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Bush: No passports at borders
Fox.com ^ | 4/15 | Fox News

Posted on 04/15/2005 6:49:37 AM PDT by Personal Responsibility

WASHINGTON — Plans requiring passports from people entering the United States don't pass muster with President Bush

(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Foreign Affairs; Government
KEYWORDS: border; bordersecurity; bush; bushamnesty; illegal; illegalaliens; immigration; minuteman; passports
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I am stunned by this comment. Whats it going to take to get some border security here? This is insane! Now we should not ask for passports because it might inconvienience people and take some time? This is nuts!
1 posted on 04/15/2005 6:49:38 AM PDT by Personal Responsibility
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To: Personal Responsibility

Bush: "Passaports! They don't need no stinkin' passaports!"


2 posted on 04/15/2005 6:52:31 AM PDT by TomGuy (America: Best friend or worst enemy. Choose wisely.)
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To: Personal Responsibility
It really hurts business and I don't want my biometric data taken just because I want to spend a day or two in Mexico or Canada. It's pointless while we still have such porous borders.
3 posted on 04/15/2005 6:54:34 AM PDT by bahblahbah
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To: HiJinx

Bush not concerned with border security ping.


4 posted on 04/15/2005 6:55:20 AM PDT by Marine Inspector (Customs & Border Protection Officer)
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To: bahblahbah
It really hurts business and I don't want my biometric data taken just because I want to spend a day or two in Mexico or Canada. It's pointless while we still have such porous borders.

Exactly. We need to use market forces to address this 'so called' border problem. It's funny how most on this thread seem to think ANOTHER piece of paper required by government is going to make them feel better.

5 posted on 04/15/2005 6:56:42 AM PDT by ClintonBeGone (In politics, sometimes it's OK for even a Wolverine to root for a Buckeye win.)
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To: Personal Responsibility
"I thought there was a better way to expedite the legal flow of traffic and people," he said.

How do you determine who is legal vs. illegal without checking their ID's? This is Bush's way of ratifying the Free Trade of the America's without having to have that pesky legislative branch (the will of the people) involved.

6 posted on 04/15/2005 6:57:18 AM PDT by RockyMtnMan
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To: Personal Responsibility

"Whats it going to take to get some border security here? "


It's gonna take a MASSIVE terrorist attack that results in the loss of thousands of American lives and billions of dollars of damage.

Oh wait - we've already had that....

Just another reason why it's impossible to take Bush seriously on the WOT when he steadfastly refuses to protect even his own borders.


7 posted on 04/15/2005 6:57:27 AM PDT by Blzbba ("Under every stone lurks a politician. " Aristophanes, 410 BC)
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To: Personal Responsibility

Would you believe..................Guestports?


8 posted on 04/15/2005 6:57:39 AM PDT by Cagey
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To: Personal Responsibility
I am stunned by this comment.

I'm not. But then again I read the entire article so I could take this comment in context. It's not a big deal to me.

9 posted on 04/15/2005 6:57:40 AM PDT by Coop (In memory of a true hero - Pat Tillman)
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To: Personal Responsibility

Who's he think he is, anyways.


10 posted on 04/15/2005 6:57:42 AM PDT by Lazamataz (Time Ebbs No Rankle)
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To: ClintonBeGone

You mean like punishing businesses who hire illegals?


11 posted on 04/15/2005 6:58:03 AM PDT by RockyMtnMan
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To: Personal Responsibility

And so it begins...... Bush relaxing his security stance....boosting Tancredo for 08....Tancredo loses....Jeb in 2012. Sorry to sound like a conspircy theorist, but slowly but surely my assessment is coming to light.


12 posted on 04/15/2005 6:58:43 AM PDT by Alex Marko
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To: Coop

The thing at issue is absolutely no one told the White House about the change to requiring passports; Bush was completely blindsided and said he found out about it on the radio.

Heads are gonna roll.


13 posted on 04/15/2005 6:58:51 AM PDT by Strategerist
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To: RockyMtnMan
How do you determine who is legal vs. illegal without checking their ID's? This is Bush's way of ratifying the Free Trade of the America's without having to have that pesky legislative branch (the will of the people) involved.

Friendly suggestion: Read the article before commenting.

