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7-Year-Old Suspected In Beating Death Of Baby Sister
WNBC Television ^ | 6/2/2005 | Puppage

Posted on 06/02/2005 7:15:50 AM PDT by Puppage

TAMPA, Fla. -- In an attack that's rattled even veteran detectives, police in Florida said a 7-year-old boy has confessed to beating his baby sister to death.

Investigators said the boy was jealous of the attention the infant was getting and upset by her crying. They said the boy beat the baby with his fists, feet and a two-by-four.

The attack occurred in Tampa, while the boy was visiting his father.

Police said the father and his girlfriend were outside with neighbors when the boy came out and told them the baby was "bleeding." They said the seven-month-old had a bloody nose, and wasn't breathing. The parents rushed the baby to a hospital, where she was pronounced dead.

A spokesman said detectives noted they'd never seen someone so young "show so much violence and so little remorse."


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Miscellaneous; US: Florida; Unclassified
KEYWORDS: deathcultivation; donutwatch; murder; siblingrivalry
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To: stormyseas

stormyseas, I'm glad your daughter is doing well under what have to be very trying circumstances for her and for you. We have always had young womenin our society who were in that situation .. my problem is that now it is THE thing to do. In the 2 examples I cited, there is now the son of a dead Marine who may or may not get the benefits
to which he's entitled, and there is probably zero chance his mother will get the benefits she would have had if they married before he shipped out. And in the case of Steve Nash and the celebrity elites, there is no reason not to marry. They have 'committed' long-term relationships, they have money, they are not kids. They are choosing this situation not only for themselves but for their kids and I just think it's very unfair. My concern isn't the individual person here and there, it's the critical mass in our society.


301 posted on 06/02/2005 2:58:11 PM PDT by EDINVA (i)
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To: stormyseas

There is NO deterrent for murders under 14, they KNOW they will not get the death penalty.


302 posted on 06/02/2005 3:00:18 PM PDT by ET(end tyranny) (Pro 26:13 The sluggard saith: 'There is a pierced in the way; yea, a pierced is in the streets.')
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To: EDINVA
"I don't understand how these men and women can bring children into the world and not make a commitment, to each other for that child's benefit, through marriage. What am I missing?"

Divorce is too easy for starters. Rather than work on problems, people just walk away. Lack of spiritual and moral guidance.
Everyone wants to get married in a church in God's presence, but no one wants to follow God's advise. Lack of commitment. Alcohol abuse, drug abuse.

It gets worse with each passing generation because fewer and fewer people are brought up with any sort of spiritual and moral guidance. Perhaps there should be a mandatory marriage school that must be completed before people get married. The church (Catholic) used to make you go to mandatory marriage school, so maybe some secular form of that should be made mandatory. Human relation class in high school?

303 posted on 06/02/2005 3:01:06 PM PDT by Nathan Zachary
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To: Aquinasfan
Yesterday he pulled all the leaves off of a birch tree I had just planted.

I'd have demanded a new tree.

304 posted on 06/02/2005 3:01:46 PM PDT by Howlin (Up or down on Janice Brown!)
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To: Howlin
Yesterday he pulled all the leaves off of a birch tree I had just planted.

I'd have demanded a new tree.

He should start taking pictures and even better use a cam corder. And each time get the destruction on film and file complaints. The parents of the obnoxious child will eventually have to pay costs which will probably end the destruction.

305 posted on 06/02/2005 3:06:15 PM PDT by ET(end tyranny) (Pro 26:13 The sluggard saith: 'There is a pierced in the way; yea, a pierced is in the streets.')
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To: ET(end tyranny)

Good thinking!


306 posted on 06/02/2005 3:08:15 PM PDT by Howlin (Up or down on Janice Brown!)
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To: Howlin

Think of all the things we now see because of so many people having cam corders. We don't have to worry about the government being the eye in the sky or the town with cameras on every corner, because many many homes have cam corders! In my opinion it is wrong but now adays, downright foolish to do anything to someone else's property. lol


307 posted on 06/02/2005 3:12:18 PM PDT by ET(end tyranny) (Pro 26:13 The sluggard saith: 'There is a pierced in the way; yea, a pierced is in the streets.')
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To: stormyseas
I can't see how capital punishment could be considered for a 7 year old either. I just can't imagine it.
I doubt anything other than foster care and counseling will given to him, but it won't be the last we hear of him either.
He is damaged psychologically now,(and probably leading up to this point) and will probably end up committing suicide, or in prison later on in life. At this point, I blame his parents, both of them for creating the little monster. I'm not saying that divorced parents or single parents are all bad either,I know plenty of single parents who are excellent parents, but obviously this particular pair are not.
308 posted on 06/02/2005 3:28:35 PM PDT by Nathan Zachary
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To: Nathan Zachary

FReepers come here to share reactions and look for answers. It's almost like coming home from work and venting to your family members. We often say stark, shocking things - out of anger and helplessness. Then someone will accuse someone else of being "judgemental" as if questioning behavior is taboo. We should criticize parents for not creating a stable environment for their children, because ultimately we will be forced to support and or live with these misfits.

