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Canadian National Public Radio Broadcasts Call for State Control of Religion
LifeSiteNews.com ^ | 20 July 2005

Posted on 07/19/2005 5:16:30 PM PDT by Aussie Dasher

OTTAWA, July 19, 2005 (LifeSiteNews.com) - Just as Senate approaches the final vote on the gay 'marriage' bill, C-38, Canada's national public radio CBC Radio has aired a commentary by a retired professor from the Royal Military College calling for state control over religion, specifically Catholicism. While parliamentarians dismissed warnings by numerous religious leaders and experts that such laws would lead to religious persecution, former professor Bob Ferguson has called for "legislation to regulate the practice of religion."

"Given the inertia of the Catholic Church, perhaps we could encourage reform by changing the environment in which all religions operate," Ferguson began his commentary in measured tones yesterday. "Couldn't we insist that human rights, employment and consumer legislation apply to them as it does other organizations? Then it would be illegal to require a particular marital status as a condition of employment or to exclude women from the priesthood. "

Ferguson continued, "Of course the Vatican wouldn't like the changes, but they would come to accept them in time as a fact of life in Canada. Indeed I suspect many clergy would welcome the external pressure."

The former professor pitched his idea as a boon to religious freedom. "We could also help the general cause of religious freedom by introducing a code of moral practice for religions," he said. "They will never achieve unity so why not try for compatibility? Can't religious leaders agree to adjust doctrine so all religions can operate within the code?"

Ferguson, would see religion regulated by provinces in the same way professions are regulated. "I am an engineer so the model I am thinking about is rather like the provincial acts regulating the practice of engineering," he said. "For example, engineers must have an engineering degree from a recognized university or pass qualification exams. They must have a number of years of practical experience and pass an ethics exam. The different branches: mechanical, electrical, civil and the like have a code of practice that applies to everyone. Why can't religious groups do the same?"

Continuing his comparison Ferguson stated, "I envisage a congress meeting to hammer out a code that would form the basis of legislation to regulate the practice of religion. Like the professional engineers' P.Eng designation, there would then be RRPs (or registered religious practitioners). To carry the analogy to its conclusion, no one could be a religious practitioner without this qualification."

Ferguson also suggests 'obvious' prohibitions on religion including preaching of 'hate'. "I won't try to propose what might be in the new code except for a few obvious things: A key item would have to be a ban on claims of exclusivity. It should be unethical for any RRP to claim that theirs was the one true religion and believers in anything else or nothing were doomed to fire and brimstone. One might also expect prohibition of ritual circumcisions, bans on preaching hate or violence, the regulation of faith healers, protocols for missionary work, etc.," says Ferguson.

The retired professor concluded his comments aired on CBC yesterday morning saying, "Now what is the point of proposing this? I do it because I am worried that the separation between church and state is under threat. Religion is important in our lives, but it can become a danger to society when people claim that the unalterable will of God is the basis for their opinions and actions. Yes religion can be a comfort and a guide, but we cannot take rules from our holy books and apply them to the modern world without democratic debate and due regard for the law."

Listen to an audio recording of the commentary: http://cbc.ca/commentary/media/20050718JUL18.ram


TOPICS: Canada; Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; News/Current Events; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: anticatholic; bigot; canada; canuckistan; censorship; communism; liberaltalkradio; publicradio
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To: Aussie Dasher

I wonder if Muslims would be required to open the ranks of their religious leaders to women?


51 posted on 07/19/2005 8:38:59 PM PDT by quadrant
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To: MACVSOG68
I do it because I am worried that the separation between church and state is under threat. Religion is important in our lives, but it can become a danger to society when people claim that the unalterable will of God is the basis for their opinions and actions. Yes religion can be a comfort and a guide, but we cannot take rules from our holy books and apply them to the modern world without democratic debate and due regard for the law."

MACVSOG68, you have a disciple in Canada.

