An Extraordinary Prophecy (Hal Lindsey on the Pope)

hal lindsey oracle ^ | 4/09/2005 | Hal Lindsey

[queenkathy]

Very true, but we can look at the signs. I like Jack Van Impe also but he's been wrong too. Hey, they just try. They don't know either. But he relates how 1 day is like 1,000 years, etc. Who knows. Not me for sure...Good night.

[wagglebee]

I don't want to argue with anyone about it because we truly have no ideas. Throughout history man has become increasingly more self-destructive and decadent, it's tough to say which are signs of man's sinful nature and which are signs of God's Judgement. People who speak in absolutes about future events tend to scare me, because ignorant people believe them for the wrong reasons. St. Peter wrote that "the ignorant will misread Paul's writings as they do other Scripture to their own destruction." (I don't have a Bible nearby so I am paraphrasing)

[queenkathy]

Gosh, you obviously didn't read this whole thread...So I'll discount your remark as being from someone who only reads up to post 10 and disregards all the other 73 posts...But thank You for your kindness!...Good night.

[Uri’el-2012]

Welcome aboard.

B'Shem Y'shua
chuck

[jude24]

Hal Lindsey and his fake books are NOT Biblical prophecy.

Well, the books are real enough....

[Lester Moore]

I like Jack Van Impe...

I dismissed him until I found out that he's got a huge percentage of the Bible memorized [no I'm not gonna go searching for how huge] and spends a minimum of 2 hours per day working on the memorization of scripture.

I give the man an "E" for effort! And a big God Bless!

Memorizing Scripture is important.

[queenkathy]

I was just reading that on his web site. He's got almost the whole Bible memorized.

[asformeandformyhouse]

So therefore, everytime someone says these prophecies are wrong and God will not return, then they are saying we are in the last days and fullfilling that.

Yes, that one prophecy.

[Fiat volvntas tva]

It is easy to find Biblical "proof" for their vague hypotheses;
There "proofs" come about only through rather severe Scripture twisting and terrible hermenuetics where they claim to employ the "historical/literal method", by which they take clear metaphors, allegory and other symbolic forms of speech and interpret them in a wooden literal fashion, most often with their results being utter nonsense.

however, they will never acknowledge the fact that "time" as we know it is a man-made concept
I wouldn't agree with that, I think Einstein was right about time being a dimension of the universe created by God.

it does not translate into the Lord's Omnipotence...
That is for sure. Time has no relevance for God except in how it affects His creation.

One of the worst scripture twistings they do is their misinterpretation of Daniel 9;
26"And after the sixty-two weeks
Messiah shall be cut off, but not for Himself;
And the people of the prince who is to come
Shall destroy the city and the sanctuary.
The end of it shall be with a flood,
And till the end of the war desolations are determined.
27Then he shall confirm a covenant with many for one week;
But in the middle of the week
He shall bring an end to sacrifice and offering.
And on the wing of abominations shall be one who makes desolate,
Even until the consummation, which is determined,
Is poured out on the desolate."

They apply the bolded section to the antichrist, when it is clearly Christ who is pictured there, it was His Atoning Sacrifice that ended sacrifice and oblation, and prophecies the destruction of Jerusalem by Titus in AD70.

it would be comical how the "teachings" of these men always reaches the conclusion that the Catholic Church is the repository for satanic teaching.
I'm Presbyterian, and don't put any stock in the likes of Dave Hunt, Hal Lindsey and others who use sloppy historical and hermenuetical methods. While there are a number of issues I would not agree with Roman Catholicism on, the main ones being justification and primacy, with others being secondary issues, there is also much I do agree with Roman Catholicism on and view their paranoia towards Roman Catholicism with a bit of amusement.

There is some evidence that Rome and Protestants are getting closer to genuine agreement on justification. Have you read the following document?

http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_councils/chrstuni/documents/rc_pc_chrstuni_doc_31101999_cath-luth-joint-declaration_en.html

[Fiat volvntas tva]

Welcome aboard.

Thank you very much.

[Fiat volvntas tva]

to watch the signs.

What Jesus and the Bible actually tell us is,
Mark13;
32"But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father. 33Take heed, watch and pray; for you do not know when the time is."

In the parable of the 10 virgins, Jesus stresses the point of always being ready for His return, for in a very real sense, Jesus comes at the moment we take our very last breath.

Concerning "signs", Jesus said this:
Matthew 12;
39But He answered and said to them, "An evil and adulterous generation seeks after a sign, and no sign will be given to it except the sign of the prophet Jonah.

I would suggest that you become more familiar with good hermenuetics and scripture so as to test these so-called prophecy experts with what Scripture actually teaches.

[queenkathy]

Well at least you've caused me to search the scripture. I'm looking for the verse that says to know the signs. Well what about this one REbv 22:7 New Living Translation "Look, I am coming soon! Blessed are those who obey the prophecy written in this scroll."

Well ok I'm still looking. I'll find it. Not in an attempt to argue because I don't want to argue. We are all on the same side I think.

