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Marks of the True Church
http://www.catholicbook.com ^ | MOST REVEREND LOUIS LARAVOIRE MORROW, S.T.D.

Posted on 09/22/2013 7:38:11 PM PDT by NKP_Vet

Did Christ establish many Churches? --Christ established only one Church, to continue till the end of time.

As God is one, He established one Church, which He commanded all men to obey and to follow in the way of salvation.

God is essentially one. He is Truth itself. How can He say to one group of men that there are three Persons in one God, and to another that there is only one Person? How can He say to one body that the Holy Eucharist is Himself, and to another that it is mere bread? God cannot contradict Himself. "He who hears you hears me" (Luke 10:16). "There shall be one fold and one shepherd" (John 10:16).

Christ never referred to His Churches, but to His Church. Christ chose only one Head for His Church. Peter could not have been the Head of conflicting churches.

Christ said: "And I say to thee, thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my Church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it" (Matt. 16:18). Christ did not say: "Upon this rock I will build My Churches," it was clearly not His intention to establish various conflicting churches.

Christ, even in His prayers, spoke of unity among His followers. There would evidently be no unity if He had founded many churches.

Immediately before His passion, He prayed: "Yet not for these only do I pray, but for those also who through their word are to believe in me, that all may be one, even as thou, Father, in me and I in thee; that they also may he one in us, that the world may believe that thou hast sent me" (John 17:20-21).

(Excerpt) Read more at catholicbook.com ...


TOPICS: General Discusssion; History; Religion & Culture; Theology
KEYWORDS: catholic; marksofthetruechurch; romancatholic
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The True Church is one, holy, catholic, and apostolic. The Church that possesses all the shining marks which Our Lord gave is the Church of God, the True Church. Any church that lacks even one of these marks is an imitation, a false church, and not the one founded by Our Lord. The True Church must possess all these marks. It is the Church which Christ commanded all to hear and obey.
1 posted on 09/22/2013 7:38:11 PM PDT by NKP_Vet
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To: NKP_Vet

Which church did the thief on the cross belong to?


2 posted on 09/22/2013 7:42:50 PM PDT by James C. Bennett (An Australian.)
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To: James C. Bennett
Which church did the thief on the cross belong to?

You mean that guy who wasn't baptized, who never ate Jesus' flesh nor drank His blood, and whom Jesus promised would be with Him in Paradise?

No way could he have been a Catholic.

3 posted on 09/22/2013 7:52:02 PM PDT by Alex Murphy (Just a common, ordinary, simple savior of America's destiny.)
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To: Alex Murphy

They say their church is built on the little unstable stone, the petros, of Peter. The church I belong to is built on the solid immovable rock, the Petra, of Christ Jesus.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kC-UyIgoaLU

My hope is built on nothing less
Than Jesus’ blood and righteousness;
I dare not trust the sweetest frame,
But wholly lean on Jesus’ name.

Refrain:
On Christ, the solid Rock, I stand;
All other ground is sinking sand,
All other ground is sinking sand.

When darkness veils His lovely face,
I rest on His unchanging grace;
In every high and stormy gale,
My anchor holds within the veil.

His oath, His covenant, His blood
Support me in the whelming flood;
When all around my soul gives way,
He then is all my hope and stay.

When He shall come with trumpet sound,
Oh, may I then in Him be found;
Dressed in His righteousness alone,
Faultless to stand before the throne.


4 posted on 09/22/2013 8:15:48 PM PDT by .45 Long Colt (A sinner can't pay for grace that's free, nor add to work that's complete.)
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To: Alex Murphy

He was baptized with a Baptism of Blood or a Baptism of Desire. Take your pick


5 posted on 09/22/2013 8:20:06 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: NKP_Vet

Not another one of these silly; divisive threads proclaiming the Catholic Church is the only “true” church.

Especially silly on a day when Islamic terrorists are in the news for murdering Christians.


6 posted on 09/22/2013 8:21:53 PM PDT by HereInTheHeartland (Just wanted to say I hope you great NSA folks are enjoying my posts here.)
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To: .45 Long Colt
From the Bible:

You do believe in the bible, don't you?

7 posted on 09/22/2013 8:21:55 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: .45 Long Colt

The One true Church and how to recognize it.

