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Surprised by Joy: A response to Richard Dawkins on Having a Child with Down syndrome.
National Review ^ | 08/23/2014 | By Matthew Hennessey

Posted on 08/23/2014 6:33:35 AM PDT by SeekAndFind



TOPICS: Moral Issues; Religion & Culture; Skeptics/Seekers
KEYWORDS: downssyndrome; murderer; richarddawkins

1 posted on 08/23/2014 6:33:35 AM PDT by SeekAndFind
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To: SeekAndFind

Who is this Dawkins? Every time I read his name I think of Hogan’s heroes, the British prisoner in particular


2 posted on 08/23/2014 6:40:15 AM PDT by yldstrk ( My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: SeekAndFind
In 2008, shortly after the Summer Olympics were held in Beijing, Sky News reporter Holly Williams interviewed the director of a Chinese maternity hospital who admitted that her facility counseled expectant mothers to abort babies with “serious deformities,” such as a missing arm or leg. “We don’t let them have the baby,” said the hospital director. “If they have it, it’s a burden to the family, to society, and to the country. We want healthy babies because they make families happy and our society happy too. We’re working to improve the quality of the population.”

This is nothing new. The Chinese have always had a custom of killing those who are less than perfect. The only difference is that they can kill the imperfect at a younger age than ever before.

3 posted on 08/23/2014 6:45:58 AM PDT by exDemMom (Current visual of the hole the US continues to dig itself into: http://www.usdebtclock.org/)
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To: SeekAndFind

As a nurse I’ve always loved taking care of my Downs patients. I don’t like phony people and they are never phony or pretentious.

When I worked in the NICU we had a Downs patient whose family nicknamed him “Sug”, short for “Sugar.” The nurses used to fight over him because we all wanted to take care of him.


4 posted on 08/23/2014 6:48:12 AM PDT by Wage Slave
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To: SeekAndFind
Thank you for posting.

This is yet another article highlighting what enlightened individuals might call the "provincial" views of Dawkins. Indeed, Dawkins and others, such as Singer, and today's "progressives," with all of their domination of academia and Far Left politics, seem to fit into a category described in an essay by T.S. Eliot on Virgil and cited by Dr. Russell Kirk in his "The Conservative Mind":

"In our time, when men seem more than ever to confuse wisdom with knowledge and knowledge with information and to try to solve the problems of life in terms of engineering, there is coming into existence a new kind of provincialism which perhaps deserves a new name. It is a provincialism not of space but of time--one for which history is merely a chronicle of human devices which have served their turn and have been scrapped, one for which the world is the property solely of the living, a property in which the dead hold no share." - T. S. Eliot

By his "doubling down," on his previous assertions, Dawkins simply reveals his own empty reservoir of "understanding."

A wisdom book from centuries past cautions:

"Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding." - Proverbs 4:7

The love brought into this world, and celebrated in the faces of those beautiful and affectionate children Dawkins would exclude from entering it, is a testament to the emptiness of his declarations.

May I suggest that FR readers order one of Ben Haden's long-ago sermons entitled, "Affliction," in which he relates a story about the unexpected birth of a Down's Syndrome baby to a minister and his wife, and how God used the birth of that child, and the people and events surrounding the couple's reaction to that birth to exert a powerfully positive influence on the lives of many individuals.

Haden's web site address is here. Now deceased, Haden was an attorney, newspaper editor, and Presbyterian minister whose "Changed Lives" radio program and internet presence made a powerful difference in the lives of many.

The same spirit seen in the faces of these beautiful children is that spirit which will live on after the physical body has returned to "dust," and that is the part of the mystery which Dawkins brain just doesn't compute.

5 posted on 08/23/2014 6:49:35 AM PDT by loveliberty2
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To: yldstrk

That was Richard Dawson, although I had to google to be sure.

He was lovely, Dawkins is a creep.

And here’s a link to a story describing his “half apology”, but it really sounds like he thinks people should apologize to him.

Oh, and btw, not to go all rad-fem but why should we listen to this MAN on the subject of abortion?


