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Mexican bishop baptizes child raised by lesbian couple
LifeSIteNews ^ | May 30, 2014 | SOFIA VAZQUEZ-MELLADO

Posted on 06/01/2014 5:20:38 PM PDT by ebb tide

Mexico City, May 28, 2014 (LifeSiteNews.com) – Mons. Raul Vera Lopez, bishop of Saltillo in the northern Mexican state of Coahuila, baptized a 16-month-old who is being raised by her natural mother and her lesbian partner this past week. This was the second such baptism to take place in Latin America recently, after a similar event took place last month in the Archdiocese of Cordoba, Argentina.

Bishop Vera Lopez has stirred controversy about his views on homosexuality in the past. Two years ago he was investigated by Vatican officials because he had affiliated his diocese with a group that openly promoted the homosexual lifestyle. Bishop Vera was their “spiritual guide.” Last year he also said, “You need to be sick in the head” to think homosexuality is a perversion, according to local media.

The bishop met two weeks ago with Pope Francis in Rome, and according to the Mexican newspaper Excelsior, the prelate discussed his views of “caring for vulnerable groups, such as the lesbian-gay community” with the pope.

“I have been open and given clarity to homosexual couples or whatever,” said the bishop, according to the pro-gay website CristianosGays. “But some groups within the Church say I promote promiscuity, those are conservative groups that harm pastoral care.”

“Who am I to judge? The Pope has the same attitude as Christ did,” he said.

The girl's mother and her partner, Lourdes Badillo and Cristal Cobas, were “married” in Mexico City, where homosexual unions have legal recognition. The girl was conceived through artificial insemination. Badillo is the natural mother.

Earlier this year, the couple made the headlines by becoming the first homosexual couple in Mexico to have their child accepted into the Mexican government’s social health system (IMSS), after a long legal battle with the institution.

“I am very happy,” Cobas told the local media. “This is another small step we must take even if laws and society don’t approve of this type of relationship.”

The girl was baptized in the Church of Saint Francis alongside two other children.

“There were several couples,” said Bishop Vera Lopez. “If I find the natural daughter of one of two women, how can I deny her baptism? If the parents seek it it’s because there is a Christian faith,” he explained to the media.

“To receive baptism there is a preparation, and during these talks certain values are made clear. The Pope already said it: Who am I to judge?”

Coahuila’s governor Ruben Moreira, from Mexico’s Party of the Institutional Revolution, welcomed Vera Lopez’ actions: “I congratulate him, we needed a voice like his, full of wisdom… to tell us that we are all children of God.”

While the governor said that the bishop was acting according to Church teaching, the Church’s Code of Canon Law states that for an infant to be baptized in the Catholic Church “there must be a founded hope that the infant will be brought up in the Catholic religion.”

“If such hope is altogether lacking, the baptism is to be delayed according to the prescripts of particular law after the parents have been advised about the reason,” canon 868 §1 adds.

Last month's baptism in Argentina was criticized over fears that the public ceremony was being used as a publicity stunt to undermine the Church's teachings on homosexuality. The couple in that case chose the president of Argentina as the godmother for their child, and made an extensive media tour following the baptism.

Bishop Vera López has also functioned as the head of two Mexican “human rights” organizations that support the legalization of abortion.

“Vera is a dissident,” Juan Dabdoub, president of the Mexican Family Council, told LifeSiteNews. “He only seeks to hurt the Church in everything he thinks the Church is wrong; it is a disobedience… I don’t understand how the Hierarchy tolerates it.”


TOPICS: Apologetics; Catholic; Moral Issues; Religion & Culture
KEYWORDS: baptism; homosexualadoption; homosexualagenda
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Last year he also said, “You need to be sick in the head” to think homosexuality is a perversion, according to local media.

“Who am I to judge? The Pope has the same attitude as Christ did,” he said.

1 posted on 06/01/2014 5:20:38 PM PDT by ebb tide
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To: ebb tide

The theology may be appalling, but shouldn’t the baby receive the sacraments of his church?


