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Neoconservatism, not libertarianism, is the true aberration on the American Right
Charleston City Paper ^ | 2010-04-07 | Jack Hunter aka Southern Avenger

Posted on 04/08/2010 9:27:19 AM PDT by rabscuttle385

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To: rabscuttle385
The Paulistineans have more in common with the Old Right on foreign policy than the New Right (their hostility to foreign adventurism rooted in Washington's farewell address). The Old Right (think Robert Taft, Robert Rutherford McCormick, etc) were for high tariffs as well as stricter immigration laws. They were also, however, strongly supportive of a free and open markets internally (at a time when interstate banking laws were nearly in conflict with the ICC), and were staunch defenders of the gold standard.

Interestingly enough, the figure who Ron Paul most resembles is the late Nebraska congressman Howard Buffet, who was the father of a certain billionaire we all know.

81 posted on 04/08/2010 11:43:21 AM PDT by Clemenza (Remember our Korean War Veterans)
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To: ChrisInAR

Society has deemed alcohol and cigarettes legal.


82 posted on 04/08/2010 11:44:06 AM PDT by rbmillerjr (Let hot tar wash their throats and may it flow freely.)
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To: rbmillerjr
"Society" is a bad way to shape one's values. Society in Hungary, for example, once made it "socially acceptable" to kill gypsies. I was told by older relatives as a youth that interracial dating wasn't "socially acceptable" and should be avoided.

I favor the maximization of liberty to the extent that it does not infringe on the liberty or privacy of others. As an example, if someone wants to accept money for sex within the confines of their own home, that should be legal (and happens all the time). When they ply their trade in public, attracting deviants and traffic to residential areas, then the law should step in.

83 posted on 04/08/2010 11:47:00 AM PDT by Clemenza (Remember our Korean War Veterans)
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To: rbmillerjr

Dope is against the law for good reason?

Okay, nobody has answered yet... where in the Constitution is Congress authorized to regulate the use of drugs?


84 posted on 04/08/2010 11:47:54 AM PDT by daniel885
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To: rbmillerjr
And losers should be able to experience the folly of their choices.

What should not happen is dirtbags like you putting a government gun in their face because you think they are "losers".

Nature will put an end to those who refuse to take care of themselves. No need for police state thug tactics to keep them from it.

85 posted on 04/08/2010 11:48:02 AM PDT by Dead Corpse (III, Oathkeeper)
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To: ChrisInAR
If you want a decent essay on libertarianism, read this pamphlet that was written in 1850 by a man that libertarians & strict constitutions like myself hold in high refard:

Yes. The great Bastait. Libertarianism used to mean something noble, just as Liberalism did back in the 18th century. Milton Friedman and Frederich Hayek called themselves Liberals.

But Liberalism and Libertarianism are no longer like that today. Today's liberalism is neo Communism and today's Libertarianism is just bizarre. We might leave the words Liberal and Libertarianism to their new owners and feel a tinge of sadness for what those words used to stand for.

86 posted on 04/08/2010 11:49:49 AM PDT by Stepan12 (Palin & Bolton in 2012)
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To: rbmillerjr
Society has deemed alcohol and cigarettes legal.

So conservatives now believe that the majority can just tell the rest of the folks how to live their lives? It just "deems" it so, huh? Then you must see no constitutional problem with health care because society has deemed that you should buy health insurance whether you want it or not? THIS IS CONSERVATISM???
87 posted on 04/08/2010 11:50:31 AM PDT by daniel885
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To: rbmillerjr
When you find a "dopehead" hiding behind that argument, then you'd have a point.

I find it amusing that someone who espouses a belief in "limited government" is also advocating for one of the biggest extra-Constitutional expansions of Federal power ever. Namely, the war on "some" drugs.

Looks like you could use this link as well.

88 posted on 04/08/2010 11:50:39 AM PDT by Dead Corpse (III, Oathkeeper)
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To: rabscuttle385

Answer this to resolve the question. Was it the neo-cons or the libertarians that drove the GOP to election destruction? Who drove the GOP car over the cliff Wolfowitz or Paul?


89 posted on 04/08/2010 11:57:03 AM PDT by ex-snook ("Above all things, truth beareth away the victory.")
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To: rbmillerjr

“Society” is in the process of doing the same thing for marijuana (for a 2nd time, in fact).

It was the Progressive Movement back in the early 20th Century that we can thank for the Prohibitionist mindset of making such things illegal.


90 posted on 04/08/2010 11:58:36 AM PDT by ChrisInAR (Alright, tighten your shorts, Pilgrim, & sing like the Duke!)
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To: daniel885

“So conservatives now believe that the majority can just tell the rest of the folks how to live their lives?”

You live in a Constitutional Republic. The people are represented by the people they elect.

Through this not so novel concept, we have illegal drugs.

We don’t get to choose which laws we will obey and which we will not. Well, just don’t get caught.

So, you liberaltarians now want to pick and choose which laws you obey, kind of like illegal immigrants and common criminals.


91 posted on 04/08/2010 11:58:46 AM PDT by rbmillerjr (Let hot tar wash their throats and may it flow freely.)
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To: Stepan12
Libertarians are dope smoking hippies with a few right wing bounces. I'm sure that many supporters of Lenin did not believe in Cheka terror, war Communism, and the brutal supression at Kronstadt, they simply wanted the "land, bread, and peace" that Lenin preached.

