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Firefox, bah humbug
ZDNet ^ | November 4, 2004 | John Carroll

Posted on 11/04/2004 3:56:42 PM PST by BigSkyFreeper

Commentary--Firefox has been getting a lot of press lately. Firefox is free software in the Stallman-sanctioned sense--released under a GPL license and built atop technology developed for the Mozilla project. Everybody LOVES Firefox. Not only is it a great browser, but it will make your teeth whiter and secure you a date with Carmen Electra.

Okay, perhaps I exaggerate, but on that note, I haven’t seen ANYONE criticize Firefox. To a certain extent, this is because it is the best alternative in a world dominated by Internet Explorer (cue Opera/Safari/Konqueror fans to go into a frothing rage). On the other hand, as I can personally attest, it is politically incorrect in the extreme to criticize anything stamped with the open source moniker.

In short, though Firefox is a good browser, political considerations have allowed it to escape some deserved criticism. Firefox supporters make some rather costly demands of Web sites, particularly given that it commands such a small, albeit growing, share of the browser marketplace. Recent feverish Firefox support pieces aside, I still think that ignoring IE’s non-standard features will prove a large, and unnecessary, barrier to the success of the best alternative to Internet Explorer.

My Experience providing support for Firefox
As a certain square-jawed actor might have said had he been abducted by aliens and forced to write software, "the experience of one programmer doesn’t amount to a hill of beans in this crazy world." Even so, for a browser that touts its support for HTML standards, I was surprised to find that it had difficulty with standard HTML.

(Excerpt) Read more at news.zdnet.com ...


TOPICS: Editorial; Miscellaneous; Technical
KEYWORDS: firefox
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To: Revel

Unfortunately, each one does a completely different thing: you'll have to wade through 'em on your own, as I'd probably screw up the recommendation.

http://update.mozilla.org
http://www.extensionsmirror.nl


151 posted on 11/04/2004 6:12:31 PM PST by Terpfen (Anyone who worried about the election: crack a smile. We won.)
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To: ShadowAce

It crashed on me again tonight. Don't know why, but when it crashes, the tabs come back up like they were, at least on the same link.

Its stability may be a little overrated, but its way better than any alternative. I hope they upgrade it to fix the issues I've complained about and make it more stable.


152 posted on 11/04/2004 8:41:36 PM PST by 1L
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To: tallhappy

dittos to the other responses to Acrobat. I have never had a problem with .pdf files.... ever.


153 posted on 11/04/2004 9:52:46 PM PST by buzzyboop (no tags, no fuss)
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To: BigSkyFreeper

Firefox is a huge PITA when trying to load certain webpages. Putting the National Weather Service radar into motion literally takes almost a minute, while in IE it was nearly instaneous.


154 posted on 11/04/2004 9:57:27 PM PST by Diddle E. Squat
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To: BigSkyFreeper

I like Firefox it's a good browser and you don't need spywaare removers like you do with MS.


155 posted on 11/04/2004 10:02:49 PM PST by John Lenin
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To: BigSkyFreeper; tallhappy
Nope. I'm using Acrobat 6.0, and have been using 6.0 since the initial release of Windows XP.

Crashes using Acrobat which makes it useless.
______________________________________________________

I'm no expert. Have you read the following info at http://plugindoc.mozdev.org/windows.html
It solved that problem for me.
______________________________________________________

Acrobat Adobe Reader


Version: 4.0 and later
The Acrobat Reader 5.x and Adobe Reader 6.0x installers will automatically detect your browser's plugins folder and install the plugin.

Important! All users of Adobe Reader 6.0.x should update to Adobe Reader 6.02. Download this update.
156 posted on 11/04/2004 11:52:47 PM PST by Eagle9
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To: Diddle E. Squat
Firefox is a huge PITA when trying to load certain webpages. Putting the National Weather Service radar into motion literally takes almost a minute, while in IE it was nearly instaneous.

All the while both IE (in Win XP) and FF use the same Java engine from Sun, and IE executes the Java applets faster.

157 posted on 11/05/2004 1:27:27 AM PST by BigSkyFreeper (Congratulations President-Re-Elect George W. Bush!)
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To: Knitebane

Neither can you. Your still putting money into Gate's pocket even if you bought a computer with Windows already on it, despite the fact you may think your getting a free copy, which you're not. That's why computers cost as much as they do.


158 posted on 11/05/2004 2:08:19 AM PST by BigSkyFreeper (Congratulations President-Re-Elect George W. Bush!)
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To: TruBluKentuckian

The look of FF reminds me of Netscape 2.0. You're right, it is like stepping into a time warp.


159 posted on 11/05/2004 2:11:17 AM PST by BigSkyFreeper (Congratulations President-Re-Elect George W. Bush!)
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To: paulsy; ShadowAce
Thanks for the cntrl-T feature. Still learning with Firefox and Fedora-Linus.... It is super fast on my machine...

Not as fast as this one though:

IBM Supercomputer Again Claims Record (nearly doubles its record set few months earlier )

160 posted on 11/05/2004 7:47:11 AM PST by Ernest_at_the_Beach (A Proud member of Free Republic ~~The New Face of the Fourth Estate since 1996.)
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To: 1L

... on (1), load the desired multiple tabs in your FF browser ... then "Bookmark This Page" (on any one of them) and check "bookmark all tabs in folder" ... that's all ... on (2) .. go to "Tools/Options", takes just a few seconds to permit the page/control you're looking at ..

