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Luther, Calvin, and Other Early Protestants on the Perpetual Virginity of Mary
http://ic.net/~erasmus/RAZ460.HTM ^ | Dave Armstrong compiles quotes from Martin Luther, John Calvin, et al.,

Posted on 06/24/2003 3:49:56 PM PDT by Patrick Madrid

Amidst all the stimulating discussion here about the Catholic doctrine of Mary's perpetual virginity, it ocurred to me that it would be instructive to point out that both Martin Luther and John Calvin -- the progenitors of two of the three major branches of the Protestant Reformation -- both held firmly to this Catholic teaching. For your consideration, let me add here some pertinent quotes from these two Protestant leaders.

I'd respectfully ask our Evangelical and Fundamentalist friends here to think carefully about these quotes and consider just how far modern-day Protestantism has drifted from its 16th-century moorings, not to mention how very far it has drifted from the fifteen centuries of the Catholic Faith that preceded the Protestant Reformation.

— Patrick Madrid

Luther, Calvin, and Other Early Protestants  on the Perpetual Virginity of Mary

All of the early Protestant Founders accepted the truth of the Perpetual Virginity of Mary. How could this be, if it is merely "tradition" with no scriptural basis? Why was its supposed violation of Scripture not so obvious to them, as it is to the Protestants of the last 150 years or so (since the onset of theological liberalism) who have ditched this previously-held opinion? Yet it has become fashionable to believe that Jesus had blood brothers (I suspect, because this contradicts Catholic teaching), contrary to the original consensus of the early Protestants.

Let's see what the Founders of Protestantism taught about this doctrine. If Catholics are so entrenched in what has been described as "silly," "desperate," "obviously false," "unbiblical tradition" here, then so are many Protestant luminaries such as Luther, Calvin, and Wesley. Strangely enough, however, current-day Protestant critics of Catholicism rarely aim criticism at them. I guess the same "errors" are egregious to a different degree, depending on who accepts and promulgates them -- sort of like the Orwellian proverb from Animal Farm: "all people are equal, but some are more equal than others."

General

{Max Thurian (Protestant), Mary: Mother of all Christians, tr. Neville B. Cryer, NY: Herder & Herder, 1963 (orig. 1962), pp. 77, 197}{Raymond E. Brown et al, ed., Mary in the New Testament, Phil.: Fortress Press / NY: Paulist Press, 1978, p.65 (a joint Catholic-Protestant effort) }{J.A. Ross MacKenzie (Protestant), in Stacpoole, Alberic, ed., Mary's Place in Christian Dialogue, Wilton, Conn.: Morehouse-Barlow, 1982, pp.35-6}

Martin Luther

{Luther's Works, eds. Jaroslav Pelikan (vols. 1-30) & Helmut T. Lehmann (vols. 31-55), St. Louis: Concordia Pub. House (vols. 1-30); Philadelphia: Fortress Press (vols. 31-55), 1955, v.22:23 / Sermons on John, chaps. 1-4 (1539) }{Pelikan, ibid., v.22:214-15 / Sermons on John, chaps. 1-4 (1539) }{Pelikan, ibid.,v.45:199 / That Jesus Christ was Born a Jew (1523) }{Pelikan, ibid.,v.45:206,212-3 / That Jesus Christ was Born a Jew (1523) }

Editor Jaroslav Pelikan (Lutheran) adds:

{Pelikan, ibid.,v.22:214-5}

John Calvin

{Harmony of Matthew, Mark & Luke, sec. 39 (Geneva, 1562), vol. 2 / From Calvin's Commentaries, tr. William Pringle, Grand Rapids, MI: Eerdmans, 1949, p.215; on Matthew 13:55}{Pringle, ibid., vol. I, p. 107}{Pringle, ibid., vol. I, p. 283 / Commentary on John, (7:3) }

Huldreich Zwingli

{G. R. Potter, Zwingli, London: Cambridge Univ. Press, 1976, pp.88-9,395 / The Perpetual Virginity of Mary . . ., Sep. 17, 1522}{Thurian, ibid., p.76}{Thurian, ibid., p.76 / same sermon}

Heinrich Bullinger

{In Hilda Graef, Mary: A History of Doctrine and Devotion, combined ed. of vols. 1 & 2, London: Sheed & Ward, 1965, vol.2, pp.14-5}

John Wesley (Founder of Methodism)

I believe... he [Jesus Christ] was born of the blessed Virgin, who, as well after as she
 brought him forth, continued a pure and unspotted virgin.
{"Letter to a Roman Catholic," quoted in A. C. Coulter, John Wesley, New York: Oxford University Press, 1964, 495}

  Main Index & Search | The Blessed Virgin Mary | Protestantism

Uploaded by Dave Armstrong on 27 January 2002.


TOPICS: Apologetics; Catholic; Charismatic Christian; Ecumenism; Evangelical Christian; General Discusssion; History; Mainline Protestant; Orthodox Christian; Other Christian; Religion & Culture; Theology
KEYWORDS: apologetics; bible; catholic; catholicism; christianity; mary; protestant; protestantism; scripture; tradition; virginity
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1 posted on 06/24/2003 3:49:56 PM PDT by Patrick Madrid
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To: Patrick Madrid
Unconvincing. These men were just as fallible as we are today. There are many others who would disagree with them, then and now. You have nothing but fallible human beings carrying on a "tradition"...a tradition that is not universally agreed to.
2 posted on 06/24/2003 4:18:29 PM PDT by LiteKeeper
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To: LiteKeeper
Unconvincing. That's just your fallible human opinion. there are many others who would disagree with you. Sorry, you score no points with that "argument."
3 posted on 06/24/2003 4:32:58 PM PDT by Patrick Madrid
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To: Patrick Madrid
It seems to me that the honest response from the Sola Scriptura crowd should be that scripture is either silent on the issue or supportive of the Catholic position.

