of new believers. However, it did not happen. I believe the reason was that, even though they were hearing The Word of God in a language very near to their own, they were hearing with MUSLIM ears, and raved about the movie because it made Jewish leaders of the day look bad.

I hope that my pessimism is wrong, but I think that muslims who flock to the sites of apparitions are looking at Mary with Muslim Eyes. Not Catholic, Protestant, or Evangelical eyes.

Of course, ALL things are possible with Christ. he could use this to save a few lost souls, but we’ll never know about it because it will have to be kept a secret.

Just My Humble Opinion.


15 posted on 07/26/2013 8:46:41 PM PDT by left that other site (You Shall Know the Truth, and the Truth Shall Set You Free...John 8:32)
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To: St_Thomas_Aquinas
Yeah, I figured that was coming because of my response to Logitech's simply pinging me to this nutty story. It's not so much that I want to say "whatever, dude," but, what else can I say to those who do not believe the Word of God is IT, and instead worship man-made, unscriptural "traditions" and dead people? Nothing, that's what I can say--NOTHING.
16 posted on 07/26/2013 8:49:42 PM PDT by WXRGina (The Founding Fathers would be shooting by now.)
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To: St_Thomas_Aquinas

Protestant ignorance is what bothers me.

//////////////

Having visited Lourdes in my youth, I can attest that the Protestants have nothing on the Romanists when it comes to superstition and ignorance (and making big bucks on the same!).


17 posted on 07/26/2013 8:54:59 PM PDT by man_in_tx (Blowback (Faithfully farting twowards Mecca five times daily).)
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To: marshmallow

Interesting but I am unsure that this proves any point in relation to Mary.

I have seen Buddhists prayerfully doing the walk up to the top of Saint Paul’s Cathedral they are reaching out for some sort of spiritual understanding but I am not sure they are getting any.

One hopes that somehow they hear the good news of Jesus Christ.


18 posted on 07/26/2013 8:56:54 PM PDT by melsec (Once a Jolly Swagman camped by a Billabong.)
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To: WXRGina
what else can I say to those who do not believe the Word of God is IT, and instead worship man-made, unscriptural "traditions" and dead people? Nothing, that's what I can say--NOTHING.

Like Luther's man-made tradition of "The Bible Alone"?

And why do Protestants, 1/4 of Christians, use Luther's Bible, rather than the true Bible?

Yes, it's difficult for Protestants to see the simple contradictions in their man-made traditions.

19 posted on 07/26/2013 8:58:24 PM PDT by St_Thomas_Aquinas ( Isaiah 22:22, Matthew 16:19, Revelation 3:7)
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To: St_Thomas_Aquinas; WXRGina

I pinged my wife to this story.

I’m not a protestant and neither is she.

Nor, am I ignorant.

I was brought up catholic and was educated by the Irish in the 60’s-70’s.( Thank you sister Stella).

I got a leg to stand on and skin in the game.

Sorry to bother you.


20 posted on 07/26/2013 9:08:02 PM PDT by logitech (It is time.)
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To: man_in_tx
Having visited Lourdes in my youth, I can attest that the Protestants have nothing on the Romanists when it comes to superstition and ignorance (and making big bucks on the same!).

There are many existing, public, scientifically-verified miracles associated with the Catholic Church, yet nothing comparable associated with Protestantism.

This could explain the hostility that some non-Catholics have toward Christ's miracles, regardless of their knowledge of the facts.

Eucharistic Miracle of Lanciano
Shroud of Turin
Incorrupt bodies of the saints
Tilma of Juan Diego
Blood of St. Januarius

21 posted on 07/26/2013 9:10:06 PM PDT by St_Thomas_Aquinas ( Isaiah 22:22, Matthew 16:19, Revelation 3:7)
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To: St_Thomas_Aquinas

This could explain the hostility that some non-Catholics have toward Christ’s miracles, regardless of their knowledge of the facts.

////////////////

“Hostility,” indeed. We are quite familiar with and greatly love Christ’s miracles that are attested to in the pages of Scripture.

