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Trying to get a glimpse of what’s over on the other side (Signs of Life after Death?)
.theheraldbulletin ^ | June 11 06 | Jim Bailey

Posted on 06/10/2006 9:45:53 PM PDT by churchillbuff

Despite lifelong beliefs that have been ingrained in my faith since childhood, I have to admit that like almost everyone else I have from time to time wondered if my existence will simply come to an end on the day I draw my last breath.

There is, after all, no way to prove one way or the other that human life continues in another realm after the body ceases to function. Nobody has come back to testify about it, with one notable exception of course, and those who reject his divinity also tend to doubt what he had to say about life after death. And the late Madalyn Murray O’Hair, the infamous atheist, hasn’t weighed in on the subject lately either.

Some would insist such doubts are implanted by the devil himself. Others counter there is no scientific basis for belief in a hereafter in the first place.

But just about every time I entertain such doubts, something comes along to reinforce my long-held belief in the hereafter. It’s often the experience of a dying saint getting their first glimpse, as an old gospel song puts it, of what’s over on the other side.

I’m told the Rev. Dr. Hollis Pistole appeared to have one such experience at his passing a little over a month ago. According to the story, Dr. Pistole, after a long battle with debilitating illness, raised up and put his arms out just before he drew his last breath. Apparently he received that glimpse of what awaited him.

My wife’s father had a similar experience, opening his eyes and reaching heavenward just before his passing.

I also recently went over my mom’s notes made at the time of my dad’s death more than half a century ago. “Under me? Under me? Thank you, Jesus,” he said.

A whole category of what have been termed near-death experiences have been catalogued by those looking for insight into what happens at the end of life. A common phenomenon is a light-at-the-end-of-a-tunnel vision. Many claim to have seen friends or relatives but were unable to reunite with them when they were suddenly jerked back into life.

My Uncle Melvin had such an experience, claiming to have seen his brother and another loved one at the time he was suffering a severe heart attack from which he recovered.

It is impossible to figure out the working of the subconscious, thus rendering any attempt at concrete conclusions problematic. Are any or all of these phenomena merely the gyrations of an active brain or might they be an indication of a link between this world and one to come?

Belief in life after death has been part of human experience as long as mankind has pondered its existence. It has been reinforced by the most sacred writings of most of the world’s major religions, including Christianity, which bases its entire concept on the idea of God personally demonstrating life after physical death through the manifestation we call Jesus.

In this life, of course, our existence is tied to our physical body. But to define human life according to our physical limitations is an obvious understatement of our role in the universe. Human interaction is limited by our physical senses. But the true self that has developed over the course of our lifetimes would seem to go far beyond the senses.

And certainly there can be no doubt that the rationality of human beings and their capability to build on their life experiences place them in a category entirely separate from other living creatures.

Is there life after death? The question defies physical proof, to be sure. But there would seem to be glimpses enough into the future to show that our existence has only just begun.

And anyway, by preparing for eternity, I think I’m building a pretty good life here as well.

Jim Bailey’s column appears on Sunday. He can be reached by e-mail at jameshenrybailey@earthlink.net.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial
KEYWORDS: afterlife; artbell; callingartbell; lifeafterdeath; nde; ndes; zaq
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1 posted on 06/10/2006 9:45:56 PM PDT by churchillbuff
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To: churchillbuff
Nobody has come back to testify about it, """

Well, nobody - except One particular Person.

2 posted on 06/10/2006 9:46:51 PM PDT by churchillbuff
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To: churchillbuff

"I walked down a long corridor, and into a room...and they had me take a number..."


3 posted on 06/10/2006 9:51:31 PM PDT by Darkwolf377
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To: churchillbuff

If anyone were allowed to come back, would they be believed?


4 posted on 06/10/2006 9:54:19 PM PDT by CindyDawg
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To: churchillbuff

My much loved, Christian Grandmother, who had been a widow for decades, reached out (actually up toward the ceiling of her hospital room) and had a beaming smile on her face as she passed over. The realm of Angels is only an arms length away anyway don'tchaknow.


5 posted on 06/10/2006 9:55:11 PM PDT by MHGinTN (If you can read this, you've had life support from someone. Promote life support for others.)
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To: churchillbuff
I have a shot at Purgatory. At least I did the last time I checked the bulletin board.

