Skip to comments.Mormonism started by Familiar Spirits [ Demonism ] [[The Other World Series]]
Posted on 10/26/2013 5:14:45 AM PDT by Colofornian
A Voice from the Dust 67 Isaiah saw the coming forth of this record as the voice of one that has a familiar spirit whispering out of the dust: 67 Woe to Ariel, to Ariel, the city where David dwelt! add ye year to year; let them kill sacrifices. 67 Yet I will distress Ariel, and there shall be heaviness and sorrow: and it shall be unto me as Ariel. 67 And I will camp against thee round about, and will lay siege against thee with a mount, and I will raise forts against thee. 67 And thou shalt be brought down, and shalt speak out of the ground, and thy speech shall be low out of the dust, and thy voice shall be, as of one that hath a familiar spirit, out of the ground, and thy speech shall whisper out of the dust. (Isaiah 29:1-4.)
Isaiah saw the downfall of Ariel, or Jerusalem, at a time far in the future, "add ye year to year." Then he seems to have been carried away in vision to witness a similar destruction of the cities of Joseph, "and it shall be unto me as Ariel." He describes how they would be besieged and forts would be raised against them. They would be brought down and would speak out of the ground. Their speech would be "low out of the dust"; their voice would be as one that hath a familiar spirit, out of the ground; and their speech would whisper out of the dust. Now, obviously, the only way a dead people could speak "out of the ground" or "low out of the dust" would be by the written word, and this the people did through the Book of Mormon. Truly it has a familiar spirit, for it contains the words of the prophets of the God of Israel.
These quotes come from Marvelous Work and Wonder Le Grande Richards Mormon so called Apostle
Mormons also claim that Is. 29:1-4 predicts the coming forth of the B. of M. Apostle LeGrand Richards says of v. 4, "Obviously, the only way a dead people could speak 'out of the ground' or 'low out of the dust' would be by the written word, and this people did through the Book of Mormon. Truly it has a familiar spirit for it contains the words of the prophet of God of Israel" (M.W. &W., p. 69). There are 15 Old Testament references to "familiar spirits," and every one of them refer to mediums in witchcraft, including Is. 29:4 (Lev. 20:6; Duet. 18:10-12). If the LDS believe the B. of M. has a "familiar spirit," they are identifying it with witchcraft! But, this text is really talking about the destruction of Ariel or Jerusalem, not about the B. of M.
Mormons Giving Heed to a Familiar Spirit - Demonism "Does It Sound Familiar?
Mormons Claim that when we read the book of Mormon, we will recognize similar words, phrases and themes from the Bible. That really shouldnt surprise us; over a dozen chapters from the Bible were lifted word for word from the King James Bible and inserted into the Book of Mormon. But Mormons still maintain that the familiarity one might feel while reading the Bible serves as verification that the Mormon scripture is from God. Mormons often refer to this recognizable similarity and say that the Book of Mormon has a familiar spirit." (from pleaseconvinceme.com)
Mormons point to Isa. 29 as "proof" of the divinity of the Book of Mormon plates buried in the ground:
Isaiah 29:4 And thou shalt be brought down, and shalt speak out of the ground, and thy speech shall be low out of the dust, and thy voice shall be, as of one that hath a familiar spirit, out of the ground, and thy speech shall whisper out of the dust.
Mormon interpretation of Isaiah's words:
Now, obviously, the only way a dead people could speak out of the ground or low out of the dust would be by the written word, and this the people did through the book of Mormon. Truly it has a familiar spirit, for it contains the words of the prophets of the God of Israel (LeGrand Richards, Marvelous Work and a Wonder, 1979 edition, pp. 67-68)
Mormonism has consistently taught that the Book of Mormon was a "familiar spirit" speaking from the ground (to Joseph Smith). I don't know why anybody familiar with the Bible would teach such a thing about a book they wanted to peddle as divine revelation, but apparently Smith was not very astute in Biblical teaching. For instance, he forgot these warnings:
Deuteronomy 18:9-12 When thou art come into the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee, thou shalt not learn to do after the abominations of those nations. There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch, Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer. For all that do these things are an abomination unto the LORD: and because of these abominations the LORD thy God doth drive them out from before thee.
Leviticus 20:27 A man also or woman that hath a familiar spirit, or that is a wizard, shall surely be put to death: they shall stone them with stones: their blood shall be upon them.
1Chronicles 10:13 So Saul died for his transgression which he committed against the LORD, even against the word of the LORD, which he kept not, and also for asking counsel of one that had a familiar spirit, to enquire of it 2Chronicles 33:6
And he caused his children to pass through the fire in the valley of the son of Hinnom: also he observed times, and used enchantments, and used witchcraft, and dealt with a familiar spirit, and with wizards: he wrought much evil in the sight of the LORD, to provoke him to anger. Isaiah 19:3
Seems to me that God frowned on famliar spirits - even to the point of ordering the deaths of those who were indwelt by these familiar spirits. And the spirit of Egypt shall fail in the midst thereof; and I will destroy the counsel thereof: and they shall seek to the idols, and to the charmers, and to them that have familiar spirits, and to the wizards.
