Skip to comments.Franklin Graham: The pope is 'not the judge'
Posted on 12/29/2013 9:04:49 PM PST by 2ndDivisionVet
Franklin Graham, the son of evangelist Billy Graham, says hes at odds on the issue of homosexuality with Pope Francis, who famously told reporters this summer, If a person is gay and seeks God and has goodwill, who am I to judge them?
I think hes right when he says hes not the judge, Graham said in an interview that aired Sunday on NBCs Meet the Press, adding: Hes not the judge. God is the judge.
Graham said he feels compelled to tell people about his belief that homosexuality is a sin and declared that he wouldnt shift on the issue.
God would have to shift and God doesnt, he said. Gods word is the same, yesterday and today and a million years from now.(continued)
(Excerpt) Read more at politico.com ...
Ping for later
I don’t see any difference between their standpoints. I do see a BillyBoy who apparently wants to hype the pope as if there WAS a difference.
It’s worth noting that, however awkwardly, this is probably the most evangelical pope the Roman Catholic church has had since Peter (if Peter is to be counted as a pope).
PS I don’t think any of this is an accident. I think God’s right smack dab on the case.
I am always on alert when tons of atheists and Christian haters are thrilled with the words of this Pope. They are hearing something that is exciting them and it is not driving them to their knees in repentance.
You can’t blame the pope for this, any more than you can blame God for how the devil misused scripture to try to mislead Christ.
In other words, if we complain about this we were trusting in something less than God as a bulwark against evil.
God prefers to win over enemies (human) by making friends of them.
Calling to repentance through kindness isn’t always the instant spectacle that you might want to see. An impatient tyrant might want to see this. A God who plays His ‘game” on the bench of eternity has other views.
If you hear someone tell you God alone is the judge, it’s a good idea to pay attention.
Since when did Pope Francis argue God's judgment ISN'T supreme?
That's the wrong conclusion to the assertion that homosexuality is a sin*: the right conclusion is "Thank God that while we were yet sinners, Jesus died for us."
(* That God would have to change to provide them salvation; their sin cannot invalidate the work of Christ nor is God changing his mind: he already said
Come now, let us reason together: though your sins are like scarlet, they shall be like snow; though they are red like crimson, they shall become like wool. he came to provide an escape from the power of sin and death.)
The right answer is contrition, and “go and sin no more”
Recognize the sin, without condemning the sinner.
There is a difference between visiting and comforting the prisoner and evangelizing to them, and lying with dogs and getting up with fleas. Sadly most of us, myself included, don’t always do such a good job at understanding and acting on that difference.
Exactly right. God wants us to love one another. All of us have sinned and fall short of the glory of God. Anyone, no matter what they have done, can confess their sins and accept Jesus Christ as their personal savior. That is the only way to the Kingdom of Heaven. Good deeds are pleasing to God, but no matter how many good deeds you do, unless you accept Jesus as your lord and savior you are condemned to eternal hell.
Graham should be careful discussing his belief on homosexuals...he might not land that new show in A&E!!
Billy Boy needs to talk to his daddy and let him tell him what the Pope meant. Sometimes Billy Boy makes no sense.
The Church needs to replace its old motto of "always the same" with "always evolving."
Completely agree. The reaction isn't "Gee, that makes a lot of sense....I need to get my life right with God". It's "I really like this guy because he accepts my lifestyle." At least that's the spin that's being put on it.
Brothers and sisters, let us acknowledge our sins, and so prepare ourselves to celebrate the sacred mysteries.
I confess to almighty God
and to you my brothers and sisters,
that I have greatly sinned,
in my thoughts and in my words,
in what I have done and in what I have failed to do,
through my fault, through my fault,
through my most grievous fault;
therefore I ask blessed Mary ever-virgin,
all the Angels and Saints, and you my
brothers and sisters, to pray for me to the Lord
May almighty God have mercy on us, forgive of our
sins, and bring us to everlasting life. Amen.
Once again the “unchanging” Church knuckles under, those awful Fundamentalist Protestants stay true.
The Church needs to replace its old motto of “always the same” with “always evolving.”
yea like Mike Murdock, Swaggert, Hines, etc etc and when was the last time your boy Joel spoke of sin.
