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Pope, Orthodox Patriarch Look to New Council at Nicea
Catholic Culture ^ | 5/30/14

Posted on 05/30/2014 8:31:28 AM PDT by marshmallow

Pope Francis and Orthodox Patriarch Bartholomew I of Constantinople have agreed to plan for an ecumenical council to be held in Nicea in 2025, the AsiaNews service reports.

Patriarch Bartholomew revealed that he and the Roman Pontiff had “agreed to leave as a legacy to ourselves and our successors a gathering in Nicaea in 2025, to celebrate together, after 17 centuries, the first truly ecumenical synod, where the Creed was first promulgated.” The Council of Nicea, held in 325, brought together over 300 bishops and approved the formula of faith now known as the Nicene Creed.

(Excerpt) Read more at catholicculture.org ...


TOPICS: Catholic; Ecumenism; Orthodox Christian; Theology
KEYWORDS: catholic; ecumenism; francis; nicea; orthodox; pope; popefrancis
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1 posted on 05/30/2014 8:31:28 AM PDT by marshmallow
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To: marshmallow

When they say “ecumenical council” do they mean “Ecumenical Council” or do they just mean “a council with a bunch of ecumenist?”

Because the news of the former would be earth-shattering.


2 posted on 05/30/2014 8:33:31 AM PDT by dangus
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To: dangus

Wondering that as well.

And can there be a true ecumenical council with two sides in schism? Is this laying groundwork for healing the breach?


3 posted on 05/30/2014 8:42:52 AM PDT by Claud
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To: marshmallow
If they are going to have a council, MUCH better to have it at Nicea than to have a "Vatican III", which would sound like the continuation of Vatican II, a Council that in many ways seemed dated as soon as Peter, Paul and Mary stopped hitting the Top 40.

Why is it that all of the cool places to have a Council are now in a Muslim country?
4 posted on 05/30/2014 8:43:42 AM PDT by Dr. Sivana ("I'm a Contra" -- President Ronald Reagan)
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To: dangus

I’m reading the Patriarch’s words and I’m not seeing anything about “council”. “Gathering” is what he said...it’s a “celebration”.

http://www.asianews.it/news-en/Bartholomew-:-With-Francis,-we-invite-all-Christians-to-celebrate-the-first-synod-of-Nicaea-in-2025-31213.html

Catholic Culture is being overoptimistic I think. But hey...prayers that it actually happens anyway! :)


5 posted on 05/30/2014 8:49:27 AM PDT by Claud
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To: Claud
And can there be a true ecumenical council with two sides in schism? Is this laying groundwork for healing the breach?

Really interesting. As a protestant and someone who professes the Nicene Creed as a representation of the true catholic faith, I'm curious what a new creed would look like that represents the true catholic faith as understood by the Roman Catholic Church.

6 posted on 05/30/2014 8:52:14 AM PDT by Tao Yin
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To: All
Patriarch Bartholomew revealed that he and the Roman Pontiff had “agreed to leave as a legacy to ourselves and our successors a gathering in Nicaea in 2025, to celebrate together, after 17 centuries, the first truly ecumenical synod, where the Creed was first promulgated.” The Council of Nicea, held in 325, brought together over 300 bishops and approved the formula of faith now known as the Nicene Creed.
A leading official of the Russian Orthodox Church said that Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew I represented only his own Patriarchate of Constantinople, and not the world’s other Orthodox churches, in his meeting with Pope Francis, according to a report from the Religious Information Service of Ukraine.

Metropolitan Hilarion, the chairman of the Russian Orthodox Church’s Department of External Church Relations, said that the Ecumenical Patriarch had not consulted with the leaders of other Orthodox churches before meeting with the Pope, according to the report. The Ecumenical Patriarch holds a primacy of honor among the Orthodox churches, the largest of which is the Russian Orthodox Church.
-- from the related thread Russian Orthodox Church distances itself from Ecumenical Patriarch’s meeting with Pope


7 posted on 05/30/2014 8:52:24 AM PDT by Alex Murphy ("the defacto Leader of the FR Calvinist Protestant Brigades")
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To: Claud
Dear Claud,

I don't know. This is the second paragraph of the article:

“Speaking exclusively with AsiaNews, Bartholomew says that together with Pope Francis we agreed to leave as a legacy to ourselves and our successors a gathering in Nicaea in 2025, to celebrate together, after 17 centuries , the first truly ecumenical synod, where the Creed was first promulgated’.”

