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Canon Law and Non-Infant Baptism
Canon Law Made Easy ^ | January 9, 2014 | Cathy Caridi, J.C.L.

Posted on 01/09/2014 11:27:51 AM PST by Weiss White

Q: My neighbors are Catholics who didn’t practice the faith for years, but now they are returning to the Church. Their children were never baptized, so they went to the parish priest to arrange for their baptism. But he refused, because he said the children are too old! He claims the children are mature enough to decide for themselves if they want to be Catholic or not…. The whole thing sounds bizarre. The parents truly want to raise their children as Catholics. Is it possible the priest doubts their sincerity? What can they do? –Rachel

A: It’s impossible to be absolutely sure what is happening to Rachel’s neighbors without knowing all the details, but we can nevertheless piece together the likely reason for the priest’s refusal to baptize their children at the parents’ request.

(Excerpt) Read more at canonlawmadeeasy.com ...


TOPICS: Apologetics; Catholic; Religion & Culture; Theology
KEYWORDS: bandwidththief; baptism; bloggymcblogger; blogpimp; blogselfpromo; blogspam; canonlaw; catholic; checkoutmyblog; comeseemyblog; didjareadmyblog; ihaveablog; iminteresting; listentome; lookatme; payattentiontome; pimpmyblog; rcia; readme; readmyblog; readmyramblings; trollingforhits
This post and all other posts on the same blog are copyrighted. That's why I only post an excerpt
1 posted on 01/09/2014 11:27:51 AM PST by Weiss White
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To: Weiss White

I doubt seriously that anyone would write that this situation ‘sounds bizarre’. This seems to me to be like ask the mullah or dear ann landers. Why not just ask a general question about children and baptism rather than putting words in a nonexistent person’s mouth?


2 posted on 01/09/2014 11:46:44 AM PST by Nifster
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To: Nifster

Weiss White seems to respond immediately to articles written by
Cathy Caridi, J.C.L. which leads me to believe they are both the same person.


3 posted on 01/09/2014 11:53:57 AM PST by knarf (I say things that are true .. I have no proof .. but they're true.)
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To: Weiss White

The way i understand it is that infant Baptism is only a christening and not a baptism in the Church.

A person must decide for them selves if they want to be a part of the Church.

Jesus was Christened as an infant, but close to thirty years old before he was baptized, aside from Jesus many young people do not know what they really believe even at that age, and some much older.


4 posted on 01/09/2014 12:08:03 PM PST by ravenwolf
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To: knarf; Jim Robinson

I believe you are correct that they are one and the same. And Weiss White is very adamant about the articles being copyrighted and not permitted to post the entire article.

Does not JimRob require bloggers to post their entire article?


5 posted on 01/09/2014 12:18:05 PM PST by Second Amendment First
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To: Second Amendment First

If they’re posting from their own blogs, there is no need to excerpt. If they’re posting from someone else’s copyrighted blog, there’s no choice.


6 posted on 01/09/2014 12:26:14 PM PST by Jim Robinson (Resistance to tyrants is obedience to God!!)
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To: Weiss White

How old are the kids?
3-4-5 priest should go with parents wishes
13-14-15 let kids make up thir own mind


7 posted on 01/09/2014 12:27:05 PM PST by brooklyn dave ( Dante DiBlasio's Afro for President)
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To: ravenwolf

“Jesus was Christened as an infant”

Where is that in the Bible or tradition? I’m not accusing you of anything, just never heard anything about that.

He was certainly circumcised per Jewish Law as an infant. Is that what you mean?


8 posted on 01/09/2014 12:30:15 PM PST by TheThirdRuffian (RINOS like Romney, McCain, Christie are sure losers. No more!)
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To: ravenwolf
Jesus was Christened as an infant

Um, no.

9 posted on 01/09/2014 12:31:29 PM PST by SoothingDave
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To: ravenwolf
"Jesus was Christened as an infant"

I know Catholics get angty at me because I question them a lot, but ... Where did you get THAT ?

