Pride or prejudice? Terri's plight...Stop the BS!

Multitudes of postings | 3/26/2005 | self

[thinkingman129]

**You missed the most important part. (and under....) **

Didn't meant to. Sorry.

**Section 2 - In all the other cases before mentioned, the supreme court shall have appellate jurisdiction, both as to Law & Fact, with such Exceptions, and under such regulations as Congress shall make." **

Plain speak: The Supreme Court will have jurisdiction over appeals from lower courts, under the regulations (laws) as Congress makes.

Congress is the legislative body, the Courts adjudicate.

**Jeb's responsibility??? Why don't you explain to me legally why thru DCF he had no right to do what he did?**

The Dept of Children and Family is an agency that meets in COURT to gain approval for their actions. Didn't you know that?

[jdhljc169]

****Plain speak: The Supreme Court will have jurisdiction over appeals from lower courts, under the regulations (laws) as Congress makes.

EXACTLY! And they legislated a law that the courts had to follow. As it should be. This is part of why our judicial branch is in the mess it is. IT IS not the final authority on everything. We have only had judicial review since 1892.

****The Dept of Children and Family is an agency that meets in COURT to gain approval for their actions. Didn't you know that?

Have you read the law of DCF? They do emergency snatches all the time WITHOUT court approval. From what I understand from the law, unless you can show me something else, is that they NEVER get court approval first.

[thinkingman129]

Yes, but their emergency *snatching* meets specific criteria laid out in the LAW.


It is unethical for a law to be written for ONE person's benefit.

[jdhljc169]

****Yes, but their emergency *snatching* meets specific criteria laid out in the LAW.

Such as?? They had a lot of allegations of abuse....


***It is unethical for a law to be written for ONE person's benefit.

But not unconstitutional. I'm curious. Why do you think it is unethical?

My opinion...this case had far more implications than just Terri. I always go back to "Who's next?" You or me?

[thinkingman129]

It IS technically, unlawful and unconstitutional for a governmental body, the Congress, to write a law for ONE person.

That's where a lot of us conservatives (yes, even some who happen to be Christians) think that Congress REALLY overstepped its bounds.

Exactly: Who's next, you or me?

What's next? Will the courts require that feeding tubes be used AGAINST a person's wish? against a family's wishes? Will a respirator be used against a person's wish? against a family's wishes? and so forth
Will heart surgery be mandated because it can be done?
Will dialysis be ordered even though the person would rather go meet his Maker?
Will a person be ordered to accept an organ transplant?

The implications are frightening, and far worse than you are imagining.

Death has lost its sting. I will live as long as I can, and then I am ready to go. I know the place I am going and He is preparing it for me.

Terri Schiavo stopped living long ago. Medical intervention (the tube so she would not choke on food she cannot chew and swallow) has prolonged her death.

She has been slowly and torturously murdered for fifteen years. I wouldn't doubt that God is saying, "Let Terri come Home, now. Let her go!"

But you can't hear God when you're filled with ideas about thoughts of self and thoughts of others.

[jdhljc169]

****What's next? Will the courts require that feeding tubes be used AGAINST a person's wish? against a family's wishes? Will a respirator be used against a person's wish? against a family's wishes? and so forth
Will heart surgery be mandated because it can be done?
Will dialysis be ordered even though the person would rather go meet his Maker?
Will a person be ordered to accept an organ transplant?

I don't believe that will be the case. I believe it will be the opposite. If you look at Germany, they started out with the disabled. That's where I see this going. Euthansia. We have been warned by the Christians in the Netherlands.

****The implications are frightening, and far worse than you are imagining.

Yeah, the implications that we will start killing people that "are not the same as us." Who are we to judge the quality of someone else's life? We are looking at it as healthy individuals trying to figure out what it would be like, but we can't because we haven't been there.

***Death has lost its sting. I will live as long as I can, and then I am ready to go. I know the place I am going and He is preparing it for me.

Same here.

***Terri Schiavo stopped living long ago. Medical intervention (the tube so she would not choke on food she cannot chew and swallow) has prolonged her death.

You are judging what her life is like. How do you know she stopped living long ago? She is disabled. She is not dead.
How many people are out there that can't chew their own food? Should we get rid of them too?

She is being starved to death and if you think that Jesus would do something like this, well I don't know what to say.

****She has been slowly and torturously murdered for fifteen years. I wouldn't doubt that God is saying, "Let Terri come Home, now. Let her go!"

How has she been murdered? By giving her food? What do you think Jesus would do?

***But you can't hear God when you're filled with ideas about thoughts of self and thoughts of others.

Are you talking about that I can't? Because I have been praying for her from the start and listening to God tell me that ALL life is prescious.

[onyx eyes]

The word Karma is not, in the bible, under that name. Karma has become slang for "what you give out, is what you get back".

(I think originally, karma comes from the Sanscrit writings? the meaning is the same, however...)

[FBD]

>"I stated that am a Christian. If you are not, then I can spend some time to explain why you should be."<

-I don't talk about my religious beliefs on this open forum, anymore. Relating to a biblical story or person is one thing, but Bible verses get thrown around here at each other like bricks, instead of being shared like the spiritual bread it was intended to be.

