Skip to comments.TERRI SCHINDLER SCHIAVO DECEMBER, 2004 DAILIES THREAD: NEWS DIGEST & GRASSROOTS ACTIVISM
Posted on 11/30/2004 8:06:26 PM PST by cyn
click here to read article
I was not aware until very recently that this picture of Terri was taken approximately one year after her collapse. The picture demonstrates, without any doubt, that PVS is a totally inaccurate conclusion.
I hear the Dr. Laura program every day from noon to 3 PM here in California. I remember her talking about Terri once -- convinced by the biased and inaccurate reporting that Terri is irretrievably brain-damaged. She has a huge audience. I haven't been successful reaching her, but it would be a great coup if someone/anyone could convince her of her inaccurate conclusion.
I completely agree with you that far more than Terri's future or the future of Floridians is at stake here. The implications are immense, but a SCOTUS rejection of Gov. Bush's appeal isn't a guarantee that your Florida legislature will generate another bill protecting disabled citizens. My best guess is that a SCOTUS rejection combined with economic considerations will be a strong disincentive for your legislators.
The remaining options would be enormous public outcry, which would have no viable affect on Judge Greer, or someone (many someones?) filing an appropriate Writ of Mandamus or/and Quo Warranto action(s) concerning Greer's lack of title to the office, perjurious affidavit and years of compensation to which he wasn't entitled.
If there's SCOTUS rejection, Felos and HINO will then see to it that matters proceed very swiftly. So, I hope and pray that Terri's parents and concerned Floridians will be ready to immediately file and pursue the only remaining legal action, complaint and maneuver available to save her life.
They do not want to open a pandora's box wherein many heads would roll.
Keep in mind that Florida's House & Senate is overwhelmingly GOP, even more than before the Nov. 2nd election. The members from this area overwhelmingly supported Terri or helped draft Terri's Law. They just didn't go far enough - they should have DONE OVER the exit protocols and remove the law that says that nutrition and dehydration is MEDICAL TREATMENT AND ARTIFICIAL. That was JABA THE HUT, JIM KING'S LEGACY and he's no longer the President of the Fla Senate. Tom Lee, who was for Terri's Law, is now the President.
Jim King is still around but term limits forced him out of the presidency. He's in the Hospice Hall of Fame and that doesn't surprise me at all that he's in it and that they would EVEN HAVE A HALL OF FAME for advocates of killing the disabled or the elderly or anyone who cannot use the English language to communicate.
There was one case where the docs thought this woman was speaking gibberish and so they were going to euthanize her. An attendant or nurse happened by and recognized that the lady was speaking Polish, not gibberish. That chance meeting saved the woman's life.
There are many other ways to communicate besides language. Look at Stephen Hawking who has one of those computer generated voices w/a keyboard. There are also cards the size of placemats where the person lacking speech can point to the picture or to the yes or no to respond. Terri it has been said did use eye blinks for yes or no. It's no wonder she's confined in one room. Can't let anyone see that she's not as she's been portrayed by husband's side.
Terri's always trying to talk and her dad and the Monsignor make her laugh. She's tender with her mom, sis and niece. Terri's a sweet person who needs proper care that Hospice isn't licensed to provide. They are not licensed for rehabilitation. Keep Terri at Hospice and she is not rehabbed at all. She is in limbo until she is in a rehab facility.
I'm posting to the thread, not directing any of this specifically your way but people lurking here need to know these things which the LOCAL media does not report.
Many rescue fantasies come and go. We'll continue our call to action until Terri is safe and out of the clutches of the mean men in black robes and the lawyers who believe that they are god. New agers are behind this scheme against Terri. They got her money, they still want her. It's like an old Vincent Price movie in many ways.
I think I'm still a member from Jeb's 2002 race but there's no way I remember my password.
THIS IS AN OPTIONAL PROJECT. Thanks, floriduh voter
"people lurking here need to know these things which the LOCAL media does not report."
No doubt. Even if the truth about Terri and relevant issues were accurately reported, a certain amount of recitation is necessary.
"They do not want to open a pandora's box wherein many heads would roll."
Governmental elitists are always concerned and watchful to foil citizen attempts that will hold their feet to the fire vis à vis their own adherence to laws. But carefully composed, well-structured and legally sufficient complaints can defeat such efforts, despite extreme resistance.
