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Millennial Series: Part 3: Amillenniallism in the Ancient Church
Bible. org ^ | 1949 | John F. Walvoord

Posted on 06/29/2014 9:54:35 AM PDT by wmfights

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It may be concluded, therefore, that the first century is barren of any real support to the amillennial viewpoint. While, indeed, the evidence is not altogether clear and not abundant for this century, it is significant that amillennial polemics have contented themselves with minimizing premillennial claims without attempting to support their own view by historical evidence. The first century is a lost cause for amillennialism.

The second century like the first is devoid of any testimony whatever for amillennialism except at its close.

At the very close of the second century and the beginning of the third we come upon the first bona fide amillennialists, Gaius (or, Caius) who wrote early in the third century; Clement of Alexandria, a teacher at the school there from 193 to 220; his pupil, Origen (185-254); and Dionysius (190-265). It was from these men that premillennialism suffered its first vocal and effective opposition.

1 posted on 06/29/2014 9:54:35 AM PDT by wmfights
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To: wmfights; Kandy Atz; Mrs.Z; CynicalBear; Iscool; amigatec; kjam22; boatbums; imardmd1; metmom; ...
Dispensational Caucus Ping

I think Dr. Walvoord does a great job of explaining how amillennialism was not the view of apostolic era Christians, or the century immediately following. The view held was premillennial.

2 posted on 06/29/2014 10:03:11 AM PDT by wmfights
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To: wmfights
I know nothing will come of the suggestion, but, I recommend you take a look at Charles Hill's Regnum Caelorum: Patterns of Millennial Thought in Early Christianity .
3 posted on 06/29/2014 10:22:11 AM PDT by Lee N. Field ("And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to promise" Gal 3:29)
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To: wmfights
At the very close of the second century and the beginning of the third we come upon the first bona fide amillennialists, Gaius (or, Caius) who wrote early in the third century; Clement of Alexandria, a teacher at the school there from 193 to 220; his pupil, Origen (185-254); and Dionysius (190-265). It was from these men that premillennialism suffered its first vocal and effective opposition. The nature of this opposition, its exegetical grounds, and the effect upon premillennialism are all significant.

With the close of the third century, the evidence indicates a distinct increase in power in amillennialism and a corresponding loss of power for the premillennialists. In the church, it is clear that the rising tide of amillennialism comes almost entirely from the Alexandrian school, in particular, from Clement, Origen, and Dionysius, all of this locality. Accompanying this change in the church was the corresponding political change under Constantine which became effective more and more in the fourth century. With the coming of Augustine a new day and a new chapter in the history of millennialism was written.

As can be seen, this refusal to believe scripture and insert private interpretation started in Alexandria, Africa...It started with the Catholic religion, of course...Why would a Christian follow a religion that has its roots in Africa???

This false (non)interpretation serves the Catholic religion very well...With it, they gave themselves the role of being the true religion which will last to eternity...They secured their position by joining with the worldwide Roman army and wiping out as many of the 'heretics' as they could find...

With a literal reading of the scriptures with a real Millennium, Rome doesn't exist...There is no legitimate Church of Rome...They must deny the Millennium...

I don't know what happened to the Reformers...They apparently fell off the wagon some time ago, for some reason...

If the Millennium is allegorical, people have to dump countless numbers of passages in the O.T. since they become meaningless and are a waste of good ink and paper...I don't believe God had the O.T. prophets go out and tell stories for what, entertainment???

4 posted on 06/29/2014 11:01:58 AM PDT by Iscool
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To: Iscool
I don't know what happened to the Reformers...They apparently fell off the wagon some time ago, for some reason...

We have a great deal we can agree with them about, but why they refuse to see how much of the Roman theology they took with them is beyond me. One of the great battle cries of the Reformers were the 5 Solas, one of these being Sola Scriptura. We find Premillennialism in Scripture, you can't find Amillennialism unless you do away with literal interpretation of prophecy.

If the Millennium is allegorical, people have to dump countless numbers of passages in the O.T. since they become meaningless and are a waste of good ink and paper...I don't believe God had the O.T. prophets go out and tell stories for what, entertainment???

Great illustration of where allegorical interpretation leads.

It sure seems like we are going to see our LORD any day now with all that's going on in the Middle East. The shame of it is most people don't see the implications of the Pope siding with the Palestinians, or Russia becoming involved in supporting Iraq. Allegorical interpretation blinds people to seeing God's plan playing out right before us.

5 posted on 06/29/2014 11:34:23 AM PDT by wmfights
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To: wmfights

Thanks for the ping. Walvoord has laid it out rather plainly. If there is no coming millennial reign by Christ much of scripture would have to be ignored or unduly allegorized. Those who claim the millennium is Christ reigning now would have to restrict Him to reigning over only a part of the universe.


6 posted on 06/29/2014 11:50:19 AM PDT by CynicalBear (For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ)
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To: Iscool
>> With a literal reading of the scriptures with a real Millennium, Rome doesn't exist...There is no legitimate Church of Rome...They must deny the Millennium...<<

Interesting how that works isn’t it? We see that in many sects. In order to fit scripture into their belief system they must allegorize or ignore parts of scripture.

>> I don't know what happened to the Reformers...They apparently fell off the wagon some time ago, for some reason...<<

I think most people forget or overlook that the Reformers came out of Catholic belief and retained much too much of that belief and practice.