10 posted on 01/09/2014 12:41:37 PM PST by knarf (I say things that are true .. I have no proof .. but they're true.)
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To: knarf; ravenwolf

I doubt that ravenwolf is a Catholic. If so, he/she is a poorly informed one.


11 posted on 01/09/2014 12:44:30 PM PST by SoothingDave
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To: ravenwolf

I think you mean, Jesus was taken to the temple for the sacrifice, naming and circumcision.
That ceremony is at 8 days.


12 posted on 01/09/2014 12:53:27 PM PST by svcw (Not 'hope and change' but 'dopes in chains')
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To: Weiss White

Short answer: If they’re old enough that they could make First Communion if they were baptized already, they’re old enough to make their own decision to be baptized, and go through (I know this is going to sound strange, but go with it) RCIA adapted for kids.

I know this because I’m an adult catechumen right now and my parish has a separate RCIA class going for the kids.


13 posted on 01/09/2014 1:04:50 PM PST by RichInOC (2013-14 Tiber Swim Team)
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To: Second Amendment First; knarf; Weiss White
I believe you are correct that they are one and the same. And Weiss White is very adamant about the articles being copyrighted and not permitted to post the entire article.

I believe you're correct on the first part. And I know you're correct on the second part, making the first part (if true) disingenuous.

14 posted on 01/09/2014 1:16:15 PM PST by Alex Murphy ("the defacto Leader of the FR Calvinist Protestant Brigades")
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To: Weiss White

Not bizarre. Infant baptism is for infants. Adults must ask for baptism on their own. The official church reply makes sense.


15 posted on 01/09/2014 1:30:50 PM PST by I want the USA back (Media: completely irresponsible traitors. Complicit in the destruction of our country.)
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To: Alex Murphy
"I believe you're correct on the first part. And I know you're correct on the second part, making the first part (if true) disingenuous"

By faith, I believe you just made sense

16 posted on 01/09/2014 1:32:06 PM PST by knarf (I say things that are true .. I have no proof .. but they're true.)
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To: I want the USA back

I wonder how many kids raised by Catholics are actually allowed to make that decision for themselves?


17 posted on 01/09/2014 1:47:08 PM PST by happilymarriedmom
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To: happilymarriedmom

Or how many baptize their children, but later leave the faith entirely?


18 posted on 01/09/2014 1:55:10 PM PST by darkangel82
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To: svcw
Jesus was not taken to the temple for circumcision.

In the traditional church calendar, the Nativity is celebrated on Dec. 25, the Circumcision 8 days later on Jan. 1, and the Presentation in the Temple (or the Purification of the Virgin Mary) on Feb. 2, the 40th day after the Nativity.

19 posted on 01/09/2014 2:00:46 PM PST by Verginius Rufus
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To: Verginius Rufus

Mary and Joseph were observant Jews, Jesus would have been circumcised when he was eight days old, Joseph would have named Him, and there would have been a sacrifice.
I have know idea what your dates are referring to, the family would have acted in accordance to the Law.


20 posted on 01/09/2014 2:39:05 PM PST by svcw (Not 'hope and change' but 'dopes in chains')
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To: RichInOC

My parish has a seperate program for children, I help one of the two deacons in regards to RCIA. The other deacon heads what it is called, RCIC.


21 posted on 01/09/2014 3:00:42 PM PST by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: svcw
Since we don't know the actual day of Jesus' birth, we don't know the 8th day or the 40rh day after that date. The Church, after fixing on December 25 as the date to celebrate the birth of Jesus, fixed the other two celebrations in keeping with that.

The rite of circumcision is supposed to date back to Abraham, hundreds of years before the first temple was built. All of the Israelite baby boys were supposed to be circumcised on the 8th day--there was no way to force families from all over the Holy Land to bring the newborn babies to Jerusalem for a ritual that could be just as well handled locally. Infant mortality was enough of a problem without aggravating it.

If you know of a passage in the Bible that says that circumcision had to be performed in the temple, please let me know where it is.