14 posted on 04/15/2005 6:59:28 AM PDT by Coop (In memory of a true hero - Pat Tillman)
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To: Alex Marko
Bush relaxing his security stance....boosting Tancredo for 08....Tancredo loses....

You mean Tancredo gets the nomination and loses? BWHAAHAHAHAHAHA.

15 posted on 04/15/2005 6:59:29 AM PDT by Strategerist
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To: Blzbba
Just another reason why it's impossible to take Bush seriously on the WOT when he steadfastly refuses to protect even his own borders.

Did anyone read this article? Or is everyone too busy jumping to conclusions?

16 posted on 04/15/2005 7:00:08 AM PDT by Coop (In memory of a true hero - Pat Tillman)
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To: Strategerist

Tancredo will not win. Whatever party that nominates a moderate will win.


17 posted on 04/15/2005 7:00:36 AM PDT by Alex Marko
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To: Personal Responsibility

I agree. We need passports. People have told me that when they go to Canada, it's harder for them to get into Canada then it is to come back to the US. Now that's saying something.

President Bush, the Canadian and Mexican borders are INTERNATIONAL. I needed a passport to go to France. I also have to have one when I go to China. Just because Canada, Mexico, and the Caribbean nations are our neighbors, that does not mean that we are to give them special status.


18 posted on 04/15/2005 7:00:40 AM PDT by wk4bush2004
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To: Personal Responsibility; HiJinx
"The president said Thursday he was surprised by the proposed rules announced last week by the State and Homeland Security departments."

That's what we've been telling the President all along - WE WANT TIGHTER BORDER CONTROL!

Walk around with yer head in a fog ignoring everyone else but Fox and when it lifts a bit yer surprised.

Well, surprise! surprise!

I would expect the resignations of those department heads who made the recommendations on the President's desk, stat. How dare them not agree with his open border policy.

19 posted on 04/15/2005 7:02:59 AM PDT by azhenfud ("He who is always looking up seldom finds others' lost change...")
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To: Personal Responsibility

The family and I are driving to Michigan this week, we have to go through Canada to get to Michigan. Requiring a passport would be A HUGE F-NG PAIN IN THE ASS!!!!!

Illegals aren't passing through gated entry points...they are coming across unguarded territory. So guard it better and don't burden the average citizen.


20 posted on 04/15/2005 7:03:03 AM PDT by Pondman88
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To: Personal Responsibility

Americans should NOT have to have a passport to enter their own county. Everyone else should.
How simple is that?
Asking Americans for a passport to reenter their country is tantamount to....."papers please".


21 posted on 04/15/2005 7:03:09 AM PDT by sheana
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To: bahblahbah

Hes Right: Passports wont do anything. We cant check peoples passports until we catch them!

The Real solution could always be a Fence or Wall. The only traffic going through the none policed entrences (Ex. Deserts and Rivers as opposed to highways) Is a one-way stream from Mexico. A Fence and or wall could solve all that!


22 posted on 04/15/2005 7:03:17 AM PDT by el_doctor2
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To: bahblahbah
It really hurts business and I don't want my biometric data taken just because I want to spend a day or two in Mexico or Canada.

It won't hurt business and you are subject to CBP taking you biometric data when you reenter the country anyway.

23 posted on 04/15/2005 7:03:32 AM PDT by Marine Inspector (Customs & Border Protection Officer)
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To: Personal Responsibility
You edited out some of the important text, hence taking it out of context, troll. If you want to trash President Bush, head to DU. The complete thought on the comment to chose to pick out reads:
WASHINGTON — Plans requiring passports from people entering the United States don't pass muster with President Bush (search), who has ordered a review of this border security effort amid fears it would impede legal travel from Canada, Mexico and other U.S. neighbors.

This is correct. It will cause people in Canada to not be able to travel in as easily who are entering legally. From the folks I know up there, getting a passport is not the something you can do easily.

What is wrong with it being reviewed?

24 posted on 04/15/2005 7:04:00 AM PDT by RedBloodedAmerican
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To: bahblahbah
It really hurts business

I say hogwash... How does it hurt business?
25 posted on 04/15/2005 7:04:18 AM PDT by demkicker (Support DeLay, the Hammer, and the fillibuster ban on judicial nominations!)
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To: Coop
I read it, and saw this further down. Doesn't sound so horrible to me at least:

Bush said the rules must be more flexible, and could include electronic fingerprint imaging "to serve as a so-called passport for daily traffic" to help speed up the process.