None of the events or phenomena listed in your list of “miracles” are supported by Scriptures, so I am under no compunction to believe them.

Actually, I am skeptical of most of them, and generally find them a distraction from the Gospel.

The Tilma of San Diego, for example, is not going to get anyone into heaven... sorry to break it to you.


22 posted on 07/26/2013 9:23:35 PM PDT by man_in_tx (Blowback (Faithfully farting twowards Mecca five times daily).)
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To: St_Thomas_Aquinas
So, not worshiping Mary is ignorance? I gladly plead ignorance rather than idol worship. Please see comments by former nun, Mary Ann Collins: MARY WORSHIP? A Study of Catholic Practice and Doctrine

According to the Catechism of the Catholic Church reading at paragraph 411: "Mary benefited first of all and uniquely from Christ’s victory over sin: she was preserved from all stain of original sin and by a special grace of God committed no sin of any kind during her whole earthly life. The problem is, that is not Biblical! (Here is the link to the Catechism. Please feel free to search for paragraph 411 for yourself. Catechism of the Catholic Church )

Romans 3:23 says, "For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God."

Revelation 15:4 says, "Who shall not fear thee, O Lord, and glorify thy name? For thou only art holy."

Romans 3:10 says, "There is none righteous, no, not one."

In Luke 1:47, Mary says, "And my spirit has rejoiced in God my Savior." IF she is sinless, why does she need a Saviour?

23 posted on 07/26/2013 9:35:49 PM PDT by A Formerly Proud Canadian (I once was lost but now I'm found; blind but now I see.)
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To: left that other site

I believe you are right. I wonder what they will do if they learn the truth about her and her baby boy. Maybe the Christmas song should be translated into their native tongue and given away for free.


24 posted on 07/26/2013 10:33:52 PM PDT by huldah1776
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To: St_Thomas_Aquinas
The 'true' Bible? You mean the one with the Apocrypha? Those books that the Tanakh (Jewish Bible) does not include? Since the Talmud (at Bava Basra 14b-15a, Rashi to Megillah 3a, 14a) states that the books of the Tanakh were compiled by the "Men of the Great Assembly" (450 BC) and did not include the Apocrypha, these books did not form any part of the Scriptures of Jesus' day.

Since these books were not part of the Scriptures of Jesus day and He is not recorded as referencing any of them in His Words, why did the Roman church decide to then add these books to the Bible? Doesn't the Book of Revelation admonish the addition of or subtraction of any of the words contained?

You talk of 'man-made traditions'. How about the infallibility of the Pope? How did that work with Pope Stephen VI (896–897) or Pope John XII (955–964), who gave land to a mistress, murdered several people, and was killed by a man who caught him in bed with his wife. How about Pope Benedict IX (1032–1044, 1045, 1047–1048), who "sold" the Papacy and held homosexual orgies in the Lateran palace? What about Pope Boniface VIII (1294–1303) or Pope Urban VI (1378–1389), who complained that he did not hear enough screaming when Cardinals who had conspired against him were tortured? How about Pope Alexander VI (1492–1503), a Borgia, who sired at least seven children with an uncertain number of women? How about the Medici popes, Pope Leo X (1513–1521) and Pope Clement VII (1523–1534)?

Is it any wonder that Father Luther wanted reformation? With 'infallible' Popes like those noted above, how can one believe that such a doctrine is NOT man made?

Is God infallible? Of course! The Holy Spirit will guide the church universal however, those who will not submit to the leading of the Holy Spirit will falter! The RC church is no more or no less capable of faltering than any other church because it is a man made organization susceptible to all the lies that the Deciever can throw at its leaders. THIS is why we ALL must yield to the Bible and the leading of the Holy Spirit. In ALL things, including what you may feel is the Holy Spirit, test it to scripture, NOT to the traditions of man!