Use this guideline as a measure...

*It was founded by Jesus Christ Himself in Mt 16:18.
*It would be built on Simon Peter, Mt 16:18.
*It would be defended by GOD Himself, Mt 16:18-19.
*It would have authority given by Jesus Christ, Mt 16:19,18:17-18.
*It would be guided by the Holy Spirit who will dwell within it, Jn 14:15-17, Act 15:28,16:6.
*It would be one and undivided, Mk 3:24-25.
*It would have one fold and one shepherd, Jn 10:16.
*It would have Priests, Bishops, and Deacons, 1Tim 3:1-13.
*It must have the Holy Eucharist celebration, Jn 6:42-70, Acts 2:42.
*It must be found in all nations, Mt 28:19.
*It must be found in all centuries, Mt 28:20.
*Jesus Christ said He would be with His Church every day, in every year, until the end of the world,   Mt 28:20. (This means no gaps in time.)


8 posted on 09/22/2013 8:22:46 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: NKP_Vet

Right after Christ told Peter that He would build His church upon this rock, He told Peter that He must suffer and die. Peter denied that it would happen.

Matthew 16:23 NIV

Jesus turned and said to Peter, “Get behind me, Satan! You are a stumbling block to me; you do not have in mind the concerns of God, but merely human concerns.”

Can Peter be both the rock upon which Christ built His church and a stumbling block to Christ?


9 posted on 09/22/2013 8:23:12 PM PDT by BuckeyeTexan (There are those that break and bend. I'm the other kind. ~Steve Earle)
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To: NKP_Vet
Marks of the True Church

FOUR MARKS OF THE TRUE CHURCH
Lists Every Catholic Should be Familiar With: The 4 Marks of the Church
Radio Replies Second Volume - Holiness of the Church
One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic: Marks of the Church Building as well as the Church Herself
The 15 Marks of The Church
Catholic Biblical Apologetics: The Marks of the Church, One, Holy, Catholic, Apostolic
Four Marks of the Church Four Marks of the Church
One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic: The Marks of Christ's Church [Ecumenical]

10 posted on 09/22/2013 8:27:06 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: HereInTheHeartland

Not silly and not divisive. “Many are called, few are chosen.” Christ’s words.


11 posted on 09/22/2013 8:28:00 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Salvation

How many times are you going to cut and paste that?

And when are you going to explain the biblical basis for your salvation? I don’t want your hundreds of links. I want you to show me from Scripture. I want it in your words.


12 posted on 09/22/2013 8:31:52 PM PDT by .45 Long Colt (A sinner can't pay for grace that's free, nor add to work that's complete.)
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To: BuckeyeTexan
Can Peter be both the rock upon which Christ built His church and a stumbling block to Christ?

Yes. Even on the day of Christ's crucifixion Peter denied Him three times ... but Peter's role as the "rock" wouldn't really become firmly established until after Christ's death and resurrection.

Think of Christ's "church" as the deposit of faith that was left for His followers of that place and time as well as those who would come later in the future. In this context, there was no need for a "church" while Christ was walking on this earth.

13 posted on 09/22/2013 8:33:36 PM PDT by Alberta's Child ("I've never seen such a conclave of minstrels in my life.")
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To: .45 Long Colt

I’m glad you posted this - you saved me the time. Christ is the head of the church - NOT Peter! This is where Catholicism is in error - misunderstanding the words petra and petros. Jesus is the rock - and upon this foundation the church was built. He was complimenting Peter for saying that He was the Christ - not building His bride upon the shoulders of Peter.


