Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Taken as red
Ha'aretz ^

Posted on 12/07/2001 10:15:51 PM PST by madrussian

Many of the Jewish immigrants who reached the United States during the great immigration of 1881-1914 were believers in socialism, and ardent supporters of trade unions and other pro-labor organizations. The Russian Revolution in 1917 strengthened their communist fervor: Quite a few were convinced that the "days of the messiah" had come and a just society would soon arise in the Soviet Union where Jews could fulfil their duty as Soviet citizens.

And yet hardly any of them went so far as to return to their land of birth. Most preferred to continue their pursuit of the American dream, according to which every immigrant laborer could get ahead, establish himself financially, and give his American-born children an education that would enable them to be president of the United States one day. For the majority, the dream of financial prosperity vanished within a decade, as the Great Depression left tens of thousands of people dying of hunger and created unemployment on a scale unknown since the beginning of the Industrial Revolution.

This was the atmosphere in which Mary Leder's parents decided to return to the Soviet Union and try their luck in the Jewish autonomous republic of Birobidzhan. The Leders were devoted communists, and their daughter, Mary, born in the United States, joined the American communist movement at the age of 15, after the family moved from the East Coast to California in search of employment.

In October 1929, more than a year before the Wall Street stock market crash, the Leders were already feeling the pinch. The father, a builder by profession, was finding it difficult to sell houses. By 1931, it was clear that the move to California was not a success. Mary's parents envisaged a brighter future in the Jewish socialist homeland Josef Stalin was anxious to establish in the eastern republic of Birobidzhan.

Mary's reaction was one of shock: What connection did she have with a faraway country whose language she did not speak? As a girl who had grown up without any formal ties to Judaism, what interest could she possibly have in any kind of Jewish homeland, even a socialist one? Although she was a supporter of the Soviet Union and communism, Mary, who had dreamed of going to college and becoming a journalist, was devastated. Realizing that she could not remain alone in the United States, the teenager informed her parents that she would accompany them, but not for long. When she turned 18, she said, she would go back to America.

This book is a kind of diary kept by Mary Leder from the day she set sail for Japan in the company of her parents, en route to Soviet Russia, until her return to the United States 30 years later. After several weeks with her family, she decided that Birobidzhan was not for her. She asked to stay with relatives in Moscow, hoping to learn a profession there. Not wanting to be a burden to her aunt and uncle, she ended up joining a commune of young people, with whom she lived and worked for several years.

Meanwhile, her parents in Birobidzhan decided to wind up the Soviet chapter of their lives and go back to the United States.

Mary, now 18, chose to stay behind and become a Soviet citizen as a first step toward finding employment. Hoping that Mary would soon rejoin them, her parents and younger siblings departed for America. Towards the end of the 1930s, Mary went to work for a foreign language publishing house, where the Soviet authorities took advantage of her skills and those of other foreign citizens residing in the Soviet Union. Later, she even received spy training, but the project through which she was being sent to America was cancelled at the last minute.

After returning to her former job, Mary married Abraham, a Jew from Rostov, and gave birth to a daughter. When the Germans invaded the Soviet Union, Mary and Abraham fled to a small town in the Volga region together with many other families. During that time, their young daughter became ill and died. When the couple eventually moved back to the capital, they encountered blatant anti-Semitism and anti-Americanism that began to affect their personal and professional lives. These trends intensified in the 1950s, although Stalin died in 1953.

When Abraham succumbed to a serious illness in 1959, Mary applied for an exit visa: The time had come to reunite with her parents in the United States. It took several years before her dream came true. In 1965, at the age of 45, Mary returned to the land of her birth, where she lives until today.

Leder's book is built on contradictions and dissonance. The equation is supposed to balance out in the end, but it doesn't. Right from the beginning, we have the family's high hopes with respect to the communist world, where everyone is equal and has the same opportunities, regardless of religion or class. But the author is soon disappointed with Stalin's "Jewish republic," and before long, her parents are, too.

Next, the author decides that by joining a commune in Moscow, she will be able to move ahead in the Soviet system. Again, she sobers up quickly, her hopes for collectivism soon dashed. At spy school, as Leder dreams of using her fluent English to aid her new homeland, up pops an officer and advises her that when she gets to the United States as a Soviet agent, she should defect. Go live with your parents, he says. You aren't cut out to be a spy, and anyway, life in America is so much easier.