6 posted on 08/23/2014 6:53:29 AM PDT by jocon307
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To: jocon307

I have no clue who this hateful hothead is, but I also have no doubt he will live to regret his blindness


7 posted on 08/23/2014 6:55:43 AM PDT by yldstrk ( My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: SeekAndFind

Eugenics is a progressive program. It has been for over a century.

The National Socialists were big on culling people they deemed unfit from society as well.

There really is no new thing under the sun, and modern progressivism isn’t new at all.


8 posted on 08/23/2014 7:00:35 AM PDT by Skepolitic
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To: SeekAndFind

A nation that allows the killing of babies is a nation that will fall to darkness...Citizens make nations...and it is the citizen,s duty to protect life...all life from this veil of ignorance....


9 posted on 08/23/2014 7:01:10 AM PDT by BCW (ARMIS EXPOSCERE PACEM)
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To: Wage Slave

A cousin of mine, 5 years ago, was told her baby was going to be Downs & was advised to abort it. She decided to seek a second opinion and that doctor told her the baby was fine. She had decided not to abort regardless and today is blessed with a very healthy, happy 5 year old, no Downs. During the time she was seeking the second opinion, etc., I did some research on Downs children, just to improve my understanding of what she might be facing. Invariably, the parents of Downs children were glad they had them and considered them an absolute blessing and talked about how these children had enriched their lives and families. One described them as angels from Heaven that God had given them for special care here on earth. Ever since, I’ve always thought of them that way and I admire the parents that, despite knowing their children will be ‘different’, choose life.


10 posted on 08/23/2014 7:03:15 AM PDT by Qiviut ( One of the most delightful things about a garden is the anticipation it provides. (W.E. Johns)
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To: yldstrk
He's the man with all the answers...
11 posted on 08/23/2014 7:03:53 AM PDT by Ouchthatonehurt ("When you're going through hell, keep going." - Sir Winston Churchill)
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To: Qiviut

When I was pregnant I refused the test for Down’s because I was not going to abort no matter what


12 posted on 08/23/2014 7:04:49 AM PDT by yldstrk ( My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: Ouchthatonehurt

Hope he learns his lesson before he has to visit his father in the underworld


13 posted on 08/23/2014 7:06:10 AM PDT by yldstrk ( My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: yldstrk; Qiviut
When I was pregnant I refused the test for Down’s because I was not going to abort no matter what

That is why you are a good Person Yldstrk.

As well was your Cousin Qiviut.

14 posted on 08/23/2014 7:07:20 AM PDT by KC_Lion (Build the America you want to live in at your address, and keep looking up.- Sarah Palin)
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To: yldstrk

When I was pregnant I refused the test for Down’s because I was not going to abort no matter what

*************************************************

I think the percentage of babies aborted after prenatal diagnosis with Downs is about 90%. It’s been called ‘genocide’ and a holocaust ... children killed because of one extra chromosome. I just can’t wrap my mind around how someone morally justifies this .... I think the key is ‘morally’. A lot of decisions involving kids is ‘economic’ these days and priorities are not what is best for the kids, but what won’t interfere with the lifestyles of those having the kids.


15 posted on 08/23/2014 7:15:33 AM PDT by Qiviut ( One of the most delightful things about a garden is the anticipation it provides. (W.E. Johns)
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To: yldstrk
I think the test for Down’s Syndrome involves amniocentesis. This is an obviously invasive procedure that involves risks of its own. So, yet another reason to not test.
16 posted on 08/23/2014 7:38:10 AM PDT by j. earl carter
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To: SeekAndFind

Slouching toward Gattaca.


17 posted on 08/23/2014 7:45:08 AM PDT by edpc (Wilby 2016)
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To: SeekAndFind

The evil resulting from taking the belief in evolution to its ultimate conclusions.


18 posted on 08/23/2014 7:57:28 AM PDT by Down South P.E. (Be a Berean Acts 17:11)
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To: SeekAndFind

As the daddy of a newly-teenaged girl who isn’t Downs but very developmentally-delayed, I can agree with the poster.

We didn’t have any of our kids ‘tested’ before birth because my wife and I were never interested in finding out if anything was wrong with them. With my special daughter, it wasn’t until she was about 2 that we noticed that something wasn’t right.