I need to get more monks praying for me.

6 posted on 06/10/2006 9:56:26 PM PDT by battlegearboat
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To: churchillbuff

The Transfiguration is all anyone needs to know that there is life after death. Moses and Elijah talking. What else does one need besides Jesus's promise? If a person denies this, than hearing about someone's experience from the otherside certainly isn't going to bring someone to faith.


7 posted on 06/10/2006 9:56:51 PM PDT by taxesareforever (Never forget Matt Maupin)
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To: CindyDawg

not sure they would be believed, seeing as is someone doesn't believe Jesus came back, why would they believe a person came back...


8 posted on 06/10/2006 9:57:21 PM PDT by votelife (we need 60 conservative senators)
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To: CindyDawg

"They have Moses and the prophets, let them listen to them." If they can't listen to Moses and the Prophets, they won't listen even if a man came back from the dead.


9 posted on 06/10/2006 9:58:05 PM PDT by churchillbuff
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To: churchillbuff

Some people have had experiences that they know better than to talk about with others who have not.

Yes, there is more.


10 posted on 06/10/2006 9:58:43 PM PDT by RonHolzwarth ("History repeats itself - first as tragedy, then as farce" - Karl Marx)
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To: churchillbuff

We have TWO bodies : physical and spiritual, like the particle/wave duality of matter. When the silver cord is snapped, the golden bowl broken, they go their separate ways; the "particle" to the junk car yard called the cemetary, the "wave" either up or down. From statistical studies of the NDE about 2/3rds go up to heaven(thru the tunnel, like the birth process itself), 1/3 go down to hell. It may have to do with the UP Quark(+2/3 charge)and DOWN Quark(-1/3 charge); but, hey, that's just a guess...Jesus will explain it all when he gets back as our ambassador to intelligent species thruout the universe.


11 posted on 06/10/2006 9:59:30 PM PDT by timer
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To: churchillbuff
The proof there is life after death is an indirect one. It goes like this: if nothing we do survives death, then no new generation can build on the work of the one that preceded it.

(Denny Crane: "Every one should carry a gun strapped to their waist. We need more - not less guns.")

12 posted on 06/10/2006 10:03:23 PM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives On In My Heart Forever)
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To: churchillbuff

There is, after all, no way to prove one way or the other that human life continues in another realm after the body ceases to function.

Creation is enough proof for me, every creation MUST have a creator!


13 posted on 06/10/2006 10:06:54 PM PDT by garylmoore (Faith is the assurance of things unseen.)
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To: Darkwolf377
"I walked down a long corridor, and into a room...and they had me take a number..."

BWAHAHAHAHA! I love that film! Nice to know that someone else remembers it!

14 posted on 06/10/2006 10:07:07 PM PDT by Alex Murphy (Colossians 4:6)
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To: churchillbuff

That's what the Bible says. Remember the guy who wanted to go back and warn his kin? People would probably come up with all kinds of rationales to explain that someone hadn't really died.


15 posted on 06/10/2006 10:07:37 PM PDT by CindyDawg
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To: RonHolzwarth; devolve; ntnychik; PhilDragoo

I've read a number of books on NDE's - Near Death Experiences. Very interesting to read, especially the stories told by young children!


16 posted on 06/10/2006 10:09:32 PM PDT by potlatch (Does a clean house indicate that there is a broken computer in it?)
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To: battlegearboat

I have a DSL:')


17 posted on 06/10/2006 10:11:23 PM PDT by CindyDawg
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To: churchillbuff
"You don't have a soul. You are a Soul. You have a body."

- CS Lewis

18 posted on 06/10/2006 10:13:22 PM PDT by Joe 6-pack (Que me amat, amet et canem meum)
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To: churchillbuff
Whose fan is in His hand, and He will thoroughly purge His floor, and gather His wheat into the garner; but He will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire" (Matthew 3:10-12 KJV)

"I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in Me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing. If a man abide not in Me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned" (John 15:5-6 KJV)


The interesting thing about the branch and the chaff is they do not burn forever. If wheat chaff or a branch is cast into a fire they burn until nothing more is left. In essence the branch or chaff cease to exist. Burned from existence, blown away on the wind , no more a branch or chaff.

