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Canonization of popes John Paul II, John XXIII to draw millions to Rome
New York Post ^ | 04/20/14 | Pedro Oliveira Jr

Posted on 04/20/2014 10:45:40 AM PDT by Old Yeller

Easter services today are expected to kick off a record-breaking week at the Vatican. Two beloved modern popes — John Paul II and John XXIII — are to be canonized at the Vatican next Sunday by Pope Francis. There will be services all week, which could draw the most pilgrims ever to the Catholic capital. John Paul II is remembered for helping to bring down communism and for inspiring a generation of Catholics.

Many now call him “The Great,” only the fourth pope to have earned the moniker. And while much of the crowd’s focus will be on the Polish pope’s remarkable achievements, Pope John XXIII — known as the “Good Pope” for his kindhearted nature — was no less revolutionary. Pope Francis bypassed the second miracle typically required for canonization for John XXIII, declaring that he deserved the honor for having convened the Second Vatican Council.

Rome officials said they expected 3 million visitors in the city during the period from the Easter celebrations this weekend and the canonization next Sunday. Nineteen heads of state and 24 prime ministers are expected to attend the canonization ceremony in St. Peter’s Square. In line with Pope Francis’s no-frills papacy, organizers said the canonizations would be a much more sober affair than the three-day extravaganza that marked John Paul’s beatification, the last step before sainthood, in 2011. Cardinal Agostino Vallini, the vicar of Rome, said some churches would remain open overnight on the eve of the canonization to provide a spiritual retreat for pilgrims, “but not much else.”

Francis has long signaled his support for making a saint of John Paul II, whose funeral nine years ago saw mourners chant, “Santo subito [Saint now]!”

(Excerpt) Read more at nypost.com ...


TOPICS: Religion & Culture
KEYWORDS: pope
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Let me guess: "We aren't worshipping him, we're venerating him".
1 posted on 04/20/2014 10:45:41 AM PDT by Old Yeller
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To: Old Yeller

I heard some liberals say that these popes being declared saints is a political move. Leave it to the liberals to rain on someone else’s parade. These liberals aren’t even faithful Catholics, so what is it to them, what the Catholic church does?

Besides, liberals are supposed to be tolerant. They tell us to be tolerant of others and what they are doing.


2 posted on 04/20/2014 10:48:18 AM PDT by Dilbert San Diego (Im)
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To: Old Yeller
"Let me guess: "We aren't worshipping him, we're venerating him"."

You guessed it.

Have a cookie.

3 posted on 04/20/2014 10:50:44 AM PDT by Celtic Cross (The brain is the weapon; everything else is just accessories. --FReeper Joe Brower)
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To: Old Yeller

By taking the name John XXIII, he settled the question of whether the previous John XXIII was an anti-pope.


4 posted on 04/20/2014 11:04:32 AM PDT by MUDDOG
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To: Dilbert San Diego
The liberals are right -- but not for the reasons you've cited.

It is highly irregular for the Catholic Church to canonize anyone -- let alone a pope -- so soon after they've died. If you go back over history you'll find that it usually takes centuries of intense research and scrutiny before they would ever canonize a saint who was such a high-profile figure. I believe there have only been three popes canonized who served after 1200 A.D.

5 posted on 04/20/2014 11:12:14 AM PDT by Alberta's Child ("I've never seen such a conclave of minstrels in my life.")
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To: Old Yeller

I would say that John XXIII’s convening of Vatican II is a giant blot on an otherwise edifying life story.


6 posted on 04/20/2014 12:11:48 PM PDT by Arthur McGowan
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To: Alberta's Child

I’m sure these are worthy men ... but life is about a relationship with Jesus. . .sometimes people get so caught up in the moment and forget The Real Bottomline.


7 posted on 04/20/2014 12:14:02 PM PDT by Maudeen (Jesus is the Answer. . .now what is the problem?)
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To: Old Yeller

2,000 years ago, the Son of God rose from the grave, after being tortured and murdered on a cross, so that the penalty of sin would be paid for all of humanity, and Hell itself could be avoided if we only accepted the Christ in our hearts.

Of all days to peddle this idolatry, did the Vatican have to pick the Resurrection Day of Jesus Christ?


