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Hell Has to Be
Archdiocese of Washington ^ | 11-19-17 | Msgr. Charles Pope

Posted on 11/20/2017 7:50:50 AM PST by Salvation

Hell Has to Be

November 19, 2017

This is the eleventh in a series of articles on the Four Last Things: death, judgment, Heaven, and Hell.

Today we come to the final of the Four Last Things: Hell. I have written extensively on this topic over the years, largely in response to the widespread dismissal of the revealed doctrine of Hell. In contradiction to Scripture, many presume that Hell is an unlikely destination for most. Never mind that Jesus taught just the opposite (e.g., Matt 7:13-14). In my own small way, I have tried to keep people more rooted in the sobriety of the Gospel than in the wishful thinking of the modern age. No one warned of Hell more than did Jesus. Arguably, 21 of the 38 parables amount to warnings about Hell and the need to be ready for judgment day. (I have written more on that here: Jesus Who Loves You Warned Frequently of Hell.)

In this post, however, I would like to consider why Hell has to be. Frequently, those who doubt Jesus’ biblical teaching ask this: If God is love, then why is there Hell and why is it eternal?

In short, there is Hell because of God’s respect for our freedom. God has made us free and our freedom is absolutely necessary if we are to love. Suppose that a young man wanted a young lady to love him. Suppose again that he found a magic potion with which to lace her drink. After drinking it, Presto, she “loves” him! Is it real love? No it’s the effect of chemicals. Love must be freely given. The yes of love is only meaningful if we are free to say no. God invites us to love him. There must be a Hell because there has to be a real alternative to Heaven. God will not force us to love Him or to come to Heaven with Him.

But wait a minute; doesn’t everyone want to go to Heaven? Yes, but it is often a “heaven” as they define it, not the real Heaven. Many people understand Heaven egocentrically: It’s a place where they will be happy on their own terms, where what pleases them will be available in abundance. The real Heaven is the Kingdom of God in all its fullness. So while everyone wants to go to a “heaven” as they define it, not everyone wants to live in the Kingdom of God in all its fullness. Consider the following examples:

  1. The Kingdom of God is about mercy and forgiveness. Not everyone wants to show mercy or forgive. Some prefer revenge. Others favor severe justice. Some prefer to cling to their anger and nurse resentments or bigotry. Further, not everyone wants to receive mercy and forgiveness. Some cannot possibly fathom why anyone would need to forgive them since they are right! Recall the second son in the Parable of the Prodigal Son. Instead of entering the feast at the pleading of his father, he refuses to enter because that wretched brother of his is in there. He will not forgive or love his brother as the father does. In so doing, he excludes himself from the feast. Despite his father’s pleading, he will not enter through forgiveness and mercy. The feast is not a feast at all for him. Similarly, Heaven will not be “heaven” for those who refuse the grace to forgive and love their enemies and those who have harmed them.
  2. The Kingdom of God is about chastity. God is very clear with us that His Kingdom values chastity. For the unmarried, this means no genital sexual contact. For the married, this means complete fidelity to each other. Further, things such as pornography, lewd conduct, and immodesty are excluded from the Kingdom. Many people today do not prefer chastity. They would rather be unchaste and immodest. Many celebrate fornication and homosexual acts as a kind of liberation from “repressive” norms. Many people like to consume pornography and do not want to limit their sexual conduct. It is one thing to fail in some of these matters through weakness, but it is quite another to insist that there is nothing wrong with such behavior.
  3. The Kingdom of God is about Liturgy. All of the descriptions of Heaven emphasize liturgy. There are hymns being sung. There is the praise of God. There is standing, sitting, and prostrating at certain times. There are candles, incense, and long robes. There is a scroll or book that is opened, read, and appreciated. There is the Lamb on a throne-like altar. It’s all very much like the Mass—but many are not interested in things like the They stay away because the say it’s “boring.” Perhaps they don’t like the hymns and all the praise. Perhaps the scroll (the Lectionary) and its contents do not interest them or agree with their moral preferences. Having God at the center rather than themselves is unappealing.

The point is this: If Heaven isn’t just of our own design; if Heaven—the real Kingdom of God—is about these things, then doesn’t it seem clear that there actually are many who don’t want to go to Heaven? You see, everyone wants to go to a “heaven” of their own design, but not everyone wants to live in the real Kingdom of Heaven. God will not force any one to live in Heaven if he doesn’t want to live there. He will not force anyone to love Him or what He loves or whom He loves. We are free to choose His Kingdom or not.