52 posted on 07/19/2005 8:43:22 PM PDT by annalex
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To: SittinYonder
"Of course the Vatican wouldn't like the changes, but they would come to accept them in time as a fact of life in Canada. Indeed I suspect many clergy would welcome the external pressure."

I think with the new Pope saying he would like a smaller, but more believing Church, he may just tell Canada that if they were to implement this policy, the Church will remove its presence from that country. Close and demolish all Catholic schools, churches, hospitals and universities.

53 posted on 07/19/2005 9:12:08 PM PDT by Betty Jane
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To: Aussie Dasher; lainie

DAMMMN! those people are nuts!


54 posted on 07/19/2005 9:49:42 PM PDT by Cheapskate (America , -- -- -- -- Yeah!)
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To: Aussie Dasher

Unitarianism by fiat?


55 posted on 07/19/2005 10:03:57 PM PDT by bourbon (It's the target that decides whether terror wins.)
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To: Aussie Dasher
Couldn't we insist that human rights, employment and consumer legislation apply to them as it does other organizations?

I'm sure the irony of this statement escapes the professor. Freedom of religion is a human right. What right does the Canadian government or any government have to dictate the Catholic Church's beliefs or internal practices?

56 posted on 07/19/2005 10:14:50 PM PDT by Unam Sanctam
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To: redgolum
Worse than that. Once Canada does it, then it will be advocated in the USA.

I see the book of Revelation coming true before our very eyes.

57 posted on 07/20/2005 3:17:59 AM PDT by tom h
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To: Fitzcarraldo
I think the idea is to cobble a generalized/world religion.

Never heard of the "Unitarian" Church? They pretty much fit the bill.
58 posted on 07/20/2005 3:20:40 AM PDT by Kozak (Anti Shahada: " There is no God named Allah, and Muhammed is his False Prophet")
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To: Fitzcarraldo
I think the idea is to cobble a generalized/world religion.

Yep - part of Satan's plan to make all the churches apostate so they offer no path to God.

59 posted on 07/20/2005 4:18:05 AM PDT by trebb ("I am the way... no one comes to the Father, but by me..." - Jesus in John 14:6 (RSV))
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To: Aussie Dasher
One might also expect prohibition of ritual circumcisions, bans on preaching hate or violence, the regulation of faith healers, protocols for missionary work, etc.,"

etc.
etc.
etc.
I think the Chinese Catholic model is what he is shooting for here. Nothing like telling a Religion what to do. Hey, it worked for Henry VIII. It is nice to know he only mentioned Catholicism, we must be doing something right!
60 posted on 07/20/2005 4:41:56 AM PDT by Dominick ("Freedom consists not in doing what we like, but in having the right to do what we ought." - JP II)
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To: somniferum
"We can laugh at this whackjob now, but who knows in the next 10-20 years.."

Exactly!! One of my favorite writers, Mark Shea, says, "Sin makes you stupid." You see how ridiculous things are getting. People like this are genuinely stupid. The scarey thing is that these stupid people are in positions of power. I fear more for my kids than for myself.
61 posted on 07/20/2005 4:51:58 AM PDT by goodform
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To: goodform
"Can't religious leaders agree to adjust doctrine so all religions can operate within the code?"

This sounds like something I might have dreamed up when I was 18 and reading Bertrand Russell and Ayn Rand. Some super-rationalist, religion-hating intellectual's scheme to 'tame' world religion, because they fear it but also recognize they can't extinguish it.

People like this are genuinely stupid.

They have MADE themselves stupid with secular-humanist dogma.

62 posted on 07/20/2005 5:18:06 AM PDT by ARepublicanForAllReasons (A socialist is just a communist who happens to be outgunned!)
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To: big'ol_freeper

Hehehe, Division-wise I'm not sure, but I believe he's got somewhere around 1.1 billion foot soldiers. :)


63 posted on 07/20/2005 5:54:31 AM PDT by Romish_Papist (The times are out of step with the Catholic Church. God Bless Pope Benedict XVI.)
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To: Podkayne
"Margaret Atwood, author of "the Handmaids Tale" came up with a preposterous, unintelligible plot line based on the Canadian extremist notions concerning the future evolution of Christianity in America."