... I'm a management consultant, am on the net alot ... had been using IE since 1996 until July, tried Opera, Mozilla then Firefox 1.0 ... rough advantages over IE (Imp = relative importance to me):

.....Item.....................Imp....IE......FF

Update aggravation ...........24......5.....100
Virus attacks ................18......60.....99
Spyware attacks ..............23......30.....99
Download speed (dialup)........5......40.....95
Popup, ad blocking............20......20.....95
Other stuff (lots of it)......10......0......90

Totals/Weighted Grade........100.....25......97

... have had zero problems with virus or Spyware since July (had many before), have done no updates of any kind ... have not needed IE at all since I figured out (2) above ...

HK


161 posted on 11/05/2004 11:13:08 AM PST by HK Ball
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To: BigSkyFreeper
Your still putting money into Gate's pocket even if you bought a computer with Windows already on it, despite the fact you may think your getting a free copy, which you're not. That's why computers cost as much as they do.

That's why I build my own computers. I haven't bought a copy of Windows since Win98SE. And I haven't used Windows (on my own network...I've used everything up to 2003 on other people's machines) since then.

And I'm well aware that Windows isn't "free" with a new computer. The cost is just buried.

And I don't give money to Mr. Bill, so I build 'em myself.

TANSTAAFL

162 posted on 11/05/2004 1:05:09 PM PST by Knitebane
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To: BigSkyFreeper
I've been hand coding HTML in Notepad since 1995

I almost hate to ask... but I really have to. Why!?! Why are you still hand coding HTML in notepad?

I see "handcoded in notepad" as a badge of honor on websites everywere.. both good and bad.

I can understand if you don't want to use a WYSIWYG interface like Dreamweaver MX (even though it is a beautiful thing). People all tell me that hand coded is always best, but often when I hand code something and run it through Dreamweaver it ends up a little better... and I mean from the HTML source point of view.

But if you insist on doing it all by hand, which is perfectly valid, please at least get a decent text editor like emacs or vi, or one of the many decent text editors made for windows. Things like syntax highlighting and decent scripting can be very nice... while... notepad makes me very very sad :-(

-paridel
163 posted on 11/10/2004 5:05:08 PM PST by Paridel
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To: Knitebane
Mozilla isn't free. It's community supported. If you downloaded it, that means you

What is wrong with just wanting to download a piece of software and have it work? Why should using a piece of software, free or otherwise, obligate you to submit a bug report to the developers?

Please don't tell me you are obligated to because it's a community project. Because it may very well be the case that the existance of the community project may mean that a commercial alternative was never developed.

It may be a nice thing to do to contribute back to the community but why are you obligated? I never read that in the GPL.

-paridel
164 posted on 11/10/2004 5:09:04 PM PST by Paridel
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To: Paridel
Please don't tell me you are obligated to because it's a community project.

And neither is anyone (especially the developers) obligated to care about your problems if you've taken their work and returned nothing.

Community supported software works because the community contributes back money, fixes and bug reports. If you won't be a part of the solution, no one cares that you have a problem.

It's up to you, whether you contribute and work with the developers. No one is going to make you. No one is going to tell you that you can't use the software.

But no one is obligated to help you either.

I never read that in the GPL.

The GPL is a minimum set of legal requirements that basically says:

If you use this code as a basis for your own project, any changes you make MUST be returned. If you just want to use it, you don't HAVE to do anything.

It also states that the code is without any warranty. If it breaks you get to keep both pieces.

So all the complaining is for nothing.

Now, if you want support, if you want something more than what the developers have already given you for free, that's a different issue, a different negotiation.

You want something? Give something.

165 posted on 11/10/2004 5:50:15 PM PST by Knitebane
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To: Knitebane
And neither is anyone (especially the developers) obligated to care about your problems if you've taken their work and returned nothing.

Fair enough, I read you earlier post as meaning you are obligated to give back, but if you what you are saying is that you should not expect support if you are not willing to give back than I would agree. Quid pro quo? Sure.

Now I do like the tabbed browsing in firefox, and I use it primarily because it is more secure than i.e. and I can use the same program in Linux and windows.

It is missing some more advanced features that I would really like it to have, so I've been looking into other browsers, but haven't really found one I like as much.

Typically I find with commercial software that it often caters to the lowest common denominator, i.e. the average user, which makes sense but often is missing features that I would like but other might find confusing. Open source I typically find that the software doesn't really cater to anyone (save maybe the author).

Firefox seems to be somewhat a mix of the two.

In any case there are a few things I'd like to enable, maybe someone here has figured them out? First is emacs-style key-bindings in the address bar and text input boxes, and second is adding additional file types. I can change the action for already recognized file types, but adding new ones so far has alluded me. Of course I've only spend about 5 minutes trying to figure it out, I'm sure it's possible.

-paridel
166 posted on 11/10/2004 9:13:19 PM PST by Paridel
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To: Paridel

Notepad+ is a pretty good text editor. It can open larger files than the Windows based Notepad, and even has HTML tags and color coding built right in. :)


167 posted on 11/10/2004 11:08:40 PM PST by BigSkyFreeper (Congratulations President-Re-Elect George W. Bush!)
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To: BigSkyFreeper
Certainly, notepad+ is much much better. No Xemacs ;-), but then again it's not 100+ MB either.

-paridel
168 posted on 11/11/2004 8:34:05 AM PST by Paridel
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To: BigSkyFreeper
I just installed Foxfire and Thunderbird (mozilla) email a few days ago. I am using Foxfire now as my main browser.

There is one site I have found that will not load on it due to incompatibility. I will only use IE now for the rare page the needs IE to open.

I am stll exploring and finding goodies in Foxfire that I like better than IE.

169 posted on 11/11/2004 9:02:56 AM PST by wanderin
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