14 posted on 09/22/2013 8:34:58 PM PDT by Catsrus
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To: Salvation

I am a Catholic. Why should I consider becoming a Christian?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Catholic-Christian.html

What is Roman Catholicism?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Roman-Catholicism.html

Is salvation by faith alone, or by faith plus works?
http://www.gotquestions.org/salvation-faith-alone.html

What is sola scriptura?
http://www.gotquestions.org/sola-scriptura.html

Is Catholicism a false religion? Are Catholics saved?
http://www.gotquestions.org/catholicism.html

Are Catholic beliefs and practices biblical?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Catholic-Biblical.html

What is the origin of the Catholic Church?
http://www.gotquestions.org/origin-Catholic-church.html

What is the Catholic Bible?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Catholic-Bible.html

What does the Bible say about the virgin Mary?
http://www.gotquestions.org/virgin-Mary.html

What is the Catholic sacrament of Holy Eucharist? What is the Catholic definition of celebrating Holy Eucharist?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Holy-Eucharist.html

What is the immaculate conception?
http://www.gotquestions.org/immaculate-conception.html

Is prayer to saints or Mary biblical?
http://www.gotquestions.org/prayer-saints-Mary.html

Is worship of saints / Mary biblical?
http://www.gotquestions.org/worship-saints-Mary.html

What are the Apocrypha / Deuterocanonical books? Do the Apocryphal / Deuterocanonical books belong in the Bible?
http://www.gotquestions.org/apocrypha-deuterocanonical.html

What is transubstantiation?
http://www.gotquestions.org/transubstantiation.html

Is apostolic succession biblical?
http://www.gotquestions.org/apostolic-succession.html

Is praying the rosary Scriptural?
http://www.gotquestions.org/praying-rosary.html

Are the seven Catholic sacraments biblical?
http://www.gotquestions.org/seven-Catholic-sacraments.html

Should Catholic tradition have equal or greater authority than the Bible?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Catholic-tradition.html

What does the Bible say about the pope / papacy?
http://www.gotquestions.org/pope-papacy.html

What does the Bible say about confession of sin to a priest?
http://www.gotquestions.org/confession-sin-priest.html

What does the Bible say about infant baptism?
http://www.gotquestions.org/infant-baptism.html

What was the first / original church? Is the original / first church the true church?
http://www.gotquestions.org/original-church.html

What was the Protestant Reformation?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Protestant-Reformation.html

Is the pope, or the next pope, the antichrist?
http://www.gotquestions.org/pope-antichrist.html

What is the whore of Babylon / mystery Babylon?
http://www.gotquestions.org/whore-Babylon-mystery.html

What are Christian saints according to the Bible?
http://www.gotquestions.org/saints-Christian.html

What is the Apostles’ Creed?
http://www.gotquestions.org/apostles-creed.html

What does the Bible say about purgatory?
http://www.gotquestions.org/purgatory.html

What is moral theology?
http://www.gotquestions.org/moral-theology.html

What is the rock in Matthew 16:18?
http://www.gotquestions.org/upon-this-rock.html

Is the priesthood of all believers biblical?
http://www.gotquestions.org/priesthood-believers.html

What is extreme unction?
http://www.gotquestions.org/extreme-unction.html

Was Saint Peter the first Pope?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Peter-first-pope.html

Is the perpetual virginity of Mary biblical?
http://www.gotquestions.org/perpetual-virginity-Mary.html

What is the Eastern Orthodox Church and what are the beliefs of Orthodox Christians?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Eastern-Orthodox-church.html

What was the Great Schism?
http://www.gotquestions.org/great-schism.html

What are indulgences and plenary indulgences and is the concept biblical?
http://www.gotquestions.org/plenary-indulgences.html

Is papal infallibility biblical?
http://www.gotquestions.org/papal-infallibility.html

Catholic vs. Protestant - why is there so much animosity?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Catholic-vs-Protestant.html

What is the difference between Catholics and Protestants?
http://www.gotquestions.org/difference-Catholic-Protestant.html

What does the Bible say about liturgy? Should a Christian participate in liturgical worship?
http://www.gotquestions.org/liturgy-liturgical.html

Does the Bible teach mortal and venial sin?
http://www.gotquestions.org/mortal-sin-venial.html

Are apparitions of Mary, such as Lady Fatima, true messages from God?
http://www.gotquestions.org/lady-fatima.html

Does the Bible support the Catholic practice of a marriage annulment?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Catholic-annulment.html

Is the Catholic concept of a nun biblical?
http://www.gotquestions.org/nuns-Catholic.html

What were the Inquisitions?
http://www.gotquestions.org/inquisitions.html

What does the Bible say about holy water?
http://www.gotquestions.org/holy-water.html

What is the Assumption of Mary?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Assumption-Mary.html