Moses failed to have his sons circumcised on the 8th day: see Exodus 4:25.

22 posted on 01/09/2014 3:30:43 PM PST by Verginius Rufus
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To: ravenwolf

Jesus was dedicated to God’s service as an infant at the Presentation in the Temple.


23 posted on 01/09/2014 4:38:11 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Salvation

Jesus was dedicated to God’s service as an infant at the Presentation in the Temple.


Ok, i used the wrong word, i had been told that infant baptism was called Christening and that it was the same as Jesus being dedicated, is that right.


24 posted on 01/09/2014 5:43:46 PM PST by ravenwolf
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To: svcw

I think you mean, Jesus was taken to the temple for the sacrifice, naming and circumcision.
That ceremony is at 8 days.


No, it was after the days of her purification 40 days i think.

Luke 2:22-40
22 And when the days of her purification according to the law of Moses were accomplished, they brought him to Jerusalem, to present him to the Lord;


25 posted on 01/09/2014 6:16:49 PM PST by ravenwolf
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To: ravenwolf

“Jesus was Christened as an infant,”

No, He was circumcised.


26 posted on 01/09/2014 6:21:43 PM PST by vladimir998
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To: SoothingDave

I doubt that ravenwolf is a Catholic. If so, he/she is a poorly informed one.


You know, you could just be right but why don,t you tell me what i am poorly informed on and tell me where i was informed wrong.


27 posted on 01/09/2014 6:24:57 PM PST by ravenwolf
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To: svcw; ravenwolf

Jesus was circumcised on the 8th day (Luke 2:21). He was presented at the temple on the 40th day (Luke 2:22-24).

Catholics celebrate those two days with the Feast of the Circumcision (Jan 1st) and Candlemas (Feb 2nd).

As far as I can tell, the circumcision would have been done at home, while the presentation would have, obviously, had to been done at the temple.


28 posted on 01/09/2014 6:44:57 PM PST by markomalley (Nothing emboldens the wicked so greatly as the lack of courage on the part of the good -- Leo XIII)
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To: ravenwolf

Jesus was not “Christened” as an infant.

I can’t possibly know where you picked up such a strange notion.


29 posted on 01/09/2014 6:47:55 PM PST by SoothingDave
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To: TheThirdRuffian; Weiss White; SoothingDave; knarf; svcw; vladimir998

Actually i tried to go into gear with out engaging the clutch, i was informed by what i took to be a well read Catholic that the Catholic Church did not baptize infants but only Christened them.

And that this was carried over from the dedication of Jesus in the temple and that it was after the days of his mothers purification.

It had nothing to do with his circumcision.

Luke 2:22-40
22 And when the days of her purification according to the law of Moses were accomplished, they brought him to Jerusalem, to present him to the Lord;

I made a mistake and said Jesus was Christened as an infant and any one knows that is wrong since Christianity was not even heard of at that time.

But i always thought that the Catholics baptized babies and was informed that was wrong that they only Christened them.

Which makes since to me and Luke 2:22 seems to be where it came from, in fact i believe i was told that is where it came from but can not find the comment.

If i was informed wrong about if it is christening or baptizing then that is another thing, i am not a Catholic i only know what i am told and am trying to learn where their doctrine comes from and this makes good sense to me.


30 posted on 01/09/2014 7:20:12 PM PST by ravenwolf
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To: ravenwolf

Whoever told you that Catholics do not baptize babies was mistaken. There is no distinction, sacramentally, between baptizing an infant or an older person.

What is different is that an infant has his parents speak for him. The Church will only baptizs those infants whose parents promise to raise them in the Church.

A person above the age of reason speaks for himself.


31 posted on 01/09/2014 7:31:04 PM PST by SoothingDave
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To: ravenwolf

“i was informed by what i took to be a well read Catholic that the Catholic Church did not baptize infants but only Christened them.”

Well, he - or she - isn’t so well-read after all.