To cling to the position that Mary was not ever-virgin, without solid scriputral basis, reveals the real agenda -- not to uphold scripture, but rather to challenge all things considered Catholic.
4 posted on 06/24/2003 4:57:05 PM PDT by el_chupacabra (AMDG)
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To: el_chupacabra
I agree. And as I pointed out in an earlier post on the "Fr. Ron Tacelli Article" thread, Scripture is silent on this issue, in terms of an explicit statement saying either that Mary had other children besides Christ or that she did not have other children besides Christ.

The fact is, as even Protestant leaders such as Martin Luther and John Calvin (no friends of Catholicism) readily recognized and admitted, the historic Christian teaching on this issue was that Mary remained a perpetual virgin.

Since the sola scriptura mindset cannot possibly resolve this issue, it is eminently reasonable to consider what the early Christians in the first several centuries of Christianity believed and taught about Mary's virginity. You will find -- and I'd be happy to post examples to corroborate this, if anyone wants to see them -- that orthodox Christian belief in Mary's perpetual virginity was both ubiquitous and continuous during those first fifteen centuries. I respectfully suggest that that is a fact our Protestant friends should ponder carefully and prayerfully.
5 posted on 06/24/2003 5:05:50 PM PDT by Patrick Madrid
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To: Patrick Madrid
You guys aren't obsessed with Mary are you. No not a bit.
6 posted on 06/24/2003 5:06:38 PM PDT by DManA
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To: DManA
Obsessed? No. At least no moreso than Martin Luther or John Calvin. And let's not forget that Catholic marian teachings are at the forefront of the arguments consistently raised by Protestant critics of the Catholic Church. So, since it always seems to get around to Mary in these discussions, why do you flinch when Catholics bring her up first? Is there an unspoken double standard at work here perhaps?
7 posted on 06/24/2003 5:09:30 PM PDT by Patrick Madrid
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To: Patrick Madrid
As you can glimpse in the writings of Luther and Calvin, the radical wing of the Reformation never honored Mary. But it has little to do with what is in the Bible. Rather it has to do with their dogmatic rejection of Catholicism.
8 posted on 06/24/2003 5:17:42 PM PDT by RobbyS
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To: Patrick Madrid; nickcarraway; Salvation
Bump!
9 posted on 06/24/2003 5:35:42 PM PDT by Canticle_of_Deborah
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To: Patrick Madrid
Is this more appropriately posted on the Neverending Story thread? It is where Calvinists and Catholics engage in debate and Apologetics is advanced. Jim Robinson seems to have it particularly for that purpose. Just noting fyi. V's wife.
10 posted on 06/24/2003 6:09:31 PM PDT by ventana
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To: ventana
A lot of us don't go over to the NES thread. I like having this type of thing out on the main forum periodically, especially for lurkers.
11 posted on 06/24/2003 6:19:02 PM PDT by Canticle_of_Deborah
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To: Canticle_of_Deborah
I see your point. I respect Jim's preferences for the use of his site and wouldn't want to compromise the Religion section where so many fine Catholic as well as other religious information is posted. It's edifying. I guess JR will let it be know how much bandwith apologetics is furnished herein. V's wife.
12 posted on 06/24/2003 6:45:28 PM PDT by ventana
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To: LiteKeeper
These men were just as fallible as we are today.

Hmmmm ... I must make a decision! Shall I follow a self-admittedly fallible set of beliefs termed Protestantism, or a self-admittedly infallible set of beliefs termed Catholicism?

If I follow Protestantism, I'm likely to be wrong. Therefore, it shouldn't matter to stay a Catholic, since even though Protestants think me wrong, they think themselves wrong too. At worst, we are all wrong together, just on different things, and God will forgive us of the blessed muddle. At best though, we Catholics are right, and Protestants are in for a tough surprise at the judgement.

So no matter who is right, there is no harm in being a Catholic, but if Catholics are right, being a Protestant would be deadly.

13 posted on 06/24/2003 7:53:27 PM PDT by Hermann the Cherusker
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To: Hermann the Cherusker
Pascal would be proud of you ;)
14 posted on 06/24/2003 8:03:40 PM PDT by Patrick Madrid
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To: Patrick Madrid
historic Christian teaching on this issue was that Mary remained a perpetual virgin

And that would, indeed, be fact.

15 posted on 06/24/2003 8:04:53 PM PDT by MarMema
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To: Hermann the Cherusker
I am not one of them, but I know some protestants who think Catholics are not going to Heaven. They say Catholics are trying to work their way into Heaven and have not asked Jesus to forgive their sins. I am offended when either a CAtholic or Protestant claims only they are going to Heaven.
16 posted on 06/24/2003 9:05:39 PM PDT by ACAC
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To: Patrick Madrid
Bookmarking
17 posted on 06/24/2003 9:22:14 PM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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To: Patrick Madrid
**That's just your fallible human opinion.**

18 posted on 06/24/2003 9:22:53 PM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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To: Patrick Madrid
BUMP
19 posted on 06/24/2003 10:22:19 PM PDT by nickcarraway
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To: Hermann the Cherusker; american colleen; sinkspur; Lady In Blue; Salvation; Polycarp; narses; ...
even though Protestants think me wrong, they think themselves wrong too

Pinging the troops ... both camps! I'll put on the first pot of coffee.

20 posted on 06/25/2003 1:47:42 AM PDT by NYer (Laudate Dominum)
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