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Russian People Hear More About John Paul II's Connection to Fatima.
Inside The Vatican ^ | 10/24/01 | Alessandro Schirru

Posted on 10/25/2001 7:56:58 AM PDT by marshmallow

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To: The_Reader_David
What is the Eastern spin on Ferrara-Florence? As I understand it, the Turks offered the them a choice, and they chose to renounce a Church council (both lungs) to avoid worldly annihilation. Their decision was certainly understandable, (nobody said this would be easy), and I don't know if I would have done differently in their shoes, but how do your leaders explain it? I am genuinely curious, and ask this with all respect due a brother in Christ.
51 posted on 10/26/2001 9:50:31 PM PDT by tristero
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To: The_Reader_David
and is now running neck and neck with Islam for that distinction.

Glory to God! Thanks for sharing this.

52 posted on 10/27/2001 10:03:47 AM PDT by MarMema
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To: crazykatz
Excuse me sir/ma'am, but are you currently taking any prescription medications?
53 posted on 10/27/2001 10:06:40 AM PDT by Conservative til I die
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To: Campion
Also on the other hand, the Catholic Church within the ex-USSR was virtually exterminated. We lost thousands of priests just in Spain, just due to the communist revolution supported there by Stalin.

That musta been a sweet deal for the Orthodox clergy in the USSR.
54 posted on 10/27/2001 10:09:16 AM PDT by Conservative til I die
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To: Stavka2
Thanks for the bump. Reading about JP2 always makes me scurry to read more about prelest. Worldliness is never holy and flaunting of it always leads me to feelings of suspicion.

I prefer holy men in backwood huts, hopefully part of a monastic community, but not always.

JP2 would do well to study St Seraphim at length, and it wouldn't hurt him to read several times The Way of the Pilgrim. But then again perhaps he suffers from mental deterioration at his advanced age...

55 posted on 10/27/2001 10:11:43 AM PDT by MarMema
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To: marshmallow
He is a truly humble man.

Thanks for a good laugh this morning!

56 posted on 10/27/2001 10:16:06 AM PDT by MarMema
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To: marshmallow
Have you been paying attention to what the Pope has been saying?

I have mostly been paying attention to what he has been doing. Like making a habit of visiting traditional Orthodox countries, often against their wishes. That strikes you as humility?
Then he chooses Ziggy Brezinski as a companion to visit the hotbed of Ukraine and in honor of his visit an Orthodox church is scheduled to be leveled supposedly to make room for JP2 to speak in the city. That strikes you as honorable behavior? You have my pity.
By the way, Ziggy is in bed with at least one major oil company and hates Russians with a passion. Some way to get yourself invited to Russia, eh? And there was/is a major oil pipeline being debated in Ukraine just before the time of JP2's visit.
Methinks JP2 has been delving into some worldly behaviors even beyond his excessive need for publicity and ecumenical leadership. Whether intentionally or not.

By the way, hope this answers your questions about why Russia didn't want him to come visit.

57 posted on 10/27/2001 10:24:05 AM PDT by MarMema
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To: marshmallow
The Pope has continually and steadfastly reached out to the Orthodox Church. His attempts have often been rebuffed such as the shameful behavior of the Greek Orthodox hierarchy on his recent visit to Greece.

But why??? Is it humble to force yourself on others when you are unwanted? Is it holy? What do you call it? I teach my children that this behavior is rude. Agreed on the shameful behavior of the monks.

58 posted on 10/27/2001 10:28:34 AM PDT by MarMema
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To: marshmallow
Maybe this is because Orthodoxy's own contribution to the opposition of communism, was at best, unremarkable.

Yes, we are a passive faith and a nonworldly one. But it sure beats thinking you are more powerful than God in making world changes, or more knowledgeable than God as to which changes are necessary.

59 posted on 10/27/2001 10:33:57 AM PDT by MarMema
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To: Stavka2
you know those nifty northern guys from Germany: the Nazies.

Well at least they didn't beatify more than one of them. (And isn't that the funniest thing - choosing your own saints instead of letting God do it?)

60 posted on 10/27/2001 10:37:17 AM PDT by MarMema
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To: tristero
Russia rejected Florence/Ferrar at least as forcefully as did the Empire, even though they were under no Turkish threat. The Emperor at the time, the one who would be swayed most by worldly concerns, backed the False Union, as did most of the bishops (including all the delegates, except St. Mark of Ephesus). The Union foundered because it involved accession to false Latin doctrines, rejected uniformly by the ordinary clergy, monastics and laity (including the Empress).

The Russian delegate, one Archbishop Isadore, was deposed as a heretic and exiled. He was later made a Cardinal by the Pope of Rome.

The Orthodox take on the spiritual basis for the final demise of the Empire, is that the last Emperors become too worldly, seeking aid from the Latin heretics, rather than from God.

61 posted on 10/27/2001 8:57:36 PM PDT by The_Reader_David
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To: MarMema
There are Catholics in Greece. There are Catholics in the predominantly Orthodox countries which JPII has visited. The same goes for the predominantly Isalmic countries he has visited.

You're telling me he can't visit the Catholics and people of goodwill in these places because folk like the Greek Orthodox hierarchy don't want him there?

62 posted on 10/29/2001 4:28:11 AM PST by marshmallow
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To: marshmallow
In May of 1917 Russia was a Greek Orthodox country which held worship of Mary in high regard. Bolshevistic atheism had not as yet taken hold. Russia was already converted in 1917 as the Czar was the protector of the Greek Orthodox faith for centuries. The promise of Russia's conversion was not revealed until 1941 when Lucia had become a nun and then made public in October of 1942 by Cardinal Schuster, a highly partisan Nazi Catholic prelate by order of Pope Pius XII who did so in order to motivate German troops in their siege of Stalingrad and the commensurate promise of the "catholicization" of Russia.. The original story of the miracle was "added to" by order of Cardinal Schuster, to enhance its propaganda value. Think about it. Why would the Virgin Mary want to convert a Greek Orthodox nation that worships her and prays the rosary to a Roman Catholic faith that worships her and prays the rosary? Furthermore, if the Virgin told her "if my requests are heeded Russia will be converted" and at the same time told her to keep the request secret, how would anyone be able to keep her request? From 1917 until 1942 perhaps no conversion was necessary until von Paulus was trapped in Stalingrad. This myth is nothing but Catholic propaganda.
63 posted on 10/29/2001 5:31:04 AM PST by Woodkirk
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To: Woodkirk
LOL!! Yeah, but it's good propaganda. Your propaganda stinks.

Russia was a Russian Orthodox country, not Greek Orthodox. The rest of your post attains the same level of accuracy.

64 posted on 10/29/2001 8:23:06 AM PST by marshmallow
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To: ZULU
I agree with earlier posters, we are all Christians and our real enemy is the specter of militant Islam. << Amen. As a Catholic I have nothing but the deepest respect for the Orthodox Church and Evangelicals who believe in the Word of God. All Christians need to unite against the Mohammedan fanatics who would destroy the West, all of our Churches(they won't look at the denomination name before they drop their bombs or fly their planes into it) and our whole way of life. Let's support and pray for each other in the name of Our Lord Jesus Christ.
65 posted on 10/29/2001 9:43:52 AM PST by Clintons a commie
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