During World War II, Leder is fired by the hope that the Soviet nation is fighting fascism. In reality, she finds that Soviet society has turned its back on her due to anti-Semitism. Finally, she believes that she will be cared for by the communist system, that citizens will be provided with everything they need in the way of food, medical care and education. The truth is that she cannot even obtain the simple drugs that might have saved her husband's life.

Mary Leder's story is both fascinating and sad. It is written in a flowing style, without the abundance of detail that often makes memoirs hard to read. Reading this book, one cannot help reflecting on the courage of this girl, who embarks on the adventure of living apart from her parents in a foreign country and makes no special effort to join them when they pack up and go home. On the one hand, we gasp at the temerity of a 16-year-old who joins a commune in an unfamiliar land where she doesn't speak the language.

On the other, it is hard to accept her passivity with respect to returning to the bosom of her family. She does make several attempts to leave the Soviet Union, but one can certainly think of some channels she hasn't tried, and the same goes for her family. Is she harboring a secret anger at having to accompany her parents to the Soviet Union in the first place? Has she become swept up in an adventure that is more than she bargained for?

In a country where parents equip their kids trekking to the Far East with international cell phones and beg them to drop into an Internet cafe at least once a week to "touch base," the story of a family that moves from the United States to the Soviet Union and sends a 16-year-old daughter alone to the capital, ultimately saying goodbye for close to three decades - that is certainly a story worth reading and thinking about.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Miscellaneous
KEYWORDS:
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-89 next last
Interesting piece of history. Real life, not Hollywood schlock or pseudo-history.
1 posted on 12/07/2001 10:15:51 PM PST by madrussian
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: CommiesOut
It deserves a thread.
2 posted on 12/07/2001 10:17:40 PM PST by madrussian
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: madrussian
She deserved whatever pain she recieved. If it had been up to her, most people on FR and the rest of te world would be in chains or gulags.
3 posted on 12/07/2001 10:25:25 PM PST by KantianBurke
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: KantianBurke
When it was up to Lenin and his merry band of Bolsheviks, millions were put in gulags and murdered. But as someone said, they were simply "idealists". Right.
4 posted on 12/07/2001 10:29:31 PM PST by madrussian
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: KantianBurke; madrussian; malarski; Askel5; GROUCHOTWO; Zviadist; kristinn; Free the USA...
If it had been up to her, most people on FR and the rest of te world would be in chains or gulags.

Let's hope that nowadays she writes books only.

5 posted on 12/08/2001 2:24:59 AM PST by CommiesOut
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: madrussian; malarski; Askel5; GROUCHOTWO; Zviadist; kristinn; Free the USA; struwwelpeter...
I can't believe it, comrade.
She even had conflicts with the California Communist Party leadership.
What a troublemaker.
More
6 posted on 12/08/2001 3:41:25 AM PST by CommiesOut
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: madrussian
I'm curious as to why she stayed in the Soviet Union after her parents returned home to America. Did she really believe she would have more opportunities there? And I'm curious as to why the parents thought life in the USSR was going to be so good for Jews; there had been pogroms there for YEARS and Jews had been coming the the US to escape them! I guess, like their daughter, they were looking for some entity to take care of them.
7 posted on 12/08/2001 3:51:52 AM PST by SuziQ
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: madrussian
But as someone said, they were simply "idealists".

How did you know that? Bought a book already?
That's what it says on the front flap:
"For much of the time she was an idealistic supporter of Soviet socialism and a dedicated member of the Young Communist League".

8 posted on 12/08/2001 3:55:05 AM PST by CommiesOut
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: madrussian
I take it she reunited with her family and they all work for a major American media outlet.
9 posted on 12/08/2001 6:01:32 AM PST by Leisler
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: CommiesOut
YCL=a mirror image of Hitler's Youth, the former causing even more blood-letting than the latter.
10 posted on 12/08/2001 8:38:27 AM PST by GROUCHOTWO
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: madrussian
This is a "man bites dog" story. Jews who left the Russian Empire and the Soviet Union to come to the United States were among the least likely of any immigrant group to ever go back. Millions left but only a few thousand ever returned.

The number of Jews who returned to the Soviet Union in the 1930's is dwarfed by the number who left the Soviet Union before 1990 and returned to Russia after the fall of communism.