Let's look at Isa. 29 IN CONTEXT:
Isaiah 29:4 Woe to Ariel, to Ariel, the city where David dwelt! add ye year to year; let them kill sacrifices. Yet I will distress Ariel, and there shall be heaviness and sorrow: and it shall be unto me as Ariel. And I will camp against thee round about, and will lay siege against thee with a mount, and I will raise forts against thee. And thou shalt be brought down, and shalt speak out of the ground, and thy speech shall be low out of the dust, and thy voice shall be, as of one that hath a familiar spirit, out of the ground, and thy speech shall whisper out of the dust. Moreover the multitude of thy strangers shall be like small dust, and the multitude of the terrible ones shall be as chaff that passeth away: yea, it shall be at an instant suddenly. Thou shalt be visited of the LORD of hosts with thunder, and with earthquake, and great noise, with storm and tempest, and the flame of devouring fire.
Well, when we look at Isa. 29 in context, we can see that it is anything BUT an endorsement of some metal plates buried in Palmyra, NY, dug up by a young occultist with a plan to make money off of gullible neighbors. No, it is a warning against having anything at all to do with a "famliar spirit," a demonic entity that resides within a person. Smith sought familiar spirits, and apparently was possessed by one until he died. In today's jargon, we call these indwelling demons "spirit guides." These are especially prevalent in people following New Age teachings or plainly occultic beliefs.
Folks, stay away from those running after familiar spirits and demonic powers - Mormonism is just such a religion. Steeped in the occult, it has no problems with communicating with the dead (in fact, encourages it), basing it beliefs on spiritistic visions, and following a "prophet," Smith, who was deeply involved in the Kingdom of Darkness.
Isaiah saw the downfall of Ariel, or Jerusalem, at a time far in the future...They would be brought down and would speak out of the ground. Their speech would be "low out of the dust";
Also from the blog:
* Reviews [The OTHER World Series: 'The eyes of the dead are upon us' - ex-LDS 'prophet']
* Teachings Concerning The Spirit World [Lds: 'unseen...visitors'...from 'world beyond' close]
* Interesting Similarities between Mormonism and Spirit Release Therapy [The OTHER World Series...]
* Do Mormons Believe in Ghosts? [The OTHER World Series: 'spirits...not far from us']
* Opinion: Mormon zombies are hard to find is Halloween fit for LDS? [The OTHER World Series]
* Is "Ghost Hunters" host Grant Wilson a member? [of the Mormon church? Yes]
* 25 years ago today - 1988 Oct.1 [Lds complete 100 million endowments for the dead in temples]
And this thread -- up as of this morning:
* What Is the LDS Standard For Discerning Between Spirits? [Smith: 'some revelations of the devil']
Real question: did the dead prophet Samuel speak to Saul because the witch of Endor had conjured him up, or because God had willed a miracle at that moment?
Scripture does record that He opened the mouth of Balaam’s donkey, and she spoke.
Scripture is clear that what is intended for evil, God turns for good (example: Joseph, Genesis 50).
This is yet another example of that: The evil intended here is to conjure up a deceased spirit to bypass God's ways of guidance.
God allowed that to happen for the express purpose of judgment: Samuel pronounced that judgment, which was then promptly fulfilled the following day.
As for your specific Q about the conjuring powers of the witch...note (a) she was frightened/surprised that he actually showed...meaning she had no ongoing experience with this; and (b) humans -- or demons -- don't have the inherent power to bring people back from the dead (Luke 16:24-31; Heb. 9:27)
Scripture does record that He opened the mouth of Balaams donkey, and she spoke.
Yes...people can read this in Numbers 22
And, similarly, ELSIE posts on FR.
One of the most abused, partial verses, taken out of context phrases in the Bible:
Judge not, lest you be judged".
Frequently, the people who toss it out, have no understanding of it, in full and in context.
Mormonic Verses Placemarker
“Real question: did the dead prophet Samuel speak to Saul because the witch of Endor had conjured him up, or because God had willed a miracle at that moment?”
The answer is, it was a Demon, not Samuel, though it seems like it really was Samuel at first. From the Illustrious Matthew Henry’s commentary:
“The spectre, or apparition, personating Samuel, asks why he is sent for (1Sa_28:15): Why hast thou disquieted me to bring me up? To us this discovers that it was an evil spirit that personated Samuel; for (as bishop Patrick observes) it is not in the power of witches to disturb the rest of good men and to bring them back into the world when they please; nor would the true Samuel have acknowledged such a power in magical arts: but to Saul this was a proper device of Satan’s, to draw veneration from him, to possess him with an opinion of the power of divination, and so to rivet him in the devil’s interests.