25 posted on 07/26/2013 10:42:14 PM PDT by A Formerly Proud Canadian (I once was lost but now I'm found; blind but now I see.)
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To: A Formerly Proud Canadian
Luke 1

The Birth of John the Baptist Foretold

5 [c]In the days of Herod, king of Judea, there was a priest named ZECHARIAH ,[d] of the division of Abi′jah; and he had a wife of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was ELIZABETH. 6 And THEY were BOTH RIGHTEOUS BEFORE GOD, WALKING in ALL THE COMMANDMENTS and ORDINANCES of the Lord BLAMELESS.

26 posted on 07/26/2013 11:20:01 PM PDT by johngrace (I am a 1 John 4! Christian- declared at every Sunday Mass , Divine Mercy and Rosary prayers!)
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To: A Formerly Proud Canadian

Who said Mary was worshipped. She isn’t. Venerated and we ask her to pray for us, but that’s it.

Worshipped are God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit.

Got that?


27 posted on 07/26/2013 11:23:08 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: A Formerly Proud Canadian

When I start hearing of reports that these Muslim spiritual miracle seekers that go to Marian shrines are turning from Islam and become followers and believers in Jesus Christ, then it might peak my interest. Jesus said more blessed are those who see not, yet believe. We are not to seek after signs. That is why only by faith is it possible to please God.


28 posted on 07/26/2013 11:28:11 PM PDT by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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To: WXRGina
I sympathize with you. Some people can't pass up a chance to be snarky with others. You have my permission to use this gif file ANY time you want:


29 posted on 07/26/2013 11:35:43 PM PDT by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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To: St_Thomas_Aquinas; WXRGina
Like Luther's man-made tradition of "The Bible Alone"? And why do Protestants, 1/4 of Christians, use Luther's Bible, rather than the true Bible? Yes, it's difficult for Protestants to see the simple contradictions in their man-made traditions.

Are you trying that again? What do you mean by "Luther's Bible"? Martin Luther's German translation of the Bible omitted NONE of the books that Catholics have in their Catholic Bible. When are FRoman Catholics gonna remember that? Here's the link, once again http://tquid.sharpens.org/Luther_%20canon.htm#a2

And as for sola Scriptura - which is NOT "The Bible alone" - Luther taught the same thing the early church fathers did which was the same thing the Apostles did which was the same thing Jesus did. Holy Scripture - because it is Divinely-inspired (God breathed) stands apart from ALL other writings as THE rule of the Christian faith. If a doctrine called essential to the faith cannot be backed up by Scripture, it doesn't belong in the rule of faith. It is really no more complicated than that. What it doesn't mean is that Christians can ONLY read the Bible to learn about the faith at the exclusion of all other writings.

For someone who bemoans ignorance, I'd expect a better understanding of these basic facts - they've certainly been mentioned enough times.

30 posted on 07/26/2013 11:50:45 PM PDT by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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To: A Formerly Proud Canadian

Amen!


31 posted on 07/26/2013 11:57:16 PM PDT by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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To: johngrace; A Formerly Proud Canadian
So, now, Zechariah and Elizabeth get to join Mary in being without sin? Heck, couldn't God have made us ALL sinless and saved himself the trouble of the incarnation and the crucifixion?

ALL have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. All means ALL.

32 posted on 07/27/2013 12:00:30 AM PDT by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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To: boatbums

So how do you explain them being blameless in Luke? I am all ears.


33 posted on 07/27/2013 12:18:53 AM PDT by johngrace (I am a 1 John 4! Christian- declared at every Sunday Mass , Divine Mercy and Rosary prayers!)
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To: boatbums
And if all means ALL how do explain the ALL in this scripture.

explain All in the Parents walking blameless in All in Luke. Thank you

34 posted on 07/27/2013 12:24:46 AM PDT by johngrace (I am a 1 John 4! Christian- declared at every Sunday Mass , Divine Mercy and Rosary prayers!)
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To: boatbums
And THEY were BOTH RIGHTEOUS BEFORE GOD, WALKING in ALL THE COMMANDMENTS and ORDINANCES of the Lord BLAMELESS.

Well does " All" mean all in Luke too. The Holy Word of God? I am all ears.

