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COP SHOOTS ‘ROLE PLAY’ SOLDIERS IN LETHAL ERROR
New York Post ^ | 2/25/02 | Post Wire Services

Posted on 02/25/2002 12:52:18 AM PST by kattracks

Edited on 05/26/2004 5:04:16 PM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]

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To: Dick Bachert
No, they're a DEAD and a WOUNDED STUDENT.

Sounds to me like General Shinseki was in charge of the thing.

And please -- both of you -- see your doctor about increasing your Prozac dosage.


Dick, this is a forum of differing opinions and thoughts. Some of us have actually attended this training, some of us have supervised this training, and some of us have organized and planned this training.

Here is a point of fact. There is not enough money or time to train Special Forces Candidates in all facets of Special Forces Operations in a TRADOC (School Environment).

The training is planned around a grouping of core critical elements designed to identify suitable candidates for acceptance in permanent positions within Special Forces assignments.

It takes years to develop a Special Forces Soldier both in and out of a School environment. The vast majority of quality training is received by Special Forces Soldiers when they are assigned to their Operational Detatchments within a Special Forces Group.

It is tragic and unfortunate that one candidate is dead and one was wounded in this training scenario, but consider this; Special Forces Operations are inherently dangerous. Most of our fatalities occur during the conduct of operations while serving on an Operational Detachment.

With these things in mind it is not necessary to provide a diatribe of personal attacks and comments of prozac dosages.
221 posted on 03/01/2002 4:08:48 AM PST by 18Z5W9
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To: Dick Bachert;rbmillerjr;sneakypete;dwsuwf
And please -- both of you -- see your doctor about increasing your Prozac dosage.

Gee, maybe you could email us some. Look around that obviously unused array of Anabuse and Lithium bottles until you find it. ;)
222 posted on 03/01/2002 4:30:57 AM PST by GussiedUp
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Comment #223 Removed by Moderator

To: GussiedUp;Dick Bachert
Gussy,it's obvious he has staked-out a "position" on all this,and there is no way he is about to let reality intrude on that position. You just can't reason with someone who won't listen.
224 posted on 03/01/2002 5:40:02 AM PST by sneakypete
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To: 18Z5W9
18,

Sorry about that. Guess I sorta lost it there.

I have a PERFECT solution for the problem of the difficulty in training a SF trooper: Either hire IRS agents away from the IRS or dip into the same pool from which they get their people. These folks seem to be naturally endowed with the stealth, animal cunning, killer instinct, etc., etc. required for the job. It would save tons of training money. Probably be able to ship them right out to Trashcanistan or wherever to seek and destroy the foe du jour.

(Gingrich once responded to a question from a constituent at a Town Hall Meeting about what we would do with all those IRS agents if we ever got a National Retail Sales Tax by saying they all should get weapons training and be sent south to guard our border with Mexico. Worked for me.)

Of course, unlike current SF folks (most of whom are still capabable of guilt feelings and remorse), THESE new guys could NEVER be allowed to return to the US: Waaayyyy too dangerous to life and liberty here.

225 posted on 03/01/2002 6:17:44 AM PST by Dick Bachert
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To: Thorn11cav
This is a true story another truth is DO NOT try this with a Texas Ranger or State Trooper...underneath those mirror sun glasses is a Android who's only program is DUTY. He will shoot you !!!

Funny story from my epic journey westward after 9/11:

I was driving a Mustang GT convertible from DC to San Diego, and I passed through Amarillo. Just west of the city center, I got pulled over right next to an onramp. I was sweating: I hadn't been speeding or anything.

The cop was a State Trooper who'd noticed the Maryland plates and the VERY careful maintenance of the speed limit (I'd been told that you just did NOT speed in Texas), noticed that I didn't have the top down on a sunny day (I'm pretty fair-skinned and didn't want to burn) and decided I was worth a look.

After a brief check of my license and a quick "Where ya headed/where ya comin' from" Q&A, he was handing back my license when something hit his head, bounced off the top of my car, and landed on the road outside my door. A truck full of rowdies comes up the onramp.

Trooper: "Suh, what was that thing that bounced offa mah head?"

I crane my neck and look down. "An empty Budweiser can."

"Suh, you have y'self a safe trip home. Ah got some bid'ness to tend to."

About four miles down the road, he's got six pieces of white trash in the position, hands on the hood of the truck, and he's tallying up the empty and full beer cans...

226 posted on 03/01/2002 6:53:21 AM PST by Poohbah
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Comment #227 Removed by Moderator

To: 18Z5W9
Great post at #221
228 posted on 03/01/2002 6:28:43 PM PST by rbmillerjr
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To: kattracks
Why is this posted now? This is old news.
229 posted on 03/01/2002 6:30:23 PM PST by KeyLargo
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To: sneakypete
Sign of the times.

In what way?

LEOs seeing terrorists under every rock, or conversely; Everyone's a bad guy but you and me, and I'm not so sure about you.

Definately a communications failure, But I've got to wonder if there isn't more to the story.

230 posted on 03/08/2002 4:07:17 AM PST by packrat01
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To: Lumberjack
Military Intelligence

Col. Flagg?

231 posted on 03/08/2002 5:20:43 AM PST by packrat01
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To: Stefan Stackhouse; sneakypete; harpseal; Squantos; GussiedUp; rbmillerjr; Dick Bachert...
ambush some of the real SF guys (who would only have blanks in their weapons)

Perhaps it speaks to their professionalism that they follow orders. FWIW, I never went anywhere with just blanks. Two stripper-clips in a chemical glove, stuffed in another chem glove, in a ziplock, secured with quadruple rubber bands; in a dedicated ammo pouch.

As an aside; SF with blanks against terrorists with ball? After heavy losses, the SF would ultimately prevail; IMHO.

232 posted on 03/08/2002 5:54:03 AM PST by packrat01
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To: packrat01
Col. Flagg?

"I am the wind" crashes through tent window.

"Oh look, the wind broke its led" says Hawkeye.

233 posted on 03/08/2002 6:07:16 AM PST by Lumberjack
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To: packrat01
. FWIW, I never went anywhere with just blanks.

I can tell you there is damn near zero chance of this happening on Robin Sage. The students are given a shake-down and them locked into isolation before their insert,and the "G's" are normally shaken-down after they are picked up at Bragg. Making sure none of them have any live ammo is the purpose of the shake-down. Nobody wants any mistakes made.

234 posted on 03/08/2002 4:09:10 PM PST by sneakypete
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To: sneakypete
Like I wrote: Perhaps it speaks to their professionalism that they follow orders.

My NCOs always knew what I carried, where I carried it, and assigned two other guys in our platoon with whom I had to "share".

Just don't let Kap'n Kupkake know you have it...

There's Safety First, there's Safety First; and then there's Safety First.

235 posted on 03/21/2002 6:13:33 AM PST by packrat01
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To: packrat01
I don't know who you were quoting,but it wasn't me.
236 posted on 03/21/2002 10:19:31 AM PST by sneakypete
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