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Pat Robertson has a message for Dover, PA: Don't ask God to help.
WGAL.com ^ | 11.10.05 | WGAL

Posted on 11/10/2005 1:33:57 PM PST by conserv13

DOVER, Pa. -- Pat Robertson had a special message for residents of Dover, Pa., today after voters there elected to boot the current school board, which instituted an intelligent design policy that led to a federal trial.

Robertson made the comment after Lee Webb of CBN News delivered a report on how residents in Dover voted in eight new Democratic board members, replacing all eight current members who had voted for a policy that required students in ninth-grade biology classes to hear a statement on intelligent design before hearing lessons on evolution. Webb then asked Robertson what he thought about the vote.

Here was Robertson's response.

"I'd like to say to the good citizens of Dover: If there is a disaster in your area, don't turn to God, you just rejected him from your city. And don't wonder why he hasn't helped you when problems begin, if they begin. I'm not saying they will, but if they do, just remember, you just voted God out of your city. And if that's the case, don't ask for his help because he might not be there."

(Excerpt) Read more at wgal.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: angrygod; crevolist; dover; intelligentdesign; ispatoffhismeds; patrobertson; patsfullofhotgas
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To: BeHoldAPaleHorse
He's using the approach favored by the mafia when they go around collecting protection money.

"Nice little town yous got here. Be a shame if sumthin' were to, you know, happen to it. Lotsa things can happen to a town ain't got insurance you know. Like a hurricane could blow in, level the joint. Or maybe a tornado. You knows how them tornadoes is. Always makin' a mess of things. Yeah, kinda makes you think about payin' up on dat insurance thing, don't it?"

251 posted on 11/11/2005 8:55:37 AM PST by RogueIsland
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To: RogueIsland
Avian flu
252 posted on 11/11/2005 8:56:14 AM PST by Right Wing Professor
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To: drlevy88
How did he know the Lord was going to smite her? Hello?

The Lord seldom reaches His big hand down and smites anyone directly. Usually, it's some jihadist with the bomb, dagger, sword, etc.

253 posted on 11/11/2005 8:56:37 AM PST by VadeRetro (Liberalism is a cancer on society. Creationism is a cancer on conservatism.)
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To: VadeRetro

The best managers know how to delegate.


254 posted on 11/11/2005 9:01:02 AM PST by Right Wing Professor
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To: VadeRetro

The New Testament is quite notably lacking in this kind of violence. It's a kingdom of the spirit, rather than a kingdom of men.

That God clued in Peter and arranged the timing as well is a, well, no-brainer. The church itself had the gift of prophecy for quite a while; if it didn't, there wouldn't be any authoritative New Testament. This is a straightforward case of prophecy.


255 posted on 11/11/2005 9:02:45 AM PST by drlevy88
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To: conserv13

256 posted on 11/11/2005 9:10:39 AM PST by DoctorMichael (The Fourth-Estate is a Fifth-Column!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)
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To: drlevy88

It's fairly easy to prophesy something bad when you have the means to make it happen. The end times was prophesied also, but that's a bit more difficult to pull off.


257 posted on 11/11/2005 9:14:10 AM PST by js1138 (Great is the power of steady misrepresentation.)
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To: js1138

This isn't the only time that Christians were spoken of as coming to hurt by supernatural force for bad attitudes in the assembly. See 1 Cor 11:23ff.


258 posted on 11/11/2005 9:18:17 AM PST by drlevy88
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To: conserv13

This is ridiculous. Robertson has jumped the shark, and should really consider the Monastic life at this point.

patent


259 posted on 11/11/2005 9:20:57 AM PST by patent (A baby is God's opinion that life should go on. Carl Sandburg)
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To: patent

If I remember right, only Catholicism has a monastic tradition--Protestants eschew (gesundheit) monasticism as being pagan in origin.


260 posted on 11/11/2005 9:33:39 AM PST by BeHoldAPaleHorse (MORE COWBELL! MORE COWBELL! (CLANK-CLANK-CLANK))
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To: Physicist
Anyone wishing for God to punish Dover, PA (and I believe Pat Robertson to be in that number) has repudiated Christian teachings that are much more important than the Genesis account of creation.

I always thought that the Genesis account of creation was of utmost importance to most creationists. Certainly it seems far more important than "Thou shalt not bear false witness...", because so many creationists seem to think that directive to have an exception when pushing a literal Genesis worldview.
261 posted on 11/11/2005 9:33:49 AM PST by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
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To: dmanLA
Well then don't get all worked up if men acted like apes.

Argument from the consequences. The final resort of a creationist who has no arguments left. Also meaningless because humans are apes, thus anything that a human does is "acting like an ape" by definition.
262 posted on 11/11/2005 9:40:56 AM PST by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
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To: Right Wing Professor
I see the original post of your excellent piece was taken down.

