Posted on 12/17/2021 7:31:59 AM PST by The Ignorant Fisherman
The church has always held that Mary was sinless from conception. Show me one historian or church authority writing prior to the onslaught of protestantism that recorded that the church taught otherwise. (Even schismatic Luther held belief in the doctrine of the Immaculate conception!)
Besides, the atonement WAS applied to her prior to conception.
Where in the bible does it say she was born without sin? You won’t find it. The Catholic Church made it up
It is both true and a mystery for us to believe this doctrine. For example, how did her flesh escape the original sin of both her parents? And how did the flesh that became the body of her Son also escape corruption? The Church does not specify how this came about.
However, Anne Catherine Emmerich, in her description of her private revelations written down by Clemans Bretano, describes how when Adam started walk towards Eve to commit Original Sin, God took some of his flesh. This flesh was used by God to bless Abraham and his descendants. Consequently the Jews would not leave Egypt until the Pharaoh released the bones of Joseph to them, who died without passing on the blessing, even enduring 10 different horrible punishments before releasing them. And it also explains why when Jacob stole the blessing from Esau it could not be reversed.
One can be without sin and need a savior. Mary is both. sinless and savable.
what she wasn’t is Catholic.
hehehe.
but she is adored by this Catholic.
why look for fables and myths when our world needs blessings.
Read the 2 genealogies in Mat 1 and Luke 3 and compare. Notice in Matthew that the seed line goes through David to Solomon and goes on till Jeconiah. This same man was called by 2 other names in Scripture. He was also called "Coniah" and "Jehoichin". In Jeremiah 22:30 God was angry with this same man and cursed him. God pronounced that NONE of his descendants would prosper. Being in the line of Jesus would be a problem for him by blood.
Now look at Luke 3:23. We see that Joseph was declared to be the son of Heli. Matthew 1:16 declares Joseph was born of Jacob. God would not recognize Joseph as anything legal in the line of Jesus as he came through Jeconiah who was cursed. So how would Joseph be said to come from Heli, who was actually Mary's father?
Zelophehad is mentioned in Numbers 36 dealing with the problem of a man that was in line to inherit property in the Promised Land but only had daughters and no sons to pass it on to. Moses consulted God and God told him to make a statute found in Numbers 36:6-13. It says that the women can marry who they want as long as they marry within their fathers tribe. When they marry this way, their husbands would be adopted and could hold property for the woman. Joseph would have been cursed according to his relationship to Jechoniah, but when he married Mary, Joseph became legally the son of Heli and could inherit property for her. Joseph couldn't be the blood donor to Jesus due to the curse, but he was the legal father and husband to Mary by adoption. The Holy Spirit supplied the male DNA and Mary provided the egg for Jesus and it could be traced to the line of David on both sides both legally and biologically.
According to Scripture Jesus had to be from the line of David and He qualified through Solomon and Nathan.
Where in the Bible does it say that the Catholic Church made it up?
Are you serious?
What does that imply? In all the OT and NT the Savior came to save. Read Isaiah's prophecy.
I did not say that God had forgotten. Humanity has forgotten, the logical result of the Fall.
We are created to live in loving union with God. That is the plan.
Yes, applying your own logic to your claim.
Mary was never sinless....the only sinless person ever or ever will be is Jesus Christ. She was the birth mother of our Savior. It pretty much stops right there as to anything regarding her divinity which she never had nor does she now.
“For all have sinned and come short of the Glory of God” does not say “all but Mary have sinned”. If it was so, it would SAY so.
She was a virtuous young woman, but not sinless.
Read his passages for yourself and tell me where the heck he derives his premise.
Jesus' earthly father, Joseph, was a carpenter. We know this from the account of when Jesus began teaching in His hometown of Nazareth and His neighbors wondered at His abilities.
Matthew 13:54–55 says, "Coming to his hometown [Jesus] taught them in their synagogue, so that they were astonished, and said, 'Where did this man get this wisdom and these mighty works? Is not this the carpenter's son? Is not his mother called Mary? And are not his brothers James and Joseph and Simon and Judas?'"
In Mark's Gospel, a bit of different language appears to describe this same encounter: "'Is not this the carpenter, the son of Mary and brother of James and Joses and Judas and Simon? And are not his sisters here with us?' And they took offense at him" (Mark 6:3).
The word in both accounts that is translated "carpenter," could also mean builder or handyman. So it is possible that "carpenters" were the type of people you called when something needed to be fixed, whether made of wood, stone, or some other material. It is also possible a "carpenter" functioned as a type of civil engineer, possibly even designing bridges or other structures. We don't know for sure that Jesus was trained as a carpenter by Joseph, but it was common practice at that time and at that place.
How amazing to think that Jesus—the creator of the universe, our Savior and Lord, the Word of God, the Son of God—was taught to build things with the very materials He spoke into existence. How even more amazing that He is currently building His church (Matthew 16:18) and preparing a place for all who put their faith in Him (John 14:1–3).
Adam and Eve? Everyone in heaven, since God cannot look on sin?
I think you understood the post clearly.
Quote
I just reviewed Luke 2:22-24 and Leviticus 12:1-8. This guy is full of Adam Shiff. How the author
believes that these these two passages have anything to do with Mary is beyond logic.
Leviticus 12 deals with the time the Woman was to be in her blood after giving birth.
For a total of 40 days for Mary because Jesus was a firstborn male..
And there was an offering that she was to bring to the temple,along with her firstborn son, when the days of her purifying were complete.
It is written the offering at that time was to make atonement for her..
That’s exactly what is being described in Luke 2.
According to the law..
That day that Mary brought her firstborn son to the temple was 40 days from His birth..
Luke 2 and Leviticus 12 are talking about the exact same thing.
What it doesn’t say in Leviticus 12, is that the Father has one day,once a year, where people were to fast night and day, afflicting themselves.
It just so happens there is a reference to that day in Luke. With Anna the Prophetess fasting and praying night and day,on the same day 40 day old Jesus is presented in the temple.
40 days before that day would be a summer day/night that Jesus would have been born.
Today, that is commemorated on Groundhog day, which is 40 days from December 25.
Luke 2 and Leviticus 12 absolutely tie together.
As December 25 and 40 days later, Groundhog day tie together.
As the Father’s New Moon Day in His 6th month and 40 days later, the Father’s Day of Atonement, the 10th day of His 7th month with Simeon and Anna the Prophetess, tie together..
According to you, it doesn’t work that way.
Where in the bible does it say that the bible is the Christian Owner’s Manual, and that if it isn’t there, it isn’t real?
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