“Ecumenical synod” sounds more like “ecumenical council” than “celebration.


sitetest

8 posted on 05/30/2014 8:55:00 AM PDT by sitetest (If Roe is not overturned, no unborn child will ever be protected in law.)
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To: marshmallow

If the Orthodox admit they were wrong I’m sure the Romans will happily let them back into the fold.


9 posted on 05/30/2014 8:56:52 AM PDT by DManA
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To: Claud

I think part of the problem is in this phrase, which is confusing in English:

“to celebrate together, after 17 centuries, the first truly ecumenical synod”.

Superficially it sounds like we are holding our first ecumenical synod after 17 centuries. Don’t think that’s what the Patriarch meant though, just that we are *celebrating 325 together* for the first time in 2025.


10 posted on 05/30/2014 8:57:12 AM PDT by Claud
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To: sitetest

Yes, but the “synod” mentioned there must refer to 325 not 2025, no? “Where the Creed was first promulgated”?

Admittedly, the phrase can bear both readings.

This would indeed be earth-shattering to both sides...I just have trouble believing that a new Ecumenical Council would be announced so casually.


11 posted on 05/30/2014 9:00:49 AM PDT by Claud
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To: Tao Yin

You can probably let your curiosity rest on that. Given all the trouble we had 1200 years ago when the single word “filioque” was added to the Creed in Latin, I seriously doubt any new Creed will ever be entertained. I saw a “Native American Creed” once and it was a theological atrocity. *shudder*

There are of course other legit creeds that we use from time to time: the Apostles Creed and the Athanasian Creed. I guess theoretically we could have more, but the Nicene Creed is what it is and won’t change.

Interestingly, when the Pope says the Nicene Creed in Greek, he does not say the filioque.


12 posted on 05/30/2014 9:09:21 AM PDT by Claud
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To: Claud
Dear Claud,

I came to a similar conclusion after several readings.

sitetest

13 posted on 05/30/2014 9:39:24 AM PDT by sitetest (If Roe is not overturned, no unborn child will ever be protected in law.)
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To: Claud
From the Vatican website...

Official Notice from the Office of Vatican Translation

We are experiencing some difficulties with the updated version of Google Translate that we use for all official announcements from the Vatican.

Obviously, there will be misunderstandings when the Pure Language of Rome is translated into the confusing and imprecise language of English.

Were not sales of indulgences down again this year, perhaps we could use human translators for these announcements. Unfortunately, is not possible. The misinformation from the poorly named "Reformation" continues to erode our sales of these valuable "get out of jail free" cards for your loved ones.

For this reason, we beg your patience. Be assured that after every important announcement, we will work with the Google Translate employees to refine our message until it causes less ambiguity and concern.

Thank you very much for your patience and understanding. Please do buy indulgences for your departed loved ones, who are suffering.


14 posted on 05/30/2014 9:40:35 AM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( "I didn't leave the Central Oligarchy Party. It left me." - Ronaldus Magnimus, 2014)
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To: Tao Yin

I seriously doubt they would attempt to tinker with the current Nicene Creed.


15 posted on 05/30/2014 9:45:38 AM PDT by Rich21IE
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To: DManA

You know, we Orthodox feel exactly the same way toward the Romans. If you just admit your incorrectnesses and reform we’ll be happy to bring you into communion with the rest of Christianity.


16 posted on 05/30/2014 9:46:55 AM PDT by Doug Loss
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To: DManA

DManA:

We really need to step back from the polemics with the Orthodox, in my opinion. Vatican II did not teach any dogmas, and it has been many times misinterpreted by the liberation theologians and critical perspective biblical scholars, no doubt. However, there does seem to be some real fruit of Vatican 2 interpreted in continuity with all that came before it [to use Emeritus Pope Benedict’s term] with respect to our relationship with the Orthodox. Vatican 2 allowed Pope Paul VI to meet Patriarch Athagoras in 1964. The Eastern Patriarch has journeyed to Rome to celebrate the feast of Saints Peter and Paul in the past, at one such celebration, Pope Benedict and the Patriarch led the Catholics gathered at the Mass in reciting the Nicene Creed. The recent meeting of Pope Francis and the Patriarch was really interesting.