11 posted on 12/08/2001 8:49:53 AM PST by Inyokern
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: madrussian
When Abraham succumbed to a serious illness in 1959, Mary applied for an exit visa: The time had come to reunite with her parents in the United States.

Just wondering what happened to poor Abraham. If I can read Mary's "idealistic" mind, she probably left him dying in the Soviet Union to go back to the country that she despised, good ol' USA.

Also, she must have joined the spy agency on her own, ready to spy on us. The citizens of the Soviet Union were not compelled to join the KGB or any other intelligence gathering organization. It was their own choice. What a scum.

12 posted on 12/08/2001 4:04:10 PM PST by malarski
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: malarski; madrussian
John Walker (Maryland/California Taliban) should write a thick book and ask Laurie Bernstein and Robert Weinberg for Introduction.
Then he can put money in the bank and wait for pardon from Pres. Hillary or Pres. Kennedy Townsend.
13 posted on 12/09/2001 10:23:05 AM PST by CommiesOut
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: SuziQ
And I'm curious as to why the parents thought life in the USSR was going to be so good for Jews; there had been pogroms there for YEARS and Jews had been coming the the US to escape them!

You are confused, pogroms happened in isolated parts of the Russian Empire, like Ukraine. This story goes against the usual "Stalin was an anti-semite and Jews were victims in the Soviet Union" revisionist mantra.

14 posted on 12/09/2001 11:09:01 AM PST by madrussian
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: madrussian
You are confused, pogroms happened in isolated parts of the Russian Empire, like Ukraine.

Because that is where the Jews lived. Duh.

When the Russian revolution occurred in Moscow, there were almost no Jews living in Moscow.

15 posted on 12/09/2001 12:02:41 PM PST by Inyokern
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: Inyokern
Because that is where the Jews lived. Duh.

Perhaps you are trying to blame Russians for the pogroms that didn't happen in Russia? LOL! You know they would have happened in Russia if the Jews had lived there, right?

When the Russian revolution occurred in Moscow, there were almost no Jews living in Moscow.

Not as many as in Ukraine, that's for sure. The February revolution removed the pale and made Jews free, and they repaid with overthrowing Provisional government.

16 posted on 12/09/2001 12:09:51 PM PST by madrussian
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 15 | View Replies]

To: madrussian
Perhaps you are trying to blame Russians for the pogroms that didn't happen in Russia?

I didn't blame the Russians for any pogroms on this thread.

The February revolution removed the pale and made Jews free, and they repaid with overthrowing Provisional government.

So between Feburary and October 1917, the Jews moved enmasse to Moscow, raised an army and overthrew the Kerensky government? Do you really believe something so absurd?

The fact is that most Jews (or at least, the small number who had any interest in Russian politics at all) supported the Kerensky government.

17 posted on 12/09/2001 12:48:59 PM PST by Inyokern
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: CommiesOut
John Walker (Maryland/California Taliban) should write a thick book and ask Laurie Bernstein and Robert Weinberg for Introduction.

Or perhaps Thaddeus "Ted" Kascynski.

18 posted on 12/09/2001 1:40:50 PM PST by Inyokern
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: Inyokern
Any neo-commie moron would work.
What a country, eh?
19 posted on 12/09/2001 1:46:34 PM PST by CommiesOut
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: Inyokern
Don't forget Rabbi Daniel Bergman!!!
20 posted on 12/09/2001 3:05:11 PM PST by GROUCHOTWO
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: GROUCHOTWO
Don't forget Rabbi Daniel Bergman!!!

Don't forget Marian Zacharski, who could write a book entitled "How to Steal US Military Secrets and Get Off Scot Free."

21 posted on 12/09/2001 3:11:41 PM PST by Inyokern
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: Inyokern
I didn't blame the Russians for any pogroms on this thread.

One could interpret your "Duh" as a suggestions that the same would have happened in Russia.

So between Feburary and October 1917, the Jews moved enmasse to Moscow, raised an army and overthrew the Kerensky government? Do you really believe something so absurd?

It does sound absurd if your scenario is the only one conceivable. The fact that the overwhelming majority of the Bolsheviks in Lenin's government were Jewish is sufficient to realize who were the main Bolsheviks supporters and ideologues.

22 posted on 12/09/2001 3:13:20 PM PST by madrussian
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: madrussian
The fact that the overwhelming majority of the Bolsheviks in Lenin's government were Jewish is sufficient to realize who were the main Bolsheviks supporters and ideologues.

