Inward purity & outward dress -- Does it matter how we dress for worship?

The Prayer Book Society of the USA ^ | September 2, 2003 | The Rev'd Dr. Peter Toon

[nobdysfool]

In reality, outward dress and inward reverence and respect are not the same thing. Outward dress does not guarantee or even indicate true reverence and respect. God looks on the heart. Reverence and respect is not something you can buy at Wal-Mart or even the most exclusive men's or women's clothiers. It comes from the heart, if it's there at all. If it's not there, clothing will not change that. I think the proper guidance would be to encourage people to sincerely ask God to direct them in their choice of attire, and to go no further than insisting that modesty and respect for others must be included in the choices made, out of respect for others.

[hiho hiho]

--Litmus test: If they sing "Just As I Am" in church, they
--shouldn't be imposing or even thinking about a dress code
--that discriminates against rural folks and farmers.


I have to wonder if anyone read the original post!! Who said anything about “imposing” a “dress code”? Now the word “discriminates” is thrown in -- you would think that this is a liberal group!

The point is to wear your best, just like you would if you had an audience with GW Bush, QE II, or the Pope! This is an internal thing that YOU do to show YOUR respect for someone greater than YOURSELF! Where in the world did some of you think that this was a move to impose a dress code on OTHERS?!

Now, “Just As I Am” refers to your starting point, it does not mean that you can continue to wallow in sin.

[CCWoody]

Ping! (Isaiah 52:14)

Woody.

[drstevej]

***The point is to wear your best, just like you would if you had an audience with GW Bush, QE II, or the Pope! This is an internal thing that YOU do to show YOUR respect for someone greater than YOURSELF! ***

Ping to post #2.

Should I quit worshipping in the tub ???

[hiho hiho]

---ould I quit worshipping in the tub ???

PUBLIC WORSHIP

PRIVATE WORSHIP

Different beasts!

[hiho hiho]

What is it with boomers (I am one) and their jeans? One would think someone was taking away their MTV. Personally I have not worn jeans in public for over 25 years -- I want no association with my generation by wearing “the uniform“.

This topic has to do with how one approaches their Creator. I think of the generations of humans fearful to utter his name (thus losing the pronunciation). Now I read about chairs in churches with cup holders for espresso. Have kneelers been replaced with foot rests yet?

[Gamecock]

Hi brother More,

we shouldn't broad-brush everyone with the same paint

That is what I was getting at.

But we should first worry about the persons soul before how they are dressed. If people are coming to church with thongs showing, I suspect there is a bigger problem than their dress. Their problem is something a dress code won't fix.

BTW, I wear a tie each week, a loud tie, a tie that blinds the preacher.

[Gamecock]

***Have kneelers been replaced...***

What's a kneeler? ;-)

[jude24]

The point is to wear your best, just like you would if you had an audience with GW Bush, QE II, or the Pope! This is an internal thing that YOU do to show YOUR respect for someone greater than YOURSELF! Where in the world did some of you think that this was a move to impose a dress code on OTHERS?!

See, I don't buy this line. If I were to go visit GWB, or some other potentate, I would wear a suit and tie because that is what our culture expects.

But at church, where did the suit and tie idea come from? It's decidedly not biblical in origin, but rather cultural. "Sunday best" was not about piety, but rather showing off to the community.

James has a lot to say about those who make judgment based on the quality of someone's clothing -- its personal favoritism, damn hypocrisy.

More than a few evil men wore suits and ties to church.

Now, I am explicitly assuming we're not talking about issues of modesty.

[nobdysfool]

I have to wonder if anyone read the original post!! Who said anything about “imposing” a “dress code”? Now the word “discriminates” is thrown in -- you would think that this is a liberal group! The point is to wear your best, just like you would if you had an audience with GW Bush, QE II, or the Pope! This is an internal thing that YOU do to show YOUR respect for someone greater than YOURSELF! Where in the world did some of you think that this was a move to impose a dress code on OTHERS?! Now, “Just As I Am” refers to your starting point, it does not mean that you can continue to wallow in sin.

