Posted on 04/09/2023 9:10:17 PM PDT by SeekAndFind
The average English-speaking person living in America in the 1700s was certainly better educated than just about anyone educated in America in the last 75 years.
We have fallen a long way. But we still have not hit bottom.
Not sure I agree with the conclusion put forth by the writer. Because I have read the Declaration of Independence and the tenor of it seems much less convincing than all the supposed supporting arguments this article advances.
In fact, my reading of the Declaration of Independence makes me a bit suspicious of how little of this article was devoted to examining the language found therein.
I would suggest that each person here go and read the Declaration of Independence with a fresh and open mind. It is full of big talk, for sure. And I am not convinced about this “defensive war” posture.
OTOH - George Washington was a real genius in so many ways. And even with him, it is difficult to look at the defeat of the British without seeing the Hand of God in the events and outcome.
Paul could not imagine a Stalin?
Hold on a minute.
Paul would have been quite aware of the murders committed by numerous foreign invaders. Ashurbanipal was the last great king of Assyria; take a look at what he did during his 38-year reign.
But there were many other totally murderous despots before the time of Paul.
A Stalin was totally comprehensible to people living in the first century AD.
Second Amendment is a thing. Those preachers usually aren’t Bible-believers themselves.
Yeah ok, I do see your point. But I have a hard time believing Paul was advising that the people in the USSR should willfully submit to the whims of someone like that.
But I doubt Paul encountered someone who murdered in the tens of millions. The barbarian Tamerlane probably did, but who knows if Paul was aware of him. But he certainly knew of despots. Good point.
I noticed that maybe 30 years ago. There are those who try to put it in a different light that what I see on the printed page.
It is a small problem in the whole scheme and does not seem to bear on the Gospel and the salvation message. But it is an interesting thing for Paul to have written.
John MacArthur acknowledged that he was disobeying the government.
He made it very clear that he was obeying God and that Christians are instructed (ordered? told by God? like in the Bible? Letter to the Hebrews?) to gather together for worship and instruction.
So please get over your upset-ness about this.
I would suggest reading the text, and believing what it plainly says.
bingo
It’s basically a heresy to hold the words of Paul as carrying all the weight of the words of Jesus. It’s silly to give him more weight than any of the other gospels.
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Ironically enough, that smacks a bit of ... heresy. Well, some would call it heresy.
Well, this thread has been quite lively.
My first thought, too.
When it affected HIM, he changed.
To a large degree you are correct. Many of them come from denominational backgrounds that tossed scripture out tge backdoor years ago, although I know of one individual in a very conservative bible believing bavmcground who believes our American Revolution was a sin against God and he hangs his justification ohlf tgat coclusion squarely upon Romans 13.
To a large degree you are correct. Many of them come from denominational backgrounds that tossed scripture out tge backdoor years ago, although I know of one individual in a very conservative bible believing bavmcground who believes our American Revolution was a sin against God and he hangs his justification ohlf tgat coclusion squarely upon Romans 13.
Then go to the linked page I provided.
In the US we don’t have rulers. We are a government of the people by the people
That is mere sophistry. A government of the people by the people means they elect rulers. Otherwise you have no govern-ment. And once you elect government, you are obligated to obey it, aside from instances of requiring disobedience to God, as long as government exists which enforces laws.
Which is in line with what I said, but not "ought" but conditionally must, as much as I disagree with so many of the excessive regs which I try to obey.
So one might consider whether Hitler was a lawful superior. His claim to power was actually very tenuous and based on forcibly intimidating an elected legislature into making him dictator. He never won a free and fair election.
Regardless. "there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God." (Romans 13:1) God allowed him to be in power as a test, but you still had to conditionally obey his government as Christians did the Romans and must do today toward Muslim dictators and Communists. You normally keep their speed limits etc. as here but save condemned babies as the noble Egyptian midwives did in disobedience to Pharaoh's command. And the NT church did in preaching its evangelical gospel.
One might similarly consider whether a law requiring one to turn in specific weapons or parts (e.g., "large capacity" magazines) is within the government's competence, since it strikes directly at the right of self-defense, which is a natural right of man.
It would depend on degrees, and excessive regs such must be challenged. Here automatic knives having a blade longer than one and a half (1 ½) inches, a knife with a double-edged blade, or device which enables a knife with a locking blade to be drawn at a locked position are illegal to carry in public. We were just told that we are supposed to recycle clothes, a 3 step process costs tax payers money (though since wet or dirty clothes are exempted, then there is an out). Every 5 years the gov. is sppsd to do (and usually does) a "habitability" check of all rented apartments (aside from relatives - whatever that means today) which includes checking the grounding of outlets and leaky faucets.
I guess I am somewhat a libertarian.
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