So this could be a major, major, major. In addition, I think the Orthodox are having a Synod in 2017 so it will be interesting as to how this plays out. If the Patriarch of Constantinople says for 1,700 anniversary of the Council of Nicea, he is calling for the Orthodox and Roman Church to meet together, I wonder if his brother Bishops will listen to him, or maybe how many will listen.

Now I pray at a theological level, this happens because God is one, and Christ is one and his Church is one, both visibly and spiritually and with the Orthodox, we share 99.99999% already. Now there is a side of me that would also like to see this happen if just to see the FR Protestant heads here allegorically “explode”


17 posted on 05/30/2014 9:50:22 AM PDT by CTrent1564
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To: CTrent1564

Why do you think Protestant heads would explode? Wouldn’t be all that significant to me.


18 posted on 05/30/2014 10:01:08 AM PDT by DManA
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To: marshmallow
There are different kinds of Councils.

The Top Ten Most Important Church Councils
On the 50th Anniversary of the Second Vatican Council
Vatican II, 50 Years Later : The council brought great controversy, but eventually, a greater gift
It is the Decision of the Holy Spirit and Us….On the Council of Jerusalem...(Catholic Caucus)

Ecumenical Councils
Catholic Biblical Apologetics: General Councils of the Church, 1870-1962
Catholic Biblical Apologetics: General Councils of the Church, 1123-1545
Catholic Biblical Apologetics: General Councils of the Church, 49-870
Catholic Biblical Apologetics: Acts 15 Model: General- Ecumenical Councils of the Church Universal
Catholic Biblical Apologetics: The Biblical Model for Handing On Truth and Refuting Error: Acts 15, The Council of Jerusalem
A Timeline of Catholic Church history, 1-500 A.D. (includes Councils, Canon of the Bible)
MAJOR COUNCILS OF THE CHURCH - 1st Council of Nicaea - 325 A.D. (1st in a series)
MAJOR COUNCILS OF THE CHURCH - 1st Council of Constantinople - 381 A.D. (2nd in a series)
MAJOR CHURCH COUNCILS - The Council Of Chalcedon - 451 A.D.

19 posted on 05/30/2014 10:12:58 AM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: DManA

DManA:

Well, for one, there is the constant use of Orthodox and their Theology when FR Prots here criticize or debate Catholic theology, although most of those who cite it don’t understand what they are citing for even the Patriarch in his Joint Letter with the Pope speaks of “Sister Churches”


20 posted on 05/30/2014 10:24:36 AM PDT by CTrent1564
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To: Rich21IE
The "current" Nicene Creed is actually the version of the Council of Constantinople in 381.

Both the Eastern and Western Churches recognize the first seven ecumenical councils. The Catholic Church held a bunch more in the Middle Ages (a couple of which tried unsuccessfully to undo the East/West schism of 1054), but only two since the end of the Council of Trent.

21 posted on 05/30/2014 10:32:10 AM PDT by Verginius Rufus
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To: Rich21IE; Tao Yin

Here is one of the best summaries of the Creed issue. He was written by the late Cardinal Avery Dulles, SJ, and published in a Lutheran theological scholarly journal. I have a file that I Downloaded years ago and was fortunate to find this copy of it linked on this site.

http://www.keepthefilioque.com/2013/09/the-filioque-what-is-at-stake/

The Latin Tradition has a long history of teaching the filioque as a legitimate doctrine regardless if it is in the Nicene-Constantinopolian Creed, which wasn’t affirmed as an ecumenical council till Chalcedon in 451AD [I am talking about Constantinopile 381] for if you look at the Creed recited at Ephesus in 431, it is in the Nicene version of 325.


22 posted on 05/30/2014 10:36:10 AM PDT by CTrent1564
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To: Tao Yin
I'm curious what a new creed would look like that represents the true catholic faith as understood by the Roman Catholic Church

The old one, which we recite (or sing) at Mass every Sunday, works just fine, thanks. :-)

23 posted on 05/30/2014 10:39:36 AM PDT by Campion
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To: aMorePerfectUnion
Were not sales of indulgences down again this year

They've been at zero since about 1550. How can they be "down again this year"? Oh, I get it: they're down to zero, again this year, just like it's been for the last 464.

24 posted on 05/30/2014 10:41:57 AM PDT by Campion
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To: Alex Murphy
Historically, the person in the East who called councils was the Byzantine Emperor, not the Patriarch. With no Emperor since 1453 ... ??

And the Russians are correct that the EP is not their ecclesial superior.