I think the Lord is kind. I don't think he intends an eternity of hell for the average Joe that doesn't believe in Him. I think He will honor the wishes of those who think and believe when they die they are dead, that they cease to exist.

He will give them what they want, no more existence.
19 posted on 06/10/2006 10:14:04 PM PDT by A message (Zarqawi dead, Democrats deeply saddened)
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To: garylmoore

I have a first cousin who had not one but two NDEs. He was an agnostic ass before the first one. Became a Christian following the first. Had a second one during which he claims several truths were evident: all animal and plant living things continue to recycle through the earth, over and over into the world, but humans only arrive once because we have a spirit that the rest don't have. OH, and Angels have bodies but unless they want you to know it, you cannot touch or sense them yet they can see you any time they choose. His 'intuition' now is astonishing also.


20 posted on 06/10/2006 10:18:04 PM PDT by MHGinTN (If you can read this, you've had life support from someone. Promote life support for others.)
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To: timer
From statistical studies of the NDE about 2/3rds go up to heaven(thru the tunnel, like the birth process itself), 1/3 go down to hell.

That runs counter to most of what I've heard. What statistical studies are you citing?

It may have to do with the UP Quark(+2/3 charge)and DOWN Quark(-1/3 charge); but, hey, that's just a guess...Jesus will explain it all when he gets back as our ambassador to intelligent species thruout the universe.

If your statistics are right, a lot of nonChristians go UP Quark.

21 posted on 06/10/2006 10:21:22 PM PDT by Ken H
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To: RonHolzwarth

Some people have had experiences that they know better than to talk about with others who have not.

Yes, indeed. You are so right. I was going to say that it is a matter of faith, but when I saw your comment I knew that perhaps you too had experienced something that let you know. There aren't words to describe it.


22 posted on 06/10/2006 10:23:03 PM PDT by hardworking (Me? I just work to earn a living, pay taxes, educate my kids...so what could I possiblty know?)
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To: churchillbuff

"Nobody has come back to testify about it,"


Try Dannion Brinkley's Book, "Saved by the Light"


23 posted on 06/10/2006 10:26:00 PM PDT by Rennes Templar ("The future ain't what it used to be".........Yogi Berra)
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To: Ken H

A careful reading of Scriptures will reveal to you that there are two groups in Heaven, the Bride of Christ and the invited guests; both are there because of what Jesus did for us. Some even if the truth of Him is revealed to them will choose to not accept the Grace of God in Christ. They 'didn't choose wisely', to quote the old Knight in Last Crusade.


24 posted on 06/10/2006 10:30:58 PM PDT by MHGinTN (If you can read this, you've had life support from someone. Promote life support for others.)
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To: All
I know a guy who went to be by the bedside of a fellow who was dying of cancer. He had led the cancer patient to Christ, and he was on his last legs. Before becoming a Christian, he was a hardened skeptic, as was a good chunk of his family. Prior to death, with all his relatives around his bed, he became delirious. He spoke like he was seeing people he hadn't seen in years, saying hi to them and that he was happy to see them. He said at one point, "And who are you, little girl? You're my daughter?" He and his wife had been expecting a girl at one point, but she miscarried. And so on. He gave a vivid description of what he saw, then suddenly sat up in bed, pointed to his atheist sister, and said, "It's all true. You need to listen to Pastor C. He's right about all of it." Then he fell back to the pillow, and was gone.

My grandfather was in a care home. He talked for a week about going out with Mary, my grandmother, who'd passed a few years before. One evening, he got out his good shirt and slacks and laid them out for the next day. When he got up, he put them on. When the nurse commented on it, he told her simply that he was going out that day. When she said that she was going down the hall to get his meds, he replied, "Well, go ahead, but I'll be gone before you get back." She left to get his drugs, and when she returned, he was sitting in his chair, having left the building seconds before. Talk about an exit!

25 posted on 06/10/2006 10:34:36 PM PDT by Othniel (Allah: The Goat-Dung idol of millions......)
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To: hardworking; RonHolzwarth

3-1/2 years later, and I still ponder things I cannot put into words.


26 posted on 06/10/2006 10:36:15 PM PDT by Petruchio (* Censored *)
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To: churchillbuff
I'm told that my 102 year old g-g- grandmother sat up in her deathbed just as she took her last breath and said loudly with a big smile on her face, "Oh Isaac, it's really you". Isaac was her husband, a Baptist pastor who had died almost 30 years before. I have a faded and yellowed copy of his picture taken in the smartly tailored uniform of Captain of a Confederate infantry company, and he was a fine specimen of a handsome, athletic appearing young man at that time in his life.