As for the political views of the current roster of Florida legislators, thanks for letting me know. Sounds like there's more sympathy there for Terri than I could know about over here on the West Coast.
As a former Valley Girl, I can relate.
cyn, I'm trying to get the St. Pete Times Forum to be clickable. Can you help? You're an ace at hyperlinks.
Gallows humor: They better eat their wheaties.
If that doesn't spur folks to help Terri's Fight, I don't know what will. Please sign up at this email address to join Terri's Fight. firstname.lastname@example.org
Thanks to the ACLJ, American Center for Law & Justice who are helping fight the ACLU.
I think Clay's hair is cute in that picture.
I think Clay has surpassed Harry Connick, Jr. whose voice has not improved with age, that's just my opnion but Harry's voice is rougher and slightly off key. Even slightly off key DRIVES FLORIDUH VOTER UP THE WALL.
Scalia: Founding fathers never advocated the separation of church and state Scalia in shul: State must back religion
By URIEL HEILMAN
US Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia used an appearance at an Orthodox synagogue in New York to assail the notion that the US government should maintain a neutral stance toward religion, saying it has always supported religion and the courts should not try to change that.
Speaking at a conference on religious freedom in America on Monday hosted by Manhattan's Congregation Shearith Israel, the oldest Jewish congregation in North America, Scalia said that the founding fathers never advocated the separation of church and state and that America has prospered because of its religiousness.
"There is something wrong with the principle of neutrality," said Scalia, considered among the court's staunchest conservatives. Neutrality as envisioned by the founding fathers, Scalia said, "is not neutrality between religiousness and nonreligiousness; it is between denominations of religion."
Scalia cited early examples of support of religion in the public sphere by George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, and Benjamin Franklin, the last of whom went so far as to argue at the Constitutional Convention in 1787 for the institution of daily prayers.
Today, Scalia noted, the government exempts houses of worship from real-estate tax, pays for chaplains in Congress, state legislatures, and the military, and sanctions the opening of every Supreme Court session with the cry, "God save the United States!"
"To say that the Constitution allows the court to sweep away that long-standing attitude toward religion seems to me just wrong," he said. "I do think we're forgetting our roots."
Scalia's speech, at a conference marking the 350th anniversary both of Jews in America and of Shearith Israel, elicited a standing ovation.
Scalia was nominated to the nine-member Supreme Court in 1986 by president Ronald Reagan to fill the seat vacated by William Rehnquist, who became the chief justice after Warren Berger retired. Now, with speculation that Rehnquist is on the verge of retirement after a recent diagnosis of thyroid cancer, Scalia may be the leading candidate to take his place.
It is widely believed that President George W. Bush will appoint a staunch conservative as chief justice if he gets the chance, and the only other Supreme Court justice considered sufficiently conservative is Clarence Thomas, appointed by president George H.W. Bush.
Originally from New York, Scalia wore a black skull cap as he addressed the congregation with his back to the ark.
"The founding fathers never used the phrase 'separation of church and state,'" he said, arguing that rigid separation of religion and state as in Europe, for example would be bad for America and bad for the Jews.
"Do you think it's going to make Jews safer? It didn't prove that way in Europe," he said.
"You will not hear the word 'God' cross the lips of a French premier or an Italian head of state," Scalia said. "But that has never been the American way."
Most establishment Jewish groups, however, are staunch supporters of church-state separation. Earlier this month, for example, the American Jewish Committee was part of a coalition that won a lawsuit to block a Florida program allowing state aid to go to parochial schools. In 2000, the Anti-Defamation League led several Jewish groups in criticizing vice presidential candidate Sen. Joseph Lieberman for talking too much about God on the campaign trail.
Scalia said expunging religion from public life would be bad for America, and that the courts, instead, should come around to most Americans' way of thinking and to the founding fathers' vision for the US. He noted that after a San Francisco court last year barred the recitation of the Pledge of Allegiance in public schools because it includes the phrase "under God," Congress voted nearly unanimously to condemn the decision and uphold use of the phrase. more
Source: The Jerusalem Post
Scalia: founding fathers never advocated the separation of church and state
FV SAYS: Justice Scalia's words are somewhat encouraging.
Thanks for colorizing and linking. I get that to happen 50 per cent of the time.