Sign of the cross - what is the meaning? Should Christians perform the sign of the cross?
http://www.gotquestions.org/sign-of-the-cross.html

Is the Pope the Vicar of Christ?
http://www.gotquestions.org/vicar-of-Christ.html

What does the Bible say about Limbo?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Limbo-Bible.html

What does the Bible say about being a God-parent?
http://www.gotquestions.org/God-parent.html

Does the Bible teach the celibacy of priests?
http://www.gotquestions.org/celibacy-priests.html

What is sacerdotalism?
http://www.gotquestions.org/sacerdotalism.html

Which of the 30,000 Protestant denominations is the true church of God?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Protestant-denominations.html

Who is the Queen of Heaven?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Queen-of-Heaven.html

Is the observance of a first communion biblical?
http://www.gotquestions.org/first-communion.html

What is the correct interpretation of John 20:23?
http://www.gotquestions.org/John-20-23.html

What is the cause of sexual abuse in the Catholic Church?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Catholic-abuse.html

What is the Holy See?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Holy-See.html

Who are the Jesuits, and what do they believe?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Jesuits.html

What is iconoclasm?
http://www.gotquestions.org/iconoclasm.html

Do eucharistic miracles really happen?
http://www.gotquestions.org/eucharistic-miracles.html

Is it wrong for Catholics to refer to their priests as “father”?
http://www.gotquestions.org/father-Matthew-23-9.html

What is the meaning/definition of the word Catholic?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Catholic-meaning-definition.html

What happened at the Council of Trent?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Council-of-Trent.html

What is the Hail Mary that Catholics say so often?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Hail-Mary.html

What is the Vatican / Vatican City?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Vatican-City.html

What is the Catholic catechism?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Catholic-catechism.html

Is the Catholic concept of absolution biblical?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Catholic-absolution.html

Why is the real presence of Christ in the Lord’s Supper such a controversial issue?
http://www.gotquestions.org/real-presence.html

What is beatification and canonization and are they biblical?
http://www.gotquestions.org/beatification.html

What is a novena?
http://www.gotquestions.org/what-is-a-novena.html

Is penance mentioned in the Bible?
http://www.gotquestions.org/penance-Bible.html

What was the Holy Roman Empire?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Holy-Roman-Empire.html

Do Catholics worship idols / practice idolatry?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Catholic-idolatry.html

What is a papal conclave?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Catholic-idolatry.html

Is Mary the mother of God?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Mary-mother-God-theotokos.html

Is Mary the co-redemptrix / mediatrix?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Mary-redemptrix-mediatrix.html

How are Catholics able to perform exorcisms if many of their beliefs are unbiblical?
http://www.gotquestions.org/Catholic-exorcisms.html

Read more: http://www.gotquestions.org/Catholic-questions.html#ixzz2fGUxJe9D


15 posted on 09/22/2013 8:35:31 PM PDT by haffast (Books serve to show a man that those original thoughts of his aren't very new at all. -Abe Lincoln)
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To: Catsrus
I’m glad you posted this - you saved me the time. Christ is the head of the church - NOT Peter! This is where Catholicism is in error - misunderstanding the words petra and petros. Jesus is the rock - and upon this foundation the church was built. He was complimenting Peter for saying that He was the Christ - not building His bride upon the shoulders of Peter.

nope, Christ said exactly what He meant...He named Peter as titular head of His church. While Christ is, of course, the actual head of the church, he named Perer and all future popes as the Vicar of Christ on Earth.The Vicar is one who stands in the place of, acts as head, "runs things". Christ also promised that while practicing that role, the pope would be proyected from making an error in matters of faith and morals. So far it has worked out just fine...

16 posted on 09/22/2013 8:46:18 PM PDT by terycarl
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To: Salvation

“...The One true Church and how to recognize it.

Use this guideline as a measure...

