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Christian lied about faith to survive Saudi siege
Reuters ^ | 31 May 2004 14:43:21 GMT | Samia Nakhoul

Posted on 05/31/2004 9:00:49 AM PDT by Ernest_at_the_Beach

KHOBAR, Saudi Arabia, May 31 (Reuters) - A Christian Arab who was held captive by al Qaeda militants in Saudi Arabia said on Monday he lied to them about his faith and praised their battle against the West, to save his life.

Nizar Hajazeen, a Jordanian software businessmen who was at the Tower hotel in the Oasis compound during the 25-hour drama in Khobar, said the militants lectured him about Islam and their aim to liberate Saudi Arabia from "infidels and crusaders".

The complex where the militants held about 50 foreigners -- including some Westerners -- was their last target in the violence in the eastern Saudi oil city in which they killed at least 22 people.

Hajazeen, 32, had tried to call a cab to go to work on Saturday but the phone lines were jumbled.

"I went down and the Filipino receptionist told me there were terrorists in the compound and gunshots were heard," he told Reuters.

He tried to help security guards close the hotel entrance gate but the lock did not work and a manager recommended he hide, Hajazeen said.

"I went to the room of a Jordanian colleague. Someone banged violently on the door. We opened and there were two men, one with a machinegun, another with a revolver. They were wearing black track suits," he said, adding that one had a wounded arm.

Both were in their twenties.

"They asked us if we were Arab or Westerners. We told them: 'We're Arab'.

"One then asked if I was a Christian or a Muslim. I told him we were Muslims and showed him my colleague's Koran as proof. I told him we supported them and that we were against America and Europe. I had to say that."

"HAPPY BIRTHDAY"

Residents of the compound said the attackers asked everyone they encountered if they were Muslim or Christian, before taking them hostage or killing them.

An Oasis manager said the gunmen shot and killed several Westerners as soon as they entered the complex.

The gunmen made two Indian hotel staff with master keys show them where the Westerners were, Hajazeen said.

His brother called him on his mobile phone to wish him a happy birthday -- a day late -- just as the militants were saying their motive was to drive Americans and Christians from their country.

"They asked me to turn off my mobile but did not take it away as they did with others," Hajazeen said, adding that they told him and his colleague to stay in the room and left.

"We stayed locked in our room. One of us was hiding in the shower, another one was hiding in the bathtub," Hajazeen said, adding that from time to time they sneaked back into the bedroom to watch the news on television.

He said that before commandos freed them on Sunday, compound security guards called his mobile to ask him to check if the militants had rigged his floor with explosives. He found nothing.

"Before the commandos came, there was heavy gunfire and one explosion shook the hotel. We could hear glass being smashed, screams... It sounded like someone was giving out orders."

Saudi security forces later called them out, saying: "Do not be scared."

Making his way to freedom he saw the bodies of four Indians and an Italian cook.

"They had been shot dead. Some were on the staircases."


TOPICS: Extended News; Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: alqaeda; christianarabs; coward; hostages; khobar; radicalmuslims; saudiarabia
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Sanitized version, no mention of mutiliation of the 9 killed.
1 posted on 05/31/2004 9:00:50 AM PDT by Ernest_at_the_Beach
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach
Sanitized version, no mention of mutiliation of the 9 killed.

I heard some had been mutilated. No more mention of this.

2 posted on 05/31/2004 9:04:16 AM PDT by SheLion (Please register to vote! We can't afford to be silent.)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

Nothing wrong with lying to the moslem scum...


3 posted on 05/31/2004 9:06:16 AM PDT by isthisnickcool (I'm isthisnickcool, and I approved this post!)
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To: isthisnickcool

I agree....nothing with with lying!


4 posted on 05/31/2004 9:07:08 AM PDT by Arpege92 (There are no more political simpletons in the world today other than European Leftist -Yossi Halevi)
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To: Arpege92

nothing wrong with lying!


5 posted on 05/31/2004 9:07:32 AM PDT by Arpege92 (There are no more political simpletons in the world today other than European Leftist -Yossi Halevi)
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To: isthisnickcool; hellinahandcart

This guy has just lost his eternal life. He'd better enjoy this one.


6 posted on 05/31/2004 9:07:49 AM PDT by sauropod (Paleo-cons make better lovers)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach
Matthew 10:32-33 "Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess before my Father which is in heaven. But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven."

