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Catholic Fisticuffs: Look How Those Christians Shove One Another
Patheos ^ | September 3, 2013 | Kathy Schiffer

Posted on 09/04/2013 12:04:32 PM PDT by Alex Murphy

It’s been quite a belligerent weekend in the Catholic blogosphere, hasn’t it?

First there was the Catholic Answers brouhaha, which was started in part by my post regarding the financial crisis looming at that great Catholic apologetics apostolate.

Then there was Michael Voris, chest thumping, publishing the salaries of well known Catholic media personalities, then castigating them for earning wages which are commensurate with their professional achievement and marketplace value, and which are sufficient to support their families.

Two seemingly unrelated dust-ups, but with a common element: In both cases the flames of discord were fanned by traditional Catholics.

It’s ironic, isn’t it, that the traditionalists—the very group which purports to defend the Church from transgressors—would so insistently work to separate Catholics one from the other? That their comments would be characterized, not by genuine caring for their fellow believers with whom they disagree, but with pride and venom?

Reading the combox arguments which ensued following my original Catholic Answers post, I couldn’t help but wonder what Jesus must think of the uncharitable way that some of His followers addressed one another.

And if you’re one of those who believe you can catch more flies with honey, rather than by whacking them over the head with a frying pan, then you’ll probably agree with me that any unbelievers who happened into the combox last week would not likely have stayed to pursue their study of the Catholic faith. No, more likely they’d have run in the opposite direction.

And that’s a shame.

C’mon, you guys: They’ll know you are Christians by your love. Pope Francis has called upon believers to build bridges, not walls. Let’s start building.


TOPICS: Apologetics; Catholic; Ministry/Outreach; Moral Issues
KEYWORDS: catholic; churchofnice; kumbaya; michaelvoris
It’s been quite a belligerent weekend in the Catholic blogosphere, hasn’t it?...Two seemingly unrelated dust-ups, but with a common element: In both cases the flames of discord were fanned by traditional Catholics. It’s ironic, isn’t it, that the traditionalists—the very group which purports to defend the Church from transgressors—would so insistently work to separate Catholics one from the other? That their comments would be characterized, not by genuine caring for their fellow believers with whom they disagree, but with pride and venom?
1 posted on 09/04/2013 12:04:32 PM PDT by Alex Murphy
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To: Alex Murphy
And if you’re one of those who believe you can catch more flies with honey, rather than by whacking them over the head with a frying pan

This is a classic case of false dichotomy.

The religions of the world that are currently growing are the ones that are being more demanding of their followers.

The ones that are dying are the ones using honey to be syrupy sweet in an effort to be "inclusive."

2 posted on 09/04/2013 12:11:00 PM PDT by ClaytonP
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To: Alex Murphy

Alex, I’m bemused by your wall-to-wall coverage of this controversy. My traditionalist-filled Facebook wall isn’t nearly so thorough. ;)


3 posted on 09/04/2013 12:14:29 PM PDT by Claud
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To: Alex Murphy

A real good old fashioned brouhaha!


4 posted on 09/04/2013 12:15:07 PM PDT by Gamecock (Many Atheists take the stand: "There is no God AND I hate Him.")
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To: Alex Murphy

I had never heard of Patheos before, and after skimming through their website, I’m still not sure what they stand for.


5 posted on 09/04/2013 12:18:43 PM PDT by Steve_Seattle
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To: Claud

The Catholic traditionalist with whom I’m most familiar is Charles Coulombe, and he has always struck me as a man with a sense of humor, far from the surly stereotype described by the author of this piece.


6 posted on 09/04/2013 12:22:32 PM PDT by Steve_Seattle
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To: Claud
Alex, I’m bemused by your wall-to-wall coverage of this controversy. My traditionalist-filled Facebook wall isn’t nearly so thorough. ;)

I'm amused by the coordinated "wall of silence" on the subject.

7 posted on 09/04/2013 12:37:04 PM PDT by Alex Murphy (Just a common, ordinary, simple savior of America's destiny.)
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To: Alex Murphy; All
Oh my goodness, do you guess it's going to get so bad they'll be in court fighting over real estate like a bunch of Presbyterians?

Things won't get really interesting, though, until after this program later today.

8 posted on 09/04/2013 12:39:51 PM PDT by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)
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To: Rashputin
Oh my goodness, do you guess it's going to get so bad they'll be in court fighting over real estate like a bunch of Presbyterians?

There's always bankruptcy court, if you prefer.

9 posted on 09/04/2013 12:44:31 PM PDT by Alex Murphy (Just a common, ordinary, simple savior of America's destiny.)
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To: Alex Murphy

I do prefer the bankruptcy court since it puts things back to square one.


10 posted on 09/04/2013 12:47:11 PM PDT by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)
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To: Alex Murphy

What post on CA troubles? They sent their appealed to me as i once posted there, but was banned for life by some mod whom i think misses the Inquisition, for countering an RC rant against Prots. But they still want money from me.