Margaret Atwood is a bona fide, drooling moron, a complete imbecile. The fact that she is considered a "distinguished author" says it all about the decline of literature. "The Handmaids's Tale" gets my vote as the most laughably paranoid and bigoted book of the last 50 years. It is a complete embarrassment. But if you want to know what I really think . . .
64 posted on 07/20/2005 7:09:31 AM PDT by Steve_Seattle
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To: Aussie Dasher

"I do it because I am worried that the separation between church and state is under threat. Religion is important in our lives, but it can become a danger to society when people claim that the unalterable will of God is the basis for their opinions and actions."

Orwell at work!


65 posted on 07/20/2005 7:14:07 AM PDT by Hermann the Cherusker
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To: Aussie Dasher

No wonder the slang for Canada's basic monetary unit is the "loony".


66 posted on 07/20/2005 7:16:37 AM PDT by Dane ( anyone who believes hillary would do something to stop illegal immigration is believing gibberish)
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To: Aussie Dasher

Why not skip to the chase and just ban religion?


67 posted on 07/20/2005 7:18:16 AM PDT by Frumious Bandersnatch
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To: Steve_Seattle
The frightening thing is that this weirdo doesn't see the absolute irony of what he is saying. His words are the biggest threat to separation of church and state that I've ever heard in North America.

No, they are a threat to the liberty of Holy Mother Church. The separation of Church and State means not allowing any religious influence on the State. It doesn't mean (at least to Liberals) not attacking religion and religious institutions.

68 posted on 07/20/2005 7:19:03 AM PDT by Hermann the Cherusker
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To: Aussie Dasher

I was hoping this was from Scrappleface -- alas, not.


69 posted on 07/20/2005 7:29:12 AM PDT by Polyxene (For where God built a church, there the Devil would also build a chapel - Martin Luther)
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To: Aussie Dasher

What a crock. They are picking on the wrong religion, but today it fits their agenda. In the future, they will have wished they had done differently, but it will be too late . . .


70 posted on 07/20/2005 7:39:20 AM PDT by Aliska
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To: american colleen; Lady In Blue; Salvation; narses; SMEDLEYBUTLER; redhead; Notwithstanding; ...
Catholic Ping - Please freepmail me if you want on/off this list


71 posted on 07/20/2005 9:56:58 AM PDT by NYer ("Each person is meant to exist. Each person is God's own idea." - Pope Benedict XVI)
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To: american colleen
In addition to being a fine Catholic artist and writer, Michael O'Brien is a prophet speaking through the form of the novel.
72 posted on 07/20/2005 10:24:57 AM PDT by Siobhan ("Whenever you come to save Rome, make all the noise you want." -- Pius XII)
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To: Aquinasfan

This would never have happened if the abuses after Vatican II had not effectively destroyed the Catholic Church in Canada from within. The Church is now weak, emaciated, and her sons and daughters especially in Quebec have abandoned Her in droves. This legislation would never have had a hope if the Catholic Church in Canada hadn't sold its birthright for a mess of pottage.


73 posted on 07/20/2005 10:29:07 AM PDT by Siobhan ("Whenever you come to save Rome, make all the noise you want." -- Pius XII)
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To: Aussie Dasher

Wow - Satan chimes in on Canadian Public Radio.


74 posted on 07/20/2005 10:44:23 AM PDT by Rutles4Ever
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To: Aussie Dasher

"calling for state control over religion, specifically Catholicism" I'm sure that will work, no problems I can see.


75 posted on 07/20/2005 10:51:30 AM PDT by isom35
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To: american colleen

Read and enjoyed Father Elijha very much, I will have to check those three out.