25 posted on 05/30/2014 10:46:55 AM PDT by Campion
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To: Campion

“They’ve been at zero since about 1550. How can they be “down again this year”?”

Don’t kid yourself. Just this week a fellow Catholic assured me they still exist.

Personally, I’ve not seen the published income numbers this year, so I don’t have an opinion.

In any case, I suppose you have to take that up with the Office of Vatican Translation.


26 posted on 05/30/2014 11:12:35 AM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( "I didn't leave the Central Oligarchy Party. It left me." - Ronaldus Magnimus, 2014)
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To: Campion
Not being Romanish, I Googled this up for you from Catholic Answers... There may be an official office of indulgences too. I don't know.

Does the Catholic Church still sell indulgences?


Full Question

One of the causes of the Reformation was the selling of indulgences. Does the Catholic Church still sell them?

Answer

That's like asking, "Have you stopped beating your wife?" The Catholic Church does not now nor has it ever approved the sale of indulgences. This is to be distinguished from the undeniable fact that individual Catholics (perhaps the best known of them being the German Dominican Johann Tetzel [1465-1519]) did sell indulgences--but in doing so they acted contrary to explicit Church regulations. This practice is utterly opposed to the Catholic Church's teaching on indulgences, and it cannot be regarded as a teaching or practice of the Church.

In the 16th century, when the abuse of indulgences was at its height, Cardinal Cajetan (Tommaso de Vio, 1469-1534) wrote about the problem: "Preachers act in the name of the Church so long as they teach the doctrines of Christ and the Church; but if they teach, guided by their own minds and arbitrariness of will, things of which they are ignorant, they cannot pass as representatives of the Church; it need not be wondered at that they go astray."

The Council of Trent (1545-1564) issued a decree that gave Church teaching on indulgences and that provided stringent guidelines to eliminate abuses:

Since the power of granting indulgences was conferred by Christ on the Church (cf. Mt 16:19, 18:18, Jn 20:23), and she has even in the earliest times made use of that power divinely given to her, the holy council teaches and commands that the use of indulgences, most salutary to the Christian people and approved by the authority of the holy councils, is to be retained in the Church, and it condemns with anathema those who assert that they are useless or deny that there is in the Church the power of granting them.

In granting them, however, it desires that in accordance with the ancient and approved custom in the Church moderation be observed, lest by too great facility ecclesiastical discipline be weakened. But desiring that the abuses which have become connected with them, and by any reason of which this excellent name of indulgences is blasphemed by the heretics, be amended and corrected, it ordains in a general way by the present decree that all evil traffic in them, which has been a most prolific source of abuses among the Christian people, be absolutely abolished. Other abuses, however, of this kind which have sprung from superstition, ignorance, irreverence, or from whatever other sources, since by reason of the manifold corruptions in places and provinces where they are committed, they cannot conveniently be prohibited individually, it commands all bishops diligently to make note of, each in his own church, and report them to the next provincial synod. (Sess. 25, Decree on Indulgences)

In 1967 Pope Paul VI reiterated Catholic teaching on indulgences and added new reforms in his apostolic constitution Indulgentiarum Doctrina (cf. Vatican Council II: The Conciliar and Post-Conciliar Documents, ed. Austin Flannery, O.P. [Northport, New York: Costello, 1980], 62-79).


27 posted on 05/30/2014 11:18:05 AM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( "I didn't leave the Central Oligarchy Party. It left me." - Ronaldus Magnimus, 2014)
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To: aMorePerfectUnion
it ordains in a general way by the present decree that all evil traffic in them, which has been a most prolific source of abuses among the Christian people, be absolutely abolished

Thank you. That's what I said: the sale of indulgences has been abolished for 460+ years.

28 posted on 05/30/2014 11:48:06 AM PDT by Campion
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To: aMorePerfectUnion
Just this week a fellow Catholic assured me they still exist.

I never said indulgences "don't exist". I said they aren't *sold*. There is no money involved when I read my Bible for 30 minutes, receive communion, make a good confession, and say three prayers for the intentions of the Pope. Do you see money there? There isn't any, unless you count the wear and tear on my good shoes and gas to drive to church.

But you do that, too, don't you?

29 posted on 05/30/2014 11:50:38 AM PDT by Campion
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To: aMorePerfectUnion
There may be an official office of indulgences too.