8 posted on 04/20/2014 12:15:00 PM PDT by SkyPilot
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To: Old Yeller

I think both canonizations are premature.

John XXIII convened Vatican II. Huge mistake.

JPII neglected major parts of his job. His episcopal appointments were wretched, and as complaints about Hunthausen, Weakland, Clark, Hubbard, and others piled up, he did nothing. He was a dupe of the repellent Maciel.


9 posted on 04/20/2014 12:16:24 PM PDT by Arthur McGowan
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To: Old Yeller

Obama is sending three reliably pro-abortion Catholics to the canonization. They will all be given Communion.


10 posted on 04/20/2014 12:18:14 PM PDT by Arthur McGowan
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To: MUDDOG

“By taking the name John XXIII, he settled the question of whether the previous John XXIII was an anti-pope.”

Since the original “John XXIII” willingly renounced any claims to the papacy and recognized Martin V it would seem that was taken care of in the 15th century. As a final jibe at Martin V, however, his supporters made sure that his tomb inscription said: “John the former pope”. Martin V was furious, but let it stand.


11 posted on 04/20/2014 12:23:29 PM PDT by vladimir998
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To: SkyPilot

“Of all days to peddle this idolatry, did the Vatican have to pick the Resurrection Day of Jesus Christ?”

Of all days to peddle your false accusations of idolatry, did you have to pick the Resurrection Day of Jesus Christ?


12 posted on 04/20/2014 12:26:35 PM PDT by vladimir998
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To: Alberta's Child

“It is highly irregular for the Catholic Church to canonize anyone — let alone a pope — so soon after they’ve died. If you go back over history you’ll find that it usually takes centuries of intense research and scrutiny before they would ever canonize a saint who was such a high-profile figure. I believe there have only been three popes canonized who served after 1200 A.D.”

Not exactly. Padre Pio was canonized 34 years after his death. John XXIII? 52 years after his death. St. Francis of Assisi was canonized only two years after his death. It varies wildly from saint to saint.


13 posted on 04/20/2014 12:33:52 PM PDT by vladimir998
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To: vladimir998

It never lets up does it.


14 posted on 04/20/2014 12:36:03 PM PDT by OpusatFR
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To: Old Yeller

Oh, fuss, fuss, fuss.


15 posted on 04/20/2014 12:44:02 PM PDT by Tax-chick (Entropy is high. Wear a hat! And carry an umbrella.)
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To: vladimir998

16 posted on 04/20/2014 12:59:05 PM PDT by SkyPilot
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To: SkyPilot

What Drudge posts doesn’t effect your responsibility for what you post.


17 posted on 04/20/2014 1:40:06 PM PDT by vladimir998
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To: vladimir998
If you claim to be a follower of Jesus Christ and believe the Scriptures are true, then you should see something wrong with this picture I am posting now.

If you don't, then look inward.

18 posted on 04/20/2014 2:51:58 PM PDT by SkyPilot
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19 posted on 04/20/2014 2:58:11 PM PDT by SkyPilot
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To: SkyPilot

There’s nothing wrong with that or this: http://www.arlingtoncemetery.mil/events/Ceremonies/WreathLayings.aspx


20 posted on 04/20/2014 5:49:18 PM PDT by vladimir998
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To: SkyPilot

Can you please call this very special Sunday by its real title “Easter Sunday” . Thank-you!

Christ is RISEN! He is RISEN indeed!


21 posted on 04/20/2014 6:05:47 PM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: SkyPilot

If you want to know, the canonizations will not take place until next Sunday.


22 posted on 04/20/2014 6:07:45 PM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: OpusatFR

Yep, this thread has become “Catholic bashing central” for today.


23 posted on 04/20/2014 6:09:21 PM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: Arthur McGowan

If I’m not wrong all the Bishops you mentioned were recommended by Bernardin and Jadot.

Blame them.


24 posted on 04/20/2014 6:11:56 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Arthur McGowan
Well I was right on two out of the three.