>"Opinions are like butts, everybody's got one (but some are definitely more attractive...)!"<

Yes, on that point we agree! {G}

Regards

[pageonetoo]

The word Karma is not, in the bible, under that name. Karma has become slang for "what you give out, is what you get back". -onyx eyes

-I don't talk about my religious beliefs on this open forum, anymore. Relating to a biblical story or person is one thing, but Bible verses get thrown around here at each other like bricks, instead of being shared like the spiritual bread it was intended to be. -FBD

...and that is nothing like the Holy Scriptures. God repeatedly reveals to us that we are unworthy, and sinful creatures. He lets us know that we are worthy of nothing but death, and eternal separation should be our rewards.

But, He says, "what you give out...I'll cover with my blood...and forgive....and overshadow you with My love... if you will just believe!"

FBD, use Scripture as your tool. If you have a proper undertanding, it is a sword... (it doesn't hurt if you have studied Greek and Hebrew... which I did, but there are plenty of resources available. The best guide is the Holy Sprit!)

2Tim 3:10ff-

10You, however, know all about my teaching, my way of life, my purpose, faith, patience, love, endurance, 11persecutions, sufferings–what kinds of things happened to me in Antioch, Iconium and Lystra, the persecutions I endured. Yet the Lord rescued me from all of them.

12In fact, everyone who wants to live a godly life in Christ Jesus will be persecuted, 13while evil men and impostors will go from bad to worse, deceiving and being deceived.

14But as for you, continue in what you have learned and have become convinced of, because you know those from whom you learned it, 15and how from infancy you have known the holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus.

16All Scripture is Godbreathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, 17so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.

Find peace, Terri... that is my prayer...

[FBD]

Thanks for the scripture quotes, FRiend.

But there is no medicinal, ethical, or religious teaching that supports a government court or a society which prohibits a mother from putting water on the lips of her dying daughter..

There is not a single scripture in the Bible that will validate, excuse, or sanction that.

Regards

[pageonetoo]

But there is no medicinal, ethical, or religious teaching that supports a government court or a society which prohibits a mother from putting water on the lips of her dying daughter..

I am reminded of the old straw about..."gag at a gnat, and swallow a camel".

There is no satisfaction in this situation. The law is the law. I am one of the first to rail against the bureaucracy, and senseless legal wrangling. I agree that it is trajic. But, you wish to assuage your feelings of guilt, and shower the blame on those who happen to believe that this is Terri's desire. You will make wild accusations based on your "righteous" indignation, but this is actually what the law demands.

If they allow the mom to give the daughter a swallow water, your argument would then use that rational to give her another drink, then food, in whatever form would traverse her throat, if it could. They would say that, at any expense, at any time, in any way, she should be fed. They would not give her peace. They just don't want her dead. They would only make themselves happy, at her expense!

On another thread, one woman posited that MS had bought someone else's brain scans, and substituted them for Terri's. Please excuse me while I shake my head in disbelief...

In your medical ethics, or religious ethics, where does it say life is fair? The only truth is God's eternal gift!

They've called in Jesse Jackson, for pete's sake... the witch doctor himself!!! It isn't about Terri Schiavo, it is about a lot of selfish people, and their "15 minutes of fame"! It's certainly none of your business, nor is it any of mine. The law was written in response to situations arising with new technologies. It recognizes the inate desire of a mom's bosom...

We don't know what TS said, we weren't there. We do know that a lot of courts have ruled ON ALL EVIDENCE PRESENTED, PAST AND PRESENT, (oh, I know, they were rigged)and all have agreed with MS! Anything less than following their desision is a violation of HER Rights! That's just my opinion!

[FBD]

>"But, you wish to assuage your feelings of guilt,
and shower the blame on those who happen to believe that this is Terri's desire."<

-I have no guilty feelings in this matter, and I haven't showered blame on you. I did not personally act in this matter, and as Christians, we each must answer for our own actions.

I also subscribe to a philosophical position, my tagline:
“The measure of a society is how it treats the least of us."


I've tried to have an intelligent conversation with you, and without lumping you in as something you are not.
Why do you continue to do this with me? I encourage you to go through my post history, and show me where I have showered blame on you, or done anything of the sort that you have accused me of in your post to me. If I have, then I apologize afore-hand.

>"You will make " righteous indignation, but this is actually what the law demands."<

-Your last post was full of scripture, and now here you are throwing bricks at me in this post.

-The woman is 12 days without water, her mother should not be deprived by armed police officers, of a God given right to hold, and comfort her daughter, while she is dying.
Her mother giving her water, or moistening her lips is not going to bring her back. Ms. Schiavo's organs are full of morphine poison, and have undoubtablty shut down. it's more for the consoling of a mothers feelings that I am concerned about at this point, laws be damned.

If you wish to call my comments, and thoughts: "wild accusations" based on my "righteous indignation", well then, grab a couple more bricks, and fire away.

Quite frankly, FRiend; this conversation has gotten rather tedious, and I've more productive things to do with my time. Carry on without me, on your thread.

Take care.