That is like saying the fact that the membership of the National Black Republican Network are black means that most blacks are Republican.

Most Jews were not communist in 1917. National politics was a foreign concept to most Jews back then.

The Russian Revolution began in Moscow and St, Petersburg, places where there were virtually no Jews, rather than Kiev, Odessa or Minsk, or, for that matter, Poland, where Jews were numerous.

The places where Jews lived were not centers of resistance to the Provisional Government of Kerensky. There were Jews associated with Lenin, but there were also many Jews associated with Kerensky.

23 posted on 12/09/2001 3:42:48 PM PST by Inyokern
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: Inyokern
He was exchanged for 25 Western agents!!!
24 posted on 12/09/2001 3:43:32 PM PST by GROUCHOTWO
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: madrussian
One could interpret your "Duh" as a suggestions that the same would have happened in Russia.

My "duh" meant that it would pointless to have a pogrom in a place where there were no Jews. The pogroms took place in Ukraine because that was where the Jews were.

Do you understand now?

25 posted on 12/09/2001 3:46:26 PM PST by Inyokern
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: GROUCHOTWO
He was exchanged for 25 Western agents!!!

What does that have to do with Zacharski's guilt and the fact that he still owes the US Government a lot of years in prison?

26 posted on 12/09/2001 3:50:07 PM PST by Inyokern
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: Inyokern
The government decided to excuse him because they wanted their 25 spies back. What did the government get when Mossad spy Marc Rich blackmailed Clinton for a pardon?
27 posted on 12/09/2001 4:08:16 PM PST by GROUCHOTWO
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: Inyokern
Hey, did you know there is a serious connection between Kaczynski and the Nazis?
It should keep you busy for a while: Ross E. Getman, Wagner opera and Ted
Seriously though, we unleashed Kaczynski only for one purpose: to give Sandler a rhyme to "Lewinsky" in his Passover Song.
Adam Sandler's Passover Song .
So, be nice.
28 posted on 12/09/2001 4:35:51 PM PST by CommiesOut
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: Inyokern
That is like saying the fact that the membership of the National Black Republican Network are black means that most blacks are Republican.

For your analogy to work, Bolshevik government would have to be called Jewish faction of Bolshevik government.

Most Jews were not communist in 1917. National politics was a foreign concept to most Jews back then.

You mean members of a party? Of course not. Party members were always a minority. Sympathizing with destruction of Russia and perceiving it as their tribal revenge? Quite possibly. Tribal interests have always been paramount in Jewish community.

The Russian Revolution began in Moscow and St, Petersburg, places where there were virtually no Jews, rather than Kiev, Odessa or Minsk, or, for that matter, Poland, where Jews were numerous.

Jews were numerous in Menshevik and Bolshevik movements. History is often done by militant minorities, with majority being rather apathetic or not knowing better.

The places where Jews lived were not centers of resistance to the Provisional Government of Kerensky. There were Jews associated with Lenin, but there were also many Jews associated with Kerensky.

Provisional government was overthrown by Bolsheviks, and we know who were in charge there.

29 posted on 12/09/2001 4:36:35 PM PST by madrussian
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies]

To: Inyokern
The pogroms took place in Ukraine because that was where the Jews were.

Do you understand now?

Are you saying that the only reason the pogroms didn't take place in Russia because there were few Jews? And that they took place in Ukraine because that's where the Jews were? LOL!

30 posted on 12/09/2001 4:45:19 PM PST by madrussian
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 25 | View Replies]

To: SuziQ
I'm curious as to why she stayed in the Soviet Union after her parents returned home to America.

Probably because of hormonal needs. She was young, no parents supervision and the idea of the New Soviet Man probably appealed to her.

31 posted on 12/09/2001 5:35:39 PM PST by malarski
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: madrussian
During World War II, Leder is fired by the hope that the Soviet nation is fighting fascism. In reality, she finds that Soviet society has turned its back on her due to anti-Semitism.

It seems that the reviewer is really confused on the issue of the anti-Semitism. The Soviet nation is fighting fascism and at the same time is anti-Semitic. Hmm, kind of mutually exclusive statement.

32 posted on 12/09/2001 5:48:38 PM PST by malarski
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: madrussian
Me: Most Jews were not communist in 1917. National politics was a foreign concept to most Jews back then.