There is an official book - "The Raccolta"

http://www.loretopubs.org/raccolta-the.html

30 posted on 05/30/2014 11:57:55 AM PDT by BlatherNaut
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To: Campion; Alex Murphy

By the same tokens, neither is the Bishop of Rome.

31 posted on 05/30/2014 12:15:17 PM PDT by BlueDragon (...to stay on the safe side...I'm never stopping in Amarillo again)
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To: Alex Murphy; F15Eagle; Larry Lucido
Metropolitan Hilarion, the chairman of the Russian Orthodox Church’s Department of External Church Relations, said that the Ecumenical Patriarch had not consulted with the leaders of other Orthodox churches before meeting with the Pope, according to the report.

I wonder what Metropolitan Alexander, of the Latvian Orthodox Church, thinks about this?

32 posted on 05/30/2014 12:16:25 PM PDT by Gamecock (#BringTheAdultsBackToDC)
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To: Campion

“I never said indulgences “don’t exist”. I said they aren’t *sold*.”

First, they were sold.
Second, they could be sold again in the same way - without sanction, but probably with knowledge.
Third, I expect money doesn’t overtly change hands. It is likely more of a large gift to the church in exchange.
Fourth, they do not publicize this.

“There is no money involved when I read my Bible for 30 minutes, receive communion, make a good confession, and say three prayers for the intentions of the Pope.”

If you think you get indulgence brownie points for doing any of that, you are far outside the Biblical teaching.

“But you do that, too, don’t you?”

Dear friend, if you are asking if I read God’s Holy Word, certainly. Partake of the Lord’s Supper, certainly. Confess my sins, certainly. “Three prayers for the intentions of the pope”, no. Nor do I have the false belief that any of that earns salvation, or time off for good behavior.


33 posted on 05/30/2014 1:10:06 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( "I didn't leave the Central Oligarchy Party. It left me." - Ronaldus Magnimus, 2014)
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To: Campion

“Thank you. That’s what I said: the sale of indulgences has been abolished for 460+ years. “

Abolished as the official position of the Roman church, yes. In actuality, who knows. They claim they were not sanctioned originally, but it was widely known. It seems doubtful that Rome was unaware.


34 posted on 05/30/2014 1:11:22 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( "I didn't leave the Central Oligarchy Party. It left me." - Ronaldus Magnimus, 2014)
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To: Campion
The old one, which we recite (or sing) at Mass every Sunday, works just fine, thanks. :-)

Yes, we recite one of the three Ecumenical Creeds every week. The purpose of the creeds is to clearly define the catholic faith to distinguish those who are inside the church and those who are not.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it is my understanding that Rome does not accept the creeds as a sufficient test of catholic belief. There are additional stipulations and axiomatic beliefs that are required to be considered part of the church.

35 posted on 05/30/2014 2:20:20 PM PDT by Tao Yin
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To: marshmallow

Well, bowl me over with a feather....more confusion?


36 posted on 05/30/2014 3:04:15 PM PDT by piusv
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To: marshmallow

Judging by the comments from the Patriarch of Moscow, the head line is wrong.


37 posted on 05/30/2014 5:40:28 PM PDT by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: Claud

I’m seeing it commonly translated as “synod,” which is also what the patriarch called the ecumenical council of Nicea. Which is perfectly ambiguous.


38 posted on 05/30/2014 5:50:22 PM PDT by dangus
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To: Tao Yin

We’re staying with the old one. OK, so we added “and the Son,” sparking a bug sticking point between East and West. So that issue will have to be resolved.


39 posted on 05/30/2014 5:53:22 PM PDT by dangus
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To: dangus
When they say “ecumenical council” do they mean “Ecumenical Council” or do they just mean “a council with a bunch of ecumenist?” Because the news of the former would be earth-shattering.

========================================

I think that the 2025 Council will be a continually developing "work in progress," whether it's capitalized or not.

40 posted on 05/30/2014 6:59:07 PM PDT by cloudmountain
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To: Dr. Sivana
"If they are going to have a council, MUCH better to have it at Nicea than to have a "Vatican III", which would sound like the continuation of Vatican II, a Council that in many ways seemed dated as soon as Peter, Paul and Mary stopped hitting the Top 40."

"Why is it that all of the cool places to have a Council are now in a Muslim country?"

