Greenspan warns against deficits (says to cut social security)

CNN ^ | 02/24/04

[hoosierboy]

NEW YORK (CNN/Money) - Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan warned Congress Wednesday to take quick action to fix the nation's swollen budget deficit, saying it could impair the ability to pay Social Security benefits and weigh on the broader economy.

[Cold Heat]

Government, like a family, can incur a large amount of debt and service it without giving up the weekly movie.

There is a point that it can indeed be a problem.

We reached one of those times a few years ago when the debt load was higher than now but the interest rates on the debt were very high. The high interest debt had to be retired and new borrowing at much lower interest rates took it's place.

Kind of like refinancing the government.

That is where we are today, and that is why the debt is not a real problem now.

But it could get much worse in about ten years and needs to be controlled so that we have more room to adjust to future SS expenditures..

[SierraWasp]

11:22 Greenspan: Inflation is not permanently subdued

There he goes again!!! The DJIA could use some of his Viagra as just as it finally starts to get it up above 10.6K, he spooks it again!!!

[kinghorse]

Oh and buy Mexican REITS. They are sending their working age folks here to work and pay taxes. We are sending our 50 plus crowd there to stretch a dollar.

[GraniteStateConservative]

If that were to actually happen, it would be because there is no government, nor a U.S.A anymore.

Well, if the world went to the Euro standard and Asians stopped financing our debt, that could almost happen.

[SierraWasp]

Gold futures are at a 3 month low, this A.M.!!!

[Grampa Dave]

I'm on social security and any adjustments as you noted will not cut my payments. If my trophy bride waits too long to go on Social Security, she will be impacted.

The headlines here are scare headlines to scare senior citizens into not voting for GW. Their current payments and mine will not be cut regardless of what anyone says.

The key is that current payments will not be cut and future payments will/may be deferred.

[Cold Heat]

11:22 Greenspan: Inflation is not permanently subdued

LOL! Always a market hot button.

It always gets pushed.

Just mention the word..................

[Grampa Dave]

Thanks for your clarification of what Greenspan really said not what people assume he said from the headlines:

The focus of this article is actually wrong. Greenspan didn't advocate cuts in SS, just suggested raising the age or changing the COLA figures.

What he said is the real problem is Medicare because it is virtually impossible to determine its cost. With an ageing population, advances in medical care, and additional entitlements (prescription drugs), this is the real culprit to our budget problems.

[happygrl]

The market liked the comments.

LOL, are you inferring that the market reads FreeRepublic ?

Not that it would be a bad thing....

[Cold Heat]

The headlines here are scare headlines to scare senior citizens into not voting for GW. Their current payments and mine will not be cut regardless of what anyone says.

Yes, you can smell the Rats a mile away.

The stench is intolerable.

[SierraWasp]

11:31 Greenspan: No worries on large foreign Treasury sales

Or, "Don't worry, be happy," right?

[Cold Heat]

LOL! NO>>>>>>>>>

Greenspans comments, at least at first.

This is just knee jerk stuff.

The real market problem today is a mis-read and fear of what Putin did. The oil markets are shook up and the news that the oil fields in Saudi Arabia have peaked.

Rats, Rats, Rats! They are Reutering the markets!

[jpsb]

What the problem? All the Bushbots keep telling me that the deficets are no big deal. Tens of Trillions of dollars in debt is cool. Obviouly Greenspan doesn't get it, yall need to flood Greenspan with email and letters explaining to how deficets either budget or tradre are really good things.

[Brownie74]

If the government was serious about saving money, which they're not, they could begin by stopping all of the benefits they are giving to illegal aliens.

Why take from Americans that have been forced to pay into this government sponsored ponzi scheme and give it to them? That's socialism - plain and simple.

[expatpat]

YOU may not have seen a cut if you were old enough. But everyone born after some time in 1938 is getting a cut because of the raising in retirement age that has already been implemented. Either in the monthly payment, if they retire before the new retirement age (like I did), or in total payments, if not, because of the missing payments between 65 and their new retirement age.

Any further raise in retirement age will cause further cuts. Your last sentence is erroneous, except for those who were lucky enough to beat the 1938 date.

[happygrl]

The retirement age has already shifted to 67 for many of us.