2 posted on 06/01/2014 5:23:00 PM PDT by Mamzelle
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To: ebb tide

Can the Pope judge people who disagree with the policy?


3 posted on 06/01/2014 5:23:52 PM PDT by AppyPappy
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To: ebb tide
the Church’s Code of Canon Law states that for an infant to be baptized in the Catholic Church “there must be a founded hope that the infant will be brought up in the Catholic religion.”

Defrock this buffoon.

4 posted on 06/01/2014 5:25:22 PM PDT by ConservingFreedom (A goverrnment strong enough to impose your standards is strong enough to ban them.)
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To: Mamzelle
See above.
5 posted on 06/01/2014 5:26:08 PM PDT by ConservingFreedom (A goverrnment strong enough to impose your standards is strong enough to ban them.)
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To: Mamzelle

Years ago, in Spain, my little cousin was denied baptism because his parents were not married in the Catholic church (the mom was Lutheran). Since a baptism certificate was then necessary for just about anything in Spain, beginning with registering for kindergarten, the parents agreed to get married again. Then it turned out that no priest would marry them as long as the mother was Lutheran, and she refused to convert just to go along. Eventually a priest married them in the sacristy and a few days later the boy was baptized.


6 posted on 06/01/2014 5:30:51 PM PDT by Former Fetus (Saved by grace through faith)
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To: ebb tide

The Vatican going to let this go?


7 posted on 06/01/2014 5:38:03 PM PDT by GeronL (Vote for Conservatives not for Republicans)
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To: Mamzelle

The child should be baptized period. That is what Jesus would do and then He would pray for the child and her parents. People need to concentrate on the sins they themselves are committing and quit judging others. God doesn’t have a “sin hierarchy” and we all sin regularily.


8 posted on 06/01/2014 5:41:29 PM PDT by doc maverick
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To: Mamzelle
The theology may be appalling, but shouldn’t the baby receive the sacraments of his church?

Yes.

9 posted on 06/01/2014 5:42:30 PM PDT by cloudmountain
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To: ebb tide

The baby is an innocent. If the church baptizes babies, it should baptize all of them, because no baby ever does anything that warrants being lost.

The church can always excommunicate later on.


10 posted on 06/01/2014 5:43:11 PM PDT by Jonty30 (What Islam and secularism have in common is that they are both death cults)
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To: ConservingFreedom
Defrock this buffoon.

Yes.

11 posted on 06/01/2014 5:43:20 PM PDT by cloudmountain
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To: ebb tide

The child needs Gods Grace. And all the help it. An get.


12 posted on 06/01/2014 5:44:05 PM PDT by FatherofFive (Islam is evil and must be eradicated)
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To: GeronL
The Vatican going to let this go?

The Vatican has nothing to do with this. This is the bailiwick of the bishops.

13 posted on 06/01/2014 5:44:41 PM PDT by cloudmountain
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To: cloudmountain

The Vatican investigated him, the article said, 2 years ago as he was the spiritual leader to a homo group and they did what? Nothing?


14 posted on 06/01/2014 5:48:31 PM PDT by GeronL (Vote for Conservatives not for Republicans)
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To: Former Fetus
Since a baptism certificate was then necessary for just about anything in Spain, beginning with registering for kindergarten

What about Christians who don't believe in infant baptism, and non-Christians?

15 posted on 06/01/2014 5:49:23 PM PDT by ansel12 ((Ted Cruz and Mike Lee-both of whom sit on the Senate Judiciary Comm as Ginsberg's importance fades)
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To: FatherofFive; Jonty30; doc maverick; cloudmountain; Former Fetus

So why not give Holy Communion out on street corners to anybody who asks?


16 posted on 06/01/2014 5:50:08 PM PDT by ebb tide
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To: ebb tide

An infant child is without sin.


