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US group implants electronic tags in workers
Financial Times ^ | 2/12/06 | Richard Waters

Posted on 02/12/2006 4:28:09 PM PST by wagglebee

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To: from occupied ga

>>Did this person wander on to a nominally conservative forum by mistake?


member since 2003. 5 seconds of due dillegence would have told you that.


251 posted on 02/13/2006 10:24:50 AM PST by forrestroche (But ignorance, while it checks the enthusiasm of the sensible, in no way restrains the fools...)
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To: archy
If CWII becomes a nightmare come true in America....the losses in Finland wouldn't cover the losses in a single major metropolitan area in the U.S.....

"Americans" and others who live here - with allegiances to a entity beyond America and it's Constitution are VAST in number....

Now that the Left can see abject failure of their attempt to steal America through the Courts and Politics -- they may become emboldened to act out violently...

That would be their stupidest move of all....
There are MANY ready to respond violently to that foolishness.

Semper Fi
252 posted on 02/13/2006 10:25:24 AM PST by river rat (You may turn the other cheek, but I prefer to look into my enemy's vacant dead eyes.)
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To: RS

>>>Regarding friendly fire problems, consider that any device that can be read by us can also be read by the enemy


...that's why DoD wants em so bad.


253 posted on 02/13/2006 10:26:56 AM PST by forrestroche (But ignorance, while it checks the enthusiasm of the sensible, in no way restrains the fools...)
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To: af_vet_rr
Of course, by the time you decide to care, it will be too late.

And of course that's way too advanced a concept for the moron you were addressing, but nonetheless, you're absolutely right.

254 posted on 02/13/2006 10:29:14 AM PST by inquest (If you favor any legal status for illegal aliens, then do not claim to be in favor of secure borders)
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To: river rat

I think I remembered reading that if the first Civil War's losses were extrapolated to our present day population, deaths from a similar civil war today would be over 9 million.


255 posted on 02/13/2006 10:32:13 AM PST by Centurion2000 ("If you're going to shoot somebody, Shoot! Don't talk!")
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To: wagglebee

I think all terrorists should have the chips implanted prior to their release (or escape). Then we can send the predators to go get them.


256 posted on 02/13/2006 10:36:15 AM PST by stumpy
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To: VRing

>>>Please come and try to chip me.


I don't want the job - it was undoubtedly fall to somebody a LOT bigger than me (and you).


257 posted on 02/13/2006 10:36:23 AM PST by forrestroche (But ignorance, while it checks the enthusiasm of the sensible, in no way restrains the fools...)
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To: forrestroche

"...that's why DoD wants em so bad."

Pretty dumb if they did ... when fighting a non-technical foe, all the bad guys have to do is come up with an IED that goes off when it senses ANY RFID tag - their rats scurry across freely, our guys get hit.


258 posted on 02/13/2006 10:37:18 AM PST by RS ("I took the drugs because I liked them and I found excuses to take them, so I'm not weaseling.")
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To: MortMan

>>>>ACLU people? So, anyone who believes that privacy is more important than automatic identification is an ACLU ass?


Well they are the ones always crying about privacy "rights" - which dosn't, incidentally, appear anywhere in the Constitution. It is a construct of the leftist judiciary of the 60's.


259 posted on 02/13/2006 10:40:39 AM PST by forrestroche (But ignorance, while it checks the enthusiasm of the sensible, in no way restrains the fools...)
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To: forrestroche

My point is that the 4th amendment prohibits unreasonable search and seizure - and RFID chips can (and will, at some point) be used to search you without your knowledge, and certainly without even probable cause.

The poster I replied to stated that everyone who was against that was an ACLU type. Thet oversimplification is assinine - and genuinely detracts from the debate.

Sure, the ACLU will go ape over this - maybe. But a lot of conservative thinkers will, too. Both factions may be acting under their own, very different set of beliefs. Let's debate the topic, not try to cut off debate by demonizing the opponent.