Perhaps a brief story will illustrate my point:

I once knew a woman in one of my parishes who in many ways was very devout. She went to daily Mass and prayed the rosary on most days. There was one thing about her, however, that was very troubling: she couldn’t stand African-Americans.

She would often comment to me, “I can’t stand Black people! They’re moving into this neighborhood and ruining everything! I wish they’d go away.” I remember scolding her a number of times for this sort of talk, but it seemed to have seeming effect.

One day I decided to try to make it more clear: “You know you don’t really want to go to Heaven,” I challenged.

“Of course I do, Father,” she replied. “God and the Blessed Mother are there; I want to go.”

“No, you won’t be happy there,” I responded.

“Why?” she asked, “What are you talking about, Father?”

“Well you see there are Black people in Heaven and you’ve said that you can’t stand to be around them, so I’m afraid you wouldn’t be happy there. God won’t force you to live in Heaven if you won’t be happy there. That’s why I think that you don’t really want to go to Heaven.”

I think she got the message because I noticed that her attitude started to improve.

That’s just it, isn’t it? God will not force us to live in the Kingdom if we really don’t want it or like what that Kingdom is. We can’t just invent our own “heaven.” Heaven is a real place. It has contours and realities of its own that we can’t just brush aside. Either we accept Heaven as it is or we ipso facto choose to live apart from it and God. So, Hell has to be. It is not a pleasant place, but I suppose the saddest thing about the souls in Hell is that they wouldn’t be happy in Heaven anyway. It’s a tragic plight, not to be happy anywhere.

Understand this, too: God has not utterly rejected even the souls in Hell. Somehow, He still provides for their basic needs. They continue to exist and thus God continues to sustain them with whatever is required for that existence. He does not annihilate them or snuff them out.

God respects their wish to live apart from the Kingdom and its values. He loves them but respects their choice.

Why is Hell eternal? Here I think we encounter a mystery about ourselves. God seems to be teaching us that there comes a day when our decisions are fixed forever. In this world we always have the possibility of changing our mind so the idea of a permanent decision seems strange to us. Those of us who are older can testify that as we age we get more and more set in our ways; it’s harder and harder to change. Perhaps this is a little foretaste of a time when our decisions will be forever fixed and we will never change. The Fathers of the Church used an image of pottery to teach on this. Think of wet clay on a potter’s wheel. As long as the clay is moist and still on the wheel it can be shaped and reshaped, but once it is put in the kiln, in the fire, its shape is fixed forever. So it is with us that when we appear before God, who is a Holy Fire, our fundamental shape will be forever fixed, our decisions will be final. This is mysterious to us and we only sense it vaguely, but because Heaven and Hell are eternal, it seems that this forever-fixed state is in our future.

This is the best I can do on a difficult topic: Hell has to be. It’s about God’s respect for us. It’s about our freedom and summons to love. It’s about the real Heaven. It’s about what we really want in the end. We know what God wants: to save us. The real judgment in question is what we want.


TOPICS: Apologetics; Catholic; History; Theology
KEYWORDS: catholic; hell
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Video
1 posted on 11/20/2017 7:50:50 AM PST by Salvation
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To: nickcarraway; NYer; ELS; Pyro7480; livius; ArrogantBustard; Catholicguy; RobbyS; marshmallow; ...

Monsignor Pope Ping!


2 posted on 11/20/2017 7:52:17 AM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Salvation

There is an argument—a very convincing one—that Hell is not eternal for only God is eternal. Dualism like that of the Manichees was considered heresy in the day.


3 posted on 11/20/2017 7:56:18 AM PST by aspasia
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To: Salvation

Yep. it’s all covered here:
Jewishnotgreek.com


4 posted on 11/20/2017 7:57:38 AM PST by robroys woman (So you're not confused, I'm male.)
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To: aspasia

Quibbling.

“Eternal” includes more than our awarenes of time time, but from in time it includes all of the past as well as the present and future. The Lake of Fire is still in the future. When it will be occupied even the “past” while it has been occupied will not include eternal past.

Hell can be both forever and still not be eternal.


5 posted on 11/20/2017 8:10:52 AM PST by Rurudyne (Standup Philosopher)
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To: Rurudyne

If hell can be both forever and still not be eternal there’s more than a snowball’s chance in hell!


6 posted on 11/20/2017 8:11:59 AM PST by aspasia
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To: aspasia

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice_XV

Ice 15 also absolutely lacking in magnetism ... so it would be the most unattractive snowball possible.