*It was founded by Jesus Christ Himself in Mt 16:18.
*It would be built on Simon Peter, Mt 16:18.
*It would be defended by GOD Himself, Mt 16:18-19.
*It would have authority given by Jesus Christ, Mt 16:19,18:17-18.
*It would be guided by the Holy Spirit who will dwell within it, Jn 14:15-17, Act 15:28,16:6.
*It would be one and undivided, Mk 3:24-25.
*It would have one fold and one shepherd, Jn 10:16.
*It would have Priests, Bishops, and Deacons, 1Tim 3:1-13.
*It must have the Holy Eucharist celebration, Jn 6:42-70, Acts 2:42.
*It must be found in all nations, Mt 28:19.
*It must be found in all centuries, Mt 28:20.
*Jesus Christ said He would be with His Church every day, in every year, until the end of the world, Mt 28:20. (This means no gaps in time.) ...”

Thanks for this invaluable list of Scriptural references.


17 posted on 09/22/2013 8:48:23 PM PDT by rbmillerjr (We have No Opposition to Obam a's Socialist Agenda:)
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To: terycarl

You are so much in error, I don’t know where to begin. Do the words, “all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God,” ring a bell? This means ALL - including the pope. Jesus did NOT name Peter as titular head of the church. That’s ludicrous! Jesus died for the church - and to become a sacrifice for our sins. Peter was once a sinner, who also needed salvation. He, too, was a mere mortal man - and NO pope is protected from error in matters of morality and faith - because ALL have sinned.

I suggest you take this up with the Lord - its His book you are rewriting - not mine. And, yes, you will be held accountable at the judgment seat of Christ for believing false doctrine and also teaching it to others. Which judgment seat you stand in front of is up to you - Now, you need to seek out the Word to find out what I’m talking about. p.s. - there is NO purgatory! No one can pray your soul out of it into heaven. Sorry, but this is also a false teaching of the Catholic Church.


18 posted on 09/22/2013 9:27:14 PM PDT by Catsrus
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To: Salvation; Alex Murphy
Don't make the rest of us drive you into having to defend your extra-Biblical beliefs (Mary worship, transubstantiation, praying to the dead ‘saints’ who represent everything from ‘flat tires’ to ‘foot itches’, prohibitions for clergy marriage, etc.).

Even using YOUR own Bible, you have no basis, Salvation. However, you have many here eager to take these non-Biblical beliefs on again in debate with you, so, this should get interesting.

19 posted on 09/22/2013 9:27:31 PM PDT by ConservativeMind ("Humane" = "Don't pen up pets or eat meat, but allow infanticide, abortion, and euthanasia.")
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To: NKP_Vet

THE most important, not exclusive but of defining importance, trait of Christ’s church pronounced by Christ himself, has been overlooked both by author and the posters here. Not one has remarked upon it.


20 posted on 09/22/2013 10:04:59 PM PDT by count-your-change (you don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough)
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To: count-your-change

I was thinking the Law of Love.


21 posted on 09/22/2013 10:30:04 PM PDT by Kandy Atz ("Were we directed from Washington when to sow and when to reap, we should soon want for bread.")
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To: NKP_Vet

I can’t help but wonder what it would take to move the commenters from debate, to grappling, to battle; which in the final analysis would be based upon hearsay which would be inadmissible in a court of law. Worse yet is the prospect that the victor and the vanquished would have accomplished nothing more than the expenditure of energy at the very least and the loss of lives at the most; having argued to begin with a matter that cannot be settled in this existence as it concerns the spiritual beliefs of those involved. “Oh the Catholics hate the Protestants and the Protestants hate the Catholics, the Hindus hate the Moslems and everybody hates the Jews...” (Tom Lehrer) So now we have Evangelical Christians added into the mix. Sectarianism raises it’s ugly head once again. Shiite/Sunni anyone?

I’ll bow out now and let you folks go at it.


22 posted on 09/22/2013 11:23:28 PM PDT by chulaivn66 (Semper Fidelis)
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To: NKP_Vet
The TRUE church, the body of Christ, His bride, is a spiritual house of which all genuine believers in Jesus Christ are living stones added to it. The Roman Catholic Church claims to be this one church but it can easily be proved that it is not. Here's how, is every baptized member saved and born again? Are there CINOs (Catholics in Name Only) that are members of the Roman Catholic Church? If the answer is YES, and it's obvious, then the Roman Catholic Church cannot be THE church Jesus said he built and which comprised his body.