32 posted on 01/09/2014 7:48:28 PM PST by vladimir998
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To: ravenwolf
What Simeon and Anna Teach Us [at the Presentation of the Lord] (Catholic/Orthodox Caucus)
In Preparation for the Feast of Candlemas… [Catholic Caucus]
THE PURIFICATION, COMMONLY CALLED CANDLEMAS-DAY, Presentation of the Lord
The Feast of the Presentation of the Lord Jesus in the Temple
Feast of the Purification (Candlemas)
Candlemass and Ashes
SIMEON IS OPEN TO THE LORD’S ACTION [Presentation of the Lord]
The Mysteries of Candlemas
[Feast of the] Presentation of the Lord
Orthodox Feast of The Presentation of Our Lord and Savior in the Temple; February 2
33 posted on 01/09/2014 8:19:00 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: ravenwolf

**Actually i tried to go into gear with out engaging the clutch, i was informed by what i took to be a well read Catholic that the Catholic Church did not baptize infants but only Christened them.**

Find another source of information, OK?


34 posted on 01/09/2014 8:20:38 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: knarf

Interesting… kind of also explains the commentary on excerpting fathering than fully posting


35 posted on 01/09/2014 8:31:56 PM PST by Nifster
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To: Salvation

Ok, i was obviously mis informed but was trying to see the point of view of the Catholic Church.

Luke 2
22 And when the days of her purification according to the law of Moses were accomplished, they brought him to Jerusalem, to present him to the Lord:

They did present Jesus to the lord, which if this is where infant purification came from and if it was purification and not Baptism then i could readily see that i could agree with the Church on more than i thought.

but too many things tell me that is not to be.

I agree with the Catholic,s that Jesus is the Christ which is plainly backed by scripture.

And i agree that Jesus was most likely Mary,s only child which can not be proven by scripture.

And no doubt there are a lot of other things we can agree on.

But all of these teachings that are not backed by scripture and some that even go against scripture over rides the other.


36 posted on 01/10/2014 4:15:59 AM PST by ravenwolf
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To: SoothingDave

What is different is that an infant has his parents speak for him. The Church will only baptizs those infants whose parents promise to raise them in the Church.


Obviously then i was misled by a Catholic who does not really believe in infant baptism and was only making excuses for the Church or i was led to just thinking they were Catholic.

Mat 3:11
I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance. but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:

Jesus was probably 29 or 30 years old when he was baptized.

ACTS 2
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Repent and be baptized for the remission of sins, how could any one repent for a baby who had not yet sinned?

Repenting means seeing the truth, water baptism is just the way to show that repentance.

God allowed the ones under the age of 20 years old to reach the promised land, could it be that he did not consider them to be old enough to be accountable?

Different people has diverse opinions about this but it is plain that babies or even kids to repent and be baptized for
the remission of sin is false doctrine.


37 posted on 01/10/2014 7:18:50 AM PST by ravenwolf
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To: knarf; humblegunner; Jim Robinson
Weiss White seems to respond immediately to articles written by Cathy Caridi, J.C.L. which leads me to believe they are both the same person.

If true, then they are using "copyright" to get away with blog pimping.

38 posted on 01/10/2014 7:42:04 AM PST by xzins ( Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! Those who truly support our troops pray for victory!)
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To: Weiss White
Weiss White seems to respond immediately to articles written by Cathy Caridi, J.C.L. which leads me to believe they are both the same person.

If true, then they are using "copyright" to get away with blog pimping.

39 posted on 01/10/2014 7:42:34 AM PST by xzins ( Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! Those who truly support our troops pray for victory!)
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To: xzins

Just another effort to proseletyze


40 posted on 01/10/2014 7:46:37 AM PST by knarf (I say things that are true .. I have no proof .. but they're true.)
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To: Weiss White

Interesting that you only post this one person’s material:

http://www.freerepublic.com/tag/by:weisswhite/index?tab=articles


41 posted on 01/10/2014 7:59:58 AM PST by humblegunner
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