It’s been a challenge, but there have been blessings in the struggle.


19 posted on 08/23/2014 7:58:05 AM PDT by hoagy62 ("Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered..."-Thomas Paine. 1776)
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To: Ouchthatonehurt

It goes without saying that the guy is pure evil. But to me, there’s also a look in his eyes that says he’s barely held together. I expect one day someone will rebuke him in the name of Jesus and he’ll fall down, screaming.


20 posted on 08/23/2014 8:26:52 AM PDT by CatherineofAragon ((Support Christian white males---the architects of the jewel known as Western Civilization.))
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To: Wage Slave
I don’t like phony people and they are never phony or pretentious.

You hit the nail on the head.

When I hear people say that people with Down Syndrome are all so nice, I shake my head. Some of them are not very nice, and to state that every person with Down is nice is to insult them as human beings.

But I have never met a person with Down Syndrome who was a phony.

21 posted on 08/23/2014 9:44:49 AM PDT by Jeff Chandler (Conservatism is the political disposition of grown-ups.)
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To: SeekAndFind; GodGunsGuts; Fichori; tpanther; Gordon Greene; Ethan Clive Osgoode; betty boop; ...

ping


22 posted on 08/23/2014 10:25:06 AM PDT by metmom (...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith...)
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To: edpc
Slouching toward Gattaca.

Perfect.

23 posted on 08/23/2014 10:28:51 AM PDT by dfwgator
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To: metmom

Isn’t Dawkins due for a stroke or something?
.


24 posted on 08/23/2014 10:45:12 AM PDT by editor-surveyor (Freepers: Not as smart as I'd hoped they'd be)
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To: CatherineofAragon

Some people just have pale skin, but this one has a death warmed over pallor. Reminds me of Arafat.

One foot on the grave, the other on a banana peel..


25 posted on 08/23/2014 10:53:30 AM PDT by Ezekiel (All who mourn the destruction of America merit the celebration of her rebirth.)
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To: yldstrk
When I was pregnant I refused the test for Down’s because I was not going to abort no matter what...

When I was expecting our third, I was 34. New Jersey had put in a requirement for doctors to inform their 'older' mothers about the importance of amniocentsis. I asked my Doc what they would need to look for, besides Down's, since I wouldn't have aborted, no matter what. He said one thing that could be important to know would be if the baby had a neural tube syndrome. I asked if that could be seen on an ultrasound, and he said it could, so I refused the amnio, and had an ultrasound.

When we had our fourth, in MA, I don't remember my Doc suggesting an amnio at all, but I might have told him early on that I wouldn't be interested. ;o)

26 posted on 08/23/2014 5:24:40 PM PDT by SuziQ
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To: SeekAndFind
The Chinese DO put a different value on life that the West.
They DO think more of male babies and less female babies.

All the PC people in the world can't change those facts. They ARE as different from us (Europeans, the West, whatever) as Mother Theresa and Venus Williams.

27 posted on 08/23/2014 5:51:02 PM PDT by cloudmountain
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To: SuziQ

:)


28 posted on 08/23/2014 6:54:14 PM PDT by yldstrk ( My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: SuziQ

God bless you. Because of the mixture of blood types, I had to undergo them.

No Down babies, although my son and daughter in law birthed one, then adopted another.


29 posted on 08/23/2014 6:56:50 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: SeekAndFind

I certainly hope Dawkins in his later years gets some debilitating illness or disease that makes his life “they are not rational and self-conscious beings. “ ...

So it would morally ok to kill him....

I am sure he would agree.../S


30 posted on 08/23/2014 7:01:17 PM PDT by Popman (Jesus Christ Alone: My Cornerstone...)
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To: metmom

Thanks for the ping!


31 posted on 08/23/2014 7:50:58 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: metmom
With the growing power of the latest version of the National/Socialists (the “Democrats” in America), they, and the “News” Media, have become ever more brazen in their advocacy. Hence, the stench grows stronger as Western Civilization approaches ever closer to the cesspool that is the balance of our World.

Thanks for the beep!

32 posted on 08/24/2014 1:59:43 PM PDT by YHAOS
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