The church Jesus established is the true UNIVERSAL called-out assembly (what the word "church" means) and the place where a person chooses to worship doesn't automatically convey sonship nor salvation. The "church" is the people within that belong to Christ, redeemed by His precious blood, indwelled by the Holy Spirit - who will be within us until we get to heaven - and all, as living stones, are being built up as a spiritual house for a holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ. (I Peter 2:5)

The Roman Catholic Church doesn't own the copyright to the name "Christian" nor "church of Jesus Christ". Not even all their billions in wealth can buy it, either.

23 posted on 09/22/2013 11:39:41 PM PDT by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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To: boatbums

24 posted on 09/23/2013 12:05:07 AM PDT by narses
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To: NKP_Vet; infool7; Heart-Rest; HoosierDammit; red irish; fastrock; NorthernCrunchyCon; ...
+

Freep-mail me to get on or off my pro-life and Catholic List:

Add me / Remove me

Please ping me to note-worthy Pro-Life or Catholic threads, or other threads of general interest.

25 posted on 09/23/2013 12:05:22 AM PDT by narses
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To: Salvation
He was baptized with a Baptism of Blood or a Baptism of Desire. Take your pick

What happened to "one baptism"?

26 posted on 09/23/2013 4:35:42 AM PDT by Alex Murphy (Just a common, ordinary, simple savior of America's destiny.)
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To: terycarl

“and all future popes “

I’m sure you have a Scripture reference where a pope is mentioned.


27 posted on 09/23/2013 5:08:57 AM PDT by HereInTheHeartland (Just wanted to say I hope you great NSA folks are enjoying my posts here.)
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To: NKP_Vet

MOST REVEREND LOUIS LARAVOIRE MORROW, S.T.D.

Does,t that mean the most high?

Mathew 23
5 But all their works they do for to be seen of men: they make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the borders of their garments,

6 And love the uppermost rooms at feasts, and the chief seats in the synagogues,

7 And greetings in the markets, and to be called of men, Rabbi, Rabbi.

8 But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren.

9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.

10 Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ.

11 But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant.

12 And whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted.


28 posted on 09/23/2013 5:22:55 AM PDT by ravenwolf
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To: count-your-change

Not one has remarked upon it.


John 14:15
If ye love me, keep my commandments.

Matthew 13:57
And they were offended in him. But Jesus said unto them, A prophet is not without honour, save in his own country, and in his own house.

The Church say they are His own house, but they do not believe what he said.

Jesus is not enough they have to have a religion that has more to it, they have to establish authority.

Luke 17
21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

23 And they shall say to you, See here; or, see there: go not after them, nor follow them.


29 posted on 09/23/2013 6:35:55 AM PDT by ravenwolf
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To: Kandy Atz

At John 13:34,35 Jesus said he was giving the disciples a new commandment, that they love each other not just as the Law commanded but as he had loved them. That kind of love amongst them would define his disciples, “by this all will know that you are my disciples”.

Hence Paul could say that without this love all other gifts or acts were meaningless: speaking in tongues of men and angels, prophecy, charity, faith enough to move mountains, knowledge....(1 Cor. 13)

A commandment of such import from Jesus himself and it doesn’t even appear on any of the “lists”!


30 posted on 09/23/2013 6:42:08 AM PDT by count-your-change (you don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough)
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To: HereInTheHeartland

“Not another one of these silly; divisive threads proclaiming the Catholic Church is the only “true” church:.

Well you know the old saying “Not a billion people can be wrong”. LOL.


31 posted on 09/23/2013 6:43:11 AM PDT by NKP_Vet
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To: Alex Murphy

Salvation is correct, the good thief was baptized, by either desire or blood.


32 posted on 09/23/2013 8:01:25 AM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: Alberta's Child

AMEN.

We forget that it was Christ who built His Church on the rock that is Peter.


33 posted on 09/23/2013 8:05:19 AM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: HereInTheHeartland

+1. I for one am tired of it.


34 posted on 09/23/2013 8:14:13 AM PDT by mad_as_he$$
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To: NKP_Vet

The Church is the body of Christ, not a person, a building or religiosity. But born again believers in Jesus Christ that put their faith and trust in Him for the forgiveness of their sins and eternal life, is the body of Christ.