You: You mean members of a party?

No, I meant not communist or communist sympathizers. National politics was a foreign concept to Jews in that era. The rabbis advised Jews not to become involved in the politics of a gentile nation.

Tribal interests have always been paramount in Jewish community.

Avoiding pogroms was the only constant motivating factor in the Jewish community of the Russian Empire. Very few Jews were interested in any radical revolution.

Jews were numerous in Menshevik and Bolshevik movements. History is often done by militant minorities, with majority being rather apathetic or not knowing better.

History is often portrayed by the majority population in a way that scapegoats minorities for all problems. You have yet to explain how the Jews, who were not very numerous in Russia, were able to instigate a communist revolution (according to your theory) while they were not able to instigate one in Ukraine, Belarus, or Poland, where they made up a much larger percentage of the population. Have you considered the possibility that most Jews simply were not interested in communism?

Provisional government was overthrown by Bolsheviks, and we know who were in charge there.

You have presented no evidence that most Jews favored the Bolsheviks over the Provisional Government.

33 posted on 12/09/2001 5:59:29 PM PST by Inyokern
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 29 | View Replies]

To: GROUCHOTWO
Looks like Sharon forgot to tell GWB: "Gimme my spy now!"
34 posted on 12/09/2001 6:22:25 PM PST by CommiesOut
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: CommiesOut
There is an anti-Semitic/Slavic conspiracy here in ref. to Ted Kaczynski propagated by certain MeAlwaysRight posters. It is worth to remember that his brother name was DAVID and his mother's maiden name certainly was not Kaczynski.
35 posted on 12/09/2001 10:40:20 PM PST by malarski
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 28 | View Replies]

To: CommiesOut; malarski
Odd thing...the above link to Getman's article. Getman mentions that the '70s raging Neo-Nazi from Chicago, Phil Collin, was really a Cohn whose father had been in Dachau. This is the one that pushed for KKK marches in Chicago suburbs.
36 posted on 12/10/2001 9:22:31 AM PST by GROUCHOTWO
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 28 | View Replies]

To: madrussian
Please note post #36.
37 posted on 12/10/2001 9:25:04 AM PST by GROUCHOTWO
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: malarski
It is worth to remember that his brother name was DAVID and his mother's maiden name certainly was not Kaczynski.

I don't know her maiden name, but her first name was Wanda, if that helps.

38 posted on 12/10/2001 9:44:47 AM PST by Inyokern
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

To: Inyokern
No, I meant not communist or communist sympathizers. National politics was a foreign concept to Jews in that era. The rabbis advised Jews not to become involved in the politics of a gentile nation.

National politics as full participants, maybe. National politics that can be perceived as self-defence and opposing their "opressors", I wouldn't be so sure. Besides, there is a huge gap between what some rabbis may profess somewhere, let alone that that teaching is open to interpretation what it really means, and real life.

Avoiding pogroms was the only constant motivating factor in the Jewish community of the Russian Empire. Very few Jews were interested in any radical revolution.

There must have been different notions of "radicality". American Jewish neocons are much more radical and agressive than traditional conservatives, for example. But to them, they are just normal and logical. Bolshevik revolution was "avoiding pogroms" and "taking some revenge" for some, I am sure.

History is often portrayed by the majority population in a way that scapegoats minorities for all problems.

It's a two-way street and the same can be said about minorities who often believe they are victims all around. I'd rather take an objective approach, where every side is assigned some blame. Wouldn't you? Or in other approach, either side is blameless and is simply acting in their own interests that may diverge. But that's not what Jewish supremacists have in mind, to them their tribe is beyond reproach, and "anti-semitism" is some universal illness that's guaranteed to exist everywhere just because "Jews are special and misunderstood".

You have yet to explain how the Jews, who were not very numerous in Russia, were able to instigate a communist revolution (according to your theory) while they were not able to instigate one in Ukraine, Belarus, or Poland, where they made up a much larger percentage of the population.

First portion of your question is more technical, whether a minority can affect the course of history in any major way. I already answered that question somewhere. As for the second part, it's a topic of separate discussion. As far as I know, Jewish kommies were active in those countries too, and we had a discussion on how kommies were cheered in Poland in 1939. Also, could local population be more hostile to the movements that were headed by Jews, whose tricks they were up to? Also, Jewish kommies did have some successe in Hungary and Germany.