II. Saul makes his complaint to this counterfeit Samuel, mistaking him for the true; and a most doleful complaint it is: I am sorely distressed, and know not what to do, for the Philistines make war against me; yet I should do well enough with them if I had but the tokens of God’s presence with me; but, alas! God has departed from me. He complained not of God’s withdrawings till he fell into trouble, till the Philistines made war against him, and then he began to lament God’s departure. He that in his prosperity enquired not after God in his adversity thought it hard that God answered him not, nor took any notice of his enquiries, either by dreams or prophets, neither gave answers immediately himself nor sent them by any of his messengers. He does not, like a penitent, own the righteousness of God in this; but, like a man enraged, flies out against God as unkind and flies off from him: Therefore I have called thee; as if Samuel, a servant of God, would favour those whom God frowned upon, or as if a dead prophet could do him more service than the living ones. One would think, from this, that he really desired to meet with the devil, and expected no other (though under the covert of Samuel’s name), for he desires advice otherwise than from God, therefore from the devil, who is a rival with God. God denies me, therefore I come to thee. Flectere si nequeo superos, Acheronta movebo. - If I fail with heaven, I will move hell.
III. It is cold comfort which this evil spirit in Samuel’s mantle gives to Saul, and is manifestly intended to drive him to despair and self-murder. Had it been the true Samuel, when Saul desired to be told what he should do he would have told him to repent and make his peace with God, and recall David from his banishment, and would then have told him that he might hope in this way to find mercy with God; but, instead of that, he represents his case as helpless and hopeless, serving him as he did Judas, to whom he was first a tempter and then a tormentor, persuading him first to sell his master and then to hang himself. 1. He upbraids him with his present distress (1Sa_28:16), tells him, not only that God had departed from him, but that he had become his enemy, and therefore he must expect no comfortable answer from him: Wherefore dost thou ask me? How can I be thy friend when God is thy enemy, or thy counsellor when he has left thee?
2. He upbraids him with the anointing of David to the kingdom, 1Sa_28:17. He could not have touched upon a string that sounded more unpleasant in the ear of Saul than this. Nothing is said to reconcile him to David, but all tends rather to exasperate him against David and widen the breach. Yet, to make him believe that he was Samuel, the apparition affirmed that it was God who spoke by him. The devil knows how to speak with an air of religion, and can teach false apostles to transform themselves into the apostles of Christ and imitate their language. Those who use spells and charms, and plead, in defence of them, that they find nothing in them but what is good, may remember what good words the devil here spoke, and yet with what a malicious design.
3. He upbraids him with his disobedience to the command of God in not destroying the Amalekites, 1Sa_28:18. Satan had helped him to palliate and excuse that sin when Samuel was dealing with him to bring him to repentance, but now he aggravates it, to make him despair of God’s mercy. See what those get that hearken to Satan’s temptations. He himself will be their accuser, and insult over them. And see whom those resemble that allure others to that which is evil and reproach them for it when they have done. 4. He foretels his approaching ruin, 1Sa_28:19. (1.) That his army should be routed by the Philistines. This is twice mentioned: The Lord shall deliver Israel into the hand of the Philistines. This he might foresee, by considering the superior strength and number of the Philistines, the weakness of the armies of Israel, Saul’s terror, and especially God’s departure from them. Yet, to personate a prophet, he very gravely ascribes it once and again to God: The Lord shall do it. (2.) That he and his sons should be slain in the battle: Tomorrow, that is, in a little time (and, supposing that it was now after midnight, I see not but it may be taken strictly for the very next day after that which had now begun), thou and thy sons shall be with me, that is, in the state of the dead, separate from the body. Had this been the true Samuel, he could not have foretold the event unless God had revealed it to him; and, though it were an evil spirit, God might by him foretel it; as we read of an evil spirit that foresaw Ahab’s fall at Ramoth-Gilead and was instrumental in it (1Ki_22:20, etc.), as perhaps this evil spirit was, by the divine permission, in Saul’s destruction. That evil spirit flattered Ahab, this frightened Saul, and both that they might fall; so miserable are those that are under the power of Satan; for, whether he rage or laugh, there is no rest, Pro_29:9.
"Regard not them that have familiar spirits, neither seek after wizards, to be defiled by them; I am the Lord your God." Joseph Smith Translation, Lev. 19:31
"Here is a voice that has spoken from the dust with a familiar spirit, and touched the hearts of men and women in many lands. Those who have read it prayerfully, be they rich or poor, learned or unlearned, have grown under its power"
(Gordon B. Hinckley, Conference Reports, October, 1959, p. 119)
"Isaiah prophesies of Book of Mormon. One of the most important predictions regarding the Book of Mormon is found in the 29th chapter of Isaiah. ... They should have heaviness and sorrow and should be brought down to speak out of the ground, and their speech was to be low out of the dust, and their voice was to be as of one that had a familiar spirit,"
Lds "prophet" Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 3, p. 213
Y'all familiar with ma son??