17 posted on 06/01/2014 5:51:28 PM PDT by Labyrinthos
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To: ebb tide

Why not?

One of the most offensive things to God is being an obstacle to salvation.

7.Matthew 18:6
But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.


18 posted on 06/01/2014 5:52:16 PM PDT by Jonty30 (What Islam and secularism have in common is that they are both death cults)
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To: ansel12

Move?


19 posted on 06/01/2014 5:52:42 PM PDT by Jonty30 (What Islam and secularism have in common is that they are both death cults)
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To: doc maverick

Not when those in question don’t think their behaviors are sins. The Lesbians are flaunting their sin.


20 posted on 06/01/2014 5:52:46 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: Mamzelle
Where there is sincere intent --- eiter of the person to be baptized, or the parents if it is an underage child --- to be freed from sin and to profess a growing Faith in the Lord, then Baptism is appropriate whatever the person's past.

The rite of Baptism even includes an exorcism:

V. Do you reject Satan?
R. I do.

V. And all his works?
R. I do.

V. And all his empty promises?
R. I do.

However, if you're dealing with people raising the child who have a public commitment to lesbian sin (a commitment they have shown in the most public way possible: pseudo-marriage), you do not have this sincere intent.

Baptism is not some kind of magic. Sincere intent is always required, otherwise it is fraudulent and, in fact, a sacrilege.

21 posted on 06/01/2014 5:54:15 PM PDT by Mrs. Don-o ("Every saint has a past, and every sinner has a future." - Oscar Wilde)
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To: Jonty30

You obviously believe in the Sacrament of Baptism. Do you also believe in the Sacrament of Confession?


22 posted on 06/01/2014 5:56:46 PM PDT by ebb tide
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To: ebb tide

The child didn’t commit the sin, or any sin. Why not baptize him?


23 posted on 06/01/2014 5:57:24 PM PDT by RinaseaofDs (.)
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To: Jonty30

Can Spain be that oppressive and backwards?

I knew they had a barbaric past but surely they aren’t still so backwards.


24 posted on 06/01/2014 5:58:38 PM PDT by ansel12 ((Ted Cruz and Mike Lee-both of whom sit on the Senate Judiciary Comm as Ginsberg's importance fades)
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To: ansel12

Well I certainly wasn’t expecting some kind of Spanish Inquisition.


25 posted on 06/01/2014 5:59:07 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: Jonty30; doc maverick; cloudmountain
#21

Every Sacrament must have intent--- not perfection, but intent --- to be freed from sin. If intent were not essential, we could just spray water over whole football stadiums of people and baptize them all, couldn't we? It would be as if Baptism was not a sacrament at all, but rather some kind of magic.

Being unbaptized does not damn this child. Unbaptized babies, when they die, are commended to the mercy of God in the rites of the Catholic Church.

26 posted on 06/01/2014 6:01:37 PM PDT by Mrs. Don-o ("Every saint has a past, and every sinner has a future." - Oscar Wilde)
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To: RinaseaofDs; Mrs. Don-o

See Mrs. Don-o’s post 21.


27 posted on 06/01/2014 6:01:55 PM PDT by ebb tide
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To: ebb tide

the baby can’t help who its being raised by


28 posted on 06/01/2014 6:03:08 PM PDT by faithhopecharity ((Brilliant, Profound Tag Line Goes Here, just as soon as I can think of one..)
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To: ebb tide

the baby can’t help who its being raised by... and will frankly need as much help from the Church and others of good will, as it grows up without a proper home

I’m all for the baby receiving the sacrament of baptism and being welcomed into the Church


29 posted on 06/01/2014 6:03:48 PM PDT by faithhopecharity ((Brilliant, Profound Tag Line Goes Here, just as soon as I can think of one..)
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To: ansel12
I'm no canon lawyer, but think the refusal of baptism in the stated case (the Lutheran mother) would be contrary to canon law, since the Catholic Church recognizes Baptism as valid and sacramental in virtually all Christian denominations (except some outliers like Mormonism and Oneness Pentecostalism).