7 posted on 06/29/2014 11:58:47 AM PDT by CynicalBear (For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ)
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To: wmfights; Iscool
>>It sure seems like we are going to see our LORD any day now with all that's going on in the Middle East. The shame of it is most people don't see the implications of the Pope siding with the Palestinians, or Russia becoming involved in supporting Iraq. Allegorical interpretation blinds people to seeing God's plan playing out right before us.<<

As current events unfold you would think there would be more whose eyes are opened to how it fits into prophesy.

8 posted on 06/29/2014 12:01:33 PM PDT by CynicalBear (For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ)
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To: wmfights

It has only been lately that I have even been familiar with the words premillennial and amillennial but I guess I have always been the latter

And I base my belief mainly on the following scriptures

Mathew 24
26
Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.

27
For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

28
For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.

Meaning there will be no carcass

John 14
14 Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.

2
In my Father’s house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.

3
And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

John 6
40
And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

He receives the saved unto himself at the last day.

Rev 20
4
And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and [I saw] the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received [his] mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

Rev 20:6
But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

So I suppose I believe that we have been living in a physical kingdom with Christ in his spiritual kingdom.

Luke 9:27
But I tell you of a truth, there be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the kingdom of God.

The ones in Rev 20:4 may have literally lived again and reigned in the spiritual kingdom of God.

Rev 20:16 may actually be saying that the rest of the dead would literally live again after the thousand years were finished.

We are getting prepared in this world to go to the one Christ is preparing, but it is hard for me or any one else to separate the two.


9 posted on 06/29/2014 1:00:49 PM PDT by ravenwolf
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To: Lee N. Field

That is a lot of money for some ones opinion, I bought the entire Bible much cheaper that that.


10 posted on 06/29/2014 1:19:27 PM PDT by ravenwolf
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To: wmfights
Russia becoming involved in supporting Iraq

Syria, Russia, Iraq and Iran bonded together with China waiting on the sidelines...

11 posted on 06/29/2014 1:24:00 PM PDT by Iscool
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To: ravenwolf
We are getting prepared in this world to go to the one Christ is preparing, but it is hard for me or any one else to separate the two.

Easy for me...Two Kingdoms...Jesus talks about a wedding in his parables...There's a bride...And, there are guests at the wedding...There's a lot more there going on than one might think...

A spiritual kingdom where Christians will reign with Christ while simultaneously a physical kingdom where humans live in peace for a thousand years...

Over 30,000 verses in that bible...They aren't all there just talking about fairy tales...

12 posted on 06/29/2014 1:32:39 PM PDT by Iscool
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To: ravenwolf
That is a lot of money for some ones opinion, I bought the entire Bible much cheaper that that.

And a paperback at that...

13 posted on 06/29/2014 1:34:36 PM PDT by Iscool
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To: Iscool
Syria, Russia, Iraq and Iran bonded together with China waiting on the sidelines...

I keep reminding myself we just don't know when. It could be soon. It could be another 500 years. To me, it sure looks like it will be soon.

15 posted on 06/29/2014 2:40:27 PM PDT by wmfights
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To: Iscool

Over 30,000 verses in that bible...They aren’t all there just talking about fairy tales...


You got that right, there is more going on than I could figure out in a thousand years.

Every time I think I am just getting a hint of something it always contradicts something else.

But I wonder if we are really supposed to know every thing?


16 posted on 06/29/2014 2:42:58 PM PDT by ravenwolf
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To: CynicalBear
As current events unfold you would think there would be more whose eyes are opened to how it fits into prophesy.

I think that as more and more eyes are closed, the prophecy is able to go forward. Remember, blindness in part happens to Israel. It is not possible for a blind man to see these things. Blindness seems to be spreading to the church as we are experiencing a falling away.
18 posted on 06/29/2014 3:11:40 PM PDT by Seven_0 (You cannot fool all of the people, ever!)
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To: ravenwolf
It has only been lately that I have even been familiar with the words premillennial and amillennial but I guess I have always been the latter

Why do you believe the verses you noted popint to no millennial reign on Earth? Excuse me if I misread your post.

From Dr. Wavoord's article:

The question of the disciples, “Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?” (Acts 1:6), occasioned no denial from the Lord Jesus, but merely the reminder that it was not for them to know the “time.” The request of the mother of James and John for preferment of her sons in the kingdom was not refused on the ground that no future earthly kingdom was in prospect, but that the places of honor were reserved for those chosen by the Father (Matt 20:20-23). While the argument from silence is never decisive, Christ also told His disciples, “If it were not so I would have told you” (John 14:2). If no earthly kingdom was in prospect, it seems strange also in view of the prevailing Jewish concept of an earthly kingdom that Christ should tell His disciples, “I appoint unto you a kingdom, as my Father has appointed unto me; that ye may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom, and sit on thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel” (Luke 22:29-30). The positive testimony of Revelation 20 with its six references to a reign of Christ on earth for one thousand years while hotly disputed and denied significance by the amillenialists is nevertheless their stubborn foe.

If this isn't demonstrative of a Millennial Reign of Christ on Earth you also have the actual behavior of the Apostles after Pentecost. Believers gathered with them in Jerusalem waiting in anticipation of the coming Kingdom.

19 posted on 06/29/2014 3:13:19 PM PDT by wmfights
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To: CynicalBear; Iscool
As current events unfold you would think there would be more whose eyes are opened to how it fits into prophesy.

You would think so, but the opposite seems to be happening. A literal reading of Scripture has been devalued and I hate to say it, but Premillennialists have contributed to the problem by getting caught up in date setting. There is no question in my mind that the systematic theology of Premillennialists which places the literal understanding first and recognizes that GOD is not done with Israel is correct, but when we set dates we diminish our credibility.

20 posted on 06/29/2014 3:21:49 PM PDT by wmfights
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