35 posted on 09/23/2013 9:03:42 AM PDT by ForAmerica (Texas Conservative Christian *born again believer in Jesus Christ* Black Man!)
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To: Catsrus
He, too, was a mere mortal man - and NO pope is protected from error in matters of morality and faith - because ALL have sinned.

Were the human authors of Scripture prevented from error in writing Holy Writ? Remember, ALL have sinned.

36 posted on 09/23/2013 10:57:43 AM PDT by Campion ("Social justice" begins in the womb)
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To: Campion

The Pope has never been an instrument of the Holy Spirit for writing Scriptures. I’m not sure the meaning of your post.


37 posted on 09/23/2013 11:11:24 AM PDT by Catsrus
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To: ConservativeMind

Oh, that dumb Dr. Scott Hahn, converting to that heathen religion.....

http://www.amazon.com/Rome-Sweet-Home-Journey-Catholicism/dp/0898704782/ref=la_B001H6MRHU_1_5/180-6022377-3266563?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1379966745&sr=1-5

The well-known and very popular Catholic couple, Scott and Kimberly Hahn, have been constantly travelling and speaking all over North America for the last few years about their conversion to the Catholic Church. Now these two outstanding Catholic apologists tell in their own words about the incredible spiritual journey that led them to embrace Catholicism. Scott Hahn was a Presbyterian minister, the top student in his seminary class, a brilliant Scripture scholar, and militantly anti-Catholic ... until he reluctantly began to discover that his “enemy” had all the right answers. Kimberly, also a top-notch theology student in the seminary, is the daughter of a well-known Protestant minister, and went through a tremendous “dark night of the soul” after Scott converted to Catholicism.

Their conversion story and love for the Church has captured the hearts and minds of thousands of lukewarm Catholics and brought them back into an active participation in the Church. They have also influenced countless conversions to Catholicism among their friends and others who have heard their powerful testimony.

Written with simplicity, charity, grace and wit, the Hahns’ deep love and knowledge of Christ and of Scripture is evident and contagious throughout their story. Their love of truth and of neighbor is equally evident, and their theological focus on the great importance of the family, both biological and spiritual, will be a source of inspiration for all readers.


38 posted on 09/23/2013 1:13:23 PM PDT by NKP_Vet
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To: narses

39 posted on 09/23/2013 5:06:15 PM PDT by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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To: Catsrus
You are so much in error, I don’t know where to begin. Do the words, “all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God,” ring a bell? This means ALL - ip.s. - there is NO purgatory! No one can pray your soul out of it into heaven. Sorry, but this is also a false teaching of the Catholic Church.ncluding the pope.

All have sinned and fallen short....even Popes...who would ever deny that...not me, the popes are people..they eat and use the restroom.....HOWEVER, when they speak ex cathedra, from the chair of Peter, on matters of faith and morals, they are infallible...they CANNOT make an error, Christ promised it.

On the subject of Purgatory, sure there is such a place, the Catholic Church has taught that for a couple of thousand years but along you come, born in the mid 20th century, to straighten out the oldest religious organization on Earth.....Thanks!!

40 posted on 09/23/2013 7:18:52 PM PDT by terycarl
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To: Catsrus
Jesus did NOT name Peter as titular head of the church. That’s ludicrous! Jesus died for the church - and to become a sacrifice for our sins. Peter was once a sinner, who also needed salvation. He, too, was a mere mortal man -

sure He did, remember, thou art Peter and upon this rock I will build my church???? What do you suppose Christ was doing other than naming Peter as titular head of the church as He knew that He would soon be leaving Earth..

no one denies that Peter was a sinner, he denied Christ three times during the passion . ALL men are sinners and Peter is no exception. Peter, like the rest of needed salvation and chances are very good that he recieved it. That does not mean that Jesus did not choose him for the important role of guiding the church after the ressurection. Peter was, in fact the first Pope and the papal succession has continued, unbroken, to this date!!!Neat isn't it!!!

41 posted on 09/23/2013 7:29:39 PM PDT by terycarl
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To: terycarl; Catsrus
the oldest religious organization on Earth

Judaism is much older.