Terri's following her doctor's instructions to open her eyes and look at him.
More videos are at http://www.terrisfight.org
Life, death in the Schiavo case
By Michael Kirkland
WASHINGTON, Dec. 21 (UPI) -- The Supreme Court of the United States is used to dealing with disputes over life and death, but the case of Terri Schiavo is among the most poignant. How the justices deal with her case, assuming they accept it, may depend on a 1990 precedent involving another young woman in a "persistent vegetative state."
Theresa Marie Schindler, later Terri Schiavo, was born in Pennsylvania on Dec. 3, 1963, and lived there with or near her parents until 1986, when she married Michael Schiavo and moved to Florida. Both sides in the case agreed they lived happily there. They had no children and both were employed.
Then in February 1990, their lives changed. Terri Schiavo was 26 when she suffered a cardiac arrest caused by a potassium imbalance in her body. Since 1990 she has lived in a nursing home in Pinellas Park, Fla., under constant care, has been fed and given water by tubes, and nurses change her diapers. A court has ruled she has never regained consciousness. For three years Michael Schiavo and his wife's parents, Robert and Mary Schindler, were close, but eventually Schiavo and the Schindlers stopped speaking to each other because of disagreements over the young woman's care. In 1998, eight years after his wife slipped into a coma, Schiavo asked a court to order her life support removed.
A state judge ruled that "clear and convincing evidence" showed Terri Schiavo to be in a persistent vegetative state and that she would have chosen to end life support if she were in a condition to make that decision. A state appeals court agreed with the judge, ruling, "The evidence is overwhelming that Theresa is in a permanent or persistent vegetative state." She is not in a coma, the court found, but has "cycles of apparent wakefulness and apparent sleep without any cognition or awareness." Because of a lack of oxygen due to the heart attack, her brain has deteriorated, the court found, and "much of her cerebral cortex is simply gone."
The Schindlers did not accept the findings. Instead, they filed an attack on the final ruling alleging fraud and claiming newly discovered evidence. The couple maintained their daughter was not in a vegetative state but indeed interacted with visitors. They also alleged Michael Schiavo was acting in his own financial interests, not in the interests of his wife.
Eventually, on Sept. 17, 2003, the Probate Division of the Circuit Court of Pinellas County, Fla., authorized the removal of the food and water tubes from Terri Schiavo's body. The tubes were removed less than a month later. "The death watch over Terri Schiavo had begun," lawyers for Florida Gov. Jeb Bush said in a petition to the Supreme Court. "Public reaction to the dramatic, and apparently final, chapter of this long, personal and public tragedy was intense."
In the face of that reaction, Bush and the state Legislature acted. A new state statute, Chapter 2003-418 of the Laws of Florida, gave the governor the authority to prevent the withholding of food and water from a patient if -- as of Oct. 15, 2003 -- there was no previous written directive from the patient to remove it; a court has found the patient to be in a persistent vegetative state; food and water have been withheld, and any member of the patient's family challenges that action. The governor's authority expired under the law 15 days after the day it was implemented -- in other words, on Oct. 30, 2003 -- meaning Bush would have acted by then in the Schiavo case.
After the issuance of a stay, the local circuit court was directed by the law to appoint a guardian for the patient to make recommendations to the governor and the court on her treatment. Attorneys for Michael Schiavo challenged the law in court, and eventually the Florida Supreme Court struck it down. The Florida high court ruled that the law "violates the fundamental constitutional tenet of separation of powers and is therefore unconstitutional both on its face and as applied to Theresa Schiavo."
Bush, supported by many of the evangelicals who support his brother, the president of the United States, then asked the U.S. Supreme Court for review. The governor's petition asks the high court to determine whether the Florida court violated his rights and those of "his incompetent ward" under the 14th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution.
The amendment says, among other things, that any state may not "deprive any person of life, liberty or property without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction of equal protection of the laws." The petition also asks the high court to determine if Bush and Terri Schiavo were deprived of their rights when the Florida court upheld findings in the earlier parts of the case, when the governor was not a party to the dispute.
The U.S. Supreme Court rejects the vast majority of cases that land at its doorstep, of course, and there is no guarantee it will accept the Bush petition. A good sign, however, is that the justices have asked for a response from Michael Schiavo by next week, something they would not have done if they were rejecting the Bush petition out of hand.