7 posted on 11/20/2017 8:24:35 AM PST by Rurudyne (Standup Philosopher)
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To: Rurudyne

But look, if that lake is eternal, certainly your damnation doesn’t have to be—unless you’re the devil incarnate.


8 posted on 11/20/2017 8:33:03 AM PST by aspasia
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To: Rurudyne

But look on the bright side: if that lake is eternal, certainly your damnation doesn’t have to be—unless you’re the devil incarnate.


9 posted on 11/20/2017 8:33:25 AM PST by aspasia
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Just as a reminder: She’ol, Haides, Gehenna (also Gai-Hinnom or the Valley of the son of Hinnom in Hebrew, alternately the Valley of Tophet and the Valley of Slaughter) and Tartaros still all have different meanings. Of course, the lake of fire and brimstone (linked in the Bible to Gehenna, which is currently a public park outside Jerusalem) is definitely indicated to be prepared for Satan and his angels, and those humans not found in the Book of Life at the last judgment are going to be thrown into it.
10 posted on 11/20/2017 8:49:38 AM PST by Olog-hai ("No Republican, no matter how liberal, is going to woo a Democratic vote." -- Ronald Reagan, 1960)
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To: aspasia

Are you thinking as man does or are you thinking as God does?


11 posted on 11/20/2017 9:16:38 AM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: aspasia
He speaks to free will and how damnation is a choice, and also how a soul can become set in its ways as the body ages.

Personally, I wonder if the soul requires a body to have free will and thus be able to make choices.

But, once the body dies, it loses its free will and the soul is then fixed, set in its ways, so to speak, as it can no longer change itself.

Because, without the body, there is no free will, and thus no choice and no ability to repent, and thus, no forgiveness for the disembodied soul.

But does that mean eternal damnation? Well...maybe, maybe not. Perhaps the eternal fire of hell is itself a natural purification process that burns away sins.

The sins of a soul are what give it mass and weigh it down, so to speak.

When a sin-free soul is released from its physical body in death, it blasts off to heaven like a rocket being launched into space.

However, the more sin the soul has, the greater the soul’s density or mass or weight, and down, down in hell it sinks to the level of its sin.

However, as the fire burns the sins away, the soul naturally becomes lighter, less dense, and naturally the soul rises higher.

This is not unlike what happens when a soul in a body repents and sins are forgiven, but without a body and a free will to make the choice to repent and seek forgiveness, the sinful soul in hell simply must endure the natural process of being literally being purified by fire for however long that process takes.

Because of the laws of thermal dynamics and how nothing is wasted, I sometimes think that hell is like the furnace/power station that runs the heat and lights for Heaven.

I’ve heard of the great power that is, or that is contained within, a soul and that it is somewhat analogous to the power contained within the atom.

Perhaps hell is naturally hot kinda like a nuclear reactor is hot, due to the great energy of that YUGE concentrated mass of disembodied souls burning away their sins.

Therefore, if there are levels to hell and a soul rises (becomes closer to God) as it becomes less dense, due to its sins burning away, then damnation doesn’t have to be eternal. It just ‘feels’ that way.

12 posted on 11/20/2017 10:26:36 AM PST by GBA (A = 432)
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To: Salvation

Jesus didn’t teach anything on hell. He taught about Gehenna, the proper name of a valley on the S and E of Jerusalem. That proper noun didn’t need translating anymore than Jerusalem or Bethlehem did, and the Roman Catholic church didn’t translate it. In the 16th century, they substituted the word hell for Gehenna. Hell came from a word meaning “cover,” from which our word helmet comes. Farmers used a “hell” to cover their produce so it wouldn’t freeze. The word had no connotation of eternal conscious torment in the spiritual realm.

Comparison of Jesus’ Teaching on Gehenna
vs. Roman Catholicism on Hell

1. Jesus taught that Gehenna was escapable, while Roman Catholicism teaches that Hell is inescapable.

2. Jesus taught only one occurrence of the punishment of Gehenna, while Roman Catholicism teaches Hell is eternal and unending.

3. Jesus taught that the punishment of Gehenna was in only in his generation, while Roman Catholicism teaches it’s for all generations.

4. Jesus taught that the punishment of Gehenna was a physical judgment, while Roman Catholicism teaches Hell is a spiritual judgment.

5. Jesus warned that the punishment of Gehenna was a regional judgment involving people in Judea, while Roman Catholicism teaches Hell is global and universal.