Waekland

 

Archbishop of Milwaukee[edit]

On September 20, 1977, Pope Paul VI appointed Weakland Archbishop of Milwaukee. He was consecrated bishop on November 8, in the Cathedral of St. John the Evangelist by Archbishop Jean Jadot.[4]

----------------------------

Clark

On April 23, 1979, Clark was appointed the eighth Bishop of Rochester by Pope John Paul II.[2]

 

Hubbard

On February 2, 1977, Hubbard was appointed Bishop of Albany by Pope Paul VI. He received his episcopal consecration on the following March 27 from Cardinal Terence Cooke, with Bishops Edwin B. Broderick and Edward Joseph Maginn serving as co-consecrators. He was the youngest bishop in the country at the time.


25 posted on 04/20/2014 6:31:18 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Salvation

I didn’t say JPII appointed all of them. I said that JPII did nothing about them even though he knew all about their abuses—liturgical and theological.


26 posted on 04/20/2014 9:17:20 PM PDT by Arthur McGowan
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To: Arthur McGowan

Convening Vatican II is the stated reason that Pope Francis forfeited the requirement for a second miracle in the canonization of Pope John 23rd.


27 posted on 04/20/2014 9:32:34 PM PDT by NKP_Vet ("It is foolish and wrong to mourn the men who died;we should thank God that such men lived" ~ Patton)
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To: Arthur McGowan

“John XXIII convened Vatican II. Huge mistake”.

Pope Francis doesn’t seem to think it was a mistake and has said the reason he forfeited the second miracle for John the 23rd is because John convened Vatican II.

In the case of JP2 two miracles have already been attributed to his intercession and Pope Benedict waived the 5 year wait requirement before the canonization process can be initiated.

Catholic theologians usually cite JP2 was one of the greatest pope’s in history. He’s already being called “Great” and only five other popes in history have been honored with that designation.

Hopefully Mother Teresa will be be canonized in the near future.


28 posted on 04/20/2014 9:42:11 PM PDT by NKP_Vet ("It is foolish and wrong to mourn the men who died;we should thank God that such men lived" ~ Patton)
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To: NKP_Vet; Arthur McGowan

This is nothing more than the canonization of Vatican II.

God help us.


29 posted on 04/21/2014 4:22:09 AM PDT by piusv
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To: piusv

How wonderful this double canonizations will take place, on the beautiful feast day of the great “ Divine Mercy “, April 27, 2014.


30 posted on 04/21/2014 5:38:48 AM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: Biggirl

Koran-kissing “saint” JPII.

Like I said, God help us.


31 posted on 04/21/2014 7:15:14 AM PDT by piusv
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To: vladimir998; Old Yeller
Vladimir,

Can you explain this contradiction to me? The angels themselves vehemently prohibit worship of themselves. So did Moses. So did Paul, so did Peter, and all the apostles. So did the prophets of God.

8I, John, am the one who heard and saw these things. And when I heard and saw, I fell down to worship at the feet of the angel who showed me these things. 9But he said to me, “Do not do that. I am a fellow servant of yours and of your brethren the prophets and of those who heed the words of this book. Worship God.”

Revelation 22:8

---------------------------------------------------------------

As Peter entered the house, Cornelius met him and fell at his feet in reverence. 26 But Peter made him get up. “Stand up,” he said, “I am only a man myself.”

Acts 10:25-26

----------------------------------------------------------------

This attitude every man and woman should have. None of us are worthy of worship. We are to avoid idolatry in all circumstances, including the worship of humans (1 Corinthians 10:14). The synonyms of idolatry are idolization, fetishization, fetishism, idol worship, adulation, adoration, reverence, veneration, glorification, lionization, and hero-worshiping.

Given this truth, explain to my why this is Biblical?


32 posted on 04/21/2014 7:20:32 AM PDT by SkyPilot
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To: SkyPilot

In the traditional sense, I disagree that love and respect of our popes is idolatry. However, the reactions and defense I have seen by Catholics of recent popes most definitely verge on papal idolatry.


33 posted on 04/21/2014 7:30:42 AM PDT by piusv
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To: piusv
In the traditional sense, I disagree that love and respect of our popes is idolatry.

How is that reconciled with the Scriptures? Could not Peter or the angels have simply justified bowing before them as "love and respect?" Or did they reply No! - do not do that, because only God deserves that worship?

However, the reactions and defense I have seen by Catholics of recent popes most definitely verge on papal idolatry.

Agree. Why do you think that this behavior, which the Scripture clearly condemn in the strongest of terms, endures?