Are we uninformed how adult sexual predators and murderers spent their childhood?
sp


309 posted on 06/02/2005 3:44:07 PM PDT by sodpoodle (The Ivory Billed Woodpecker discovered Arkansas - when HRC moved to NY)
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To: Puppage

Forget it Jake, its FLORIDA!


310 posted on 06/02/2005 3:44:37 PM PDT by Clemenza (The Ice Cream Truck in my Neighborhood Plays Helter Skelter)
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To: Puppage

I cannot comprehend how a child can commit such a heinous act. I put the blame on the parents, not the child. Children are sponges. They soak up what they see and hear. It seems that more and more children are raising themselves, because their parents won't do it. And this is the result. Children are learning all the wrong things.


311 posted on 06/02/2005 3:53:53 PM PDT by Luna (Lobbing the Holy Hand Grenade at Liberalism)
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To: All
I heard on local radio that the boy's mother had him enrolled in a Karate class and he got too aggressive - so she enrolled him in one that is less aggressive.

They did not say if he was enrolled at the time that he killed his little step-sister.

312 posted on 06/02/2005 3:54:41 PM PDT by LADY J
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To: Ecthelion

You would need to post pictures also!


313 posted on 06/02/2005 4:01:14 PM PDT by B4Ranch ( Report every illegal alien that you meet. Call 866-347-2423, Employers use 888-464-4218)
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To: B4Ranch

I meant toask before. Are those phone numbers legitimate?


314 posted on 06/02/2005 4:03:47 PM PDT by ET(end tyranny) (Pro 26:13 The sluggard saith: 'There is a pierced in the way; yea, a pierced is in the streets.')
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To: Aquinasfan

Move before he becomes a teenager!


315 posted on 06/02/2005 4:04:39 PM PDT by B4Ranch ( Report every illegal alien that you meet. Call 866-347-2423, Employers use 888-464-4218)
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To: pbrown

Two weeks! Wow, 33 years, congratulations and a quick prayer for 33 more.


316 posted on 06/02/2005 4:07:05 PM PDT by B4Ranch ( Report every illegal alien that you meet. Call 866-347-2423, Employers use 888-464-4218)
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To: B4Ranch
Two weeks! Wow, 33 years, congratulations and a quick prayer for 33 more.

Thank you, and please send any and all prayers to my husband...he needs them for coping with me. :-)

317 posted on 06/02/2005 4:27:11 PM PDT by processing please hold (Islam and Christianity do not mix ----9-11 taught us that)
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To: ET(end tyranny)

If they weren't why would I post them? Of course they are.


318 posted on 06/02/2005 4:32:14 PM PDT by B4Ranch ( Report every illegal alien that you meet. Call 866-347-2423, Employers use 888-464-4218)
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To: Ecthelion
I talked to this man in the Ellis Unit, he is on death row, a guilty man. He was scheduled to be executed August 1999, his new wife fought for him, she got a third appeal. If he would not have seen this appeal he would have never found G-d. What if we take their lives a day too soon? Now we are talking about a child here. Genesis 9:6 Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man. This scripture clearly says man,(I know that man means male, however, are we completely sure, do we want to take that chance?) so I am not so sure G-d would want a boy to be put to his death. What I am saying about then on to the elderly. When we believe that a life is worthless and non salvageable all life becomes useless, if it can not immediately and positively contribute to society. As we have seen with abortion and mercy killings as you have stated. I believe mercy killing is murder, even if the person wants it, they can carry the burden of suicide. But the person who assist should be under the same punishment, as all others that commit murder, correct? For life and death in this matter should be left alone, we do not know what affects we will have in the future for our elderly or our sick. As I said when human life becomes non-salvageable we are all doomed, and we lack faith.
319 posted on 06/02/2005 5:09:09 PM PDT by stormyseas
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To: Nathan Zachary

He might not even receive that if you want to know the truth, once ordered a lot of judges lose track through child welfare and down the line. It might not have been both parents, but you are right something had to seriously effect this boy and make him this angry. Each time this happens it is a different issue, with different facts, that makes it hard to for see it before it happens. By the time we are completely educated, it seems we might be too late.