All sinners are welcomed into the church, yet they must repent and change their ways like all of us. If only non-sinners went to church, churches would be empty
Perhaps Graham was mistranslated.
Actually there is a difference.. Graham is willing to tell them they will die in their sin and go to hell .....The pope well who is he to judge ??
When the Pope speaks from a special chair—his words are infalible and reflect the will of God. But when he’s not, its just his opinion.
You’ve hit the nail on the head for those of us who are Catholic and find the “Who am I to judge?” comment troubling.
You know where I stand on changes in the Church. However, the Church has not changed in its doctrine re: homosexual acts. The problem is the impression/message that certain comments give/send, certain liberal (”Wuerl”) appointments made by Francis, the concern that there could be changes on the horizon, the fact that a leading gay and lesbian magazine chose Francis as Person of the Year, etc.
As of now, however, there have been no official change.
It’s ultimately tradition that follows on which selects what’s “ex cathedra” anyhow... so the problem of official doctrine still isn’t actually solved, it is only consensused. We have ongoing intrigue here, though kept in bounds by the Lord.
Agh, if there is not an obligatory hellfire with the message, it’s gotta be WRONG.
Uh, I don’t think so.
That is the same thing I was thinking. You said it better. It is the part the Pope did not finish with that excites the lefties.
Not so much a hellfire message but the obligatory full Catholic teaching. All too often, Francis only speaks part of the Truth. Sometimes, he speaks lies (as in his latest comment about Mary). Both cause serious problems.
If someone wants to hear the whole 9 yards of Catholic theologizing, that someone can always look it up online. Sometimes a heavy immediate theology dump is not the grace God has in mind. Jesus wasn’t into such things; why should we Christians be more arrogant?
Jesus was clear in what He meant (even to the point of not holding back “hard sayings”). Popes have a responsibility to give a clear Catholic response. Francis is sorely lacking in his responsibility. The fruits of which are clear.
If he is not allowed to judge homosexuals, then he is not allowed to judge homosexual priests who molest boys.
You can either judge or not.
Let me try to do this as delicately as I can.
I fervently wish that someone would ask the Pope, “Is it right and proper for a man to join his genital to the oral or anal cavity of another man? Is it right and proper for a woman to stimulate the genitals of another woman?”
Phil Robertson laid it on the line with his use of graphic language. He actually set up the Pope quite well. Now, if a reporter will just follow up, some clarity can be brought. This matter of the difference is orientation / temptation and conduct / behavior is widely ignored and must be brought forth forcefully, if graphically.
Ain't nobody got time fo' dat.
Most of all the msm who must cater to the gnat like attention span of their consumers.
I’m not sure whether you’re being serious or mocking those of us who call for clarity in Church teaching.
Serious as a heart attack.
The actual teaching is clear already. The presentation is not, as far as mass consumption. Some manner is forced feeding is indicated.
Although I agree with you regarding the presentation, I’m not so sure I’m looking for graphic explanations. We do not need extreme clarifications. We just need the man in white to actually speak unequivocally Catholic.
Jesus tailored His message to His time and audience.
You want to throw the whole book at anyone who brings up the issue, and that, I must say frankly, is a sign of pride. If the message is helpful towards those who would eventually yield to God, then we don’t need it to be encyclopedic every single solitary stinking time!
Which is not always authentic biblical.
The accepted Catholic attitude, as best as I have been able to observe, is to assume that there’s little or nothing to do about the “temptation” but to swear to singlehood.
This sells the power of God short. Authentic biblicism promotes the power of God shamelessly.
Not to put too fine a point on it, the manhood needs to be restored to the “gay” (sad) man. GOD CAN READILY DO THAT WHEN CALLED UPON IN EARNEST but I think Catholic counseling norms are not up to it today, again based on what I have seen. As a Crazy Evangelical I do not have those shackles.
Seems to me like
You’re assuming. “IF” is a big if. Also, Jesus didn’t hold back. He even let disciples leave him when he said hard sayings they didn’t like.
I’m not looking for Bible thumping, just a complete Catholic POV...not one that leads others to believe that somehow Catholic teaching changed. We should always be clear and not mislead.
You have your opinion. I have mine. No need to judge signs of pride. I haven’t judged you, have I?