Posted on 07/15/2006 9:22:45 PM PDT by BlueSky194
Gerald Schaflander: Hy-Fuel - solar-produced hydrogen turned into liquid fuel
This is in the 1970s. Gerald Schaflander, with the Solar Electrlc Power Corporation of Culver City, California, and with financial help from some friends, built a pilot production facility in Menlo Park, California. Schaflander had developed Gallium Aluminum Arsenide/Gallium Arsenide solar cells and was producing hydrogen with the cells' output, which was then chemically turned into a liquid fuel. The fuel could be utilized in cars or trucks. It was not used as a liquid but as hydrogen gas, by cracking it and feeding the recovered hydrogen gas through a special carburetor.
Schaflander was harrassed by oil company inspired opposition, including quite "official" opposition such as the post office, and the company essentially driven out of business. The whole story is described in a very detailed article that was published in October 1980 called Somebody doesn't like Hyfuel. Click on the link above to read the article.
I'm curious to get people's opinion of this technology.
The person who developed Hyfuel was Gerald Schaflander.
Schaflander made the hydrogen non flammable.
He used hydrogen made from solar power and combined it with ammonia which was put in a synthesizer to create the hydrogen fuel. (Hyfuel)
The main problem - that of storage - was overcome with the discovery of a liquid hydride suitable for pumping straight into the petrol tank of a normal car.
Schaflander said his Hyfuel would only costs 59 cents a gallon.
Here's some of what it says in the article.
Car owners might wonder how difficult it would be to convert their present engines to hydrogen fuel.
Schaflander's experiments show that it can be accomplished in a few hours.
The process involves removing the gasoline tank and installing a new tank capable of holding the slightly heavier Hydrogen hydride mixture.
A Cracker would be positioned in front of the car next to the motor to convert the ammonia like Hyfuel into a gas mainly composed of Hydrogen.
This would flow into a new carburetor to which a fuel regulator is attached.
Certain other solenoid valves and vacuum and pressure switches would be wired in the car.
The Hydrogen powered vehicle would then be ready to roll.
I wouldn't doubt it.
The Major, very major oil company my Dad was jobber for . . . was sternly ruthless.
To read the article, Somebody doesn't like Hyfuel.
Here's the link.
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory%3ASuppression#Gerald_Schaflander:_Hy-Fuel_-_solar-produced_hydrogen_turned_into_liquid_fuel
It should take your right to the article.
If it doesn't,
Scroll down all the way to the bottom.
Then scroll up like 10 percent of the way and you should see
Gerald Schaflander: Hy-Fuel - solar-produced hydrogen turned into liquid fuel
The article is right below that.
Ammonia doesn't grow on trees, nor is it available in large amounts from any inexpensive source. What is the energy cost of producing ammonia?
I know that ammonia is a common chemical produced by biological reactions. It's often found in compost heaps.
I wonder if there might be a biological means of mass-producing ammonia, rather than the high-temp/high-pressure method.
Maybe bacterial strains can be developed that will produce ammonia at a rapid rate
FYI, there are enormous facilities in place for the production of ammonia, it's a very widely used feedstock for all kinds of processes; fertilizers, explosives, medecines, plenty of others. Many.
There are a few missing pieces in the description of the article that I will have to re-read to verify. Hydrogen hydride?? Come on.
I think the article is too rosy. Last I heard, hydrogen burnt through a typical combustion engine required a different cam shaft because of the faster flame front in the combustion chamber. It's not huge, but it is not just bolting on a carburator either.
DK
This almost sounds like the guy found a process for converting ammonia to hydrazine, an oily liquid: NH3 > N2H4. That in itself sounds very unlikely, since the possibility of preparing highly valuable hydrazine from cheap ammonia would seem to be too obvious for there not to be such a process.....but hydrazine aka rocket propellent is far too dangerous; explosive, corrosive, and toxic ("violent poison" per the Merck index) to be placed into public hands.
Ammonium hydride?
On the surface, this hyfuel seems to be a scam.
Every "great idea" that failed in the past was always the fault of the all powerful hidden hand of the "oil companies"...
Big red flag right there.
In addition, hydrogen causes serious metal embrittlement and basically distroys standard internal combustion engines.
Let your cat pee in your car and leave the car in the sun a few hours, you'll find out... :-(
Cheers!
Full Disclosure: BAD Kitty! (Not that they ever listen.)
If this is the guy I saw on TV back in the 70's, he looks like Mel Brooks. Does that help any?
I don't think there is a single sane individual in the world who would not agree that any major energy provider would jump on this opportunity if it worked. Publicly owned companies are in business to satisfy their shareholders. If Company A blew off this idea and Company B grabbed it, Company A would get their doors blown off.
OTOH, there are plenty of maroons (one our ex VP) who, for whatever nefarious reason, want to pump green ideas which obviously are short sighted and ineffective. This thread seems to be infected with this lot.
Uh, track the truck driver and call the police?
Wow, rough dude.
I remember this guy making the rounds on TV. If I remember correctly, he was in Merv with Dirk Pierson, and Dirk gave the guy a hard time saying that the stuff was way toxic.
I heard Schaflander went to jail over the Post Office contract he had. They claimed fraud or something.
"A Cracker would be positioned in front of the car"
This seems like a pretty racist idea to me.