Please correct me if I am wrong, but I took it as a satire on the cartoonish views of Robertson and others, and not disrespectful of Christianity.

263 posted on 11/11/2005 9:43:30 AM PST by SupplySider
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To: SupplySider
Please correct me if I am wrong, but I took it as a satire on the cartoonish views of Robertson and others, and not disrespectful of Christianity.

No, it wasn't meant to be disrespectful of Christianity.

264 posted on 11/11/2005 9:44:36 AM PST by Right Wing Professor
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To: Dimensio

Eep Eep Oop Oop Eep Eep.


265 posted on 11/11/2005 9:45:40 AM PST by drlevy88
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To: BeHoldAPaleHorse

>>>>If I remember right, only Catholicism has a monastic tradition--Protestants eschew (gesundheit) monasticism as being pagan in origin.

Its not just Catholics. The Protestants do "eschew" it, but I think Pat should start something new. Maybe just for him.

patent


266 posted on 11/11/2005 9:52:21 AM PST by patent (A baby is God's opinion that life should go on. Carl Sandburg)
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To: jennyp
God only knows. However, we do know that New Orleans was entrenched in corruption and nothing was changing it.

Through this process, a LOT of junk has come to light about the city which will probably be cleaned up.

Was this the reason? Maybe.

267 posted on 11/11/2005 10:01:01 AM PST by Siena Dreaming
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To: Dimensio
I always thought that the Genesis account of creation was of utmost importance to most creationists. Certainly it seems far more important than "Thou shalt not bear false witness...", because so many creationists seem to think that directive to have an exception when pushing a literal Genesis worldview.

Yes, we must be careful to distinguish between Christians and Bible-idolators.

268 posted on 11/11/2005 10:02:39 AM PST by Physicist
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To: springing interest
Many people there will be jostled from their routines and think on more important things. It won't affect some, but for many others maybe God wanted to get their attention and this was the way to do it.
269 posted on 11/11/2005 10:05:00 AM PST by Siena Dreaming
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To: conserv13

Matthew 11:28 (King James Version)

28Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

Sure doesn't sound like what our LORD said, does it?


270 posted on 11/11/2005 10:06:56 AM PST by trillabodilla (Jesus Saves)
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To: Quick1

If Art Bell would jump on the "Intelligent designer" question all these threads would be missing the science experts!


271 posted on 11/11/2005 10:22:31 AM PST by sausageseller (Look out for the jackbooted spelling police. There! Everywhere!(revised cause the "man" accosted me!)
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To: Quick1
Stewart must love stuff like this. The jokes pretty much write themselves at this point.

I was a bit surprised that this didn't get picked up in "This Week In God" -- maybe they already had enough material written and will get back to it next week.

272 posted on 11/11/2005 11:08:10 AM PST by steve-b (A desire not to butt into other people's business is eighty percent of all human wisdom)
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To: Jorge
Pat Robertson should do God a favor, and tell people he's an atheist.

Or he could tell people that he's a liberal Democrat. Then, instead of each side having a raving loony reverend (thus creating a sort of MAD deterrent against either side pressing the other about their association with a nut case), they'd be stuck with both Revverund Al and Revverund Pat.

273 posted on 11/11/2005 11:11:17 AM PST by steve-b (A desire not to butt into other people's business is eighty percent of all human wisdom)
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To: js1138
Rumor has it that a strand of spaghetti was found in one of the voting machines, blocking votes for one of the incumbents.

The Flying Spaghetti Monster works in mysterious ways.

274 posted on 11/11/2005 11:14:24 AM PST by steve-b (A desire not to butt into other people's business is eighty percent of all human wisdom)
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To: VadeRetro
If I'd been the local DA then I would have ordered an autopsy on those two.

CSI: Judaea.

275 posted on 11/11/2005 11:16:27 AM PST by steve-b (A desire not to butt into other people's business is eighty percent of all human wisdom)
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To: conserv13

The gist of what Pat tries to say is right... HOW he says it and HOW it get spun are 10.0 scale PR nightmares. And the guy never learns. Now that is the bigger story.


276 posted on 11/11/2005 11:16:38 AM PST by Waywardson (Carry on! Nothing equals the splendor!)
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To: Siena Dreaming
God only knows. However, we do know that New Orleans was entrenched in corruption and nothing was changing it.

Through this process, a LOT of junk has come to light about the city which will probably be cleaned up.

Was this the reason? Maybe.

Is that why he sent tornados to southern Indiana too?

Look, you think that God uses natural disasters to grab our attention. Why should God have to use such a blunt instrument as that? If I want to get someone's attention, I go over and talk to them. Call them up on the phone. Email them. Easiest thing in the world. Why can't God do such a simple, straightforward thing?

