Posted on 09/07/2003 6:43:17 AM PDT by new cruelty
Edited on 05/07/2004 6:01:29 PM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]
Remember as well that the French nobles who fought for the cause cause of freedom in America succumed to the revolutionaries in France. The French to whom the debt is owed died in the Revolution as it exterminated the nobility and all who weren't in absolute lock step.
The author convieniently omits our repayment during WWI and WWII. And lets face it, the US won the Cold War. So the Euro continent has had its bacon saved by us 3 times in the last century. Defending "Old Europe" is so Jeanne Garofalo..
With all the talk about France’s contribution to our victory in the American Revolution, I thought, as a Revolutionary War buff, I should outline their contributions for those who don’t really know much about it?
Following the surrender of Burgoyne’s badly mauled army at Saratoga NY on 17 Oct. 1777, France formally agrees to enter the war on our side. This major victory, a serious blow to Great Britain was won exclusively by American troops.
A long awaited French fleet under Count D’estaing arrives off New York in July 1778, unable to enter the harbor because the draft of their ships is too deep they sail instead to Newport Rhode Island where in operations from 22 July to 08 Aug. 1778 they attempt to seize Newport from its 3000 man British garrison, they fail! When they hear a British relief squadron is approaching they take ship and in a two day gale of Aug 11 and 12, 1778 both fleets are badly damaged. The French limp off to Boston and then to the West Indies.
After affecting repairs, the French fleet, still under D’estaing starts attacking British islands in the West Indies and takes a few, meanwhile, Washington and the Americans wonder where their “Ally” is? In the fall of 1779, the French finally sail north again, they join the Americans in an attack on Savannah Georgia from 12 Sept. to 09 Oct 1779….the attack is a failure again! The fleet sails back to the West Indies.
Meanwhile, another French Squadron under Count Rochambeau appears at Newport Rhode Island again on 12 July 1780. The British had abandoned the place months before and the French occupy it, but a British Squadron soon arrives and blockades the bay, the French will do nothing for the remainder of the year! As a side note, another French fleet with 5000 more soldiers destined for America ends up blockaded in the French Harbor at Brest….they will never see America!
Finally in fall 1781, British General Cornwallis limps into Yorktown VA after having to concede the Carolinas following a series of debatable “victories” and two very definite defeats (all at the hands of….are you ready……., AMERICANS) in which his army is rendered virtually useless. He entrenches there and awaits the arrival of the British Navy.
General Washington orders Americans to converge on Yorktown and even manages to convince Count Rochambeau to march there as well with 5000 of his men. A French fleet under Count De Grasse sails into the West Indies and up to the Chesapeake. The energetic De Grasse defeats a British Squadron at the mouth of the Chesapeake, lands his 3000 men and by 19 Oct 1781 the British surrender. The Yorktown Campaign is the only joint Franco American endeavor in the Revolution to enjoy success.
With the surrender of Cornwallis at Yorktown the war on American soil is over, British General Clinton is withdrawn from New York and sent with the British fleet to the West Indies to take them back from France, which, he manages to do with incredible ease. The French fleet is crippled at Guadeloupe and Admiral De Grasse is taken prisoner. Meanwhile another French fleet fights the British to a draw off the island of Ceylon but defeats on the Indian subcontinent mean that India will belong to Britain exclusively for the next 160 years. French attacks on the Channels Islands fail as does a joint attempt with Spain to seize Gibraltar.
Based on the facts of the case, France’s involvement meant really very little, though it did manage to distract the English for a brief time, the Royal Navy and its ground forces had no trouble dealing with the French at all! As mentioned before, the only real victory of the French at Yorktown is shared with a much larger American army.
While we are grateful to the people of France for coming to our “aid”, what was this aid really worth in terms of insuring our victory….upon consideration of the facts at hand, I would have to say, very little...
Semper Fidelis,
Mike
One and the same. If the Czechs and Austrians were threatening to invade the Islamic French Repub, er, France, who do you think they would call? The Belgians? The UN?
The French, embodying everything that is distasteful about Europe.
These days, winning a Pulitzer OR Nobel Prize only vaildates the recipient's role as a past, present OR future leftist tool.
And is Lockman's bow tie suppose to have us take him more seriously? We can see how it's helped Tucker Carlson...
After the treaty of Aix-la-Chapelle finished that earlier war, the hatred between the French and the English in the Americas never quite waned. It must be understood, that in 1755 France held most of America. The French land claims covered Canada (close to what we know know as Canada), as well as New France (that is, the stretch of land following the Mississippi River all the way to Louisiana).
The English, wanting to expand their land, often moved into the land claimed by the French. This encroachment forced the French to build several forts along the frontier. Some of these forts were Fort Duquesne (Near present day Pittsburgh), and Fort Miamis. The French, never lovers of the English due to hundreds of years of fighting, sent the Indians who allied themselves with the French in raiding parties in retaliation for raids conducted by the Indians on the English side, who claimed that thier raids were in retaliation for those made by the French. It didn't matter which side was correct, the main object wasn't to retaliate, but rather for the French to keep the English in their place, and for the English to iritate the French as much as possible until they moved out.
With the tensions already riding high, the French began to build litle Fort Le Boeuf downriver from Fort Duquesne, near Lake Erie. The English at this time claimed this land as their own. After some debate, the English decided to send a certain Major George Washington to the region of Fort Duquesne and evict the French. Washington, then 22 years old, headed a small party through the woods. While advancing, he came upon a party of French who were probably scouts. Washington gave the order to fire, and in the battle that ensued 10 French were killed, and some 22 captured. This, of course, was at a time of official peace. Washington was accused by the French of coldly leading an assasination of those men who were killed, and in fact even tricked Washington into signing a document that was translated into saying that he had attacked the party. In fact, the document he signed stated that he had Assasinated, rather than Attacked the party.
Mr. Lockman has a fine grasp of the comic book version of history. While the Fench did supply the American Revolution with credit, supplies, and eventually troops and naval support, their main focus was always directed at trying to capture the vastly important sugar-producing islands in the Caribbean from the British. When Washington requested help from the French fleet for a combined operation against Cornwallis at Yorktown, Count de Grasse allowed that he could only spare his fleet from the West Indies for a few weeks, no matter what effect this might have on Washington's plans or the American cause.
Later, when the Americans and the British began to negotiate a peace treaty that would give us our independence, they had to keep it secret from the French who saw no advantage comming to them if the war in America ended.
As Casey Stengel used to say: "That's a fact, you can look it up".
there would be no United States of America without France.
What Mr. Lockman seems to ignore – or is ignorant of – is that France did not help us during our revolt against England out of pure altruism, but as payback for the Treaty of Paris (1763) when the British received Canada from France and Florida from Spain. The resentment in France was similar to the resentment in Germany that helped lead to WWII.
The Spanish also helped us significantly, with the “loan” of 219 canon, 200 gun carriages, 30,000 muskets with 55,000 rounds of ammo, 12,000 bombs, 4,000 tents, 30,000 uniforms and $5 Million dollars.
Of course, as a journalist I can’t expect Mr. Lockman to know much history.
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