Not true. In a carbureted engine, all that is necessary is to change the carburetor jets. Now, in todays fuel-injected vehicles, it may be a different story, but NONE of the changes have anything to do with the camshaft.
I can't see how a system that uses GaAlAs/GaAs solar cells can ever be cost-effective for large-scale hydrogen production, or even electric-power production. Just because you can demonstrate a technology in the lab doesn't mean it can be economically useful.
Read the article I posted.
It went into detail about the Post Office story.
The Post office totally back stabbed Schaflander.
They sided with the oil companies.
If we had nuclear plants generating abundant amounts of electricity, the hydrogen part of the equation would be moot.
Unless the Hydrogen proves a more efficient energy storage method than electric batteries
The point is, that the problem is the energy source not how you store it. Hydrogen provides nothing new on that front.
>>>>"The point is, that the problem is the energy source not how you store it. Hydrogen provides nothing new on that front"<<<<
Nuclear Power is the source I believe we need to develop
providing
Electricity
Fresh Water (We can sure use it here in Texas)
Warm Water
The only reason that Hydrogen would enter into the mix is if it is an efficient method of storing energy where electricity is not viable or if energy cells using hydrogen are more efficient or more environmentally friendly than batteries.
I also like Natural Gas, (we have lots of it here in Texas)
If Politicians would simply GET OUT OF THE WAY we wouldn't be holding hands with and financing the ROP
TT
Read this.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1666513/posts
Hy-Fuel - solar-produced hydrogen turned into liquid fuel
i was involved with Schaflander from 1972 as a student, in ‘74 as a founder of consumers solar electric power corp. hy fuel was ammonia. i was personally responsible for this part of our effort. i used research done by the Allison division of GM for the army, known as the energy depot project to provide a demonstration of stored solar energy.
while i admire the late Dr. Schaflander, and acknowledge the prescience of our efforts, the idea that we were somehow thwarted by a conspiracy to stop new tech was a central element of Schaflander’s pitch. total baloney.
you are incorrect about the effect of hydrogen and ammonia on IC engines. there is a metal embrittlement issue associated with the storage of ammonia in steel tanks. this is cured by annealing the tanks.
the only unique effect of runnung an IC engine on ammonia is oil saponification (soap making).
i should know, as i drove a chevy caprice from edmonton to montreal on ammonia.
as there is no carbon in the fuel the acids and other nasty things that form in the oil of gas and diesel engines do not form in engines running on hydrogen or ammonia.
we abandoned the ‘cracker’ approach. it required a catalytic dissacoiator running at 500 degrees C. we directly burned ammonia in the engine. there were no metal hydrides involved.
the energy density of ammonia is roughly equivalent to methanol. you need about 2.5 volumes of ammonia to produce the same ‘mileage’ as gasoline.
Schaflander wanted to conceal this fact, and continued to maintain that our vehicle got the same mileage as gasoline, including stating this falsehood on the merv griffin show.
when i objected, schaflander said “if we can put a man on the moon, we can get equal mileage”.
i pointed out the we violated no physical laws in putting a man on the moon.
gerry did vaguely resemble a bigger, fatter mel brooks. brooks was his favorite comic.
i saw the producers and the 12 chairs because of gerry.
he actually went to prison for mail fraud in connection with fraudulent stock promotion.
“Schaflander said his Hyfuel would only costs 59 cents a gallon.”
Back in the late ‘70s?
Don't expect the conspiracy nuts (some on FR) to believe you even though you were there.
Thanks for bringing your insights to this thread.
Carburetors haven’t been used on cars for roughly twenty years. There would be some other kind of fuel delivery system, most likely injection, which would make the most sense with this highly volatile, explosive fuel.
when i left CSEP in california in 2/81, i co-founded CAE canadian alternative energy. our business plan, dependent on highly favorable pricing for electricity from ontario hydro, would have made us competitive for fleet sales.
sheik yamani’s policy of turning on the saudi tap helped destroy the economic basis of alternative fuel.
i developed a relationship with Impco of cerritos, ca, to supply CSEP, and later my canadian firm, CAE, with gaseous carburetion equipment calibrated for ammonia. it turns out that ammonia has the same btu/cubic ft as digester gas.
the equipment was essentially the same as propane conversion equipment, and did enable a low cost, relatively simple conversion.
bttt
It is nice to hear about someone else who actually met Schaflander. In 1982 I traveled from Miami Florida to Culver City, California just to meet with him. I was with Pan American Airlines, and they were looking at the practicality of fueling their jets with Hydrogen, or at least a prototype. He informed me that he was interested, but that his company needed to increase production before signing any new agreements. So, I agreed to check back with him in a few years. When I tried to check back with him, I couldn’t find him, and PanAm was history. According to Schaflander, his solar cells were “positively” affected by heat, while other solar cells worked less efficiently with heat. This meant that by using lenses, we could focus more solar energy per inch on the panel, than what normally arrives without the use of a lense. Isn’t there anyway we can resurrect the scientific team he put together, and give it a second try with modern technology? I like his idea of using potato skins to manufacture the liquid hydride. I remember that he had one scientist that deleloped the solar cells, and another one that was working with liquid hydrides. Even if these scientists are retired, there must be some way we can resurrect their research. Do, you have any ideas?
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