320 posted on 06/02/2005 5:13:19 PM PDT by stormyseas
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To: EDINVA

thank you ....and very well stated.


321 posted on 06/02/2005 5:13:56 PM PDT by stormyseas
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To: Puppage
Quotation from one of Chris's Rock's shows:

It don't take no scientist to tell who will have some f***** up kids. If the kid call his grandma mami and his mama Pam, he's going to jail

322 posted on 06/02/2005 5:18:55 PM PDT by kaiser80
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To: Puppage
Ban assault two-by-fours!
323 posted on 06/02/2005 5:21:21 PM PDT by colorado tanker (The People Have Spoken)
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To: Tempestuous

I hope you don't consider yourself a Christian.

You seem to have a lot of anger.


324 posted on 06/02/2005 5:30:00 PM PDT by stands2reason (It's 2005, and two wrongs still don't make a right.)
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To: B4Ranch

Just making sure. Wrote them down just in case. :)


325 posted on 06/02/2005 5:37:02 PM PDT by ET(end tyranny) (Pro 26:13 The sluggard saith: 'There is a pierced in the way; yea, a pierced is in the streets.')
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To: Pete
I am surprised by the anger I am seeing in response to my simple question.

I can't speak for the poster in question, but I find it frickin annoying for someone to post to a thread just to complain that the thread in question exists.

326 posted on 06/02/2005 5:43:29 PM PDT by stands2reason (It's 2005, and two wrongs still don't make a right.)
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To: Puppage

Bad Seed.


327 posted on 06/02/2005 5:57:01 PM PDT by Dionysius
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To: Ecthelion

And I don't believe that a 7 year old, in general, should be regarded like an adult when handing out a sentence.

If we were to start executing kids of that age.... goodness, why must I even try and put up a protest for executing 7 year olds?


328 posted on 06/02/2005 5:59:26 PM PDT by baseballfanjm
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To: Nathan Zachary

" ... maybe some secular form of that should be made mandatory. Human relation class in high school?"

that's not a bad idea, till you realize who would come up with the curriculum, the fine folks that bring you 'family life education' and all relationships being equal, yada yada.

The Church(es) should go back to mandatory pre-marital counseling. Our society is collapsing before our very eyes and the mainstream churches are busy being social advocates for everything and everybody but the people who are or should be in their pews.


329 posted on 06/02/2005 7:06:53 PM PDT by EDINVA (i)
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To: shekkian
And the Supreme Court says we can't put this kid to death.

You forgot the sarcasm tag. You might be mistaken for an ignorant, bloodthirsty sack of crap.
330 posted on 06/02/2005 7:12:44 PM PDT by LanaTurnerOverdrive
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To: Tempestuous
There is a 99% chance that this kid will do it again if given the chance.

Statistics have shown that 67% of all morons pull statistics out of their dumb ass.
331 posted on 06/02/2005 7:14:24 PM PDT by LanaTurnerOverdrive
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To: Tarkin
Even Scalia once said that in his opinion the VIII Amendment prohibits executing minors that are younger than 14.

As the 8th Amendment clearly states, not 16, not 15, but 14. But those activist Judges continue to add their own interpretation to the Constitution.

332 posted on 06/02/2005 7:14:27 PM PDT by Doe Eyes
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To: LanaTurnerOverdrive

bump


333 posted on 06/02/2005 7:33:13 PM PDT by LanaTurnerOverdrive
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To: stands2reason
I can't speak for the poster in question, but I find it frickin annoying for someone to post to a thread just to complain that the thread in question exists.

Should I find your post annoying when you show annoyance at my post of annoyance on an (alleged) annoying thread? Help me here.

BTW, I don't see how asking someone why they posted a particular article is complaining.

334 posted on 06/02/2005 7:36:05 PM PDT by Pete
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To: B4Ranch
"from 50 years ago", not 120 years.

Let me get this straight. You are looking for a case of a child killing an infant from 1955?

I'll see what I can do.

335 posted on 06/02/2005 7:37:35 PM PDT by Pete
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To: yellowdoghunter

The original parents would be best for the children IF they truly are loving and stable. That is obviously not the case if the parents chose to divorce. Loving, stable adults would not chose to divorce!


336 posted on 06/02/2005 8:33:25 PM PDT by trussell (Prayers for the children!)
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To: Pete

Yes, somewhere prior to '60, 61 and not much later than '50. Say 12 years.


337 posted on 06/02/2005 10:21:17 PM PDT by B4Ranch ( Report every illegal alien that you meet. Call 866-347-2423, Employers use 888-464-4218)
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To: stormyseas

The issue is not if the life is salvageable. The issue is with the just application of the law.