I'm sure that an atheist or skeptic would say that her exclamation was just her fading mind in an emotional state expressing it's fondest desire at that critical moment. But I choose to believe that she saw her dear husband's handsome young face as he reached out to take her hand and welcome her to their eternal home in that heavenly land where Jesus Christ went to prepare a place for those of us who are trusting in him and him alone for our eternal salvation.

27 posted on 06/10/2006 10:40:30 PM PDT by epow (The way of the cross leads home.)
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To: hardworking

I had both an out-of-body-experience and a NDE when I was a teen after a car wreck. I didn't understand what they were at the time, other than inexplicable to me. I don't know whether what happened to me is proof of an afterlife, but it sure was proof to me of the supernatural or at least proof of another dimension.

The OBE was very real, the NDE in hindsight, was a little fuzzy and a little harder to remember and explain. I don't remember a light or a tunnnel, but do remember great peace and beutiful soothing music and being surrounded by beautiful fauna. Never before or since have I ever felt such a great feeling. I don't know where I was, but didn't want to leave.

I was in a coma for about two weeks and spent about 48 days in a hospital.


28 posted on 06/10/2006 10:40:39 PM PDT by umgud (FR, NASCAR & 24, way too much butt time)
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To: A message
I think the Lord is kind. I don't think he intends an eternity of hell for the average Joe that doesn't believe in Him. I think He will honor the wishes of those who think and believe when they die they are dead, that they cease to exist.

He will give them what they want, no more existence.

What a bizarre thing to say. What ever makes you think that those of us who don't believe there is a life after death, want it that way???
29 posted on 06/10/2006 10:50:44 PM PDT by jennyp (My favorite lyric this week: Twig-gy Twiggy, Twig-gy Twiggy, Twig-gy Twiggy, Twig-gy Twiggy)
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To: Othniel
My Grandmother had two sons; my father and my uncle.

My Uncle died of cancer years ago in his 40's. My dad was 62 when grandma passed away of heart failure in February 2005 in her 90's.

In her last days, she was constantly talking to those who had gone before, including her departed son (my uncle) and a good friend who passed away several days before she did (no one told her).

She suddenly turned to my Grandpa and said "Why have we lost BOTH sons?" My apparently healthy father was actually standing at her bedside at the time. We all said "wow, Grandma is really becoming incoherent."

Two months after Grandma died, Dad was diagnosed with inoperable bile duct cancer...he died last July.

"Someone" must have told her that Dad would be joining her soon.

30 posted on 06/10/2006 10:52:46 PM PDT by garandgal
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To: umgud

I had what I guess is an out-of-body experience once. I was in surgery sometime in the summer of 01 and I could like see the "wakeup room" and everything from an overhead view. I was extremely groggy though. I never came close to dying though (that I know about.)

I guess it was my imagination or something. It was kindof blurry and I could feel the burning effects of the (i guess it was) morphine that the doctors gave me for pain. I was in a great deal of pain and once the doctors gave me some extra morphine I snapped out of it. The "out-of-body" experience only lasted for I guess around 1 to 3 seconds.

The reason I think it was either a dream or my imagination is because I have a hard time believing in out-of-body experiences.

I believe that christ died for my sins and am a christian but I just can't believe what I haven't seen.


31 posted on 06/10/2006 10:53:13 PM PDT by Ainast
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To: Othniel; churchillbuff; All

Goose bumps!

Thanks Churchillbuff for the thread.

Thank you Jesus for your kindness and love.


32 posted on 06/10/2006 10:53:24 PM PDT by A message
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To: MHGinTN
A careful reading of Scriptures will reveal to you that there are two groups in Heaven, the Bride of Christ and the invited guests; both are there because of what Jesus did for us.

Let's say someone has Hindu grandparents that they were very close to, and have passed on. Would the Hindu grandparents, assuming they were decent people, be invited guests? If not, then who gets to be invited guests?

33 posted on 06/10/2006 10:57:08 PM PDT by Ken H
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To: Ainast

I saw things in my OBE that I could not have seen due to my being unconscious. I also saw them from an elevated position. I also can't explain this.