42 posted on 09/23/2013 7:33:07 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: boatbums
The Roman Catholic Church doesn't own the copyright to the name "Christian" nor "church of Jesus Christ". Not even all their billions in wealth can buy it, either.

they had exclusive rights to the titles for over one thousand six hundred years. Then along came the revolution......but they still claim the titles, oh well!!

43 posted on 09/23/2013 7:35:19 PM PDT by terycarl
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To: Alamo-Girl
the oldest religious organization on Earth Judaism is much older.

Judaism is a religious belief system as is Christianity or islam, but it is not a religious organization....Catholicism is, it has a leader and a governing body.

44 posted on 09/23/2013 7:47:13 PM PDT by terycarl
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To: terycarl
"Claiming" the title and actually having Almighty God recognize it are two different things. Christians existed before there was a Roman Catholic Church and they STILL do outside of it - some exist IN it, as well. But my point is that the Catholic Church is not synonymous with the church of Jesus Christ, His body and bride. Jesus was speaking of a universal body of believers - the called-out ones, who are sanctified, justified and redeemed by grace through faith from all time and throughout the world. They are the elect, known before the foundation of the world, and predestined to be conformed to the image of Christ.

The Bride of Christ follows Christ and is faithful to Him, alone, she hears His voice and He knows her and she shall NEVER perish neither shall any pluck her from his hands. That is how we CAN know that any denomination or religious sect that claims exclusively to BE that body is in error. That is because the Bride of Christ WILL be all the saved. There will be no "goats", only sheep. There will be no "tares", only wheat that will enter into heaven. In my "church", there are tares just as there are in yours and in every other organized religion. Only God sees the heart and He knows those that are His.

45 posted on 09/23/2013 9:54:50 PM PDT by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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To: terycarl; Catsrus
Peter was, in fact the first Pope and the papal succession has continued, unbroken, to this date!!!Neat isn't it!!!

It's one of many neat little myths Catholics like to trot out whenever they think it helps their argument. It has been shown on this forum multiple times that the very idea of a "Pope of Rome" having universal jurisdiction was not even heard of until CENTURIES after Peter was martyred. In truth, ALL the Apostles were commissioned to spread the gospel of Christ and to establish local assemblies of believers in the towns where people responded to them. Many of those churches exist to this day. What has remained unbroken is that God has always kept a remnant that remained faithful to the truth and is why we have the Holy Scriptures to guide us in the rule of the faith.

But thanks be to God, who always leads us in triumph in Christ, and manifests through us the sweet aroma of the knowledge of Him in every place. (II Cor. 2:14)

46 posted on 09/23/2013 10:14:11 PM PDT by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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To: terycarl

No, it isn’t neat because it isn’t true. However, you can believe all the myths and falsehoods you want - because you and you alone will give an account of what you believe and the fact that you rejected the truth of God’s Word to embrace heresies - to the Lord himself one day.


47 posted on 09/23/2013 10:22:31 PM PDT by Catsrus
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To: James C. Bennett
"Which church did the thief on the cross belong to?"

The thief on the cross belonged, and belongs now, to the "Church" (Assembly or Congregation) of true Israel which will accept Christ upon His return. The thief asked Christ to remember him when Christ comes into His Kingdom. This is a reference to Christ's coming Kingdom, physically, literally, and "politically" on the earth for 1,000 years.

48 posted on 09/23/2013 10:29:49 PM PDT by John Leland 1789
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To: terycarl

Right before Jesus said to Peter- thou art Peter and upon this rock I will build my church - there is another scripture where Jesus asks his disciples
“who do men say I am?” Peter gave the correct answer by replying - “thou art the Christ - the son of the living God.”(Matthew 16:16) Jesus commended him by saying - 17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

You have to read Scripture in light of other Scripture - not pull one out of context and build a doctrine on it. Jesus was saying to Peter - upon this rock - meaning the truth of what he had said about Christ being the son of the living God - Jesus was building HIS church - not a church for Peter.


49 posted on 09/23/2013 10:30:01 PM PDT by Catsrus
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To: terycarl; boatbums
they had exclusive rights to the titles for over one thousand six hundred years.

One Thousand, Six Hundred, and fifty years to be precise - And that number should give one pause.

50 posted on 09/23/2013 10:46:34 PM PDT by roamer_1 (Globalism is just socialism in a business suit.)
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