260 posted on 02/13/2006 10:45:28 AM PST by MortMan (Trains stop at train stations. On my desk is a workstation...)
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To: forrestroche
member since 2003. 5 seconds of due dillegence would have told you that.

Doesn't mean that you didn't wander in mistaking this for a statist forum. Your viewpoint is that of a good little government worshiper.

261 posted on 02/13/2006 10:46:08 AM PST by from occupied ga (Peace through superior firepower)
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To: wagglebee

self ping for later read


262 posted on 02/13/2006 10:51:22 AM PST by dpa5923 (Small minds talk about people, normal minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas.)
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To: MortMan

"My point is that the 4th amendment prohibits unreasonable search and seizure - and RFID chips can (and will, at some point) be used to search you without your knowledge, and certainly without even probable cause. "


??? Is your local supplier going to start putting RFID's on his baggies full of dope at some time ?


263 posted on 02/13/2006 10:53:40 AM PST by RS ("I took the drugs because I liked them and I found excuses to take them, so I'm not weaseling.")
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To: Centurion2000
I believe that figure of 9 million, is understated..

Because:
There are 10s of million Armed Americans..
There are millions of combat veterans in the U.S., or veterans trained for combat.
Civilian weapons are capable of rapid fire, and deadly at longer ranges.
We live much closer to one another, today..
Most folks couldn't survive for more that a week, without McDonalds or Safeway.
Most folks would panic, or not know how to care for themselves under stress, illness or danger.
Foreign enemies of the U.S. could certainly introduce WMD to their "allies" in the U.S. or "deliver" them themselves -- while the U.S. is too "absorbed" to respond.
Disease, hunger, heart-attacks, grudge killings, looting, etc, etc, etc, will lead to many deaths not directly related to fighting between adversaries.

The 9 million number is on the light side -- in my opinion.
It represents only 3% of our current population.....

As a nasty aside -- based on recent election results - there are a lot more than 3% of our voting population that "needs killin"....
< /sarcasm>

Semper Fi
264 posted on 02/13/2006 10:55:00 AM PST by river rat (You may turn the other cheek, but I prefer to look into my enemy's vacant dead eyes.)
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To: from occupied ga

>>>Your viewpoint is that of a good little government worshiper.

And yours of a good little militia freak who can't get over the outcome of the "war of northern agression." In case you didn't know it, OUR GOVERNMENT is the one fighting the terrorists, and GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEES (Soldiers) - NOT you little militia boys, are the ones DYING fighting them.


265 posted on 02/13/2006 11:01:16 AM PST by forrestroche (But ignorance, while it checks the enthusiasm of the sensible, in no way restrains the fools...)
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To: RS

I'm not talking about suppliers of illicit drugs. I'm talking about having a chip implanted in your body that will tell anyone with the right equipment, including law enforcement, who you are (and potentially everything else about you) just because you came in range of their scanner.

You seem preoccupied with drugs. I'm talking about "being secure in one's person and papers".


266 posted on 02/13/2006 11:03:54 AM PST by MortMan (Trains stop at train stations. On my desk is a workstation...)
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To: river rat

>>>As a nasty aside -- based on recent election results - there are a lot more than 3% of our voting population that "needs killin"....

Can't argue with that.


267 posted on 02/13/2006 11:04:31 AM PST by forrestroche (But ignorance, while it checks the enthusiasm of the sensible, in no way restrains the fools...)
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To: forrestroche
And yours of a good little militia freak who can't get over the outcome of the "war of northern agression."

That's right, only cammied backwater mountaineers with the Stars-'n'-Bars over their huts could possibly object to mandatory chipping of the entire citizenry.

What's your IQ? Be honest, now.

268 posted on 02/13/2006 11:09:27 AM PST by inquest (If you favor any legal status for illegal aliens, then do not claim to be in favor of secure borders)
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To: MortMan

" I'm talking about having a chip implanted in your body that will tell anyone with the right equipment, including law enforcement, who you are (and potentially everything else about you) just because you came in range of their scanner."

