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French Row Over Plans to Swap Christian Holidays
France 24 ^ | 9/26/13 | Sam Ball

Posted on 09/27/2013 7:31:48 PM PDT by marshmallow

A French official has sparked controversy by suggesting that two Christian public holidays should be removed and replaced by ones marking the Jewish festival of Yom Kippur and the Muslim festival of Eid.

A proposal by a French official to replace Christian national holidays with those based on Jewish and Muslim festivals has sparked controversy in the country.

Dounia Bouzar, an anthropologist specialising in religion who was recently appointed to France’s National Observatory on Secularism, put forward the proposal in an interview with France’s Challenges magazine on Monday.

“At the moment, every French person celebrates Christmas, and I think it should be the case that we include one Muslim festival and one Jewish festival among our national holidays,” she said.

Rather than adding new holidays to the calendar, Bouzar suggested replacing two unspecified Christian public holidays with ones marking the Jewish festival of Yom Kippur and the Muslim festival of Eid.

France often prides its strong secular ideals and has strict laws enforcing the separation of religion and the state. Nevertheless, the majority of its national holidays are based on Christian festivals.

“Today, French Jews and Muslims are very uncomfortable asking for days off to celebrate these two very important holidays [of Yom Kippur and Eid],” said Bouzar.

“A Jewish holiday and a Muslim holiday becoming a celebration for all the French would fight sectarianism and advance the cause of secularism,” she added.

(Excerpt) Read more at france24.com ...


TOPICS: Current Events; Religion & Culture
KEYWORDS: europeanchristians; europeanmuslims; france

1 posted on 09/27/2013 7:31:48 PM PDT by marshmallow
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To: marshmallow

France needs to celebrate the glassification of Mecca.


2 posted on 09/27/2013 7:33:23 PM PDT by Paladin2
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To: marshmallow

Barf...just more proof the end is near


3 posted on 09/27/2013 7:34:53 PM PDT by seeker41 (take your country back by whatever means necessary)
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To: marshmallow

“Two unspecified Christian public holidays?” How many Christian public holidays do they have lying around there? Do we have any others besides Christmas and Thanksgiving?


4 posted on 09/27/2013 7:36:30 PM PDT by Cyber Liberty (It's hard to accept the truth when the lies were exactly what you wanted to hear.)
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To: Paladin2

The device used at the trinity site had a copper containment vessel, it fused green glass from the white sands.

Wonder what one housed in Stainless Steel and imploded on the black rock would yield?


5 posted on 09/27/2013 7:37:09 PM PDT by Texas Fossil
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Comment #6 Removed by Moderator

To: Texas Fossil
"fused green glass from the white sands."

They should sell that stuff by the polished cubic inch to lower the debt.

7 posted on 09/27/2013 7:40:16 PM PDT by Paladin2
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To: marshmallow

Celebrate Charles Martel’s victory on October 25, 732 over the Moors. Very French/Frankish and very much the promotion of liberte.


8 posted on 09/27/2013 7:40:39 PM PDT by Cvengr (Adversity in life and death is inevitable. Thru faith in Christ, stress is optional.)
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To: marshmallow

just a silly question.

Shouldn’t we emulate countries or cultures that we admire?

I don’t see a whole lot worthy of praise coming from the Middle East. They really have nothing worthwhile that makes any civilized man say “Golly, that sure is neat. I wish my country/culture had something like that”. I can point to some Asian, Hindi and even Russian cultural aspects that are praiseworthy. Islamic - not so much.

We are rushing to embrace Spanish in our schools. Why? Because every spanish speaking country on the globe is over-ran with ignorance, out of control reproduction, drugs, thugs, corruption and suppression of the few good men. What about those trait is something we wish to incorporate into our culture? What is there to admire about Mexico and every other 3rd world Banana Republic? Because they are over-ran with people, each a monument to ignorance; isn’t a reason to embrace them.

How about teaching languages from countries that are moving FORWARD, instead of dragging themselves (and us) backward? How about teaching our students Chinese, Japanese, Hindi or even Russian? Unless I need to speak to my gardener, or order food in a fast food restaurant; the need for Spanish just isn’t there.

But, if I need to speak to a doctor, programmer, engineer, chemist or other professional in their native language ... the odds are “sure as hell” that this individual won’t likely be a native spanish speaker.