Likewise, I'm sure that many Nazis were not so keen (at first) on putting Jews in gas chambers, they just wanted the humiliation of the Versaille treaty to be gone; however, it is the ideas of the leaders Lenin, Hitler; etc., that determine a party's movement, not some of its more naive followers.


What the heck? Libertarianism, the true conservatism, believes in limited government and free markets and somehow you compare that to socialism and fascism. Those ideologies relied on government control... so I hate to break it to you buddy but your distorted form of conservatism is much closer to those political ideologies than mine.
92 posted on 04/08/2010 12:00:12 PM PDT by daniel885
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To: Stepan12
No, I used to be a card-carrying member od the Libertarian Party, & I think they still hold true to the beliefs of Bastiat -- MUCH more than the current GOP ever would. They might do it w/o any spoken reverence to God, but their principles are similar.
93 posted on 04/08/2010 12:03:06 PM PDT by ChrisInAR (Alright, tighten your shorts, Pilgrim, & sing like the Duke!)
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To: rbmillerjr
The people are represented by the people they elect.

And those representatives take an oath to live by certain limitations laid out in the Constitution.

None of those limitations allow for drug prohibition.

Epic Constitution fail on your part.

94 posted on 04/08/2010 12:19:29 PM PDT by Dead Corpse (III, Oathkeeper)
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To: Daveinyork

Good post.


95 posted on 04/08/2010 12:24:05 PM PDT by gogogodzilla (Live free or die!)
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To: OkiMusashi

Here’s a name for you:

David Horowitz
http://frontpagemag.com/

Was a liberal, became a conservative. Believes in a strong US military and the will to use it to advance US interests.

Most of his articles are about spread of Islamic fascism.


96 posted on 04/08/2010 12:27:45 PM PDT by gogogodzilla (Live free or die!)
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To: rbmillerjr
You live in a Constitutional Republic. The people are represented by the people they elect.

Through this not so novel concept, we have illegal drugs.

We don’t get to choose which laws we will obey and which we will not. Well, just don’t get caught.

So, you liberaltarians now want to pick and choose which laws you obey, kind of like illegal immigrants and common criminals.


Right, we live in a Constitutional Republic. The Constitution doesn't give Congress the power to regulate drugs.

I don't want to disobey the law. (I don't use drugs anyway). I want unconstitutional laws repealed simply because I believe in the Constitution.
97 posted on 04/08/2010 12:28:49 PM PDT by daniel885
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To: All

Liberaltarians in no shape or disguise resemble Reagan conservatism.

Modern conservatism will be shaped by Reagan conservatism until a new winning coalition is formed. Note that Reagan accepted libertarians as part of that coalition but didn’t not accept Libertarianism on its own.

The three pillars of R Conservatism are:

1. Limited govt...low tax, lower spending

2. Peace through Strength, strong defense and foreign policy

3. Social Conservatism: Pro Life, Pro Family, basic agreed upon morality. Strong on crime etc.

Modern libertarians have three courses of #1 and skip 2 and 3.

Too bastardize the libertarian beliefs into “real conservatism” or “real” limited govt or “real” Constitutional government is a lie. It will not work btw.

Since Reagan, the coalition of the above pillars included libertarians. The new breed of libertarians have absolutely radicalized themselves and alienated themselves away from the conservative Reagan coalition.


98 posted on 04/08/2010 12:32:04 PM PDT by rbmillerjr (Let hot tar wash their throats and may it flow freely.)
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To: HangnJudge

Dang, I took the test and it came out like this:


The Quiz

The following are your scores. They are based on a gradual range of 0 to 12. For instance, a Conservative/Progressive score of 3 and 0 will both yield a result of social conservative, yet 0 would be an extreme conservative and 3 a moderate conservative

Conservative/Progressive score: 3
You are a social conservative. You believe in traditional values, and care first and foremost about your country, your family, and your religion. You dislike the agenda of the left because you see them as trying to destroy these things.

Capitalist Purist/Social Capitalist score: 1
You’re a Capitalist Purist. You believe that the market should be completely free, and that the invisible hand of the market will make sure that the people get what they want and will do it in the most efficient way possible. You believe in small government, less taxes, and more privatization.

Libertarian/Authoritarian score: 0
You are libertarian. You think that the government is making way too many unnecessary laws that are taking away our innate rights. You believe that the government’s job is primarily to protect people from harming other people, but after that they should mind their own business, and if we give the government too much power in controlling our lives, it can lead to fascism.

Pacifist/Militarist score: 9
You’re a Militarist. You believe that since the United States has so much power in the world, it has a responsibility to keep the world safe. You think that if the US does not exert its power in the world, it may eventually lose its power, and that we can not look weak in the face of terrorists, and must take them out where they live.

Overall, you would most likely fit into the category of Hardcore Libertarian


99 posted on 04/08/2010 12:34:29 PM PDT by gogogodzilla (Live free or die!)
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To: Dead Corpse

“None of those limitations allow for drug prohibition. Epic Constitution fail on your part.”
You live in a fantasy world. I don’t see Con..Lawyers winning these cases since back in the heyday of drugs in the 60s.

There is the theoretical Constitution that you think exists in reality but does not.

Have a cup of coffee and wake up to reality.


100 posted on 04/08/2010 12:36:46 PM PDT by rbmillerjr (Let hot tar wash their throats and may it flow freely.)
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