34 posted on 06/10/2006 10:58:10 PM PDT by umgud (FR, NASCAR & 24, way too much butt time)
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To: churchillbuff
God did not lie when he said on the day you partake of the fruit of the tree of good and evil you will surely die. According to our definition and concept of what life is, Adam and Eve lived a long time after they were banished. But the quality of that life was akin to death and it becomes evident they died spiritually, for death is separation from God.

Life and death has to be re-defined on a spiritual basis, not a physical basis, for there is a greater death than the death of the body.

And there is a greater life available to you here and now than the life you were given when you were born on earth.

The question that can be answered today is, can one begin partaking of that greater life and know they have entered into eternal life before their body is buried?

Well, that's the Good News!

But if we are only concerned with the question of retaining our conscious awareness, memory and identity after our physical body perishes, that can be answered by anyone who has ever had a wide-awake, out-of-body and bi-located.

35 posted on 06/10/2006 10:58:28 PM PDT by Eastbound
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To: churchillbuff
I went to three Seances about 30 years ago. Quick summary, the medium was a working man living in a small house, no money exchanged hands, and he never knew my full name.

A woman whose daughter was going with my friend, was there to talk to her husband who died mysteriously in a boating accident.

About 9 of us went into a small bedroom with stuff all over the floor and two megaphones about 30 inches high with luminous bands around them so you could see them in the dark. He said the Lords Prayer, and the 23rd Psalm.

the spirits showed up and the megaphones flew around the room making a big racket(we could see the bands in the dark). The horn them went to the woman and she carried on a conversation with her husband, asking where securities were and other financial stuff. The horn came to me and I asked eho my spirit teacher was, it whispered back. I couldn't understand it.

A few months later went again with a friend, this time we were going to catch him. I grabbed the horn when it came around, and it was like set in concrete(Even Arnold S couldn't hold it that steady). My friend grabbed it and gasped, later on he told me there was a hand on the end cut off at the writs(?).

The third time I went a friend of mine that was killed in a PBY accident showed up. The medium described him perfectly. Then my Grandmother. Remember no money involved or names known.

The medium said that we are reincarnated with the objective to improve ourselves and move closer to God. I happen to be in my third life, and my wife (who only went to one session) is in her sixth(she must have been real bad in her first life hehehe).

I have an engineering education, and I could not think of a way he could have moved that horn around like that mechanically or?

Mass hypnosis? I doubt it, considering there were 8 - 9 people.

I am an agnostic, so pretty skeptical, but who knows. I leave the door open to the possibility - it would be nice.

There is more to the above than I related.
36 posted on 06/10/2006 11:04:41 PM PDT by stubernx98 (cranky, but reasonable)
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To: Ken H

You ask a question that has no Earthly answer.Ask God when you see him, or just look around when you arrive.


37 posted on 06/10/2006 11:05:03 PM PDT by jeremiah (How much did we get for that rope?)
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To: umgud

I was kindof awake during this I think. I kindof think I was hearing sounds and my mind was making vision to the sounds I heard.

The only thing I can compare it to is like my arm going to sleep. Except its my entire body.


38 posted on 06/10/2006 11:07:28 PM PDT by Ainast
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To: Darkwolf377
"I walked down a long corridor, and into a room...and they had me take a number..."

And told me from now on I'd be voting Democrat.

39 posted on 06/10/2006 11:15:15 PM PDT by Chesterbelloc
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To: jeremiah
Would the Hindu grandparents, assuming they were decent people, be invited guests [a second shot at Heaven]? If not, then who gets to be invited guests?

You ask a question that has no Earthly answer.

Fair enough. What are the scriptural answers to the two questions above?

40 posted on 06/10/2006 11:17:49 PM PDT by Ken H
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To: Chesterbelloc
LOL!!!!

Awesome. That's the laugh of the day.

41 posted on 06/10/2006 11:24:10 PM PDT by Darkwolf377
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To: Ken H

You have freepmail


42 posted on 06/10/2006 11:27:22 PM PDT by MHGinTN (If you can read this, you've had life support from someone. Promote life support for others.)
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To: Ken H

You should consult the words of God and not the words of men for your answers. The words of God can be found in the Holy Bible. The Bible of your forefathers. The King James Bible. There you will find the answers to all your questions.