277 posted on 11/11/2005 12:23:34 PM PST by jennyp (WHAT I'M READING NOW: Art of Unix Programming by Raymond)
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To: drlevy88

Do you have an intelligent response, or have you already run out of facts and thus have resorted to inane babble prematurely?


278 posted on 11/11/2005 12:29:30 PM PST by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
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To: jennyp
Why should God have to use such a blunt instrument as that?

It would be nice if people just listened to everything God says. Unfortunately, that's not the way it works.

For example, you can call someone on the phone and try to tell them what the right thing is. But will they listen? I think you know that many will not. And some will even get hostile when you tell them the right thing.

Same with God. He has to hit many people over the head to get their attention. Many, many hearts are much harder than you would think.

279 posted on 11/11/2005 12:47:59 PM PST by Siena Dreaming
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To: Siena Dreaming
Same with God. He has to hit many people over the head to get their attention. Many, many hearts are much harder than you would think.

So what you're saying is that if I'm having trouble getting someone to understand the magnitude of a problem, I should level a city and kill dozens of people.
280 posted on 11/11/2005 12:51:14 PM PST by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
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To: Dimensio

No, you should definitely not do that.


281 posted on 11/11/2005 12:53:45 PM PST by Siena Dreaming
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To: Siena Dreaming

Just blow up their house then?


282 posted on 11/11/2005 12:54:56 PM PST by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
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To: Dimensio

Don't be silly.


283 posted on 11/11/2005 12:56:01 PM PST by Siena Dreaming
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To: Siena Dreaming

I'm just trying to follow your line of reasoning. If, when God needs someone's attention, he has to send a massive hurricane that leads to the flooding of an entire city because they wouldn't pay attention otherwise, what should we do when we need to accomplish the same objective?


284 posted on 11/11/2005 1:09:31 PM PST by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
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To: Dimensio
First of all, you're not God so cannot operate on the same level of justice.

However, where God does give the administration of true justice to men he allows and even demands just punishment. Prison, war, etc.

285 posted on 11/11/2005 1:18:22 PM PST by Siena Dreaming
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To: jennyp
"If I want to get someone's attention, I go over and talk to them...Why can't God do such a simple, straightforward thing?"

God nudges; He forgives; He nudges again; He forgives; He nudges harder; He chastises mildly and forgives; He reminds; He reminds; He reminds; He chastises a bit more; we ignore; He forgives; eventually...He judges if we are His children or if His children are oppressed; or, so it seems to my small mind peering into a mirror darkly at an incomparably greater Mind.

I don't know much about the tornado, but surely God is allowing catastrophe in His omnipotence. To be unjust, however, would make Him the author of sin. It's just my opinion--necessarily a tiny opinion in the burning light of His omniscience--that:

(1) Some tragic events are unfortunate happenstances as the example from the Gospel when Jesus asked His disciples if they thought that the collapse of the tower killing nearly a score of workers was because this construction's crew were sinners above all the rest. Christ's answer was no!

(2) Some tragic events are the result of evildoers as a murder or rape would be. A belief in God being not only merciful but also just demands His perfect recompense for the victim toward the perpetrator. "Vengeance is mine, saith the Lord."

(3) Some tragic events are the result of direct intervention of God Himself on evildoing as in the deaths of Ananias, Sapphira, Herod Antipas, etc. in the New Testament and any number of destructions in the Old Testament.

Personally, I believe the devastation along the Gulf Coast was a combination of all three, but mostly #2. And, suffering does cleanse if it is in chastisement; but, suffering vindicates if it is punitive. With life's span being wispily short in comparison with eternity, afterlife is almost the full balance of our being's existence. Thus, a shortened life may be a blessing to the one departed (a la Twain's Mysterious Stranger) while a great suffering is left behind for the bereaved.

Yet, how can we know the delectable pleasure of warming ourselves before a winter's fire if we have never known cold? How can we truly appreciate reunion if we have never known loss? How can we experience a multitude of added and ever-continuing joys which would have been withheld from us if we had not experienced a multitude of intense but (beside eternity) brief pains? Hence viewed, suffering is a very large gift for relief from pain is exquisite, and unending earthly thrill sates and dulls and maddens.

A very long life, then, may also be a blessing if it gains much wisdom in traversing many dark valleys as well as gaining much experience of complex pleasures such as the warm fire and reunion that could otherwise have not been truly appreciated or even known at all, and simpler pleasures afore-known in this life are even more of the bounty of His grace. I really do believe that God knows what He is doing. A brief life, a long life, a hard life, a "blessed" life--in short, it's all good!

286 posted on 11/11/2005 1:56:31 PM PST by Leonine
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To: RonPaulLives

I said people who respect Christianity.