Have you considered the possibility that most Jews simply were not interested in communism?

It's possible, since most is only more than 50%. And what does "not interested" mean? Does sympathetic with the goals or using it for tribal goals qualify as "interested"?

39 posted on 12/10/2001 11:34:07 AM PST by madrussian
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

To: GROUCHOTWO
It's amusing that there are several Jewish posters on Sam Francis forum that are ranting and raving against blacks and hispanics. Well, they are being honest, that's all. LOL!

Unlike Inyokern, who diplomatically answered my question about how Jews regard Jesus, saying that he was a "charismatic preacher". What he doesn't say is what really counts. LOL!

40 posted on 12/10/2001 11:37:20 AM PST by madrussian
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 37 | View Replies]

To: madrussian
Honesty vs. diplomacy. At one time there wasn't such a divergence. Diplomacy was synonymous with tact, a genteel politeness. Diplomates with charged with using tact in dealing with difficult situations. Today it means lying through your teeth.

So inny says that his religion teaches Jesus was a charismatic leader. Does he give you official references for this?

P.S. Inny's statement that few Jews were communist must mean he is not from New York or that he is being 'diplomatic'.

41 posted on 12/10/2001 3:25:03 PM PST by GROUCHOTWO
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 40 | View Replies]

To: GROUCHOTWO
P.S. Inny's statement that few Jews were communist must mean he is not from New York or that he is being 'diplomatic'.

Or that he's bargaining furiously and employing that famous Jewish "answering question with a question" tactics and fuzzy logic. They should write a manual on how to fool people... oh wait, maybe they have already.

42 posted on 12/10/2001 3:33:47 PM PST by madrussian
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 41 | View Replies]

To: madrussian
And what does "not interested" mean? Does sympathetic with the goals or using it for tribal goals qualify as "interested"?

You can tell how people feel about a government by the way they vote with their feet. There were about 7 million Jews in the Russian Empire in 1917. By 1923, when the Soviet Union sealed the border against further emigration, there were only about 3 million Jews left. Most of the Jews who had lived in the Russian Empire chose not to live in the Soviet Union.

we had a discussion on how kommies were cheered in Poland in 1939.

No, it was not commies who were cheered, it was the Russian Army. And with good reason. Any Jew who got behind Russian lines and managed to stay there was likely to survive the war. 90% of the rest died. In hindsight, they were correct to cheer the Russian Army.

43 posted on 12/10/2001 5:30:01 PM PST by Inyokern
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 39 | View Replies]

To: madrussian
Unlike Inyokern, who diplomatically answered my question about how Jews regard Jesus, saying that he was a "charismatic preacher".

Do you perhaps have me mistaken for someone else? I don't remember that exchange. I have never called Jesus a "charismatic preacher," as far as I can recall.

44 posted on 12/10/2001 5:32:51 PM PST by Inyokern
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 40 | View Replies]

To: madrussian
I didn't realize that there was a new biography out on Hillary.
45 posted on 12/10/2001 5:56:34 PM PST by Rocky
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: madrussian
Dern, you are clever!

BTW, just in case he snoops on your posts I hope you don't mind if I throw in a few little USA commie pops just for fun:
Martin Sobol,
Harry Magdoff,
Nathan Silvermaster,
Jacob Golos,
Gregory Kheifetz,
Abe Taubman,
Armand Hammer,
Abe Heller,
Maurice Heller,
Bella Gold,
Theodore Hall(Holtzberg),
Philip Jaffe,
Samiel Dickstein,
Borris Morris,
and Noel Field.
This is a very short list of the old timers. None of them are Mormons, I promise you.

46 posted on 12/10/2001 6:26:03 PM PST by GROUCHOTWO
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: malarski; madrussian
Inyo, after working hard on Wayne Gacy (typical name from Czestochowa), twisted Theodore to Thaddeus to make a point.
He's almost as good as famous historian G. Will or sociologist Jan Gross.
Now he's lying on the other thread about Czechoslovakia again.
47 posted on 12/10/2001 6:57:18 PM PST by CommiesOut
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

To: CommiesOut
Inyo, after working hard on Wayne Gacy (typical name from Czestochowa), twisted Theodore to Thaddeus to make a point.

Do you want me to prove that Gacy and Kaczynski are Polish? Do you really really want that?