The Terri Schiavo case has gone beyond a simple, if tragic, legal dispute. To many, she is considered a martyr. One report says Michael Schiavo refused to let a priest administer the last rites to his wife in 2003. Roman Catholics, in particular, have championed her parents. Columnist Nat Hentoff even suggested in The Village Voice that the young woman may have been beaten and strangled in 1990, though no evidence of that has ever been introduced into court. But beyond all the emotion and innuendo, Terri Schiavo's fate will be decided by the U.S. Supreme Court on a legal basis. For that, the justices have to reach back to 1990's Cruzan vs. Director MDH.
Nancy Cruzan was 24 when she lost control of her car on a Missouri road in January 1983. She was thrown from the car and landed face down in a ditch filled with water. Paramedics found her and resuscitated her, but she remained in a "persistent vegetative state." After seven years her parents wanted to remove life support, citing their daughter's comments to a friend about not wanting to depend indefinitely on life support should she be injured -- but hospital workers refused. When the Missouri Supreme Court backed the hospital, saying there was not enough evidence of Nancy Cruzan's wishes, the dispute reached the U.S. Supreme Court.
The 5-4 majority in the 1990 case recognized that a patient has a "liberty interest" in declining medical treatment, but that right is not unrestricted. It affirmed the Missouri Supreme Court ruling. The U.S. Constitution does not forbid Missouri from requiring "clear and convincing" evidence of an incompetent person's wishes about withdrawing life support before such support is removed, the majority said.
The Constitution does not require "the state to repose judgment on these matters with anyone but the patient herself. Close family members may have a strong feeling -- a feeling not at all ignoble or unworthy, but not entirely disinterested, either -- that they do not wish to witness the continuation of the life of a loved one which they regard as hopeless, meaningless, and even degrading," Chief Justice William Rehnquist wrote for the conservative majority. "But there is no automatic assurance that the view of close family members will necessarily be the same as the patient's would have been had she been confronted with the prospect of her situation while competent. All of the reasons previously discussed for allowing Missouri to require clear and convincing evidence of the patient's wishes lead us to conclude that the state may choose to defer only to those wishes, rather than confide the decision to close family members." Also in that 1990 majority were Justices Sandra Day O'Connor, Antonin Scalia and Anthony Kennedy, all, like Rehnquist, current members of the court. The fifth vote belonged to the late Justice Byron White. The court's four liberals dissented, saying they would honor Cruzan's wishes. Of the four, only Justice John Paul Stevens remains on the court.
Assuming that the U.S. Supreme Court accepts Bush's petition, how would the current court apply the Cruzan precedent to the Schiavo case? Look for a 5-4 split between the conservative majority and the liberal minority, with Chief Justice William Rehnquist, largely recovered from thyroid cancer, again writing the majority opinion. The four justices from the Cruzan court have no reason to change their opinion over the last 14 years. The fifth vote would come from Justice Clarence Thomas, who often votes with Scalia. Also, look for the slim majority to reaffirm Cruzan's principles without deciding Bush's 14th Amendment argument. The justices could reverse the Florida Supreme Court, ending the dispute. The state Legislature, after all, did require a written directive from a competent person before life support could be withdrawn when the person later becomes incompetent -- even if it did so in a temporary law. If that is enough to be dispositive, the U.S. Supreme Court still would have to rule that the law could be retroactively applied to the Schiavo case.
But a simple reaffirmation of Cruzan would point to a possible U.S. Supreme Court ruling that throws out the Florida Supreme Court decision without reversing it, and that sends the case back for more hearings in a tragedy that already has gone on for years.
(No. 04-757, Gov. Jeb Bush vs. Michael Schiavo, guardian of Theresa Schiavo)
(Please send comments to email@example.com.)
Copyright 2004 by United Press International.
All rights reserved.
HMMM Lets see if HINO gets out of this! (like he has with the depositions).
Christmas Eve Morning Bump! Prayers For The Life Terri !
Good article and it gives me much hope. Terri to my understanding has not just been in a nursing home, but in hospice care as if she had less than 6 months to live, which was the hope of Michael and his mistress all along. Terri lives on thanks to her parents, Florida Voter and many other dedicated freepers and Jeb Bush.
"My family and I want to wish you and your family a happy and blessed Christmas holiday. We appreciate everything you have done and are doing to help our Terri."
Christmas greetings and wishes to all, and New Year hopes for an honest guardianship ruling in 2005 that liberates Terri from anti-rehabilitation HINO's cruel and corrupt control.
If you consider there are still rumors that Sixth Circuit employees are betting on whether Terri will live or not, now THAT'S TACKY AND ILLEGAL. Thanks, FV
NOW BACK TO CHRISTMAS. MERRY CHRISTMAS, Terri's Freepers.
Ping to my post above. Tampa Tribune must know something to take a poll at this time? It has been alleged that Judge Baird's wife works at the Tampa Tribune. hmmmmmmmmmmmmm
I almost think that might be an older poll that got recirculated. The pre on the document is 1015, so maybe it's something that was published this past October (possibly even last October if you think about that date).
I can't stand these polls anyway, as you pointed out, because they're rather tacky. But my big problem is how they are typically worded. They almost lead one to respond a certain way.
The National RTL conducted a poll and asked the question in a very different fashion. This was a telephone poll and not a web one, so the audience wasn't predispositioned on the side of life. But, they asked something like "should her husband, who now has a partner and two children with her be the one to decide" kind of thing.
Naturally, the majority responding said 'no'. So, when you give people new information they will make a new decision.
I wonder what would happen if you asked "MS has not filed a guardianship plan in ** years, has not permitted Terri's teeth to be looked after in ** years and will not allow Terri outside of her room, in violation of Florida laws. Should he remain guardian?" How many do you think would vote NO.
Agree with your last post. The retiring Clerk of Courts is proud of her record protecting wards. What record?
Helping Dad out a little there, Ms. Baird was?
drudgereport.com changed all his links to "green" for the holidays. I did that weeks ago!
But, they ended their Terri segment by mentioning that maybe hubby was going to give up. Well, that's the spin but I won't believe it until I see it.
Wouldn't it be great to see Terri being taken out of Hospice and whisked away with her parents and siblings if they would ever MOVE ON and leave Terri alone.
WE NEED TO ALSO THANK GOVERNOR HUCKABEE of Arkansas. He discussed Medicare this weekend in the paper and he specifically stated "We cannot just pull feeding tubes and stop providing wheelchairs."
Maybe Governor Huckabee will run for President in 2008. I'll have his email address on the January Thread so freepers can thank him for his compassion and to let him know about Terri in case he's not aware of her.
Nothing is more premeditated than certifying that someone who is not dying is going to die.
It is awfully cold here. I hope that Terri's got proper heat and blankets. It was 34 this morning. FV
Evening bump for Terri.
Just catching up! Have been without power off and on for a few days (brrrrr!). I'll read to the end of the thread and ping the list if I see no one else has done so by then. Thanks for the article!
Terri ping to 370! If anyone would like to be on/off my Terri ping list, please let me know here or by FReepmail.
Sorry about the belated ping! Power outage problems in central Ohio!
Here are the other top stories of 2004, as voted by AP members:
Watching and waiting
By HOWARD TROXLER, Times Columnist
Published December 26, 2004
IN THE YEAR 2004
God Bless the Schindler Family.
Thanks for the ping!
NOW ANOTHER LINK RE: TERRI. Linda Kennedy has done some broadcasts about Terri. Terri's items are on the left hand margin.
Thank you, Ohioan from Florida!
I hope you're toasty warm now and remain that way throughout the rest of the winter.
Many thanks to Vicky Chachere for coverage about Terri's birthday.
For the sake of accuracy regarding her article, please note the following two corrections.
1. Cheryl Ford is not a former nurse. Cheryl is a Licensed Registered Nurse who maintains a current Washington State nursing license where she is CEO of her own company.
2. Terri's heart did not stop because of an eating disorder. The courts in the medical malpractice case never concluded that Terri had an eating disorder. According to Terri's medical records, Terri was still breathing when the Paramedics had arrived. Her heart was in an arrhythmia. Arrhythmia, caused by lack of oxygen to her brain which happened to Terri from a still undetermined cause.