9 posted on 09/27/2013 7:41:27 PM PDT by Hodar (A man can fail many times, but he isn't a failure until he begins to blame somebody else.- Burroughs)
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To: marshmallow

Sacre bleu!


10 posted on 09/27/2013 7:43:59 PM PDT by Argus
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To: All

I think he meant to say a festivus for the rest of us.


11 posted on 09/27/2013 7:44:15 PM PDT by willywill
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To: Paladin2

ROFLMAO!!!! Good one. Thanks, I need that.


12 posted on 09/27/2013 7:44:19 PM PDT by doc1019
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To: marshmallow
Here is the list of French holidays from Wikipedia.

Date English name Local name Remarks
1 January New Year's Day Premier de l'an / Jour de l' an
moveable Good Friday Vendredi Saint Friday before Easter (observed only in Alsace and Moselle)
moveable Easter Monday Lundi de Pâques Monday after Easter (one day after Easter)
1 May May Day/Labour Day Fête du Travail
8 May Victory in Europe Day Victoire 1945 End of hostilities in Europe in World War II
moveable Ascension Day Ascension Thursday, 39 days after Easter
moveable Whit Monday Lundi de Pentecôte Monday after Pentecost (49 days after Easter)
14 July Bastille Day Fête Nationale National Day
15 August Assumption of Mary to Heaven Assomption
1 November All Saints' Day Toussaint
11 November Veterans Day
Armistice Day
Remembrance Day
Armistice 1918 End of World War I
25 December Christmas Day Noël
26 December St. Stephen's Day Saint Etienne Observed only in Alsace and Moselle

The Christian holidays for the full country are: Monday after Easter, Ascension, Whit Monday, Assumption of Mary, All Saints' and Christmas. Assuming they want to keep Christmas, which two of the remaining five will be forcibly converted?

13 posted on 09/27/2013 7:46:41 PM PDT by KarlInOhio (Everyone get online for Obamacare on 10/1. Overload the system and crash it hard!)
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To: Cyber Liberty

Christmas, Good Friday and Easter are the only holidays that are recognized in most places. Of these, only Christmas warrants a “Public Holiday”, as Easter always falls on a Sunday, and Friday is typically only celebrated by a select few religions in a service.

One could argue that Thanksgiving is Deist rather than Christian. The Pilgrims gave thanks to God for their bounty and survival. The role of Christ, while important, may or may not have been significant.

I see no reason why either a Jewish or Muslim person would find offence with giving thanks to God.


14 posted on 09/27/2013 7:46:49 PM PDT by Hodar (A man can fail many times, but he isn't a failure until he begins to blame somebody else.- Burroughs)
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To: Cvengr
Ah, the high point of French civilization.

I'll have a couple of hot cross buns, please.

15 posted on 09/27/2013 7:46:52 PM PDT by Paladin2
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To: Texas Fossil

Red tint from the Iron? Yellow from Cr? Depends on the SS alloy as to the Ni content.


16 posted on 09/27/2013 7:49:27 PM PDT by Paladin2
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To: Hodar

Most Jewish people I know don’t. But too many Muslims don’t just take offense, they find it worth slaying you over because it’s the “wrong” God.


17 posted on 09/27/2013 7:53:08 PM PDT by Cyber Liberty (It's hard to accept the truth when the lies were exactly what you wanted to hear.)
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To: Paladin2

Now think of this, that first implosion device was not a hydrogen bomb. It was a fission device, not a fusion device.

How much more would be vaporized totally with modern nukes? It may be that there would be no trace of the container, since the container is much smaller now than the original at White Sands and The yield is so much larger.


18 posted on 09/27/2013 7:59:09 PM PDT by Texas Fossil
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To: marshmallow

I could support adding Yom Kippur if I were French, but taking away Christmas and Easter (Passover) to do so would be wrong, and certainly not add El Cid!


19 posted on 09/27/2013 7:59:48 PM PDT by JSDude1 (Is John Boehner the Neville Chamberlain of American Politics?)
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To: Cyber Liberty

Jews, for the most part, could care less if a national holiday celebrates their religious holidays ... they will celebrate based on their calendar. For the most part, most would rather not have national recognition ... leads to a spotlight they would rather not have pointed at them.


20 posted on 09/27/2013 8:01:26 PM PDT by doc1019
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To: Cyber Liberty

Umm...easter?!