48 posted on 12/10/2001 7:23:08 PM PST by Inyokern
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 47 | View Replies]

To: GROUCHOTWO
This is a very short list of the old timers.

Jewish Nobel Prize Winners for Science Polish Nobel Prize Winners for Science
Altman, Sidney Sklodowska-Curie, Maria
Axelrod, Julius
Baltimore, David
Barany, Robert
Benacerraf, Baruj
Berg, Paul
Bethe, Hans Albrecht
Bloch, Felix
Bloch, Konrad
Blumberg, Baruch S.
Bohr, Niels
Born, Max
Brown, Herbert C.
Calvin, Melvin
Chain, Sir Ernst Boris
Charpak, Georges
Cohen, Stanley
Cohen-Tannoudji, Claude
de Hevesy, George
Edelman, Gerald M.
Ehrlich, Paul
Einstein, Albert
Elion, Gertrude B.
Erlanger, Joseph
Feynman, Richard P.
Franck, James
Friedman, Jerome I.
Furchgott, Robert F.
Gabor, Dennis
Gell-Mann, Murray
Gilbert, Walter
Gilman, Alfred G.
Glaser, Donald A.
Glashow, Sheldon L.
Goldstein, Joseph L.
Haber, Fritz
Hauptman, Herbert A.
Hertz, Gustav
Hoffmann, Roald
Hofstadter, Robert
Jacob, Francois
Josephson, Brian D.
Kandel, Eric R.
Kapitsa, Pyotr Leonidovich
Karle, Jerome
Katz, Sir Bernard
Klug, Sir Aaron
Kohn, Walter
Kornberg, Arthur
Krebs, Sir Hans Adolf
Landau, Lev Davidovich
Landsteiner, Karl
Lederberg, Joshua
Lederman, Leon M.
Lee, David M.
Levi-Montalcini, Rita
Lipmann, Fritz Albert
Lippmann, Gabriel
Loewi, Otto
Luria, Salvador E.
Lwoff, Andre
Marcus, Rudolph A.
Mechnikov, Elie
Meyerhof, Otto Fritz
Michelson, Albert Abraham
Milstein, Cesar
Moissan, Henri
Mottelson, Ben Roy
Muller, Hermann Joseph
Nathans, Daniel
Nirenberg, Marshall W.
Osheroff, Douglas D.
Penzias, Arno A.
Perl, Martin L.
Perutz, Max Ferdinand
Prusiner, Stanley B.
Rabi, Isidor Isaac
Reichstein, Tadeus
Reines, Frederick
Richter, Burton
Rodbell, Martin
Schally, Andrew V.
Schwartz, Melvin
Schwinger, Julian
Segre, Emilio Gino
Stein, William Howard
Steinberger, Jack
Stern, Otto
Temin, Howard Martin
Varmus, Harold E.
von Baeyer, Johann
Waksman, Selman
Wald, George
Wallach, Otto
Warburg, Otto Heinrich
Weinberg, Steven
Willstatter, Richard Martin
Yalow, Rosalyn

49 posted on 12/10/2001 8:04:13 PM PST by Inyokern
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 46 | View Replies]

To: GROUCHOTWO; madrussian; malarski; Askel5; Zviadist; kristinn; Free the USA; struwwelpeter...
This is the one that pushed for KKK marches in Chicago suburbs.

Surprised?
Imagine: all commie positions taken, Soviet Union doesn't exist anymore, in other words--nowhere to go.
What can an ambitious person to do in order to get noticed?

Here's about one dude who virtually brought Washington, DC to a halt:
It was a beautiful Saturday, 08/07/99. DC Freepers got ready for a weekly duty. But here they were--Nazis. And the downtown looked like Kandahar: 1,426 Police Officers, SS, Black Helicopters, Strange Vehicles, Commies, American Labour Party, Socialist Workers, Shalom International of Miami, AJC, NAACP, FReepers, you name it...
Neo-Nazis bail out of their march
Metastasizing hate
Outnumbered neo-Nazi group cancels hate march
Pictures: 1 2 3 4 5

"I think the city ought to sue these people," Police Chief Charles Ramsey angrily declared as he stood in his riot helmet complaining that the city had just spent close to $1 million protecting the civil rights of a no-show troublemaker.
Cmon, Chief... what's wrong with a little hutzpa?
50 posted on 12/10/2001 8:23:36 PM PST by CommiesOut
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 36 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-89 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson