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A Warning to the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals
Renew America ^ | 2/23/05 | Jen Shroder

Posted on 02/23/2005 1:31:32 PM PST by jent

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1 posted on 02/23/2005 1:31:43 PM PST by jent
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To: jent

bump


2 posted on 02/23/2005 1:34:08 PM PST by Robert Lomax
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To: jent

Look folks, one last time. It is not Separation of church and state, it is Separation of Christianity and State.


I would like to note my tongue is sadly planted in my right cheek.


3 posted on 02/23/2005 2:02:05 PM PST by trubluolyguy ("Wedgies are unhealthy for children and other living things")
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To: jent
"We shall have no other gods before Him. In all of history, God has never once negotiated that commandment."
4 posted on 02/23/2005 2:09:54 PM PST by DannyTN
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To: jent

Is there any way that we can get or force the publisher to release what schools and what systems have bought that book?

If so we could start a community awareness program and run the book out of the US.


5 posted on 02/23/2005 2:12:29 PM PST by DannyTN
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To: jent

Thank you.


6 posted on 02/23/2005 2:18:30 PM PST by DoughtyOne (US socialist liberalism would be dead without the help of politicians who claim to be conservative.)
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To: jent

This court should be disbanded. They have gone through yeras where every single case taken on by the Supreme court has been overturned (27+ cases).


7 posted on 02/23/2005 2:21:25 PM PST by KC_Conspirator (This space outsourced to India)
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To: jent
To speak a little off the subject, I always think of Democrats as "The Party in Favor of Repealing the 10th Commandment."
8 posted on 02/23/2005 2:23:58 PM PST by NaughtiusMaximus (Progressives are just liberals with an Earl Scheib paintjob.)
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To: DannyTN

The 2005 textbook has been revised, (but our kids currently read the bad version til replaced) after the protests the publisher Houghton Mifflin was resold at 920 million less than it was bought for a year before, the publishers CEO (Nader F. Darehshori from Iran) was REPLACED, so was the head of the Christian organization that defended the textbook and then admitted he never even read it.

God moves when we follow Him! woooohooooo!

But the issue is still the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals not ruling on stopping the indoctrination practices, "becoming Muslim" and memorizing and reciting prayers to Allah.

textbook fallout:
http://www.blessedcause.org/PressRelease/CEAI%20Selling%20Out%20Jesus.htm

When Christian Educators prefer Islam:
http://www.blessedcause.org/PressRelease/CEAI%20Selling%20Out%20Jesus.htm


9 posted on 02/23/2005 2:28:30 PM PST by jent (of blessedcause)
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To: everyone

The author of this piece is on the right track, except for one little thing. We can't wait for God to unleash the whirlwind on this Court. We need to do it ourselves.


10 posted on 02/23/2005 2:32:23 PM PST by California Patriot
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To: California Patriot
The author of this piece is on the right track, except for one little thing. We can't wait for God to unleash the whirlwind on this Court. We need to do it ourselves.

Thank You. A most correct decision.

11 posted on 02/23/2005 3:00:27 PM PST by Digger
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To: jent
You certainly are a platinum tipped sparkplug for the Lord.


12 posted on 02/23/2005 3:05:58 PM PST by Outraged (Time to put pressure on the party)
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To: Digger

oh my gosh, what's a platinum tipped sparkplug? (hiding my bleach-blonde bottle)

nah, just a very protective mom outraged at the unbelievable stuff they try to teach my kids


13 posted on 02/23/2005 3:41:22 PM PST by jent (of blessedcause)
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To: California Patriot

ya know CP, I actually cursed someone once, after MONTHS of getting extreme mean-spirited verbal abuse from a co-worker. She had seniority over me and I had been just taking it and taking it and praying it to God. On this day it was so mean and I got so mad that I went in the bathroom and prayed to God to curse the ground she walked on. She was a writer, and I prayed she couldn't write for a whole day. Guess what happened. That whole day she sat in front of her computer and couldn't write. I heard her go into the boss and say she couldn't understand it, she had writer's block for the first time. When she finally did write something, I was on the proofing team and all the other proofers shook their heads and couldn't believe this person had written it, it was so bad.

I was shaking for days. I felt like a 2 year old (my Christian maturity) with a loaded gun. It really freaked me out. This woman was a Christian (hard to believe) and I think God spoke to her because the next day she apologized to me. It also took her a little more than a day to get back to normal.

Christians really can curse and if God is in agreement...wow. And it's Biblical, Paul did it to someone who was (I think the Bible said perverting the scriptures). Man went blind for a time.

I've been really careful not to curse anyone since. Heavy stuff. Can't do that lightly. Really shook me.


14 posted on 02/23/2005 3:50:24 PM PST by jent (of blessedcause)
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To: jent


I'm not asking anyone to do that. I'm asking people to engage in normal political activity up to at least the legal limit. This includes truth-telling even of the most painful kind.


15 posted on 02/23/2005 3:53:56 PM PST by California Patriot
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To: jent

But the plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator. In the first place amongst these there are the Mohamedans, who, professing to hold the faith of Abraham, along with us adore the one and merciful God, who on the last day will judge mankind.

LUMEN GENTIUM
Nevertheless, the religiosity of Muslims deserves respect. It is impossible not to admire, for example, their fidelity to prayer. The image of believers in Allah who, without caring about time or place, fall to their knees and immerse themselves in prayer remains a model for all those who invoke the true God, in particular for those Christians who, having deserted their magnificent cathedrals, pray only a little or not at all.
"Crossing the Threshold of Hope" by Pope John Paul II

16 posted on 02/23/2005 3:56:10 PM PST by Cultural Jihad
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To: jent

Strange, but reading that made me physically ILL! What in GOD'S NAME is going on in our courts? How did these people acquire so MUCH power? I am certificated as a paralegal and well-studied on constitutional law and this level or power just doesn't exist in the the courts envisioned by the Constitution. They were to follow and apply "The Peoples'" laws, not write, change and re-interpret to suit their own prejudices. "Activist judge" is oxymoronic


17 posted on 02/23/2005 3:59:11 PM PST by dzzrtrock ("If you can't make them see the light, make them feel the heat" (Ronaldus Magnus))
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To: jent

If I stayed faithful to what God said, "Take heed that you inquire not of other nations and how they serve their gods," and replied that I would want NO religion in textbooks, then the Bible would be gagged as well.




What scripture is she referring to?


18 posted on 02/23/2005 3:59:13 PM PST by Recall
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To: trubluolyguy

"Look folks, one last time. It is not Separation of church and state, it is Separation of Christianity and State.


I would like to note my tongue is sadly planted in my right cheek"

Not to mention it's Freedon OF Religion, not Freedom FROM Religion!!


19 posted on 02/23/2005 4:02:48 PM PST by Primetimedonna
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To: Cultural Jihad

ummmm, Cultural Jihad, maybe Muslims are so devoted because their holy books tell them it is DEATH to leave Islam. And the way it plays out in the Middle East, often members of their family receive torture if a family member leaves.

No Muslim can deny that to leave Islam, to stop being Muslim, is punishable by death in Islam. On that there are no contradictions.


20 posted on 02/23/2005 4:12:32 PM PST by jent
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To: Recall

“Take heed that you are not snared and that you inquire not after their gods, saying, ‘How did these nations serve their gods?…for every abomination to the Lord which He hates they have done to their gods” (Deut. 12:30)

“Thus says the Lord: ‘Do not learn the way of the heathens”
(Jeremiah 10:2)

“You shall not walk in the manner of the nations which I cast out before you, for they committed all of these things and therefore I abhor them” (Lev 20:23)


21 posted on 02/23/2005 4:14:06 PM PST by jent
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To: dzzrtrock

dzz, you might be interested in the actual court document then, arguing that children can be mandated to repeat prayers to allah, etc. Wasn't easy to come by because it was a dismissal and therefore "unpublished"

This is a pdf and depending on your computer, may take time to download

http://www.blessedcause.org/protest/Islam%20Ruling%2012-05-03.pdf


22 posted on 02/23/2005 4:17:01 PM PST by jent
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To: jent

John 6:53 Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.

You would have to ask Muslims in America and Europe, where no civil authority can put them to death for apostacy, why they continue to worship the one same God as the Christians do.

23 posted on 02/23/2005 4:18:50 PM PST by Cultural Jihad
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To: Cultural Jihad

Allah is NOT the Christian God! If Allah was, why would he put a curse upon all Christians and Jews?

"Fight those who do not believe in Allah…And the Jews say Ezra is the son of God; and the Christians say Christ is the son of God; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; Allah’s curse be on them; how they are turned away!" (Koran 9:29-30)


24 posted on 02/23/2005 4:23:33 PM PST by jent
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To: jent
Cursing calls for a rather radical form of judgment that our limited perceptions aren't competent to make, being mindful of Matt 7:1,2.

25 posted on 02/23/2005 4:25:40 PM PST by William Terrell (Individuals can exist without government but government can't exist without individuals.)
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To: jent

The Pope says one thing, while jent says something else. There's a moral dilemma, choosing whether to follow the lead of the visible head of Christendom, or some anonymous internet blogger's opinion.


26 posted on 02/23/2005 4:30:38 PM PST by Cultural Jihad
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To: William Terrell

William, if God didn't agree with me, it never would have happened. You have no idea how many times I was trashed by two women there, and every time I didn't answer back as is my old nature, I didn't return it in kind, I prayed over it, I asked God to help me forgive and forget, and I told Him I knew He saw it and gave it to Him for justice. After many months of being treated badly, I think God judged. Apart from Him I could do nothing.


27 posted on 02/23/2005 4:33:13 PM PST by jent
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To: Cultural Jihad

Don't believe me, don't accept everything from the Pope without checking with the Holy Spirit and the Bible. It's all about God and what He wrote. Compare that to what Muhammad said that Allah said, the characters are opposite.

Allah is not "God". It grieves me that we changed all the awesome names of God in the Bible to just God. Now it's very confusing when Allah is translated to god. We should have continued to call "God" Eloheim, Yeshua, Adonai, El Shaddai, so many beautiful names.

Allah is not one of them. In fact, phonetically, in Hebrew, Allah means to curse and lament.


28 posted on 02/23/2005 4:37:41 PM PST by jent
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To: jent

What happened to the Sixth Amendment and a speedy and public trial? Are the judges on the Ninth Circus unaware of the requirements made by the writers and signers of the US Constitution?


29 posted on 02/23/2005 4:39:21 PM PST by lifelongsoldier (Qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum.)
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To: Cultural Jihad
So the pope and the catholic church is suffering from apostasy, just as we were warned. That is why I differentiate Catholicism from Christianity. I am NOT doing this to start a flame war with catholics. Before you blast me, please read the following questions posed below and when you can answer them with biblical cites, feel free to respond on that issue. Catholicism is defined by the whim of the Pope, whom the church sees as "infallible" on topics ecumenical, biblical and spiritual.

A "Christian" is defined thusly: A believer in Jesus Christ as savior: somebody who believes that Jesus Christ was sent to the world by God to save humanity, and who tries to follow his teachings and example".

Per that "Lumen Gentium" you cited, The Pope disagrees with the words of Jesus Christ that HE (Christ) is the one route to salvation. How can one disavow Christ's teachings on salvation and define oneself as "CHRISTian"? How can one praise those who worship other "gods" for their worship of that "god"; (as done is topic 16 of the Lumen Gentium) and the islamic "god" IS another "god"; and equate that worship of another "god" with the worship of the Christian God and still be a CHRISTian?

Their "god" didn't have a son. Our's did. So much for the "same god" idea*. Either Our God was lying to them about that, another being was lying to them professing to be "God" (large "G") and they bought into it, or they are lying about their god being OUR God. Take yer pick.

*http://answering-islam.org.uk/Silas/son2.htm

30 posted on 02/23/2005 4:39:39 PM PST by dzzrtrock ("If you can't make them see the light, make them feel the heat" (Ronaldus Magnus))
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To: Cultural Jihad; jent
Rather than attempting to take on jent, at which task you are failing, you may want to cut your losses now and trot on back to the immigration threads where you at least can sound the alarm for your soft-on-illegal-aliens buddies to help you out.

Instead of confining your modest talents to defending the illegal alien lawbreakers from Mexico, I see you've now branched out to include Muslims within your protective embrace. Pathetic...

You may want to bail out now. She's eating your lunch.

31 posted on 02/23/2005 4:46:10 PM PST by Czar (StillFedUptotheTeeth@Washington)
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To: lifelongsoldier

life, there is nobody "on trial", its an issue that the 9th Circuit can stall on, and this is often done. Eventually the children of the parents suing will be out of the school so they will rule it a moot point.

What really makes me mad is how the younger daughter has been treated in all this.

Clip from another article:

What happened to Samantha Eklund in Byron County was worse. Samantha didn't want to "become Muslim," praise Allah or fast for Ramadan, so her mom wrote her a note to "opt out" of the 7th grade Islam course. When Samantha handed her teacher the note, the teacher became angry, held up the note and shouted at the class, "Is there anyone else!?"

Another student crumpled the note on her desk, squeezing it tightly, searching for the strength to hold up her note as Samantha did. "Samantha's in big trouble," someone whispered. The teacher, who had dressed in a belly-dancing costume for the lesson, appeared angry as she demanded, "IS THERE ANYONE ELSE?"

Peter, a grown fisherman, faltered at the question of a servant girl, "Aren't you one of His disciples?" Peter eyed the sharp spear of a Roman soldier and replied, "I don't know Him." A servant pointed a finger and accused him, "DIDN'T I SEE YOU IN THE GARDEN WITH HIM??!!!"

Similarly, the teacher's words echoed in the classroom, "IS THERE ANYONE ELSE?!!!! Samantha stood there, alone, as her friend wrestled with her fear to join her, gripping her note, afraid of the sharp spear of the teacher's wrath and the eyes of her classmates, the eyes of a crowd.

Samantha courageously walked to the school office, listening to comments from other children about how she did something wrong. She reported to the school office for more than a month, often three full class periods a day, and was told to study without instruction or guidance from the teacher who was always too busy. She was tested on an entire chapter of the French revolution and was given a failing grade.

Her parents sought justice through our court system and lost, Judge Hamilton believes it is acceptable to mandate children to "become Muslim," take Muslim names, memorize and recite prayers of worship to Allah, fast for Ramadan and play games with dice to advance to Mecca, (by the way, the punishment for non-believers to enter Mecca is death).

The case is under appeal and everyone is currently waiting for a ruling by the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals. The Eklunds have braved a NIGHTMARE of persecution as they fight for our religious freedom, alone. Will the nation close its eyes to what is happening to our children in California? Will Governor Schwarzenegger, who has already been apprised of the situation, abandon children like Samantha Eklund?

Judge Hamilton ruled that children can be forced to do these things because when asked, Samantha's older brother replied he did not actually believe he became a Muslim. Imagine the weight this puts on children. Pretend to be Muslim, just don't believe it. Neither did Joseph when he was sold into slavery by his brothers and was forced to attend ceremonies to false gods. Our children are being reduced to public education slaves, forced into other religions, literally on their knees to other gods.

Is this religious freedom?

http://64.233.179.104/search?q=cache:68uxP0NpDX4J:www.renewamerica.us/columns/shroder/041002+%22Samantha+Eklund%22+blessedcause&hl=en


32 posted on 02/23/2005 4:46:19 PM PST by jent
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To: Cultural Jihad

The visible leader of Christendom is not the leader of the church Yeshua built on the confession of Peter. The Lord never did relinquish His position as leader of Christianity. Christendom and Christianity today have no more than a nodding acquaintance with one another. Personally I will choose Christianity, it will lead me to eternity with God. Christendom is a nice social organization which seems to not want to offend anyone. Jesus offended many, most of whom have long since been forgotten.


33 posted on 02/23/2005 4:47:01 PM PST by lifelongsoldier (Qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum.)
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To: dzzrtrock

excellent post dzzz

I'm on the books as Catholic but I go to Calvary Chapel because I don't agree with some of the Catholic doctrines. As far as the infallible Pope goes, Peter was the first "Pope" and he made a mistake that Paul corrected him on big time. So although I believe there are MANY saved legitimate Christians in the Catholic church, and I defend her often, I think they need to work on a few things doctrinally.


34 posted on 02/23/2005 4:53:20 PM PST by jent
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To: lifelongsoldier

The visible leader of Christendom is not the leader of the church Yeshua built on the confession of Peter. The Lord never did relinquish His position as leader of Christianity...

lifelongsoldier, I've never heard "Christendom" used like that


35 posted on 02/23/2005 4:55:58 PM PST by jent
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To: All

Isn't it time for the believers, in Christianity, in the Bill of Rights, is government of the people by the people and for the people, to stand up and remind the hired hands that they work for the people, and that the people are not happy with the quality of their work? Judges can be impeached, and will be if the legislators are made to fear loss of their positions. Even the head of the Judicial Branch can be impeached. It's a little harder to try him, but it is possible.


36 posted on 02/23/2005 4:59:02 PM PST by lifelongsoldier (Qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum.)
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To: Czar

Good response. I'm sure he took that screennaame for a reason.


37 posted on 02/23/2005 5:09:51 PM PST by monkeywrench
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To: Cultural Jihad
("Cultural Jihad" writes)The Pope says one thing, while jent says something else. There's a moral dilemma, choosing whether to follow the lead of the visible head of Christendom, or some anonymous internet blogger's opinion.

You unwitingly just made my earlier point, CJ. you have also shown a lack of knowledge of Christianity. I presume that you are not a follower of same. The Pope is the head of the Catholic church but is NOT the "head of Christendom". Catholics ARE bound by his decrees and dogma. Christians are in no way bound by the decisions of the Pope and have not been since the time of the inception of the catholic church under Constantine. Information offered by "Jent", per se, who you attempt to impugn as "an anonymous internet blogger" and who apparently is anything BUT, in no way binds Christians. It is rather the fact that what she is offering is in fact that of Jesus Christ, through what is specifically addressed in the Bible, that binds us. She is in accord with same.(doffs hat to "Jent") THAT is the binding authority for Christians. Those who are of the romist church will have to follow the pope's decrees on this topic. Those of us who are Christ's followers POST reformation (aka; the time of Martin Luther) will continue to follow biblical teachings and the pope's decree is meaningless.

the Catholics see "the Reformation" and the attempted destruction of "The Church"+. Christians see it as the acknowledgement and triumph of Christ's teaching over those of the romist church's hybridization of Roman paganism and Christianity.º

+New Advent

ºRoman Cathocilism, The Unbiblical church

The reluctant messenger, Two Babylons

38 posted on 02/23/2005 5:17:22 PM PST by dzzrtrock ("If you can't make them see the light, make them feel the heat" (Ronaldus Magnus))
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To: lifelongsoldier

Yes it is time. So what about getting a thread going to see how many people can come together in All States and start one at a time and start changing them back or keep them from changing.


39 posted on 02/23/2005 6:15:32 PM PST by AIC
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To: jent

40 posted on 02/23/2005 8:38:15 PM PST by Cultural Jihad
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To: Cultural Jihad
CJ. I can see why you're in both here and the "open borders" threads. I suspect that you're in favor of of keeping the borders open so the other jihadists can mosey in at their leisure, hence the dual interest. I am in both for just the opposite reason. I don't want ANYBODY coming over our borders illegally, regardless of point of origin. RE: BOOSH'S BS which you just cited. Everyone is a "bigot" (Definition: a prejudiced person who is intolerant of any opinions differing from his own) as we all have our likes and dislikes and personal beliefs. This would include you as you've made a number of statements in these discussions which have no basis in fact and are simply your opinions. El presidente BOOSH is one of the WORST. He ignores what 75% or Americans say they want, what security experts, national security organizations and the 9/11 panel say we need; he ignores history as well as ignoring common sense to push his own personal agenda. He's completely impervious to all the evidence to the contrary and will NOT change his opinions. That's "bigotry" to the "nth" degree. El presidente thinks Islam "is a religion of peace" in spite of the evidence and record to the contrary in existence since 638 AD (the Koran) and actions dating from 653AD to date. He thinks our borders are safe. He thinks that we "need" our invaders. He thinks that they are only taking the jobs Americans don't want. He believes invaders are good for the ecomony, apparently even those of the ilk that gave us 9/11.He believes we can stop people of that nature from coming across wide-open borders without in any way molesting his "family values peaceful agrarians" as they illegally pour across....See how it works? The Whitehouse is a refuge for an intransigent bigot living in La-la land. When I express an opinion I try and review the supporting facts up front and I am willing to offer up same, as in my previous post, for anyone interested. This tends to irritate "bigots" like you and Dane, holding opinions to the contrary, as, as noted and my facts-supported beliefs conflict with your prejudices. By doing so it makes it hard to argue personal opinions back and forth when one side just has an opinion based on personal experiences or preferences and the other side has supporting research. Feel free to start supporting your opinions.
41 posted on 02/23/2005 9:46:44 PM PST by dzzrtrock ("If you can't make them see the light, make them feel the heat" (Ronaldus Magnus))
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To: Cultural Jihad

The Pope is a man, nothing more.
Allah is NOT I AM.


42 posted on 02/23/2005 10:28:51 PM PST by philetus (What goes around comes around)
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To: philetus

People argue endlessly about a being they have neither seen nor strongly desire to see.


43 posted on 02/23/2005 10:48:21 PM PST by Cultural Jihad
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To: Cultural Jihad

People argue endlessly about a being they have neither seen nor strongly desire to see."

What people would that be?


44 posted on 02/23/2005 10:55:25 PM PST by philetus (What goes around comes around)
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To: jent

One does need to be cautious about expressing angry wishes to God against people, for drastic action. Remember Satan is in there too and if it is not a godly wish, Satan can ask God for permission to act and sometimes God grants that permission. It might not technically be "sorcery" but it comes close.


45 posted on 02/23/2005 11:07:03 PM PST by HiTech RedNeck
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To: dzzrtrock
Per that "Lumen Gentium" you cited, The Pope disagrees with the words of Jesus Christ that HE (Christ) is the one route to salvation.

It looks like the Pope sees the road to Christ as beginning in morality and a belief in a creator. The intent seems to be that, with the Pope's blessings, and with the picture, however distorted, that they have of God, some of these Muslims sooner or later would come to believe in Jesus Christ, in the next world if not this one (i.e. in a purgatory). It actually isn't too far from some of C. S. Lewis's speculations about conversions that take place "under the cloud." Now whether this is credible is another story. The way many (not all) Muslims carry on seems to imply that they have cast the devil as their god.

46 posted on 02/23/2005 11:22:28 PM PST by HiTech RedNeck
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To: Primetimedonna
Add to you list: "Its God BLESS America, not GOD-LESS America" (and) "its "liberty and Justice for all", not "libertine injustice" for all"
47 posted on 02/23/2005 11:47:01 PM PST by dzzrtrock ("If you can't make them see the light, make them feel the heat" (Ronaldus Magnus))
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To: jent

Jent, you're an example of catholicism where everything turned out great.


48 posted on 02/23/2005 11:49:30 PM PST by dzzrtrock ("If you can't make them see the light, make them feel the heat" (Ronaldus Magnus))
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To: HiTech RedNeck

One does need to be cautious about expressing angry wishes to God against people, for drastic action. Remember Satan is in there too and if it is not a godly wish, Satan can ask God for permission to act and sometimes God grants that permission. It might not technically be "sorcery" but it comes close.

Excellent point HiTech, thank you! I'll remember that before I do that again. Truly freaked me out. As I said, I felt like a 2 year old with a loaded gun. Can't do that lightly.


49 posted on 02/24/2005 4:48:39 AM PST by jent
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To: dzzrtrock

lol dzz, thank you I think...
(grin...while vainly attempting to hide my flaws)


50 posted on 02/24/2005 4:52:22 AM PST by jent
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