This is the first thing I thought of when I read the headline. Very sad.
7 posted on 05/31/2004 9:09:14 AM PDT by DocRock
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To: sauropod

Sez who?


8 posted on 05/31/2004 9:09:18 AM PDT by TheOldRepublic
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To: sauropod
This guy has just lost his eternal life. He'd better enjoy this one.
Peter denied Christ 3 times and received forgiveness.

9 posted on 05/31/2004 9:09:30 AM PDT by DallasMike
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

"Everyone therefore who shall confess Me before men, I will also confess him before My Father who is in heaven. But whoever shall deny Me before men, I will also deny him before My Father who is in heaven." Matthew 10:32-33


10 posted on 05/31/2004 9:10:04 AM PDT by JeepInMazar
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To: isthisnickcool
Nothing wrong with lying to the moslem scum...

You do what you have to do to survive. I don't blame the guy. They deserve to be lied to and he probably has family that are very relieved that he is alive.
11 posted on 05/31/2004 9:10:11 AM PDT by LoudRepublicangirl (loudrepublicangirl)
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To: DocRock



You guys are nut jobs


12 posted on 05/31/2004 9:10:26 AM PDT by jern
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

This is why we're fighting in Iraq. Period.


13 posted on 05/31/2004 9:10:44 AM PDT by Ciexyz ("FR, best viewed with a budgie on hand")
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To: sauropod

Would you have told the Nazis that there were Jews in your attic? Some vengeful deity you have there, that forbids lying to representatives of the devil himself.


14 posted on 05/31/2004 9:10:54 AM PDT by hunter112
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To: DocRock
Matthew 10:32-33 "Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess before my Father which is in heaven. But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven."

I knew I had read that. Oh boy!  Very sad indeed.

15 posted on 05/31/2004 9:11:37 AM PDT by SheLion (Please register to vote! We can't afford to be silent.)
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To: isthisnickcool

This is a tough one...Peter denied Jesus three times, and yet still became the "Rock of the Church."

A girl at Columbine refused to denounce her faith and was murdered. Of course, chances are even if she did denounce her faith they would have shot her anyway.

This is a very tough question: is it ok to deny your faith to save your life? How "bad" of a lie is this? Is it worse because you're sort of "reverse witnessing" or would it be worse to die and not be able to live and witness to more people?


16 posted on 05/31/2004 9:11:57 AM PDT by craig_eddy
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To: jern; DocRock
You guys are nut jobs

Why do you say that?

17 posted on 05/31/2004 9:13:21 AM PDT by SheLion (Please register to vote! We can't afford to be silent.)
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To: SheLion

What - a mutilation ??


18 posted on 05/31/2004 9:13:35 AM PDT by traumer
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach
Residents of the compound said the attackers asked everyone they encountered if they were Muslim or Christian, before taking them hostage or killing them.

A test of faith; coming soon to a country near you?

19 posted on 05/31/2004 9:13:58 AM PDT by neutrino (Everybody, soon or late, sits down to a banquet of consequences. Robert Louis Stevenson.)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach
Matthew 10:26-33; 38-39

"So do not be afraid of them. There is nothing concealed that will not be disclosed, or hidden that will not be made known. What I tell you in the dark, speak in the daylight; what is whispered in your ear, proclaim from the roofs. Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell. Are not two sparrows sold for a penny? Yet not one of them will fall to the ground apart from the will of your Father. And even the very hairs of your head are all numbered. So don't be afraid; you are worth more than many sparrows. "Whoever acknowledges me before men, I will also acknowledge him before my Father in heaven. But whoever disowns me before men, I will disown him before my Father in heaven. . . .

and anyone who does not take his cross and follow me is not worthy of me. Whoever finds his life will lose it, and whoever loses his life for my sake will find it.

20 posted on 05/31/2004 9:14:14 AM PDT by agrarianlady
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To: jern
"You guys are nut jobs"

Why? Because we know scripture?
21 posted on 05/31/2004 9:14:20 AM PDT by DocRock
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To: isthisnickcool

Nor I. It is the duty of all non-Muslimes to lie to the scum. But unlike the Joprdanian here, I would not tell the world I had lied, one knows that Jordan is a hot bed for the creeps ter perps.


22 posted on 05/31/2004 9:14:35 AM PDT by Ursus arctos horribilis ("It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees!" Emiliano Zapata 1879-1919)
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To: Arpege92

Deny Christ and God will deny you in the afterlife.

