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To: BlackElk
If your position is that I must choose which evil I would rather endure then you have completely missed a nuance in what I wrote. I do not desire the presence of Illegal Aliens––whose presence is both a violation of our laws and a violation of that privilege which the Citizens should have to decide for themselves the state of immigration.

I have not ever written that I oppose lawful immigration on any principal, so your assertion that I'm somehow for the "calcification" of the nation is so much sophistry (and in a bad way).

If I'm to oppose lawlessness then I will do so.

As for abortion, it is sustained by a cancerous form of lawlessness that I've decried and presented sound constitutional reasonings against here at FR and elsewhere. Not to bore you but here is a short characterization of one position which may be used against abortion:

One of the principal reasons for the 14th Amendment was to enumerate to Congress the power to respect politically sourced civil rights which the several States could not disparage (the "privileges or immunities" clause).

Article 3:Section 2 of the Constitution defines the enumerated authority of the Court. It should be stressed that the article does not describe the Court as it now operats, but rather describes a Court that is only "supreme" within a limited sphere of enumerated jurisdictions (please also note that the Constitution does not capitalize "supreme" as if to say that the Court is the definitive article ... maybe it is past time we stopped doing so ourselves). The supreme Court is not even the "Supreme Court" over the several States except for these enumerated authorities––which are relatively narrow even considering the 14th Amendment.

At no time prior to 1973 did Congress ever seek to respect a civil right to an abortion that the several States could not disparage, so no "Laws of the United States" were in anyway involved nor has the 9th Amendment ever been extended to cover the several States––a specific point in the debates about the 14th Amendment. Even if it were, the Common Laws that are the subject of the 9th Amendment are quite clear: abortion is indefensible.

Therefore, the Court was utterly out of place to even accept the Roe case, much less render an opinion on it. It is fully within the rights of any State, its own Supreme Court or its Legislature, to rebuke and revoke such a lawless measure as is the pretend authority of sCOTUS to rule on such a matter as they did.

In short, I am trying to convince people of the plain truth that not only was Roe a bad opinion and ruling, but it is one that they utterly had no privilege to attempt and that they can be countermanded by any entity with superior local authority over their own laws who is willing to stick to their guns ... not some imagined international law but rather the several States themselves.

Naturally, such a tactic will not prevent abortions in all States nor could it ever return one murdered child to life; however, this is one constitutionally based logic to oppose abortion that makes no appeal to anything but law.

As I said, I will oppose lawlessness no matter if it is a great evil or comparatively minor one.

It is your position that we must endure these people who impose themselves on us simply because they may have some positive benefit that is unjustifiable.

No benefit they can ever render can annul the fact that they truthfully have no right to even make a difference simply because they chose to be here outside of our laws.
158 posted on 12/28/2006 10:13:35 PM PST by Rurudyne (Standup Philosopher)
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To: Rurudyne
While we have been arguing that the SCOTUS acted beyond its authority and unconstitutionally, 50 million innocents have been slaughtered with no end in sight. We argue. They ignore. They kill many more than a million per year by surgical abortions alone.

The 14th Amendment makes a distinction between a smaller group "citizens" and a larger group "persons." "Persons" has been held to include corporations. "Persons" also includes those natural persons who are NOT citizens but are present within our borders. The constitution says what it says and not what the border types wish it said. For example, any court would make short work of dismissing a governmental claim that police officers are able to wantonly beat non-citizens but not to so beat citizens. Equal protection extends to non-citizens who are persons.

If the non-citizens render the service of forcing a return to the recognition of the right to life, I'll take it. The rule of law died a very long time ago in the USA. Some of us prefer to deny that but it is true nonetheless. 50 million innocent dead is far MORE than enough.

159 posted on 12/29/2006 7:22:23 AM PST by BlackElk (Dean of Discipline of the Tomas de Torquemada Gentlemen's Club)
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