26 posted on 04/15/2005 7:04:36 AM PDT by KJC1
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To: Alex Marko
And so it begins...... Bush relaxing his security stance....boosting Tancredo for 08....Tancredo loses....Jeb in 2012.

**************

Jeb has lost his appeal, imho.

27 posted on 04/15/2005 7:04:42 AM PDT by trisham ("Live Free or Die," General John Stark, July 31, 1809)
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To: Personal Responsibility
Q Mr. President, a month ago you stood in Crawford with the leaders of Mexico and Canada and talked about the importance of balancing security, but maintaining the free flow of trade and people across the borders. But this month, your Department of Homeland Security has said that they're going to be requiring passports for tourists coming across the border. As somebody who is familiar with the long lines at today's border, do you -- what's your reaction to the protests from the business and tourism community? And do you support the requirement of passports?

THE PRESIDENT: Yes, I'm aware of the issue, obviously. When I first read that in the newspaper, about the need to have passports, particularly today's crossings that take place -- about a million, for example, in the state of Texas -- I said, what's going on here. I thought there was a better way to do -- to expedite legal flow of traffic and people. Evidently this has been mandated in law. And so I've talked to Condi and the Homeland Security people about making -- seeing if there's some flexibility in the law that will allow for, for example, finger imaging to serve as the so-called passport for daily traffic. But you're right, it's going to -- if people have to have a passport, it's going to disrupt honest flow of traffic. I think there's some flexibility in the law. And that's what we're checking out right now.

On the larger scale, look, we got a lot to do to enforce the border. For those of you in Arizona, now know that Arizona has got more illegal immigrants coming across their border than, I guess, any other state right now. My view is Congress needs to work with us to pass immigration reform. One, we got to enforce the border better. We've increased border spending by 34 percent since, I think, 2001. But it doesn't make any sense to me to have a system that kind of forces an industry to develop, an industry that smuggles people, an industry that forges documents, an industry that really doesn't represent the best of America.

It seems like to me what we ought to do is be open about it, and say, look, if you're a willing worker and a willing employee, and you can't find an American, here's a legal way to work. Here's a document which enables you to be here legally so that if you decide to go home for a little bit, you can. And there will be time limit on the document, a time limit on the right to be here to work. To me it's a more humane way than a system which encourages employers who are looking for workers to break the law, to accept -- unknowingly accept illegal documentation, for example. And so I -- and this is a tough issue. Look, I understand. The danger with the immigration issue is that it can be -- it can lead to nativism and encourage behavior which is really not how Americans should view the world.

The long-term solution, by the way, to -- for example, immigration issues with Mexico, is for Mexico to grow a middle class. That's why I'm such a big believer in NAFTA. It's in our interest that wealth be spread out through the hemisphere -- the best way to spread wealth is through trade -- so that Mexico can grow and become a vibrant place, so people are more likely to be able to find a job closer to home. But the reality is if you make 50 cents in the interior of Mexico and $5 in Texas, you're going to do $5, if you can make it. And so now is the time for legal -- reforming of the immigration system.

I don't believe in blanket amnesty. I think it would be mistake. I think that wouldn't -- all that would do is create another incentive for 8 million people, whatever the number is, to come. And so I think if somebody wants to be a citizen, they ought to get in line like everybody who has gotten in line to become a citizen of the United States. And so my vision is one that's work-related, and hopefully we can get Congress to move on it. There's some bipartisan movement on this issue, as well. But I'm under no illusions, this is a tough issue for people. And it's a hard one. But the system is not working right now.

And when you talk about border security, George, it's -- it would be better if our Border Patrol agents were chasing down drugs and guns than trying to chase down people. And by that I mean, it would be a much more efficient use of taxpayer's money if the system were legal, the worker system was legal so that the Border Patrol could focus on other issues. In other words, if it were legal, people wouldn't have to get in the back of an 18-wheeler. If it were legal to come here and work, you wouldn't have to walk miles across the hot desert. And it would make it easier to protect our border with an immigration system that worked on legalizing work.