If a man finds God after committing a crime, that is great. If it was meant to be, it would happen in time.

In the Jewish book of the law, a child that rebelled against his parents was to be put to death. I'd guess that if the kid murdered someone . . .


338 posted on 06/02/2005 11:30:12 PM PDT by Ecthelion
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To: Aquinasfan
Fifteen minutes later his father shows up to yell at me. "He's just five!" "He's very sensitive!"

Sad thing is that the kid probably wants to come over to your house and make trouble, just to get some attention AND discipline. After a couple years, though, the father will have the victim mentality permanently etched into the boy's character. May already be too late. How long before the little imp keys your car, poisons your pets, or burns down your house?

Might as well look for a good real estate agent.

339 posted on 06/02/2005 11:47:21 PM PDT by Thinkin' Gal
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To: Ecthelion
The issue is not if the life is salvageable. The issue is with the just application of the law.
I have explained how I feel about how just the legal system is so I don't believe I will go over it again...:) (my feelings regarding this and I have proof enough for myself of the justice system we are referring)
If a man finds God after committing a crime, that is great. If it was meant to be, it would happen in time. (the following will explain this I hope, but you have to be willing to read...:)
In the Jewish book of the law, a child that rebelled against his parents was to be put to death. I'd guess that if the kid murdered someone . . . I hope you understand after reading the following and realize Jewish law is based on G-d and they take it very seriously. Taking every aspect of every situation into account. They do not have a system like ours that just says a murderer is a murderer and then proceed to throw them all into the same boiling pot, issuing justice without taking each individual person as an EQUAL. Remember they look at the individual. THIS is Jewish law. I am not sure if you have looked into it. But when I worked for the NCADP this is an argument people used all the time to insure death for death. When in fact Jewish Law has no bearing on a secular justice system. One prohibition against murder is found in this verse of scripture, "If one spills the blood of a man, one's [own] blood will be spilled." Then we will look at the phrases directly following in the passage, "The blood of your lives will I require; from the hand of every beast will I require it, and from the hand of man, from the hand of a person's brother, will I require the life of man," this provides a rule related to the first. "From every beast will I require it" promises punishment to those who incapacitate someone, such as by tying him up, thereby leaving him defenseless to the fatal attack of a wild animal. "From the hand of man" assures punishment to those who hire someone to commit murder for them. "The blood of your lives will I require" assigns punishment to those who commit suicide. These pronouncements, which refer to heavenly imposed punishment, apply not only to direct acts of murder or suicide, but also to acts which indirectly cause the loss of life. Similarly, a variety of verses are cited as sources for the obligation to preserve one's own life and to rescue others. Jewish law holds the accords of this as great in significance because it places an extreme value to the life of each individual being. [O]nly a single human being was created in the world [at first] to teach that if any person has caused a single soul to perish. Scripture regards him as if he had caused an entire world to perish; and if any human being saves a single soul, Scripture regards him as if he had saved an entire world." Taken from a professor of Jewish law interpretation Jewish jurisprudence differentiates between biblical commandments, which are those deemed to have been directly transmitted by the Creator to Moses, and non-biblical rules. Interestingly, Jewish law does not recognize the literal meaning of a verse in the bible, the Torah, as an authoritative statement of law. In fact one may not kill another even to save ones on life It does not matter whether the other person is comatose, mentally deranged, physically handicapped or terminally ill. Similarly, to save one's own life or that of another, virtually all Jewish laws are suspended. For instance, despite the religious centrality of the Sabbath, if necessary to save his life, a person must actively do that which would other wise violate the Sabbath laws. Rabbenu Nissim (the Ran), a fourteenth century authority, states that one who, out of a misguided sense of righteousness, fails to desecrate the Sabbath to save his life, "is a murderer and is culpable for [losing] his life."Rabbi David ben Shlomo ibn Avi Zimra (the Radbaz), a sixteenth century leader, comments: "There is no righteousness in his refusal, for it constitutes suicide . . . and HaShem [God] will hold him accountable for his [loss of] life." Moreover, these rules apply even if a person's life can be only momentarily extended, for each instant of life is of infinite value. Jewish law approach…..” that matters of life and death are to be determined by God.” Unlike nonreligious legal systems, Jewish law assumes the existence of an omnipotent, omniscient and benevolent Creator whose purposes cannot always be fathomed. Jewish law also assumes a network of relationships between and among the Creator and all human beings. As a result of these assumptions, there is purpose and responsibility in every instant of life, for the individual and for the community, even though the purpose is not always readily apparent. Jewish law imposes specific responsibilities on individuals to safeguard their own lives and to help others. The extent of these obligations, however, are not unlimited. "A little child ask, mommy why do we kill people to teach people killing people is wrong." Then mom answered, "Do as we say, not as we do."
340 posted on 06/03/2005 4:22:08 AM PDT by stormyseas
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To: Puppage

We can argue death penalty or not all day... but, does anyone here honestly believe that this boy has not crossed a point of no return?