21 posted on 09/27/2013 8:02:57 PM PDT by annelizly
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To: Paladin2

It was highly radioactive and was cleaned up at the blast site soon after the test. It is very difficult to find a sample of Trinitite today.


22 posted on 09/27/2013 8:03:52 PM PDT by Texas Fossil
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To: marshmallow

***“Today, French Jews and Muslims are very uncomfortable asking for days off to celebrate these two very important holidays [of Yom Kippur and Eid],” said Bouzar.***

We wouldn’t want people to feel uncomfortable, now would we?


23 posted on 09/27/2013 8:04:23 PM PDT by MichaelCorleone (Jesus Christ is not a religion. He's the Truth.)
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To: annelizly

Not an “official” holiday because it’s always on a Sunday. Maybe I should count all Sunday’s as “Christian Holidays?” Hmmm. Must ponder that.


24 posted on 09/27/2013 8:05:24 PM PDT by Cyber Liberty (It's hard to accept the truth when the lies were exactly what you wanted to hear.)
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To: Texas Fossil
Key Lime Pie:


25 posted on 09/27/2013 8:09:16 PM PDT by Paladin2
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To: JSDude1

“....and certainly not add El Cid!”

I think the name of the Muslin holiday is “el Aeid” or something close to that.

el Cid (Rodrigo Diaz) is a Spanish medieval hero who helped banish the Moors from the Iberian peninsula. Maybe the Christian nations should have a holiday named after el Cid? We could name it as though it was for the Muslims, and then the Christians could celebrate el Cid instead. We could pretend to be ignorant and celebrate el Cid.


26 posted on 09/27/2013 8:14:24 PM PDT by Gumdrop
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To: KarlInOhio
My guess: Low Monday and Whit Monday will be kept, not because of their religious importance (they are minor feasts) but because they create three day weekends.

The Assumption and Ascension are most likely to go, despite being major feasts and Holy Days of Obligation, because the Assumption is not moveable and the Ascension is always on Thursday.

Good Friday will be kept because it creates a four day weekend and because it is also a great solemnity to boot.

Christmas and All Saints are too festive, and Christmas is too important, to be discarded.

She is only suggesting Yom Kippur so as not to be seen as openly kowtowing to Islam.

But the whole point of this exercise is to diminish Christianity and valorize Islam.

Eid al-Adha, which is the most important holiday in every Muslim sect's calendar, last four days.

She, being stupid, probably does not know this.

27 posted on 09/27/2013 8:15:47 PM PDT by wideawake
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To: Paladin2

Another photo of Trinitite

http://www.mindat.org/photo-321843.html


28 posted on 09/27/2013 8:18:03 PM PDT by Texas Fossil
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To: Cyber Liberty

Lots of people work on sundays and many business’ are open on sunday. Definitly an official holiday for them


29 posted on 09/27/2013 8:19:49 PM PDT by annelizly
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To: Cyber Liberty

Easter, I’m sure.


30 posted on 09/27/2013 8:24:09 PM PDT by expat2
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To: Texas Fossil

I made better glass samples in school (electric furnace though).


31 posted on 09/27/2013 8:26:39 PM PDT by Paladin2
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To: Paladin2

Yes, very porous and bubbled.

but what do you expect from a Nuke? hee hee hee


32 posted on 09/27/2013 8:31:59 PM PDT by Texas Fossil
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To: Cyber Liberty

Do we have any others besides Christmas and Thanksgiving?

We no longer have any! We have “spring break” instead of Easter and “winter break” instead of Christmas and I don’t think Thanksgiving was ever considered a Christian holiday. We are busy taking holidays away from the founders and leaders of our nation cramming Presidents birthdays together to make room for MLK and that communist that called La Migra on non union farm workers Chavez. I won’t be surprised if the next thing Zero does by fiat is to eliminate a holiday formerly considered Christian to his lord and mast mutthamed.


33 posted on 09/27/2013 8:36:51 PM PDT by Mastador1 (I'll take a bad dog over a good politician any day!)
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To: wideawake
Here in the U.S., at least in my diocese, The Ascension is observed on Sunday. I guess that's 43 days after Easter, not 40.

Another bad practice arising from Vatican II. Or maybe arising from the general decline of devotion among many Catholics in this era.



America demands Justice for the Fallen of Benghazi!

Genuflectimus non ad principem sed ad Principem Pacis!