28 posted on 04/15/2005 7:04:45 AM PDT by OXENinFLA
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To: RockyMtnMan
How do you determine who is legal vs. illegal without checking their ID's?

You can't and the US passport is the least abused and hardest document to counterfeit.

29 posted on 04/15/2005 7:05:03 AM PDT by Marine Inspector (Customs & Border Protection Officer)
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To: Pondman88

Yeah, when I coached speech and debate we had a lot of tournaments in the Detroit area and by far the quickest way to get there from Ithaca was through Canada.

As it is it's really difficult to get back in the country if you look foreign; a friend of mine in High School had his younger (adopted from Korea as an infant) sister held up at the border forever; this was well before 9/11.


30 posted on 04/15/2005 7:05:15 AM PDT by Strategerist
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To: Coop

Exactly. See my post above. The goal here was to trash GW. That's all.


31 posted on 04/15/2005 7:05:19 AM PDT by RedBloodedAmerican
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To: wk4bush2004

For weeks Customs agents have been informing Americans entering Mexico that by 2007 they will have to have passports to re-enter the USA. Wasn't our Commander in Chief aware of what was happening? This is just another indication that Bush is unable to concentrate on more than one issue at a time.


32 posted on 04/15/2005 7:05:43 AM PDT by gaspar
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To: bahblahbah
It's pointless while we still have such porous borders.

Bingo. When I skip over to Nueva Laredo I'll show a passport to get back, meanwhile 50 miles upriver my office's future lawnkeeper is wading the Rio Grande.
33 posted on 04/15/2005 7:05:51 AM PDT by BJClinton
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To: ClintonBeGone; blahblahblah...

Ok....grant your wish. Borders locked down. Big push made, and a big show of "looky us, megasecure borders" woohoo!

Then 19 hijackers legally inside the country take over airplanes and crash them into buildings. Terrorists rejoice. Mission accomplished.

If you claim to support the theory (as I do) that you have to kill and disassemble terrorists at their source BEFORE they get here, then you have to believe it here too.

One hole in the border ANYWHERE makes it useless. So a dollar spent on border "security" is one less dollar spent on disarming Qaddaffi or dropping a JDAM on Zarqawi.


34 posted on 04/15/2005 7:05:56 AM PDT by sam_paine (X .................................)
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To: ClintonBeGone
Exactly. We need to use market forces to address this 'so called' border problem. It's funny how most on this thread seem to think ANOTHER piece of paper required by government is going to make them feel better.

Didn't see a /sarcasm note, so have to think you are serious. We are talking about 2 concerns here at our borders, control of the non-entry point lengths of border, and better control at the entry points.

While most here seem very concerned over buttoning up the non-entry border areas, in fact, the most dangerous can very easily go through the entry points without more and tougher conrols, paper or not. There is little doubt left for me that our President is not serious about either of those problems. He must be thinking that the war on terror can be successfully fought on foreign shores alone, but that is simply false.

I wonder if Tom Tancredo is the only elected official in the country who can see the dangers on our borders?

35 posted on 04/15/2005 7:05:56 AM PDT by MACVSOG68
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To: Blzbba
Just another reason why it's impossible to take Bush seriously on the WOT when he steadfastly refuses to protect even his own borders.

Bingo.

36 posted on 04/15/2005 7:06:07 AM PDT by Marine Inspector (Customs & Border Protection Officer)
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To: gaspar
This is just another indication that Bush is unable to concentrate on more than one issue at a time

Or nobody thought to tell him.

37 posted on 04/15/2005 7:06:37 AM PDT by Strategerist
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To: Strategerist
The thing at issue is absolutely no one told the White House about the change to requiring passports; Bush was completely blindsided and said he found out about it on the radio

I don't buy that at all.

But, say it is true, then it just exemplifies how out of touch with mainstream America Bush and Co really are. That is even worse.
38 posted on 04/15/2005 7:06:39 AM PDT by TomGuy (America: Best friend or worst enemy. Choose wisely.)
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To: RedBloodedAmerican
You edited out some of the important text, hence taking it out of context, troll. If you want to trash President Bush, head to DU. The complete thought on the comment to chose to pick out reads:

*****************

Bingo.