76 posted on 07/20/2005 11:03:17 AM PDT by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: Aussie Dasher
One of the usual TV reporters asked SC nominee John Roberts this AM.

paraphrased " Will your religion get in the way of your rulings?"
My wife was livid.

I expect an all out assault on Judaism and Christianity within the next decade.
77 posted on 07/20/2005 11:04:10 AM PDT by Vinnie
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To: Vinnie
I expect an all out assault on Judaism and Christianity within the next decade.

I don't even think we have that much longer to go till open and clear attempts at suppression of orthodox Christianity. We already have a number equivocating those who are pro life with those who are jihadists.

We are in the twilight, and night will be here soon.

78 posted on 07/20/2005 11:18:58 AM PDT by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: C2ShiningC

Unbelievable.


79 posted on 07/20/2005 11:55:10 AM PDT by GipperGal
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To: NYer
I'm just too stunned to even comment on this. Never in my most dire pessimistic prognostication did I imagine that a first world liberal western democracy would consider state regulation of religion.
80 posted on 07/20/2005 11:58:48 AM PDT by GipperGal
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To: GipperGal; NWU Army ROTC

It is worse in Canada but it is coming to the US. Cardinal George spoke of an underground future for the Catholic Church in the United States on several occasions in the last year.


81 posted on 07/20/2005 12:51:58 PM PDT by Siobhan ("Whenever you come to save Rome, make all the noise you want." -- Pius XII)
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To: Siobhan
Cardinal George spoke of an underground future for the Catholic Church in the United States on several occasions in the last year.

Do you have a link to those speeches?

82 posted on 07/20/2005 1:35:40 PM PDT by GipperGal
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To: GipperGal

I've been looking. That's why I tagged NWU ARMY ROTC to the post. He would know I'm sure. I'll keep looking.


83 posted on 07/20/2005 3:26:58 PM PDT by Siobhan ("Whenever you come to save Rome, make all the noise you want." -- Pius XII)
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To: Siobhan

"It is worse in Canada but it is coming to the US. Cardinal George spoke of an underground future for the Catholic Church in the United States on several occasions in the last year."

Interesting. A link perhaps?

I can't say I'm surprised or shocked to see this article. This was predictable. The culture of death knows who it's enemies are. So Canada is drawing up it's blueprints for sort of kinder, gentler supression of religion. No surprises there. We'll see this sort of "discussion" (read: planning) in the U.S. within 5 years. If not sooner.

Christians need to start thinking about the future.


84 posted on 07/20/2005 4:40:33 PM PDT by RKBA Democrat (Eastern Catholicism: tonic for the lapsed Catholic)
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To: american colleen

My thoughts exactly. Michael O'Brian's novels seem more and more prescient as the months go on.


85 posted on 07/20/2005 4:48:11 PM PDT by GrannyML
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To: Aussie Dasher

Liberals are blind to religion...probably by design. He treats religion as an extracurricular activity like biking. Sad. They will never understand that the essence of religion is life and that our temporary existence here is just that, temporary. Any prohibitions they put on it will only make the faithful that much more fervent. We keep the eye on the prize, so to speak.


86 posted on 07/20/2005 7:18:39 PM PDT by Right in Wisconsin
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To: Aussie Dasher

Bend over and grab your ankles... Your In Canada, Big Boy.


87 posted on 07/20/2005 7:19:43 PM PDT by stocksthatgoup (http://www.busateripens.com)
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To: Aussie Dasher
I have always enjoyed the notion that Canada would be slightly easier than a National Guard training exercise as far as taking over. Except for Quebec. I think it should be left alone for all to see years after .....
88 posted on 07/20/2005 7:23:03 PM PDT by jmq
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To: Aussie Dasher

Obviously the purpose would be to force the churches to perform gay weddings, now that they are legal in Canada.


89 posted on 07/20/2005 7:24:42 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: dfwgator

The liberal sewer rats will know their job is done when Churches support sodomy and killing babies.