35 posted on 07/27/2013 12:27:38 AM PDT by johngrace (I am a 1 John 4! Christian- declared at every Sunday Mass , Divine Mercy and Rosary prayers!)
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To: marshmallow
Each year millions of Muslims come on pilgrimage to the Catholic Marian shrines. ...In the eyes of many Westerners these gestures seem ridiculous or false

Not to me. It seems consistent with paganism. It probably only seems strange to Catholics.

36 posted on 07/27/2013 3:09:16 AM PDT by HarleyD
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To: left that other site

Got to have hope that at least the SEEDS for faith in Jesus have been planted.


37 posted on 07/27/2013 3:17:54 AM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: Salvation

There are differences between the two.


38 posted on 07/27/2013 3:21:24 AM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: WXRGina; St_Thomas_Aquinas; logitech
Yeah, I figured that was coming because of my response to Logitech's simply pinging me to this nutty story. It's not so much that I want to say "whatever, dude," but,...

Actually, Logitech and this story is right on the money. Christians in the West are completely ignorant of the pagan and idolatry in third world Catholic churches. I've spent a number of years aboard and saw first hand the idolatry that goes on. It is (almost) laughable at the smugness of Catholics here who try to rationalize these pagan feelings into doctrinal understanding and justify (or ignore) this behavior in order to support the "Church". No matter what the cost.

Catholicism is nothing more than a cult and this is what underscores it. It's just that western Catholics can't face this fact and bury themselves within the bubble of a splendor Vatican building and the cuteness of the "Popemobile". After all, it's fun and the pageantry gives an air of respectability.

39 posted on 07/27/2013 3:28:45 AM PDT by HarleyD
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To: All

Yet the RC Church has NOW a Pope who is teaching right out from the Bible.


40 posted on 07/27/2013 3:31:28 AM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: huldah1776; Biggirl

Of course, I will NEVER begrudge planting seeds of faith in muslim lands. God’s Word does NOT return to Him void, and if ONE person is touched, then PRAISE GOD!

It is just so hard when they interpret EVERYTHING (Including signs, wonders, apparitions, even the Words of Our Scripture) in a Totally different and unexpected way than the way it is being presented.

The responses of muslims to even the most simple and logical questions makes civil discourse nearly impossible. A quick trip to any muslim “advice” website reveals unbelievable counsel such as this hypothetical:

“Q: My wife spends so much time with our eight children all day that she is sometimes too tired for sex. What should I do?

A: Oh, You Who Believe! The Answer to this is simple, as outlined by the prophet, peace be upon him. If your wife refuses to do her duty to you, you first admonish her. Then if she is still disobedient, banish her from your bed. If this does not work, you may beat her, but the rod with which you scourge her should not be thicker than your toothbrush. And lastly, you may divorce her, or, if you wish, keep her, and obtain a younger wife to satisfy your needs.”

This “Pastoral Counseling” Scenario is typical of islamic websites. Their take on history, science, family life, ethics, and religion is even weirder. But the tragedy is that ALL of the weirdness is a DISTORTION of the Word of God, and the exact opposite of the Spirit of the Word. One would have better luck bringing the Good News to Borneo Headhunters, because they have no reference to the Bible at all, so there is nothing to “UN-DO”.


41 posted on 07/27/2013 4:10:49 AM PDT by left that other site (You Shall Know the Truth, and the Truth Shall Set You Free...John 8:32)
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To: left that other site

Yet the good news is that in places in the global south, the Christian faith is GROWING and growing bgitme.


42 posted on 07/27/2013 4:14:44 AM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: HarleyD

That.

I have often said, here on FR, that the Catholicism you find in suburbia is not the same Catholicism you find in the rest of the world. The further you get from middle class American Roman Catholicism, the more pagan it becomes. Or perhaps most of American Catholics just disguise the paganism well.


43 posted on 07/27/2013 4:23:08 AM PDT by Gamecock (Member: NAACAC)
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To: Biggirl

Yes it is.

And let’s not forget the resurgence of the Church in the Former USSR!

God’s Word is more powerful than a two-edged sword.