341 posted on 06/03/2005 4:38:31 AM PDT by Nataku X
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To: Nataku X

Me....no I don't believe that to say that would be to say God has no power. These are just my feelings. Do I think he needs serious help??? ....YES! And probably anyone else who had a serious influence in his life.Do I think he needs to be any where near other children or people, where he is free to do this again, right now, no. Yes I do believe it is our obligation (people as a whole, the system, etc...) to try and help him, you can not claim to love and not. The fact is no matter what opinions are the law says he is too young, not until 16 when committing a crime such as this can we execute, so with that fact at hand, do we throw him away or help him if we can?


342 posted on 06/03/2005 4:53:14 AM PDT by stormyseas
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To: stormyseas

Zack?


343 posted on 06/03/2005 5:05:57 AM PDT by Rippersnapper
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To: Rippersnapper

Zack??? hmmmmm what does this mean? seriously? Who is Zack?


344 posted on 06/03/2005 5:10:03 AM PDT by stormyseas
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To: stormyseas
I don't believe that to say that would be to say God has no power.

You work on the assumption of an Arminian (non-Calvinist) God. Assuming there is one, my Biblical interpretation is that each time that one rejects the Holy Spirit's call, one makes his/her soul more callous to the point that he/she has committed the Unpardonable Sin. So, both schools of Protestant theology allow for the existence of people who cannot be redeemed.

I believe that there are certain actions that, once done, cannot ever be erased from the human psyche. Meth addiction is one. Animal torture might be another. Malicious murder is another--not justice killings (including revenge), not self-defense, just plain ol' murder.

do we throw him away or help him if we can?

IMHO, executing a 7 year old is like telling a cancer patient "you have only 5 years to live so go ahead and kill yourself." Even if he cannot ever suppress his violent tendencies to interact with society again, he can still lead a productive number of years in a tightly supervised setting carrying out community service, volunteer work, receiving a basic education, all that. Unfortunately all our current solutions (juvenile hall, jailtime, etc.) only serve to harden youth.
345 posted on 06/03/2005 5:31:05 AM PDT by Nataku X
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To: Nataku X
We can argue death penalty or not all day... but, does anyone here honestly believe that this boy has not crossed a point of no return?

The Unpardonable sin, is as you say, you were asking my opinion or anyones so I just gave what I thought. Yours may be different....:) I was saying....That to say he has crossed the point of no return is to say G-d has no power. I have the faith that G-d can change him. I believe any type of killing is wrong. Again this is my belief. I also believe that certain actions once done can not be taken back, erased from the human psyche, I believe it can never be forgotten, however I do believe we can come to terms with it, through the guidance of the Holy Spirit and learn to apply even the worst things to a positive life for G-d. Look at Paul. As one example. (again these are my feelings not meant to offend any one else)
Also I agree with you 100% about or systems today in reform. There is no help in Jail. The system thinks that to break a man or boy will prevent him from committing other crimes. No they just learn how not to get caught. They become more hardened as you say. As I have been saying, what we are doing isn't working, there has to be something else.
346 posted on 06/03/2005 5:43:30 AM PDT by stormyseas
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To: Aquinasfan; Onelifetogive
I agree that the fact that this was a broken family was likely a contributing factor.

Still, this kind of thing does happen occasionally in intact families.

A few years ago in NY there was a little girl who killed her newborn twin brothers in a jealous rage. She took them out of their cribs and smashed them against the floor.

IIRC this happened in an intact Italian-American family. (Though I wonder if the parents are still married today --could any marriage survive such a tragedy?)

347 posted on 06/03/2005 6:00:30 AM PDT by shhrubbery! (The 'right to choose' = The right to choose death --for somebody else.)
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To: stands2reason

When you have one of your kids mudered by another one of your kids, then you can talk.


348 posted on 06/03/2005 7:31:29 AM PDT by Tempestuous
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Comment #349 Removed by Moderator

To: Doe Eyes
As the 8th Amendment clearly states, not 16, not 15, but 14. But those activist Judges continue to add their own interpretation to the Constitution."

Of course it doesn't state so, but in XVIII century England it was a widely spread belief that children, that are younger than 14 should be exempted from the penalty of death. So I guess that's why Scalia believes so.

350 posted on 06/03/2005 7:45:47 AM PDT by Tarkin (St. Maximilian Kolbe (1894-1941))
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