Well first off, the chip dosen't tell them "everything else about you" - it's an ID that leads them to a data base which may or may not hold "everything else about you".
Just like your driver's license number does now.

... and IF you choose to live where you are forced to have this implanted, you have agreed to it allready.


269 posted on 02/13/2006 11:12:18 AM PST by RS ("I took the drugs because I liked them and I found excuses to take them, so I'm not weaseling.")
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To: Tench_Coxe

"The car hesitated, or rather gave a faint whirring click, as if information, somewhere, was dropping card by punch-slotted card under electric eyes."


270 posted on 02/13/2006 11:13:31 AM PST by Old Professer (Fix the problem, not the blame!)
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To: RS
... and IF you choose to live where you are forced to have this implanted, you have agreed to it allready.

OMG! You can't possibly be that retarded, can you?

271 posted on 02/13/2006 11:14:21 AM PST by inquest (If you favor any legal status for illegal aliens, then do not claim to be in favor of secure borders)
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To: forrestroche
You and MurrayMom both feel the same way. In the 20th century alone 80 - 100 million people were murdered by their own governments and fools like you think that it can never happen here Well I got news fer ya, jack. Human nature isn't any different in the USA than it was in Russia, Nazi Germany, Cambodia, Armenia, etc. Governments and the "useful idiots" who unquestioningly support them are always willing to justify any incroachment on freedom. It's "for the children" It's for the "war on terror" It's to control illegal immigration" Like the government is interested in doing that ha ha. It's for safety, etc.

There isn't any limit on what government are eager to do to their citizens to remvoe their freedoms and unfortunately there are plenty of people like you who cheer them on.

272 posted on 02/13/2006 11:18:30 AM PST by from occupied ga (Peace through superior firepower)
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To: inquest

>>>That's right, only cammied backwater mountaineers with the Stars-'n'-Bars over their huts could possibly object to mandatory chipping of the entire citizenry.

Just as only good little goverment worshippers could possibly give some benefit of the doubt to hard-working honest law enforcement officials when they say this might be really useful to us. Only a good little government worshipper could imagine that the Government is up to something OTHER than trying to jail all Americans.

>>>What's your IQ? Be honest, now.

High enough to detect the inherent hipocrisy I have so artfully exposed above. I didn't start the name calling, but while I AM intelligent, I aint too mature for a good ole fashun flame war.


273 posted on 02/13/2006 11:19:29 AM PST by forrestroche (But ignorance, while it checks the enthusiasm of the sensible, in no way restrains the fools...)
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To: forrestroche
In case you didn't know it, OUR GOVERNMENT is the one fighting the terrorists, and GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEES (Soldiers) - NOT you little militia boys, are the ones DYING fighting them.

Maybe you better think twice before trying to fit a shoe store in your mouth. There are a LOT of veterans on this board.

274 posted on 02/13/2006 11:20:30 AM PST by Centurion2000 ("If you're going to shoot somebody, Shoot! Don't talk!")
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To: forrestroche

Are you a salesman, or just a demonstration model?


275 posted on 02/13/2006 11:22:58 AM PST by Old Professer (Fix the problem, not the blame!)
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To: RS
...and IF you choose to live where you are forced to have this implanted, you have agreed to it allready.

Right. That's a lot like the folks who buy a house out in farm country then try to outlaw the smell of bovine excrement - and telling the farmer that they agreed to the new restriction when he allowed the busybodies to buy their houses.

Congratulations on your leap of illogic.

276 posted on 02/13/2006 11:26:15 AM PST by MortMan (Trains stop at train stations. On my desk is a workstation...)
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To: Centurion2000

>>>There are a LOT of veterans on this board.

Yes there are, and maybe you should ask THEM if they were "little government worshippers" because they trusted their CinC and did their duty.