Low-income households get their SS deductions "rebated" through the Earned-Income tax provision, by which they receive money which they didn't pay into income tax.

[Cold Heat]

If the government was serious about saving money, which they're not, they could begin by stopping all of the benefits they are giving to illegal aliens.

And what benefit would those be?

Illegals do not get federal bennies.

The legals do.(not that they might share them with illegals)

[SierraWasp]

"This is just knee jerk stuff."

Well, I for one, wish he would step away from the microphone!!!

I just put some more in the market and we've had five consecutive down days and he's hamming it up on the microphone trying to make it a sixth day!!!

[Cold Heat]

You talk about cuts like a democrat.

Deferral and cut are not the same.

[SierraWasp]

11:42 Greenspan again rejects specific inflation target
11:41 Greenspan: Probability of deflation lower, but not zero

He just can't/won't STFU!!!

[Protagoras]

The only way a ponzi scheme such as this can end is in government default.

They will disguise it, but it will be default. They will default by cutting the promises back or by inflating the money and devaluing the money they pay back with. Probably both.

[Cold Heat]

Low-income households get their SS deductions "rebated" through the Earned-Income tax provision

That point should be well taken.

Should be.

[rintense]

Yeah, but all the Democrats hear is, 'CUT Social Security'. Abd they will play that up in the next month. Just watch.

[Cold Heat]

Yes, the end of the world is near![sarc]

[Cold Heat]

STFU! LOL!:-)

[happygrl]

The real market problem today is a mis-read and fear of what Putin did.

They SHOULD be reading FR, then....

[Protagoras]

I miss the meaning of that comment.

[Grampa Dave]

BS.

Remarks like yours will scare the old people on SS who will not receive a cut if there are changes.

Come on. You are sounding like the gloomers and doomers on this. The proposals are not cuts for those of us on SS now, from my age of 65 to higher. That is the same language the liberals use when a conservative plans to reduce future spending. They scream cuts, and there have been no cuts, just reductions of proposed spending.

Use your excellent mind and economic sense to create a system where you and younger people can invest part of your social security payments into the markets. Whining about this is where the libs are. Younger conservatives will try to take these comments and in 2005 and beyond create a better program for them and their family.

[Cold Heat]

yeah, he is just exciting his base, because if the voter turnout is below 51%, the election is voided by Russian law.

There is little interest in the election, so he is spicing it up.

[Grampa Dave]

Amen, fellow conservative:

To: expatpat

You talk about cuts like a democrat. Deferral and cut are not the same.

[Brownie74]

Are you kidding me? What about Medicare and Medicaid for openers. A vast majority of these illegals are using forged birth certificates, drivers license, and Social Security cards to get Section 8 housing, food stamps, and other freebies.

Ever heard of anchor babies?

[Grampa Dave]

Bingo! You win the door prize for why this article's headline was written this way.

Yeah, but all the Democrats hear is, 'CUT Social Security'. And they will play that up in the next month. Just watch!

[expatpat]

The fact is that my monthly payment has been reduced by the raise in retirement age -- that is a cut in anyone's dictionary.

Deferral is certainly a cut if the effect of the deferral is never remedied -- and it isn't. What you miss in the first year or so, you never get back. (And anyone who knows about discounted cash flow would say it was a cut, even if was remedied).

And don't call me a democrat again.

[expatpat]

For you, too, Gramps.

[Grampa Dave]

You nailed this headline with this reply:

To: Grampa Dave

The headlines here are scare headlines to scare senior citizens into not voting for GW. Their current payments and mine will not be cut regardless of what anyone says.
Yes, you can smell the Rats a mile away.

The stench is intolerable.

[Cold Heat]

Ever heard of anchor babies?

Those are legal.

Fraud is fraud, and is being done by citizens as well. That is another matter, as is what States do with their Medicaid.

I just pointed out a commonly repeated statement that has no basis in reality.

just like the one that says "Illegals vote and screw up the elections")

So do dead people and white trash that gets paid for every vote they cast. Fraud is fraud.

It is the State that is responsible for fixing the Fraud in voting and in Medicaid.

They have not been very good at enforcement. Not good at all.