He should enjoy the time he has left on earth. It will be more pleasant than what is in store for him.


23 posted on 05/31/2004 9:14:42 AM PDT by Delta 21 (MKC USCG -ret)
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To: sauropod

Peter also rejected Jesus before the crowd. Still, I have a feeling Peter will be in heaven...

Our eternal life is not dependent on our perfection. It is dependent on Jesus' perfection - the perfection that understands our human frailties and weaknesses, and loves us yet.

Condemned the ones who murdered the Christians, rather than the Christians who faltered in the face of such evil.


24 posted on 05/31/2004 9:15:11 AM PDT by dandelion
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To: JeepInMazar

I would thank God would make an exception for such times.


25 posted on 05/31/2004 9:15:49 AM PDT by Ursus arctos horribilis ("It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees!" Emiliano Zapata 1879-1919)
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To: traumer
What - a mutilation ??

Huh?

I was wondering why he called us "nut jobs." What was said to make him say that.......

26 posted on 05/31/2004 9:16:08 AM PDT by SheLion (Please register to vote! We can't afford to be silent.)
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To: dandelion

"Our eternal life is not dependent on our perfection. It is dependent on Jesus' perfection - the perfection that understands our human frailties and weaknesses, and loves us yet."

I have been trying to come up with a way to express my thoughts on this thread, and you have just said it beautifully. Thank you.


27 posted on 05/31/2004 9:16:59 AM PDT by proud American in Canada
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To: neutrino
A test of faith; coming soon to a country near you?

I fear that it is coming soon. And "Muslim-Americans" (how I hate using references to hyphenated Americans) will find that they will fail the Islamist's "test of faith" because they will be found to be "not Muslim enough."

28 posted on 05/31/2004 9:17:22 AM PDT by craig_eddy
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To: sauropod

Where do you get that?


29 posted on 05/31/2004 9:17:31 AM PDT by Godfollow
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To: sauropod

Pod, if he HAD eternal life, he still has it.

The question is whether he had it to begin with.

I only hope I would not deny Christ in such a time. Even some major heroes of the reformation denied Jesus the first time, but the last time, they recanted and boldly proclaimed their faith to their death.


30 posted on 05/31/2004 9:17:35 AM PDT by RaceBannon (VOTE DEMOCRAT AND LEARN ARABIC FREE!!)
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To: sauropod
Stop it! The ONLY way the world now knows WHY they want to kill is because of this person!

If this person turns his back to Jesus, that's one thing.....but I don't think that's what happened.

31 posted on 05/31/2004 9:17:35 AM PDT by Ann Archy (Abortion: The Human Sacrifice to the god of Convenience.)
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To: sauropod
This guy has just lost his eternal life. He'd better enjoy this one.

You don't make that decision.....Some people in this thread should stop judging the guy for lying and let the Almighty work it out when the time comes.


Peter denied Christ 3 times and received forgiveness.
THANK YOU!

32 posted on 05/31/2004 9:17:57 AM PDT by Ragirl (Vote in '04 ! Those who sit on their hands end up with poop on them.)
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To: SheLion
"I was wondering why he called us "nut jobs." What was said to make him say that.......:

I don't know because I didn't judge this person, all I said was that this scripture came to mind and I was sad.
33 posted on 05/31/2004 9:18:20 AM PDT by DocRock
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To: traumer
What - a mutilation ??

Oh! Ok! I'm waking us now. heh!

Someone on Fox News said that some bodies had been mutilated. But then nothing else was mentioned.

34 posted on 05/31/2004 9:18:55 AM PDT by SheLion (Please register to vote! We can't afford to be silent.)
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To: LoudRepublicangirl
Matthew 10:32-33 "Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess before my Father which is in heaven. But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven."

They weren't confronted by men, but by animals, and vermin at that. I think they get a pass.

35 posted on 05/31/2004 9:18:58 AM PDT by BulletBobCo
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To: TheOldRepublic

The people that see the Bible as the worlds largest chose you own adventure book and will point out 1-3 verses that support their point, ignoring everything else that may hurt their point.