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -


♫ ♪  "...the answer my friend is blowin' in the wind..."  ♪ ♫


41 posted on 05/30/2014 7:08:47 PM PDT by Heart-Rest ("Our hearts are restless, Lord, until they rest in Thee." - St. Augustine)
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To: Campion

The sale of indulgences were banned during the Fourth Lateran Council (1215). In 1392, Pope Bonaface condemned many religious for selling indulgences, so it’s evident that abuses occured after that ban, but it’s equally obvious how strenuously the Vatican opposed the sale of indulgences.

Many people believe that people bought indulgences so as to allow them to commit further sin. It’s hard to say that no fool would believe such a thing possible, but such a notion would hardly require a new ban from the Vatican; the prayers of the medieval rite of confession make plain the necessity of sincere repentance from sin for the confession to be valid. More likely, people were trying to buy cheap atonement, which is still theologically absurd, but at least plausibly believed in by the simple-minded and uneducated.

Ironically, we now see this guaranteed ticket straight to Heaven freely offered throughout so much of the PROTESTANT world, where the prosperity gospel affirms you can know of your salvation despite future sins ... and also get rich ... by casting your bread on the waters... and to their ministry. In fairness, though, this prosperity gospel is vehemently opposed by most of the worst Catholic-slandering Freepers.


42 posted on 05/30/2014 7:33:28 PM PDT by dangus
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To: marshmallow

“Pope, Orthodox Patriarch Look to New Council at Nice”

WHY!


43 posted on 05/30/2014 7:39:09 PM PDT by GGpaX4DumpedTea (I am a Tea Party descendant...steeped in the Constitutional Republic given to us by the Founders)
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To: CTrent1564

Your answer is a non sequitur.

And “prots” - stay classy.


44 posted on 05/30/2014 8:30:29 PM PDT by DManA
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To: DManA

Ahhh, a “protestant” using Holy Mother Catholic Churches language of Latin.

Except it is not a non sequitor. Trust me, there are lots of Protestants who use Orthodox views and oppose them against Catholic doctrines, whereas those 2 Churches are not that different. If there is, by God’s grace, a full restoration of full communion between Rome and the Orthodox, it is not a fallacy or illogical answer to assert that indeed some protestant head will “allegorically explode” Yours will not perhaps, but many will.


45 posted on 05/30/2014 8:36:03 PM PDT by CTrent1564
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To: marshmallow
I'm not sure what this means, but it's tremendously exciting.

Pray for unity!

46 posted on 05/30/2014 8:51:58 PM PDT by St_Thomas_Aquinas ( Isaiah 22:22, Matthew 16:19, Revelation 3:7)
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To: aMorePerfectUnion
First, they were sold. Second, they could be sold again in the same way - without sanction, but probably with knowledge. Third, I expect money doesn’t overtly change hands. It is likely more of a large gift to the church in exchange. Fourth, they do not publicize this.

It's not necessary to speculate. Indulgences aren't any great secret.

Primer on Indulgences

47 posted on 05/30/2014 8:59:21 PM PDT by St_Thomas_Aquinas ( Isaiah 22:22, Matthew 16:19, Revelation 3:7)
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To: St_Thomas_Aquinas

“It’s not necessary to speculate. Indulgences aren’t any great secret.”

Sadly, if the granting of indulgences for money or favors is happening secretly today - as it seems to have happened in the past - you would not know anything about it.

Sadly again, the whole concept is false. It was an eternal fraud when they were sold.


48 posted on 05/31/2014 6:56:06 AM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ( "I didn't leave the Central Oligarchy Party. It left me." - Ronaldus Magnimus, 2014)
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To: All

I wish Catholics would stop using the “unity” term. It is misleading. I’m not sure how often it needs to be said, but it apparently needs to be said again: per Traditional Catholic teaching, unity is already found in the Catholic Church. All other churches need to join the Catholic Church. To speak as if there still needs to be unity is FALSE.


49 posted on 05/31/2014 7:34:13 AM PDT by piusv
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To: piusv
I wish Catholics would stop using the “unity” term. It is misleading. I’m not sure how often it needs to be said, but it apparently needs to be said again: per Traditional Catholic teaching, unity is already found in the Catholic Church. All other churches need to join the Catholic Church. To speak as if there still needs to be unity is FALSE.

Some of this confusion is undoubtably the result of the behavior of certain shepherds. Their highly publicized ecumenical meetings and remarks create the impression that mutual compromise is underway.

50 posted on 05/31/2014 8:13:23 AM PDT by BlatherNaut
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