AP Wire | 12/28/2004 | Legal battle over Terri Schiavo survives another year
OOPS, I thought that last paragraph was the hyperlink but it isn't. I'll go get the link. FV
HERE'S THE HYPERLINK TO THE AP STORY: http://www.bradenton.com/mld/bradenton/10513588.htm
FYI: Bradenton is south of Tampa Bay ACROSS the Sunshine Skyway Bridge by Sarasota.
Felos said there's nothing Michael Schiavo can offer to guarantee the Schindlers that their daughter would not be disconnected from the feeding tube, even if he were to divorce her and step down as her guardian.
A judge has ruled - and appeals courts have upheld - it was Terri Schiavo's wish not to be kept alive artificially. Whomever serves as guardian is now legally obligated to carry out the tube removal. Only a new trial -which is what the Schindlers are seeking - could create a new final judgment, Felos said.
"Terri is not chattel. She is not merchandise or goods that can be transferred from one person to another," Felos said. "She retains her dignity as a human being and she retains her constitutional rights."
FV ASKS: How can a human being retain their dignity while being murdered by a handful of judges, an adulterer husband, the ACLU and attorneys who do this sort of thing for a living? Terri cannot be transferred from one person to another but she can be murdered? WHAT UNBELIEVABLE SPIN THE GOAT MILKER IS CAPABLE OF.
In Terri's case, it would not be an unlawful transference. IT WOULD BE INTO PROTECTIVE CUSTODY and REHABILITATION. Sounds like a rescue to me.
New AP story from Bradenton. Link above here. Happy New Year, WC.
Top Stories of 2004: Constitutional Lawyer: Limited Legal Options Remain for Terri Schiavo
By Allie Martin and Jody Brown December 28, 2004
(Originally published on September 24, 2004) (AgapePress) - A constitutional law attorney says Florida Governor Jeb Bush has few legal options now that the state Supreme Court has struck down a law passed by the legislature to keep Terri Schiavo, who is severely brain damage, alive.
The unanimous decision, handed down on Thursday, said the law violated the separation of powers between the judicial branch and the legislative and executive branches. Last year, lower courts ruled that Michael Schiavo could have his wife's feeding tube removed -- but lawmakers passed a law to overrule the courts. Governor Bush then used that law to have the woman's tube inserted. In its ruling, Florida's high court said the law improperly delegated legislative powers to the governor.
Brian Fahling, an attorney with the Center for Law & Policy in Mississippi, takes issue with the ruling. "Certainly the governor was within his authority to see that life is preserved in that state," he says, "and the state legislature is to be commended for taking action in order to see that they provided him with statutory authority to protect her."
But now with the state Supreme Court's decision, Fahling laments that the legal options are limited. "There's no appeal federally because it's a state law that was at issue," he explains.
"[T]he governor's just going to have to get together with the legislative branch and determine what, if anything, remains for them to do to protect Terry Schiavo in order to keep her from the clutches, if you will, of the grim reaper in the form of her husband, who would like to have those feeding tubes removed."
Still, he says, the Florida governor has an "independent duty to interpret [the state] constitution -- and sometimes extreme circumstances call for extreme measures."
The attorney admits he is startled by the implications. "Here we're talking about life or death," he observes, "and the court has just told [Governor Bush] that he cannot protect one of the citizens of his state."
Like Fahling, Dr. James Dobson of Focus on the Family is decrying the court decision, saying he is "appalled" that the high court chose to override the will of the people's elected representatives. Dobson, who says the decision is "nothing less than a death sentence" for Mrs. Schiavo, reveals a sad irony in the ruling.
"That the court would justify its ruling in the name of a violation of the separation of powers between the branches of government is the ultimate insult," he says. "It is the courts that have been usurping the constitutional duty of the legislatures to make law rather than interpret it."
Terri Schiavo, 40, can breathe on her own by relies on a feeding and hydration tube to live. She suffered brain damage 14 years ago when her heart stopped beating.
FV SAYS: The attorney from Mississippi MAY be affiliated with the ACLU or the Southern Law Poverty Center. What he's said I'd take with a grain of salt. It wouldn't take but five minutes to tie him to the Southern Law Poverty Center or to the ACLU. BOTH ARE LEFTY/LIBERAL GROUPS.
Fahling's a constitutional lawyer, seems to be perturbed that the Episcopal Church ordained a homosexual.
Terri's always trying to talk. Doesn't that bother anyone???