6. Jesus taught that mortal souls, living humans would go to Gehenna, while Roman Catholicism teaches that immortal spirits will go to Hell.

7. Jesus taught that Gehenna would be physical punishment, while Roman Catholicism teaches that spiritual punishing would be carried out on immortal spirits.

8. Jesus taught that the punishment in Gehenna was to avenge martyrs, while Roman Catholicism makes no connection to avenging martyrs in Hell.

9. Jesus taught that Gehenna was to be the end of Old Covenant Israel, while Roman Catholicism teaches nothing about Hell in relation to Old Covenant Israel.

10. Gehenna was known to Moses and the Prophets, the Roman Catholic concept of Hell is unknown to Moses and the Prophets.

11. Gehenna didn’t need translating, Roman Catholicism didn’t translate Gehenna, but substituted Hell for it.

12. There was no eternal conscious torment in Gehenna, like there is in the Roman Catholic concept of Hell.

13. The warnings of punishment in Gehenna originated with Jesus, eternal conscious torment originated in Egypt.

14. The location of Gehenna is well known, the location of Hell in the spiritual realm is unknown.

15. Photographs of Gehenna are readily available, while there are no photographs of Roman Catholicism’s concept of Hell.

16. All of these characteristics of Gehenna are in the Bible, while none of Roman Catholicism’s concept of Hell is in the Bible.

17. Gehenna and Hell are not the same in any way.


13 posted on 11/20/2017 10:47:17 AM PST by FNU LNU (Nothing runs like a Deere, nothing smells like a john)
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To: Salvation

How could you know? Go with Calvin, begin as a man.


14 posted on 11/20/2017 11:11:34 AM PST by aspasia
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To: Salvation; Alex Murphy; bkaycee; boatbums; CynicalBear; daniel1212; dragonblustar; Dutchboy88; ...

One of Msgr Pope’s best ever.


15 posted on 11/20/2017 3:10:56 PM PST by metmom ( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith..)
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To: Salvation
Further, things such as pornography, lewd conduct, and immodesty are excluded from the Kingdom.

I've read something like this...


1 Corinthians 6:9-11

9. Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived:
     Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders
10. nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.
11. And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

16 posted on 11/20/2017 3:22:51 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: aspasia
There is an argument—a very convincing one—that Hell is not eternal for only God is eternal.

Daniel 12:2 niv
Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt.

Somehow; I am not convinced.

17 posted on 11/20/2017 3:25:05 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Olog-hai
...those humans not found in the Book of Life at the last judgment are going to be thrown into it.

I've read something like that...


Exodus 32:32-33
 But now, if you will forgive their sin—but if not, please blot me out of your book that you have written.”  But the Lord said to Moses, “Whoever has sinned against me, I will blot out of my book.
 

Daniel 12:1
 “At that time shall arise Michael, the great prince who has charge of your people. And there shall be a time of trouble, such as never has been since there was a nation till that time. But at that time your people shall be delivered, everyone whose name shall be found written in the book.
 
 
 
Philippians 4:3
 And I intreat thee also, true yokefellow, help those women which laboured with me in the gospel, with Clement also, and with other my fellowlabourers, whose names are in the book of life.
 

Revelation 3:5
He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.
 

Revelation 13:8
And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
 
 
 
Revelation 17:8
 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.
 
 
 
Revelation 20:11-15
"Then I saw a great White Throne and him who was seated on it. Earth and sky fled from his presence, and there was no place for them. And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and THE BOOKS WERE OPENED. Another book was opened WHICH IS THE BOOK OF LIFE. The dead were judged according to their works as recorded in the books. The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to their works.  Then death and Hades were thrown into the Lake of Fire. The Lake of Fire is the second death. If anyone's name was not found written IN THE BOOK OF LIFE, he was thrown into the lake of fire."
 
Revelation 21:27
Nothing impure will ever enter it, nor will anyone who does what is shameful or deceitful, but only those whose names are written in the Lamb’s book of life.

18 posted on 11/20/2017 3:27:27 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: FNU LNU
1. Jesus taught that Gehenna was escapable, while Roman Catholicism teaches that Hell is inescapable.

Oh?

What chapter and verse; if you please.

19 posted on 11/20/2017 3:28:51 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: FNU LNU
1. Jesus taught that Gehenna was escapable...

Off COURSE it is.

As long as you never, ever go there!

20 posted on 11/20/2017 3:29:29 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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