11 posted on 09/04/2013 12:47:18 PM PDT by daniel1212 (Come to the Lord Jesus as a contrite damned+destitute sinner, trust Him to save you, then live 4 Him)
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To: Alex Murphy

You smoked us out: it’s a coordinated effort. We also suppressed the whole traditionalist controversy in the mommy blogs that happened a while back. Whoa Nelly....remember that? No? You don’t keep up with the mommy blogs?

Whew, ok good. Never mind!

You know it’s possible that some of us just don’t give a flying flip about “blog controversies.”


12 posted on 09/04/2013 1:00:39 PM PDT by Claud
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To: Alex Murphy
Try to keep it in perspective please. We aren't lobbing chemical weapons, calling in air-strikes, or moving armor into position like some religions. While it's disheartening that we sometimes resort to the gauche and low form of "discussion" that so mars our times, let's not be so emotional that we start calling it something it isn't.

Common ground is not found by resorting to hyperbole.

13 posted on 09/04/2013 1:18:32 PM PDT by Durus (You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality. Ayn Rand)
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To: daniel1212; Alex Murphy

I think I prefer the inquisition to the higher critics and creation-deniers at “Catholic Answers.”


14 posted on 09/04/2013 1:32:46 PM PDT by Zionist Conspirator (The Left: speaking power to truth since Shevirat HaKelim.)
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To: Steve_Seattle; jrny; Antoninus

Yeah, I like Charles. And I agree. It is a stereotype, but there are definitely surly traditionalists, and we might well ask ourselves why.

Suppose we completely ban the Novus Ordo Mass starting today for....oh...15 years or so and then for another couple decades tolerate it extremely begrudgingly. We’ll treat people like complete freaks for asking for it, make them drive hours to find it in some unused storefront or completely inadequate space. Let’s see exactly how non-trads manage to stay sunny and optimistic after all that, and then we can complain about surly trads.

I’m not going to apologize for everything traditionalists do. But for Pete’s sake, they had their holiest and most precious possession on earth stolen from them and have been treated like garbage for decades. All completely improperly (illegally?) I might add, since Pope Benedict has now definitively established that the traditional Mass *was never abrogated*.

People find trads surly? Great. Offer it up. And maybe think about how the rest of us helped make them that way.

I have been able to attend 2 wonderful traditional parishes because of all the sacrifices and hard work the surly folks made over the years while being treated like garbage by their fellow Catholics. My old parish was started by a disaffected group and was eventually sold to the diocese and regularized. My new one is FSSP, which as you know splintered off of the SSPX.

As for this Voris/Catholic Answers blog “war”/pillowfight....meh. Whatever.


15 posted on 09/04/2013 1:37:55 PM PDT by Claud
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To: Claud

Really good comment. I feel a little less surly already.


16 posted on 09/04/2013 1:42:07 PM PDT by steve86 (Some things aren't really true but you wouldn't be half surprised if they were.)
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To: Alex Murphy

six


17 posted on 09/04/2013 1:42:56 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Salvation
six

Made you change hands!

18 posted on 09/04/2013 1:43:38 PM PDT by Alex Murphy (Just a common, ordinary, simple savior of America's destiny.)
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To: Claud

Well done!


19 posted on 09/04/2013 2:21:47 PM PDT by Diago
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To: Claud

Well done!


20 posted on 09/04/2013 2:21:47 PM PDT by Diago
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To: Claud

Please, whatever you do, don’t bring up women wearing pants. Or The Sound of Music. Thank you.


21 posted on 09/04/2013 3:03:20 PM PDT by Brian Kopp DPM
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To: Salvation
ob·ses·sion
əbˈseSHən/
noun
noun: obsession
  1. 1.
    the state of being obsessed with someone or something.
    "she cared for him with a devotion bordering on obsession"

22 posted on 09/04/2013 3:04:58 PM PDT by Brian Kopp DPM
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To: Alex Murphy; Salvation

ROTFLMAO!


23 posted on 09/04/2013 4:16:17 PM PDT by ebb tide
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To: Alex Murphy

My take is simple. The enemy is pressing an assault. Christians are beguiled and fight with one another while the atheists and pagans press their advantage.


24 posted on 09/04/2013 6:54:38 PM PDT by Mad Dawg (In te, Domine, speravi: non confundar in aeternum.)
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To: Brian Kopp DPM; Salvation
noun: obsession
the state of being obsessed with someone or something.

FYI: if you suffer from an obsession, counting out loud to ten does nothing to alleviate it. I've observed obsessed people trying that method recently, and it didn't help them.

25 posted on 09/04/2013 9:17:24 PM PDT by Alex Murphy (Just a common, ordinary, simple savior of America's destiny.)
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