So what you had here was two baptized parents (a Catholic and a Lutheran) requesting baptism for their child. The priest should have done it.

30 posted on 06/01/2014 6:05:20 PM PDT by Mrs. Don-o ("Every saint has a past, and every sinner has a future." - Oscar Wilde)
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To: RinaseaofDs

My Maltese hasn’t committed any sin. Why not baptize it?


31 posted on 06/01/2014 6:05:57 PM PDT by ebb tide
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To: Mrs. Don-o; Former Fetus

I wasn’t interested in the internal affairs of the catholic denomination, I was doubting that the government of Spain requires infant baptism to enter school.


32 posted on 06/01/2014 6:09:04 PM PDT by ansel12 ((Ted Cruz and Mike Lee-both of whom sit on the Senate Judiciary Comm as Ginsberg's importance fades)
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To: Mamzelle

Exactly, the baby has done nothing wrong.


33 posted on 06/01/2014 6:09:29 PM PDT by tiki
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To: ansel12

Years ago likely means before 1980, and probably before 1975. Unfortunately, Franco is still dead.


34 posted on 06/01/2014 6:27:05 PM PDT by Hieronymus ( (It is terrible to contemplate how few politicians are hanged. --G.K. Chesterton))
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To: ansel12; Former Fetus
Thanks for that clarification, ansel122.

I'm no expert in Spanish law either, but since the death of Franco in 1975, the Spanish govt. has frequently been antagonistic to the Catholic Church and friendly toward the resurgence of parties of the Left, which promote severe secularism and even atheism.

However, going back 40 years or more, under Franco 1939-1975, it's a different story. He clearly used Catholicism to assert a conservative national identity. He rebuilt with public money the churches which had been dynamited by the Communist/Anarchist parties, and considered Catholicism a bulwark against the Left.

This still would not have been right under Canon Law; but Bishops (with saintly exceptions) are all too prone to conform to civil law and ignore canon law, when it suits them.

35 posted on 06/01/2014 6:31:49 PM PDT by Mrs. Don-o ("The floor of hell is paved with the skulls of bishops." - St. John Chrysostom, Bishop)
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To: tiki

>>Can. 868 §1. For an infant to be baptized licitly:<<

>>1/ the parents or at least one of them or the person who legitimately takes their place must consent;<<

>>2/ there must be a founded hope that the infant will be brought up in the Catholic religion; if such hope is altogether lacking, the baptism is to be delayed according to the prescripts of particular law after the parents have been advised about the reason.<<

What part of Canon law do you not understand?


36 posted on 06/01/2014 6:35:20 PM PDT by ebb tide
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To: ebb tide

No problem here; the baby should receive the Sacrament.


37 posted on 06/01/2014 6:42:41 PM PDT by Mike Darancette (Do The Math)
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To: Hieronymus; ansel12; ebb tide; Mrs. Don-o
Hieronimus is right, it was before 1980 (I know that because that was the year I left Spain for good) but I don't think it was earlier than 1975. Whether it was right or wrong under canon law I do not know, but what I do know is that it was very common, I had to provide my baptism certificate to register for college. I didn't think it was right, I supported my aunt in her decision not to convert just because the parish priest said she had to! I just mentioned it because it is another example of an innocent child being denied baptism because of his parents.

Mrs. Don-o is right, those were weird times. When a bishop needed to be appointed, the church presented three choices to Franco and he had the final say... just like the church had a say in what ministers were or were not chosen. I like to tell this story to teenagers, to show them the importance of freedom of religion and how lucky they are to be born in the USA.

38 posted on 06/01/2014 6:45:21 PM PDT by Former Fetus (Saved by grace through faith)
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To: Former Fetus

So it was a requirement of the government?


39 posted on 06/01/2014 6:50:24 PM PDT by ansel12 ((Ted Cruz and Mike Lee-both of whom sit on the Senate Judiciary Comm as Ginsberg's importance fades)
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To: Mrs. Don-o

True enough.