Listen, O isles, unto me; and hearken, ye people, from far; The LORD hath called me from the womb; from the bowels of my mother hath he made mention of my name. (Isaiah 49:1 KJV)

34 posted on 09/27/2013 8:46:01 PM PDT by ConorMacNessa (HM/2 USN, 3/5 Ma<center> <table backgrines RVN 1969 - St. Michael the Archangel defend us in Battle!)
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To: JSDude1
...and certainly not add El Cid!

That's a bit blunt...

35 posted on 09/27/2013 8:58:21 PM PDT by El Cid (Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house...)
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To: marshmallow
Dounia Bouzar, an anthropologist specialising in religion...

I propose anthropologists specializing in religion be allowed to speak only once a year, and then only through a screen pointed down at the ground, in front of a waterfall.

36 posted on 09/27/2013 10:02:43 PM PDT by Talisker (One who commands, must obey.)
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To: marshmallow

Here in FL the statists tried to get rid of Good Friday, told the kids they all had to come in to school.

I think they had 45% attendance, and after a year or two, they gave up.

IMHO school has nothing to do with celebrating holidays. A school should give holidays simply because a certain number of kids won’t be coming, and at some point it is impractical to hold class.


37 posted on 09/27/2013 11:05:00 PM PDT by I still care (I miss my friends, bagels, and the NYC skyline - but not the taxes. I love the South.)
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To: marshmallow

Just as soon as Saudi Arabia gives everyone Easter off.


38 posted on 09/28/2013 1:20:09 AM PDT by Boogieman
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To: Boogieman

Good point - on a percentage basis there are likely more Christians living in Saudi Arabia than there are Muslims in France.


39 posted on 09/28/2013 8:12:57 AM PDT by wideawake
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To: Hodar
"Because every spanish speaking country on the globe is over-ran with ignorance, out of control reproduction, drugs, thugs, corruption and suppression of the few good men."

On your first point, you are mistaken. Most Spanish-speaking countries have good literacy rates, literacy being the most common international indicator of education. (Source: CIA World Factbook)

Argentina 98%
Bolivia 95.7%
Chile 95.7%
Colombia 90.4%
Costa Rica 94.9%
Cuba 99.8%
Ecuador 93.2%
Mexico 93.4%
Panama 91.9%
Paraguay 94%%
Spain 97.7%
United States 99%

On your second point, you are mistaken, because most Spanish-speaking countries are right around or below the world average fertility rate, which is only slightly above replacement; and many of them are, like the United States, actually below replacement. (Replacement=2.11)

Ecuador 2.58%
Panama 2.56
World Average 2.55
Venezuela 2.55
Peru 2.51
Argentina 2.25
Colombia 2.22
Mexico 2.21
Uruguay 2.12
Costa Rica 2.10
United States 2.05
Chile 1.94
Puerto Rico 1.83
Cuba 1.49
Spain 1.41

On your third point --- drugs--- I wouldn't want to boast much as an American, since, listed next to the Spanish-speaking countries, the U.S. is comparable in addiction to illgal drugs, and in fact exceeds them in addiction to pharmceuticals --- the main source of addiction in the orld toa. industry.

And lastly: thugs and corruption?

Gangs, Obamunists, and look: everything they touch turns to Chicago. Or Detroit. Q.E.D.

40 posted on 09/28/2013 8:55:47 AM PDT by Mrs. Don-o ("The problem ain't what folks don't know. It's what they DO know, that ain't so!" - Will Rogers)
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To: Hodar
OOps. Sorry for the typos.

Replacement paragraph:

On your third point --- drugs--- I wouldn't want to boast much as an American, since, listed next to the Spanish-speaking countries, the U.S. is comparable in addiction to illegal drugs, and in fact exceeds them in addiction to pharmaceuticals --- the main source of addiction in the world being the pharmaceutical industry.

41 posted on 09/28/2013 9:05:08 AM PDT by Mrs. Don-o ("The problem ain't what folks don't know. It's what they DO know, that ain't so!" - Will Rogers)
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To: Gumdrop; El Cid

You’re probably right, (and had a great laugh at my expense)! Which I join in as well..(or did when reading ya’lls posts) LOL


42 posted on 09/28/2013 4:12:25 PM PDT by JSDude1 (Is John Boehner the Neville Chamberlain of American Politics?)
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To: Mrs. Don-o

Very nice response. Let’s address them point by point.