[Grampa Dave]

How old are you? :)

[Muleteam1]

>>If that were to actually happen, it would be because there is no government, nor a U.S.A anymore.<<

Sorry but cuts, even the demise of, government social programs is not a misconception on the part of younger Americans. The government has demonstrated over and over again that it can replace, restructure, or phase out certain programs. The new or phased-down programs may, or may not, be as beneficial to the recipients. The pyramid styling of SS is certainly a program which demands scrutiny and much scepticism as to its continued viability.

Muleteam1

[expatpat]

Look, I have no problem with changing SS, especially if it allows people to invest their money themselves instead of giving it to the govt. However, to pretend that the cut was not a cut is as bad as pretending a slowing of growth is a cut.

[Cold Heat]

The pyramid styling of SS is certainly a program which demands scrutiny and much scepticism as to its continued viability.

The original setup was a PAYGO type accounting.

Over the years the democrats subverted this and added benefits that were never intended. They also increased the amounts of the tax to save the system and then spent the money on other things. That is what happened.

Also, the fact that medicine has improved so much and the lifespans of nonworking years have increased to the point of negating the original intentions.

All this in no way kills the system, but as Greenspan has pointed out, these things MUST be addressed by congress NOW and not later.

Governments lack of ability to invest or save money is the real problem. They cannot bank it.

[oceanview]

we are already "cutting" SS, the inflation numbers that come from the government are understated, which reduces the COLAs.

[ZULU]

Bush should have the CIA kidnap Greenspan, gag him, tie him up, and lock him in a closet somewhere in Iraq until after November 4th.

This "Republican" manufactured a recession during his father's last year of office, assuring Bush I's defeat,

Greenspan is a nutcase.

[RetiredArmy]

Greenspan opens his mouth and the market will probably take a plung. Should just keep his democratic pie hole shut.

[Brownie74]

Yeah, the anchor babies are born U. S. citizens but that does not make the mother or father (whom are usually not married) U. S. citizens. But yet the government feels the need to care for these people while taking from us.

I can't even get near a VA Hospital anymore because of government cutbacks. But go to any hospital emergency room on any given day and it will be packed with illegal aliens. They have to go there because they do not have private physicians so they use the emergency rooms and ER doctors as their primary physicians.

The people that are paying for this fiasco is the same people Greenspan is suggesting cutting benefits to.

End of story!!

[Cold Heat]

the government are understated,

understated from what?

The COLA formula was broken and they are fixing it little by little.

The Numbers now, do seem to track better with the actual cost of living. This would not be understatement if that is the case, and it appears to be for most, except the people who want to make it a election issue and say the repubs are Killing SS and starving old people or pushing them off cliffs in wheel chairs.

[GailA]

By raising the age they are trying to cheat you out of what you paid in. Men don't live as long as women. And a surviving wife only get a small portion of what her husband paid in.

I don't have enough quarters to draw on what I paid in. So the feds will keep what I paid in. As drawing on my husband's SS would net me more per month.

[Joe Hadenuf]

Grumpy seniors will get mad, but also boomers, if they feel that they have been paying into the system for 30 plus years and they are going to get a rate cut. This could be political dynomite.

The people just keep getting screwed by the DC elite......

[Grampa Dave]

Greenspan's babbling about the potential of inflation hit the Dow rather hard.

Hopefully he has left and isn't babbling any more.

[Cold Heat]

Greenspan has stated all along that the SS system, as it is now, will not be sufficient for FUTURE RETIREMENTS.

The current retirement crop will be ok, but the future must be looked at and people paying into the system now need to support changes that would be good for them in the future.

Like private investment of SS taxes not coming out of your check.

The future belongs to you.

You must take those reigns in your hands and do what is right for your generation and those that follow.

I think that people going into the system now and people on it now, understand this. Their benefit growth will have to stop and slow way down as you revamp for your needs that your children will be paying for.

This all sounds good, I know, but it is the reality.

[swarthyguy]

Politically speaking, tres, tres stooopid.

Singlehandedly, Greenspun has given the Democrats a huge issue to hang on Bush's neck, bigger than the fay marriage issue that Bush plans to hang around Kerry's neck.

How do you think this is playing in Florida? People won't blame Andrea's hubbie but with the right encouragement, be played by fear of the usual Repub bugaboos by the Dems and will ask Bush to explicitly deny this.

Explosive to even mention this in an election year, but shows which way the wind is blowing.