I think you missed the fact that I was joking a little...I wasn't as serious as you seem to be taking it. Maybe it wasn't as obvious as I thought it was. I am not arguing against the thrust of the article, but was more directly addressing the post to which I repied, and the situation of the people where it sometimes came down to a choice between going in whatever clothes they had on, or not going because they didn't have time to change. In a situation like that, I will come down on the side of going in what they're dressed in every time. It's more important to be there than to worry about how they're dressed, IMHO.

[drstevej]

***Different beasts! ***

If you principle of 'an audience with the King' is valid shouldn't I dress in my Sunday best for tub worship time? Is He less of a King in my bathroom?

[ThomasMore]

But we should first worry about the persons soul

If this is not our primary function then we better move on to something else!

BTW, I wear a tie each week, a loud tie, a tie that blinds the preacher.

LOL!

I'm relatively conservative in dress. Black slacks and either a white or black shirt. No tie. They get in the way of the Alb. :)

[malakhi]

More than a few evil men wore suits and ties to church.

[Between the Lines]

This was not my testimony but that of my wife. Someday when it pertains to the subject I will share mine as well. My wife will be thrilled that you enjoyed it and I know that she would want to say "thank you" for letting her share God's work in her life with you. Thank you and God bless.

[k omalley]

"Is He less of a King in my bathroom?"

He is still King in your bathroom but you have invited Him to be present during your bath. We are guests at His house when we go to church.
Please Steve, don't take a bath during worship at your church, your parishoners will be horrified.

[Between the Lines]

Litmus test: If they sing "Just As I Am" in church, they shouldn't be imposing or even thinking about a dress code that discriminates against rural folks and farmers.

Our church uses the song "Heart of Worship" somewhat as an unofficial theme song. I think that more churches should sing it.

Chorus:

I'm coming back to the heart of worhip
And it's all about You
It's all about You, Jesus
I'm sorry, Lord, for the thing I've made it
When it's all about You
It's all about You, Jesus

Lyrics to "Heart of Worship"

[Between the Lines]

PUBLIC WORSHIP
PRIVATE WORSHIP
Different beasts!

Interesting choice of words.

[RnMomof7]

It's my belief that God doesn't care if I'm wearing designer dresses or nice business casual-like clothes. If I were being immodest or obscene, that would be a problem. I'm not sure how I feel about shorts in church...something to think about.

Actually God probably does not care much what you wear. But the admonition not to case a brother too fall should be noted here.

I went to a church for several years that had a dress code for the women on the ministry team (not the men) . It seems that in the past a young woman that was singing wore micro mini shirts and showed a bit of midriff . A young man from the congregation told the pastor that he was having a difficult time not having impure thoughts. So the rule was set .. no short skirts and no bare midriffs .

[Between the Lines]

Isaiah 52:14

Very appropriate. Thank you.

[Between the Lines]

James has a lot to say about those who make judgment based on the quality of someone's clothing -- its personal favoritism, damn hypocrisy.

Worth Posting.

James 2
1My brothers, as believers in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ, don't show favoritism. 2Suppose a man comes into your meeting wearing a gold ring and fine clothes, and a poor man in shabby clothes also comes in. 3If you show special attention to the man wearing fine clothes and say, "Here's a good seat for you," but say to the poor man, "You stand there" or "Sit on the floor by my feet," 4have you not discriminated among yourselves and become judges with evil thoughts? 5Listen, my dear brothers: Has not God chosen those who are poor in the eyes of the world to be rich in faith and to inherit the kingdom he promised those who love him? 6But you have insulted the poor. Is it not the rich who are exploiting you? Are they not the ones who are dragging you into court? 7Are they not the ones who are slandering the noble name of him to whom you belong? 8If you really keep the royal law found in Scripture, "Love your neighbor as yourself," you are doing right. 9But if you show favoritism, you sin and are convicted by the law as lawbreakers.