Point one: Literacy.
It’s one thing to read, it’s another thing entirely to do something with the material you read. When is the last time you saw a company like Apple, MSFT, Ford, Dow Corning, 3M, or any other technology company originate from one of these countries? Why not? These are sources of cheap unskilled labor - and that’a about it. With the literacy rate you are quoting, shouldn’t they be keeping up with India, Russia or China?

Average fertility rate - ok, they are inline. Why are they fleeing their countries, instead of repairing them. Mexico has huge reserves of oil, natural resources, and if they could get their act together - they could actually be a prosperous country instead of a parasite.

The drugs, their creation, import and the cartels that ruthlessly control them - are typically from our Spanish speaking friends. When is the last time Merc, Bayer, Johnson & Johnson, Pfizer or GlaxoSmithKline sponsoring a gang? Carrying out a drive-by, kidnapping, torturing or getting in a gunfight where innocent bystanders are killed? So, let’s keep this discussion intellectually honest, and not lump LEGITIMATE drug manufacturers that generate real jobs, contribute to society - with drug cartels that are a parasite that kills, tortures, kidnaps and suppresses entire regions. There is a remarkable difference.

If you look at European, Asian and the typical culture, gangs and thugs WERE considered to be a degenerate culture, that gathered degenerates. This is not the way we are seeing things today, is it?


43 posted on 09/29/2013 10:04:33 AM PDT by Hodar (A man can fail many times, but he isn't a failure until he begins to blame somebody else.- Burroughs)
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To: marshmallow; alphadog; infool7; Heart-Rest; HoosierDammit; red irish; fastrock; ...

“A Jewish holiday and a Muslim holiday becoming a celebration for all the French would fight sectarianism and advance the cause of secularism,” she added.

“A Jewish holiday and a Muslim holiday becoming a celebration for all the French would fight sectarianism and advance the cause of secularism,” she added.

“A Jewish holiday and a Muslim holiday becoming a celebration for all the French would fight sectarianism and advance the cause of secularism,” she added.


44 posted on 09/29/2013 10:08:14 AM PDT by narses
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To: marshmallow

Given that it has been French policy to mandate shorter and shorter work hours, and longer and longer vacations, why don’t they simply add two more holidays?


45 posted on 09/29/2013 1:16:59 PM PDT by annalex (fear them not)
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To: marshmallow

Instead of Yom Kippur I recommend Simchat Torah.


46 posted on 09/29/2013 2:40:01 PM PDT by Zionist Conspirator (The Left: speaking power to truth since Shevirat HaKelim.)
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To: Zionist Conspirator
Instead of Yom Kippur I recommend Simchat Torah.

I recommend you move to Israel and finish out being a servant.

47 posted on 09/29/2013 2:57:50 PM PDT by Hacksaw (I haven't taken the 30 silvers.)
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To: Hodar
Even if everything you're saying is true, I'm not sure what it proves about "Spanish-speaking economies" in general (if it even makes sense to invent such a term) compared to others.

You wondered why Mexico is not "keeping up with" India, Russia or China. A few points of comparison:

Mexico has about a 1.78 trillion-dollar free market economy, with a labor force of about 50 million.

India has a 2 1/2 times larger, 4.7 trillion dollar economy, but with a labor force 10x larger at 486 million. Mexico's per capita GDP is $15,600 , and India's per capita GDP is $3,900 -- only one-fourth that of Mexico.

Mexico's unemployment rate 5%, India's is 8.5% (both are 2012 est.)

So, what does that prove? Maybe not much, except that Mexico is doing far better than "keeping up" with India!

My listing of the statistics in my previous reply, was not intended to be a total cultural-economic analysis (of which I am not capable). I did intend to sketch out how unfounded are some of the common false assumptions about those retrograde ignorant overbreeding banana republics with their useless feckless Spanish-speaking people.

Mexico has a TON of positives, and could be hugely prosperous if they could kick o the crooks and the socialists (but I repeat myself) and open up a free enterprise economy a every level. And they're moving in that direction: a majority of their agriculture and industry is now in private hands.

And I doubt Mexico will ever get rid of their narcotraficantes--- real scum ---- as long as so many American drug dealers --- also scum --- are willing to hand over the cash to buy the drugs. And I won't even mention the U.S. Arm-a-Thug program, Fast and Furious.

48 posted on 09/29/2013 5:45:39 PM PDT by Mrs. Don-o ("Torture your data long enough and it'll confess to anything." - Businessweek)
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