[Fiat volvntas tva]

Well at least you've caused me to search the scripture.
Excellent. I would suggest also that you embark on a study process that doesn't rely on pulling out snippets out of the context of the entirety of Scripture. God gave His Word as a whole, not simply a compiliation of snippets. It is through exhaustive study of the entire book, using a good hermenuetic that employs context of the various literary styles employed in Scripture, such as historic context, literary context being able to identify symbolic language as metaphors, simile and other figures of speech from the wooden literal.

I'm looking for the verse that says to know the signs.
Ok, then we'll look at it's context.

Well what about this one REbv 22:7 New Living Translation "Look, I am coming soon! Blessed are those who obey the prophecy written in this scroll."
Yes, and Jesus did "come", which is a Jewish idiom for "causing" or "affecting", in AD70 when Jerusalem was destroyed as Jesus prophecied in Matthew 24.

[queenkathy]

WEll as I search the scriptures I have found this one. Perhaps others will benefit from this since a few want to bash Hal Lindsey...1 John 4:20 If Someone says "I love God" but hates a Christian brother or sister, that person is a liar; for if we don't love people we can see, how can we love God, whom we have not seen? And God himself has commanded that we must love not only Him but our Christian brothers and sister, too.
So since Hal is a Christian brother, I guess if we all call ourselves Christian, we have to love him. Doesn't sound like many on here do feel that way towards him.

[queenkathy]

Excellent. I would suggest also that you embark on a study process that doesn't rely on pulling out snippets out of the context of the entirety of Scripture. God gave His Word as a whole, not simply a compiliation of snippets. It is through exhaustive study of the entire book, using a good hermenuetic that employs context of the various literary styles employed in Scripture, such as historic context, literary context being able to identify symbolic language as metaphors, simile and other figures of speech from the wooden literal.

Isn't that what you just did with the verse about signs? I'm still looking,btw. Listen, it is not my intent at all to argue scripture. I just don't think it's exactly right when anyone puts down another Christian like Hal Lindsey. You don't know anything about who I am. Or what I believe. Or what I do. If you want to dialogue that's fine, but don't assume that I have no understanding of the Bible or that I don't have as much intelligence when it comes to the Bible as you have.

[queenkathy]

1Thess 5:19 Do not stifle the Holy Spirit. 20. Do not scoff at prophecies. 21 but test everything that is said.

[wagglebee]

When I spoke about the use of "vague" proofs to reach their conclusions, I was basically being polite and giving them the benefit of the doubt. As for time being a "man made" concept, I was referring to the way in which we have to organize our lives based upon the hours of the day, day of the week, etc.; of course God created time as a definite part of the universe, but time as we use it has not relevance to God.

I am Catholic, my wife and her family is Presbyterian and I often attend Presbyterian services, in fact I am far closer to her minister than I am to my priest. Mainstream Protestant denominations (Presbyterians, Lutherans, Episcopalians, etc.) and Catholicism are in basic agreement on most issues, and none of these denominations has taken part in anti-Catholic rhetoric in quite some time. Billy Graham, Pat Robertson and many other Protestants openly mourned the death of John Paul II and they have (like you) expressed agreement with Catholicism over the basic tenets of Christianity (though they still disagree on several issues, usually related to Mary and Papal authority). However, many of these "self proclaimed" evangelical prophets seem to believe that they alone can interpret scripture and they will routinely dismiss any view that does not correspond with their's as satanic. I think that their myopic views would indeed be comical; however, many of these men have widespread followings that believe as fact whatever they say, and that fanaticism can become quite dangerous.

[Fiat volvntas tva]

I just don't think it's exactly right when anyone puts down another Christian like Hal Lindsey.
We are commanded by Scripture to "test the spirits", and also to be Bereans, which means we are to have a critical eye, especially when it comes to those who go around making predictions and claims of being "prophecy experts" as Hal Lindsey does. Jesus and the Apostles time after time exhorted the faithful to beware of false prophets and false teachers. Hal Lindsey is a bad teacher of bad theology and even worse at making predictions. We are commanded to beware of just that sort, and to warn others of them.
Scripture is not as politically correct as many are today.

You don't know anything about who I am. Or what I believe.
I know you think Hal Lindsey and Jack Van Impe are good teachers and prophecy experts. That tells me a lot about your knowledge of Scripture and discernment.

[Fiat volvntas tva]

1 John 4:20 If Someone says "I love God" but hates a Christian brother or sister, that person is a liar; for if we don't love people we can see, how can we love God, whom we have not seen? And God himself has commanded that we must love not only Him but our Christian brothers and sister, too.
So since Hal is a Christian brother, I guess if we all call ourselves Christian, we have to love him. Doesn't sound like many on here do feel that way towards him.

Having a critical eye toward those who claim to be "teachers" and "prophecy experts" as commanded in Scripture is not un-loving as you have misread into that passage. Being critical of Hal Lindsey and exposing his errors so he can correct them, and warning others of his bad theology and teaching is love, and not hate as you misunderstand.