277 posted on 02/13/2006 11:26:52 AM PST by forrestroche (But ignorance, while it checks the enthusiasm of the sensible, in no way restrains the fools...)
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To: Old Professer

Both to you.


278 posted on 02/13/2006 11:27:54 AM PST by forrestroche (But ignorance, while it checks the enthusiasm of the sensible, in no way restrains the fools...)
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To: forrestroche

Just a question--would you trust a Hillary Whitehouse/gov't with running a RFID program?


279 posted on 02/13/2006 11:28:42 AM PST by ShadowAce (Linux -- The Ultimate Windows Service Pack)
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To: ShadowAce

>>>Just a question--would you trust a Hillary Whitehouse/gov't with running a RFID program?

That's your crack speaking. That crank will never land in the oval office. And even if some dim does (it won't be her), WHO CONTROLS THE SUPREME COURT NOW? Who controls the Pentagon? Who controls the Congress?

Stop the paranoia


280 posted on 02/13/2006 11:32:29 AM PST by forrestroche (But ignorance, while it checks the enthusiasm of the sensible, in no way restrains the fools...)
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To: forrestroche
It's not paranoia. I never said she would get into office.

However, someone like her, will eventually get into office. Look at Clinton. If you won't trust a gov't like that to handle RFID, then you cannot give that tool to any gov't--that includes one in which you have the utmost respect/trust for.

281 posted on 02/13/2006 11:35:52 AM PST by ShadowAce (Linux -- The Ultimate Windows Service Pack)
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To: forrestroche

Checking out, this is just getting silly now and with all the hysterics, I fear someone is going to have a heart attack. There hasn't been a single post on the merits or risks of the use of this technology in a while. Think I'll water my plants (yes, they are chipped).


282 posted on 02/13/2006 11:37:12 AM PST by forrestroche (But ignorance, while it checks the enthusiasm of the sensible, in no way restrains the fools...)
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To: forrestroche

heh--I was right. You can't defend this in light of my post.


283 posted on 02/13/2006 11:40:19 AM PST by ShadowAce (Linux -- The Ultimate Windows Service Pack)
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To: forrestroche
Just as only good little goverment worshippers could possibly give some benefit of the doubt to hard-working honest law enforcement officials when they say this might be really useful to us.

You've provided no evidence that most LEO's favor mandatory implantation of the entire citizenry. And you've done far more than give them "some benefit of the doubt". You've completely shut off your brain to any kind of rational scrutiny of this extremely ill-advised idea.

I didn't start the name calling

Yes you did, right at the beginning, with your comments on "ACLU types". That shows that you're utterly incapable of defending your position rationally.

284 posted on 02/13/2006 11:53:21 AM PST by inquest (If you favor any legal status for illegal aliens, then do not claim to be in favor of secure borders)
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To: ShadowAce

you're right i'm just too weak


285 posted on 02/13/2006 11:53:46 AM PST by forrestroche (But ignorance, while it checks the enthusiasm of the sensible, in no way restrains the fools...)
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To: MortMan

If the farmer sells enough of his land to allow them to change the land use regulations, just who is the fool?


You seem to have missed what appears to be your own main point - RFID chips are currently used to search you without your expressed consent or knowledge - That's specifically what they were designed to do, prevent shoplifting ... duh.

Every time you leave a store with scanners in place you are being searched. You don't have to wait - go sue Walmart tomorrow.


286 posted on 02/13/2006 11:57:46 AM PST by RS ("I took the drugs because I liked them and I found excuses to take them, so I'm not weaseling.")
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To: river rat
If CWII becomes a nightmare come true in America....the losses in Finland wouldn't cover the losses in a single major metropolitan area in the U.S.....

Taken as a percentage of population, I think they'd be similar....remembering that the Finnish affray was blessedly short in duration. Most authorities set 25 Jan 1918 as the start of the conflict, though the first armed battles happened a week previously. The final Red-occupied stronghold at Viipuri fell on April 28-29 and mopping up continued until May 7, though there were many, many executions after that date.