44 posted on 07/27/2013 4:29:43 AM PDT by left that other site (You Shall Know the Truth, and the Truth Shall Set You Free...John 8:32)
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To: Salvation
Try reading the comments of former nun Mary Ann Collins that are provided as a link on my posting from last night. The Salve Regina is not worshiping Mary? Come on, open your eyes! Alfonsus de Liguori (1696-1787) was a principal proponent of the Marianist Movement. In his book The Glories of Mary, he claims that Mary was given rulership over one half of the kingdom of God; Mary rules over the kingdom of mercy and Jesus rules over the kingdom of justice. He writes that there is no salvation outside of Mary and that people should pray to Mary as a mediator and look to her as an object of trust for answered prayer.

1 Timothy 2:5 reads, "For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,". Where does it say that we need a mediator to pray to Our Mediator, Jesus? Why do we need a mediator to pray to Our Mediator, Jesus?

Please provide me with the Scripture verses that explain where Mary was appointed to rule over half of the Kingdom of God and that salvation comes only through Mary. Unless you can show me scripture to substantiate such claims, I must take them as unscriptural and man-made, yet the Roman church canonized him as a 'Saint' and named him a 'Doctor of the Church'.

Have you now "got that"?

45 posted on 07/27/2013 6:45:00 AM PDT by A Formerly Proud Canadian (I once was lost but now I'm found; blind but now I see.)
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To: boatbums

Thank you, Boatbums! I like that gif file! :-)


46 posted on 07/27/2013 7:54:15 AM PDT by WXRGina (The Founding Fathers would be shooting by now.)
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To: HarleyD; logitech
Actually, Logitech and this story is right on the money.

Logitech and I are in full agreement. He is my husband and a former catholic. He is now simply a Bible-believing Christian.

47 posted on 07/27/2013 7:57:38 AM PDT by WXRGina (The Founding Fathers would be shooting by now.)
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To: johngrace
Try reading a few versus farther, after Gabriel announces John the Baptist's conception (Luke 1:18-20):

Zechariah asked the angel, “How can I be sure of this? I am an old man and my wife is well along in years.” The angel said to him, “I am Gabriel. I stand in the presence of God, and I have been sent to speak to you and to tell you this good news. And now you will be silent and not able to speak until the day this happens, because you did not believe my words, which will come true at their appointed time.”

Zechariah was righteous, but he disbelieved God's promise, as communicated by Gabriel, so he was struck mute for a season, until John the Baptist was born. Do you know who else was 'righteous'? King David, a man after God's heart. You know, King David, the adulterer and murder. Job was also righteous, but he suffered more than I could likely take. He suffered because he was proud of his righteousness and adherence to God's laws.

ALL these folks were righteous, yet all sinned. As noted on another posting, Romans 3:23 says, "For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God." Mary even confirmed her sinful nature when she said in Luke 1:47 "And my spirit has rejoiced in God my Savior." Again, IF she is sinless, why would she need a Saviour? If Jesus did not come to save us from the wages of our sins, what did He come to save us from?

48 posted on 07/27/2013 8:16:28 AM PDT by A Formerly Proud Canadian (I once was lost but now I'm found; blind but now I see.)
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To: Gamecock
I recall walking into a church run the Catholics overseas. There on the floor was a zodiac symbol. They tried to convince me that it simply represents "mankind". Here's an interesting article by a Catholic on the Zodiac signs in a Catholic Church. The author apparently sees nothing wrong and closes with:

How touching

--------------- NOT!

49 posted on 07/27/2013 8:27:48 AM PDT by HarleyD
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To: A Formerly Proud Canadian; HoosierDammit; TYVets; red irish; fastrock; NorthernCrunchyCon; ...
WXRGina says "I can’t stomach catholic idolatry, either."

A Formerly Proud Canadian says "Satan appearing as an angel of light, healing Muslims so that they worship Mary, a woman, rather than Jesus."

Amazing the ignorance of what the Catholic Church teaches on display here at FR, truly amazing.

50 posted on 07/27/2013 8:49:40 AM PDT by narses
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