287 posted on 11/11/2005 2:03:49 PM PST by Republican Wildcat
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To: Dimensio

Are you trying to play God?

The first death is of little consequence; it is the second death that people should fear.

But being an ape, I guess you have nothing to fear because God only judges people. (/sarcasm)


288 posted on 11/11/2005 2:39:25 PM PST by dmanLA
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To: dmanLA
But being an ape, I guess you have nothing to fear because God only judges people. (/sarcasm)

Do you have an actual argument to present against the theory of evolution, or do you have to resort to ridicule because you haven't studied any biology yet arrogantly believe yourself to be an expert on the subject?
289 posted on 11/11/2005 2:40:47 PM PST by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
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To: Siena Dreaming

Seems rather harsh to me.


290 posted on 11/11/2005 3:11:44 PM PST by springing interest
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To: springing interest
Yes, God can seem harsh.

But when you realize that it's to prevent people from a worse fate, it's actually not so harsh, but redemptive.

291 posted on 11/11/2005 3:31:31 PM PST by Siena Dreaming
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To: Right Wing Professor

an image from inside Pat Robertson's brain:

http://abbeynews.com/wp/gsmite.jpg


292 posted on 11/11/2005 5:45:39 PM PST by longshadow
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To: steve-b
..they'd be stuck with both Revverund Al and Revverund Pat.

LOL.

293 posted on 11/11/2005 7:33:51 PM PST by Jorge (Q)
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To: Siena Dreaming
But when you realize that it's to prevent people from a worse fate, it's actually not so harsh, but redemptive.

Indeed. Far better for people to be drowned in a deluge than to not reject valid science in favour of poor logic.
294 posted on 11/11/2005 8:42:46 PM PST by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
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To: Siena Dreaming
First of all, you're not God so cannot operate on the same level of justice.

Justice is determined by what is done and to whom, not by who decides to do it. Or is it less evil for Bill Gates or George W. Bush or <insert your personal hero's name here> to decide to murder a random, innocent bystander than for someone else to do it?

However, where God does give the administration of true justice to men he allows and even demands just punishment. Prison, war, etc.

So every one of those New Orleansinians did deserve it? Gotcha.

295 posted on 11/11/2005 9:16:35 PM PST by jennyp (WHAT I'M READING NOW: Art of Unix Programming by Raymond)
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To: Siena Dreaming
But when you realize that it's to prevent people from a worse fate, it's actually not so harsh, but redemptive.

But what worse fate, and it's to be avoided by doing what???

Don't you see? You're taking a random act of nature and imputing a divine purpose to it after the fact. You're just going by your own beliefs & prejudices & notions, and latching on to anything that seems significant or ironic about a disaster (Katrina in this case), but it's no more rational than when an airheaded liberal imputes significance to the patterns laid down by a deck of Tarot cards or an astrological chart or swirls of tea leaves at the bottom of the cup.

You're in deep danger of tumbling down into a rabbit hole of self-delusion.

296 posted on 11/11/2005 9:23:13 PM PST by jennyp (WHAT I'M READING NOW: Art of Unix Programming by Raymond)
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To: Leonine
Personally, I believe the devastation along the Gulf Coast was a combination of all three, but mostly #2.

Really? You believe that Katrina's devastation was mostly caused by evildoers? Do tell.

297 posted on 11/11/2005 9:26:31 PM PST by jennyp (WHAT I'M READING NOW: Art of Unix Programming by Raymond)
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To: jennyp
Or is it less evil for Bill Gates or George W. Bush or to decide to murder a random, innocent bystander than for someone else to do it?

I'm not sure what Bill Gates has to do with the discussion. However, even George Bush would not take the law into his own hands beyond what is stipulated in the law. If he went beyond what is proscribed for his job, he could be impeached.

latching on to anything that seems significant or ironic about a disaster

On the contrary, I haven't picked out anything significant or "ironic" about the Gulf Coast disaster. In fact, I never postulated that God had, in fact, unleashed any kind of judgment. I had said that MAYBE there was some kind of judgment involved as God does use disaster to get people's attention. The Bible's lessons show us that.

298 posted on 11/12/2005 11:27:35 AM PST by Siena Dreaming
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To: jennyp; Leonine
LReally? You believe that Katrina's devastation was mostly caused by evildoers? Do tell.

9/11 was America's fault too (Amazing how two people so different as Osama bin Laden and Pat Robertson can agree - or perhaps not)

299 posted on 11/12/2005 1:00:14 PM PST by Oztrich Boy (Paging Nehemiah Scudder:the Crazy Years are peaking. America is ready for you.)
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To: conserv13

Mr. robertson is right on this one.

Those that forsake the Lord will in turn be forsaken.


300 posted on 11/12/2005 1:03:13 PM PST by Tempest (I'm a Christian. Before I am a conservative.)
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