With a total casualty figure of around 36,640, out of a population of some 3 million, they managed a casualty figure of about 1 per 1000.

Given the U.S. Year 2000 Census population figure of just under 300 million, that'd extrapolate here to more than a quarter million dead... but given a probable longer duration, and improved technologies for effectively performing the task at hand, I'd expect a butcher's bill of at least a million. Minimum.

287 posted on 02/13/2006 12:54:00 PM PST by archy (The darkness will come. It will find you,and it will scare you like you've never been scared before.)
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To: forrestroche
Yes there are, and maybe you should ask THEM if they were "little government worshippers" because they trusted their CinC and did their duty.

No .. I did trust my CinC and did my duty over in Kuwait, but if I were ordered by my government to forcibly inject RFID tracking devices in citizens as you suggested earlier in this thread, I would have refused and been on the other side in a heartbeat.

288 posted on 02/13/2006 1:07:13 PM PST by Centurion2000 ("If you're going to shoot somebody, Shoot! Don't talk!")
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To: Kimmers

I'd find a new job (or start up my own new business) before I'd allow my employer to do this to me.


289 posted on 02/13/2006 1:12:18 PM PST by NotJustAnotherPrettyFace
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To: wagglebee

Bump for later.


290 posted on 02/13/2006 1:16:05 PM PST by Richard Kimball
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To: RJS1950

I could see where creeps might murder to obtain personal chips from people. THAT is enough to make one ponder their personal use.


291 posted on 02/13/2006 1:16:50 PM PST by NotJustAnotherPrettyFace
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To: wagglebee
this is just the framework for anti-christ...

the control of information is everything, and always has been. Even if someone disagrees with the means to the end, you have to admit the framework is being set up so there will be no more civil liberties...

292 posted on 02/13/2006 1:21:35 PM PST by Battle Hymn of the Republic
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To: Kimmers

293 posted on 02/13/2006 1:24:09 PM PST by RockinRight (Attention RNC...we're the party of Reagan, not FDR...)
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To: Battle Hymn of the Republic
the control of information is everything, and always has been.

Exactly. People defending government surveillance try to justify it by saying things like "Well, Lincoln jailed editors during the Civil War, isn't that worse?" No, it's not worse than a government that's able to keep tabs on its citizens at all times. Freedom can survive occasional abuses. It can't survive chronic total lack of privacy.

294 posted on 02/13/2006 1:37:43 PM PST by inquest (If you favor any legal status for illegal aliens, then do not claim to be in favor of secure borders)
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To: DainBramage; moog

This is music to my ears!


295 posted on 02/13/2006 1:41:20 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going....)
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To: Libertina

Thanks for the book link.

Also, my site on it too:

http://nationalpropertyowners.org


296 posted on 02/13/2006 1:50:25 PM PST by Calpernia (Breederville.com)
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To: NotJustAnotherPrettyFace
(or start up my own new business)

But there are all these FORMS to fill out.....

297 posted on 02/13/2006 1:57:29 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going....)
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To: Tench_Coxe


>>>>Try Googling up I.G. Farben to see what I'm talking about.

Monsanto MERGED with THEM too!!!!

Read this:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1573646/posts
How do you say No NAIS in Japanese?


298 posted on 02/13/2006 2:15:40 PM PST by Calpernia (Breederville.com)
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To: HarleyD

I don't get the impression that these particular chips have lots of personal information about the employees -- just the fact they are allowed into this high security room, and presumably something to idenfity each of them, so if something goes missing, there's a record of who was in the room.


299 posted on 02/13/2006 2:17:46 PM PST by GovernmentShrinker
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To: GovernmentShrinker

The DATABASE has all the personally information. The chip is the identifier.


300 posted on 02/13/2006 2:18:41 PM PST by Calpernia (Breederville.com)
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