40 posted on 06/01/2014 6:53:32 PM PDT by cloudmountain
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To: Mike Darancette

Nope. Big problem according to canon law.


41 posted on 06/01/2014 6:55:10 PM PDT by ebb tide
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To: ebb tide

Your Maltese isn’t human. In this case the protection of the child’s soul comes down to whether your parent is a moron or not.


42 posted on 06/01/2014 6:56:03 PM PDT by RinaseaofDs (.)
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To: ansel12

I would imagine so, but way back then the lines between Church and government were so blurry it would take a lawyer to answer with 100% certainty. As for the people, just trying to go about their business, it was just more paperwork, more requirements... nothing new! Keep in mind that I am talking about a country were, before having a birthday party for your child, you were required to go to the nearest police station and apply for a permit. With lots of stamps, to milk some more money out of you!


43 posted on 06/01/2014 6:58:28 PM PDT by Former Fetus (Saved by grace through faith)
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To: Former Fetus
"In 1992, Protestantism, Judaism, and Islam were granted the status of “deeply rooted” faiths, which allowed these religious communities to enter into bilateral relations with the Spanish government. The government has since expanded the notion of “deeply rooted faiths” to permit other religious minorities, including Buddhists and Mormons, to open official bilateral relations with the state. Despite the constitutional separation between church and state, Spanish citizens are permitted to allocate a portion of their tax dollars to Catholic charities. Muslim, Jewish, and Protestant groups have unsuccessfully petitioned the government to allow for tax dollars to be allocated to non-Catholic charities. Non-Catholic religious groups also allege that the government disproportionately funds Catholic education and restricts the recruitment of non-Catholic chaplains in Spain’'s armed forces."
44 posted on 06/01/2014 7:05:57 PM PDT by ansel12 ((Ted Cruz and Mike Lee-both of whom sit on the Senate Judiciary Comm as Ginsberg's importance fades)
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To: RinaseaofDs

Replace “moron” with “unrepentant lesbian” who will not raise the child in the Catholic faith.

Why not go down to the nursery at Long Island Jewish Medical Center and secretly baptize those infants?

Why not baptize people on a public transit bus or at an airport boarding gate. You could be a missionary extradonaire!


45 posted on 06/01/2014 7:08:20 PM PDT by ebb tide
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To: tiki; Jonty30; doc maverick; cloudmountain; Former Fetus; FatherofFive; Labyrinthos; ...

How would y’all feel about the baptism of the child of two Satanists who had no other plans of raising their child except as a Satanist?

Do you not feel it to be a mockery of the Catholic Church and Her Sacraments?


46 posted on 06/01/2014 7:27:35 PM PDT by ebb tide
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To: ansel12

I read El Pais on-line, just to make sure I don’t forget the language. About a year ago there was an article about the government having drastically cut the funding of Catholic churches while building mosques like crazy.


47 posted on 06/01/2014 7:27:39 PM PDT by Former Fetus (Saved by grace through faith)
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To: ebb tide

I’m not mocking anything. Should the children bear the sins of the parents?


48 posted on 06/01/2014 7:28:42 PM PDT by Jonty30 (What Islam and secularism have in common is that they are both death cults)
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To: ebb tide

I honestly can’t answer you completely. About all I can say is that such a baby will need as much help as it can get, and especially that of learning g to know God and to have God in its life. I can’t think of any better or more likely source of this assistance for the child than the Church. I therefore hope the Church would welcome - and not refuse or reject - such a child.


49 posted on 06/01/2014 7:44:11 PM PDT by faithhopecharity ((Brilliant, Profound Tag Line Goes Here, just as soon as I can think of one..)
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To: Jonty30

We’re bearing the sins of our parents, Adam and Eve, aren’t we?


50 posted on 06/01/2014 7:46:27 PM PDT by ebb tide
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