39 posted on 04/15/2005 7:06:43 AM PDT by trisham ("Live Free or Die," General John Stark, July 31, 1809)
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To: RedBloodedAmerican; KJC1
You edited out some of the important text

It appears you have both read the article cited.

Please leave this thread immediately! ;-)

40 posted on 04/15/2005 7:06:58 AM PDT by Coop (In memory of a true hero - Pat Tillman)
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To: sheana

Then, how is it going to be determined if someone is American or not? Whenever I've left the country, I've always had to show my passport upon entry home.


41 posted on 04/15/2005 7:07:08 AM PDT by demkicker (Support DeLay, the Hammer, and the fillibuster ban on judicial nominations!)
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To: RedBloodedAmerican
You edited out some of the important text, hence taking it out of context, troll.

Actually, I didn't. I copy / pasted it directly from the first line of the Fox article.

42 posted on 04/15/2005 7:07:18 AM PDT by Personal Responsibility (Those who have sacked the sackers who were sacked for stealing my signature have been sacked.)
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To: Personal Responsibility

Being as I live about 10 miles from the Michigan Canada border, we go to the great white north a few times a year. I understand the need to protect our borders with tight control.

However, on the negative side, The US and Canada has enjoyed cordial relations for decades (notwithstanding Paul Martin and Jacques Cretien) along with easy border passage. It would cost me over $600.00 to get passports for my family, a price I am unwilling to pay.

I do support birth certificates, which have been required for a few years. Customs should explore requiring an original copy of a birth certificate, with a seal along with photo ID.


43 posted on 04/15/2005 7:07:24 AM PDT by cyclotic (Cub Scouts-Teach 'em young to be men, and politically incorrect in the process)
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To: Personal Responsibility
I totally agree with President Bush.

Be "stunned" all you want, IMO.

And regarding what's really "insane", it's allowing illegals when apprehended to go free on a promise to appear before immigration at a later date.

Looking at the big picture, the flow of immigrants coming into the USA is necessary because of the low birth rates.

Without the illegals...small business, the back-bone of the economy would tank.

Read Mark Steyn's latest columns where he gives examples of what low birth rates and socialism has done to Europe, Cananda and Russia...and what outsourcing has done for India and China's birth of a middle-class.

44 posted on 04/15/2005 7:07:58 AM PDT by DCPatriot
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To: demkicker

Nope, you can reenter with a driver's license. But since they refuse to crack down on illegals receiving licenses now they are punishing Americans again...papers please.


45 posted on 04/15/2005 7:08:20 AM PDT by sheana
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To: TomGuy

Mainstream America didn't decide to require passports; Homeland Security did.

So do you want some sort of weenie wonk like Gore who is constantly micromanaging regulations of every department in office?

What happened is that this wasn't perceived as that significant by HS and the decision was made at a department level and the WH wasn't notified and nobody said "Hey, Prez, what do you think of this?" at a cabinet meeting.


46 posted on 04/15/2005 7:08:45 AM PDT by Strategerist
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To: gaspar
This is just another indication that Bush is unable to concentrate on more than one issue at a time.

Oh yeah! Even though it's early we've got a solid winner for the coveted SPOTD award!

47 posted on 04/15/2005 7:09:06 AM PDT by Coop (In memory of a true hero - Pat Tillman)
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To: trisham
Jeb has lost his appeal, imho

He began to lose it with me when his wife was caught smuggling. His poor performance in the Schaivo case sealed it.

48 posted on 04/15/2005 7:09:44 AM PDT by ladyjane
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To: Personal Responsibility
I have family that live in Buffalo, NY. I live in West Michigan. The fastest way to get from here to there is to go through Ontario and cross back into the US at Niagra Falls. With these rules, every member of my family would need passports for the whole 4-5 hours we'd be in Canada.

In addition, read the whole article.

Bush said the rules must be more flexible, and could include electronic fingerprint imaging "to serve as a so-called passport for daily traffic" to help speed up the process.

That is all.

MGY
49 posted on 04/15/2005 7:09:53 AM PDT by TitanicMan2003 (This just in... Yasser Arafat, despite the rumors, is still dead.)
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To: demkicker
Then, how is it going to be determined if someone is American or not?

The cited article will answer your question.

50 posted on 04/15/2005 7:10:05 AM PDT by Coop (In memory of a true hero - Pat Tillman)
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