36 posted on 05/31/2004 9:20:09 AM PDT by inflation (Cuba = BAD, China = Good? Why, should not both be treated the way Cuba is?)
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To: DocRock
But whosoever shall deny me before men

These al Qaeda scum are NOT men.
37 posted on 05/31/2004 9:20:42 AM PDT by dyed_in_the_wool (Why do Al Qaeda and DNC press releases always sound the same?)
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To: sauropod
That's twisted. Abraham lied to the Egyptians about his wife, and the Egyptians incurred G-d's wrath, not Abraham. And he put his wife in danger.

What if your kids were in the room with you, would you lie then?

38 posted on 05/31/2004 9:20:50 AM PDT by Lijahsbubbe
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To: DocRock
If the scripture you quote demands being honest about your faith to a criminal murdering gang who want to kill you for it, then I disagree with the scripture. It is ludicrous, and wrong. I suspect however your interpretation is idiosyncratic, but that is for others to comment on.
39 posted on 05/31/2004 9:21:02 AM PDT by Torie
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To: Ragirl; Bobby777; Thinkin' Gal
You're right. I don't make that decision.

But have you forgotten the verse where Jesus says (paraphrasing) "Those who deny Me before men I will also deny. Those who acknowledge Me before men I will also acknowledge."?

40 posted on 05/31/2004 9:21:05 AM PDT by sauropod (Paleo-cons make better lovers)
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To: LoudRepublicangirl

Right!


41 posted on 05/31/2004 9:21:09 AM PDT by Ernest_at_the_Beach (The terrorists and their supporters declared war on the United States - and war is what they got!!!!)
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To: DocRock; Ragirl

This is the verse I was trying to remember. Thank you.


42 posted on 05/31/2004 9:21:49 AM PDT by sauropod (Paleo-cons make better lovers)
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To: sauropod

It's a good thing that you aren't God...He who knows the heart of each of us. I am not smart enough to know where this man will spend his eternity...and no matter what you say, neither are you


43 posted on 05/31/2004 9:21:49 AM PDT by jnarcus
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To: SheLion

Because you bring out 1,2 mayber 3 versus that support your point, ignoring the rest of the Bible in your quest to make a point.

The Bible is a religious text, it isn't ment to be the worlds largest chose your own adventure book.


44 posted on 05/31/2004 9:22:10 AM PDT by inflation (Cuba = BAD, China = Good? Why, should not both be treated the way Cuba is?)
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To: TheOldRepublic

Jesus. See post #7.


45 posted on 05/31/2004 9:22:20 AM PDT by sauropod (Paleo-cons make better lovers)
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To: DocRock
Why? Because we know scripture?

Did you also know that Donatism is a heresy? ;^)

(Don't mind me. I've no dog in this hunt. Just a hit-and-run to stir the pot.)

46 posted on 05/31/2004 9:22:21 AM PDT by Physicist
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To: Ann Archy
If this person turns his back to Jesus, that's one thing

Aye, THERE'S the rub, Ann Archy. You've expressed the difference: simply lying to a murderer is not "turning your back on Jesus." And I believe if we dug deeper into the scripture quoted, we'd find that that was Jesus' intent in this message: live your life as my follower.

To have eternal life you must accept Jesus as your Savior. So does knowingly lying to a murderer about your faith mean YOU haven't accepted Jesus as your Lord and Savior? I hardly think so.

47 posted on 05/31/2004 9:22:47 AM PDT by craig_eddy
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To: DocRock
I don't know because I didn't judge this person, all I said was that this scripture came to mind and I was sad.

I'm sad too. That came to mind for me when I first read the thread.

Did you ever hear the story about the Church in Russia? The Russian soldiers went into the full Church with their rifles pointed and one ask "Those who are not Christian can leave." A few trickled out of the Church thinking that the soldiers were going to kill the Christians.

After they left, the soldiers put their rifles down and said "Good. We wanted to make sure everyone was of our faith here."

48 posted on 05/31/2004 9:22:54 AM PDT by SheLion (Please register to vote! We can't afford to be silent.)
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To: traumer
mutilation

Spell checker says that is OK.

Early reports say 9 hostages had their throats slit.

Later versions are more .... sanitized...
49 posted on 05/31/2004 9:23:15 AM PDT by Ernest_at_the_Beach (The terrorists and their supporters declared war on the United States - and war is what they got!!!!)
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To: jnarcus

Talk is cheap. We have many brave Christians here...fighting Satan at the front lines...of their keyboards!!!


50 posted on 05/31/2004 9:23:39 AM PDT by Bluntpoint
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