90 posted on 07/20/2005 8:04:15 PM PDT by Aussie Dasher (The Great Ronald Reagan & John Paul II - Heaven's Dream Team!)
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To: Podkayne
How can Canada have so many people willing to present such unrealistic views of human nature?

As nations go, Canada is pretty artificial. The British and French came together simply to keep the US out. They didn't much like each other. Indeed, the English, Scots, and Irish weren't necessarily friendly towards each other.

The French didn't particularly share English Canada's affection for the British royal family, and the English didn't care about the equivalent institution for the French -- the Roman Catholic Church.

Then over the last forty years or so, it all fell apart. If the Americans weren't there already, they weren't coming. Love of England's royal family and traditions came to look fusty and old-fashioned. Quebec gradually rejected its Catholic traditions.

Everybody wanted to be truly "Canadian," but it wasn't at all clear what it meant. Except perhaps that a Canadian had to be different from US Americans, and was also expected to be different from the old school England-loving colonial Tories or pious and obedient Quebec Catholics.

So you have a vacuum into which any professor or bureaucrat with a "bright idea" can step into -- so long as it makes Canada less, rather than more, American. Canada more or less gave the world "multiculturalism," another brainstorm by academics with too much time on their hands.

91 posted on 07/21/2005 12:13:30 AM PDT by x
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To: Siobhan
This legislation would never have had a hope if the Catholic Church in Canada hadn't sold its birthright for a mess of pottage.

Yeah, but here we are. Now what do we do?

I'm reminded of a quote of Mother Angelica's, where she said she wouldn't want to live in a different age. She said we all have a great opportunity to defend the faith in this new Dark Age.

It's exciting, and terrifying. I can't imagine what my children will be facing in the coming decades.

92 posted on 07/21/2005 5:40:51 AM PDT by Aquinasfan (Isaiah 22:22, Rev 3:7, Mat 16:19)
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To: Aquinasfan
I'm reminded of a quote of Mother Angelica's, where she said she wouldn't want to live in a different age. She said we all have a great opportunity to defend the faith in this new Dark Age.

Mother Angelica was and is spot on.

93 posted on 07/21/2005 12:58:00 PM PDT by Siobhan ("Whenever you come to save Rome, make all the noise you want." -- Pius XII)
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To: annalex
I do it because I am worried that the separation between church and state is under threat. Religion is important in our lives, but it can become a danger to society when people claim that the unalterable will of God is the basis for their opinions and actions. Yes religion can be a comfort and a guide, but we cannot take rules from our holy books and apply them to the modern world without democratic debate and due regard for the law."

MACVSOG68, you have a disciple in Canada.

Hmmm. Maybe he's on to something. No, actually he should drop such ridiculous ideas. The government's job should be to protect religious rights, not regulate them.

OTOH, I think the government can and should step in when any religious group advocates the infringment on the rights of others. I'm thinking of the madrasas openly preaching the murder of innocent people, and the occasional priest advocating the bombing of an abortion clinic. But the rest of this guy's rants are just garbage.

Edmund Burke, not particularly known for his religious leanings always believed that religion helped keep the population calm and was good and necessary for civilized societies.

94 posted on 07/22/2005 2:14:25 PM PDT by MACVSOG68
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To: pierrem15

and/or Henry Bowman...


95 posted on 07/22/2005 9:42:07 PM PDT by castlebrew (true gun control is hitting where you're aiming!)
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To: RKBA Democrat

Yep. "Have faith in God, but put your trust in the Mauser" - Boer saying


96 posted on 07/22/2005 9:45:43 PM PDT by castlebrew (true gun control is hitting where you're aiming!)
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To: RKBA Democrat

Yep. "Have faith in God, but put your trust in the Mauser" - Boer saying


97 posted on 07/22/2005 9:46:47 PM PDT by castlebrew (true gun control is hitting where you're aiming!)
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