34 posted on 04/21/2014 7:39:54 AM PDT by SkyPilot
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To: SkyPilot

“Can you explain this contradiction to me?”

There is no contradiction. No one worships the pope or an image of the pope.

“Given this truth, explain to my why this is Biblical?”

Treating images or people with respect is not unbiblical. Images were used in the Temple: 1 Kings 6:23
People were treated with honor: 1 Kings 2:19

I once asked a moronic anti-Catholic bigot who posted pictures just like the ones you posted how he proposed to his wife. Did he get on one knee? Did he attest to his love and devotion to her? Did he give her flowers and an expensive ring? You should have seen him scramble for an explanation of how that was all okay, but to treat the pope with respect was wrong! Hilarious.


35 posted on 04/21/2014 7:47:47 AM PDT by vladimir998
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To: piusv

Yet I also see traditional Catholics defend TLM which is on the verge of being idolatry of a certain mass rite.


36 posted on 04/21/2014 7:48:58 AM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: vladimir998

BINGO! We have a winner!


37 posted on 04/21/2014 7:50:06 AM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: piusv

“However, the reactions and defense I have seen by Catholics of recent popes most definitely verge on papal idolatry.”

And you think Catholics treated Pius V or Innocent III or Pius IX with less honor than the last three popes? Really?


38 posted on 04/21/2014 7:51:13 AM PDT by vladimir998
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To: Biggirl; piusv

“Yet I also see traditional Catholics defend TLM which is on the verge of being idolatry of a certain mass rite.”

Ouch! That’ll leave a mark.


39 posted on 04/21/2014 7:52:35 AM PDT by vladimir998
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To: vladimir998

What troubles me is putting one rite down over a another.

Forgive me for being so hard, very exhusted from a busy Holy Easter weekend.


40 posted on 04/21/2014 7:55:37 AM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: SkyPilot

Post 35 is correct, it is simple “respect and honor” NOT worship.


41 posted on 04/21/2014 7:56:49 AM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: NKP_Vet
Convening Vatican II is the stated reason that Pope Francis forfeited the requirement for a second miracle in the canonization of Pope John 23rd.

An open admission that this canonization is politically motivated - an effort to sweep the turmoil unleashed by VII under the rug.

42 posted on 04/21/2014 10:29:16 AM PDT by BlatherNaut
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To: Biggirl
What troubles me is putting one rite down over a another

Have you done any comparative reasearch? It is beyond dispute that the Mass has been protestantized.

43 posted on 04/21/2014 10:35:28 AM PDT by BlatherNaut
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To: BlatherNaut

Your OPINION only.


44 posted on 04/21/2014 10:45:09 AM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: vladimir998

Pre-Vatican II popes didn’t make comments that went against Catholic teaching. Francis does and Catholics still defend it.

Honor and defense of the indefensible : Apples and oranges.


45 posted on 04/21/2014 10:46:03 AM PDT by piusv
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Comment #46 Removed by Moderator

To: Biggirl

LOL. Defending the traditional Catholic mass vs defending modernist comments of a pope.

Again, apples and oranges.


47 posted on 04/21/2014 10:48:32 AM PDT by piusv
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To: SkyPilot

Not sure I’m following. Love and respect is not the same as worship.


48 posted on 04/21/2014 10:50:31 AM PDT by piusv
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To: piusv

“Pre-Vatican II popes didn’t make comments that went against Catholic teaching. Francis does and Catholics still defend it.”

Oh, I see. So you’re saying that because the popes of old were all super-orthodox in your view they were worthy of papal idolatry (as you put it)? And since popes in the present day “went against Catholic teaching” in your opinion now, all-of-a-sudden, that “papal idolatry” is now bad? So it isn’t the “papal idolatry” that is wrong, it’s whether or not the pope is orthodox enough to warrant it according to piusv on FR?


49 posted on 04/21/2014 10:57:22 AM PDT by vladimir998
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To: vladimir998

NO, that’s not what I’m saying. Papal idolatry is wrong either way. My point is that in days of yore you wouldn’t have popes making modernist comments and the lay folk defending it. Now we have the lay folk defending Francis as if he can do no wrong despite his modernist, un-Catholic comments. Therein lies the idolatry.


50 posted on 04/21/2014 11:01:45 AM PDT by piusv
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