43 posted on 06/10/2006 11:33:52 PM PDT by Search4Truth (The law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul.)
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To: All; Petruchio; hardworking; RonHolzwarth

"3-1/2 years later, and I still ponder things I cannot put into words."

Although I didn't get to complete the journey I got a tiny glimpse of Paradise...the lights I saw were beautiful... mere words can't describe them!

All the time the Paramedics were working on me I didn't have the fear of death and wasn't in pain.

In my grandparents day the family were the one's taking care of their dying loved one, so they got to hear all the first hand accounts as to what was happening.

We got to hear what Aunt Jane or Uncle John said as she/he was passing & who all she/he saw. Sadly once in awhile the dying saw the flames of Hell.

And for doubters who don't believe...here's a lady's account of what she saw when she was put to death at the hands of her Doctors, and brought back to life again.

http://www.near-death.com/experiences/evidence01.html


44 posted on 06/10/2006 11:39:20 PM PDT by Ready2go (Isa 5:20 Destruction is certain for those who say that evil is good and good is evil;)
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To: churchillbuff

I tend to look at NDE stories the same as I do the Shroud of Turin. If it truly is an event where people see God, great and wonderful. If it isn't, it wasn't the focus of my faith anyway.

Particularly for non-baseball fans, I will repeat the story of Astros pitcher Roger Clemens' mother. Bess died last September on a day Roger was supposed to pitch. She told Roger to go and pitch because he would win the game, 10-2. Roger laughed because the Astros had had trouble scoring runs for him all year. Well, the Astros managed to score 10 runs and led 10-1 in the top of the ninth. Then, a normally reliable fielder made an error that let in a second opposition run. Final score: Astros won, 10-2.

Roger's sister said that, as her mother was about to die, she kept repeating "Shoeless Joe Jackson". Shoeless Joe was a member of the infamous 1919 Chicago "Black Sox" that threw the World Series for gamblers, for which he was banned from the game a year later. The White Sox had never won a World Series since then.

Clemens and the Astros reached the World Series for the first time ever in October and their opponent turned out to be the Chicago White Sox who beat them in four straight, winning their first championship since Jackson's teams of WWI.

Coincidence? You decide.


45 posted on 06/10/2006 11:50:09 PM PDT by Tall_Texan (I wish a political party would come along that thinks like I do.)
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To: potlatch
I'm reading a book on this subject. Very interesting. Many people have reported the same types of experiences-bright light, seeing deceased relatives exc..

Personally, I believe there is an after life.

I believe it because there just has to be a place for terminally ill and disabled children to go to, (if not the rest of us), where they are free from their afflictions- where they can experience the fullness of their being, and everything they didn't get to do while they were here.

46 posted on 06/10/2006 11:51:33 PM PDT by Pajamajan (Benedict Arnold and Jack Murtha served in the US military.)
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To: goldstategop

The question "Is there life after death?" is so worrying
to so many, yet none bother to ask,"What was before life?".

It's not called the wheel of life for nothing.


47 posted on 06/10/2006 11:53:16 PM PDT by tet68 ( " We would not die in that man's company, that fears his fellowship to die with us...." Henry V.)
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To: churchillbuff

I have struggled with these very same questions, especially since my wife passed.

When I was younger, I had no doubt there was a great plan. And that I was some part of it.

As I got older, it seemed less clear. Out of all the folks who had passed, why can't just one give some incontrovertible proof? Show up on the Tonight Show and give the lottery numbers for tomorrow night or something?

So where is the evidence? If I did live previous lives, why can't I remember one tiny bit? When you look at actual data, it doesn't look very supportive of extraordinary claims. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof.

Yet more of my examination have given new hope and direction. We are not just muscles and tissues. What makes us us is PATTERNS. Patterns of thought, patterns of awareness. There is no single cell in any of us that holds the "me" in it. Yet each and every cell is a tiny, living, individual being.

So we are much more than the simple sum of the parts. Wish I knew what, but maybe time will give the answer.


48 posted on 06/10/2006 11:54:15 PM PDT by djf (I'm not Islamophobic. But I am bombophobic. Same thing, I guess...)
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To: Ken H

Can't remember where I read it(2/3 go UP, 1/3 go DOWN), somewhere... But we christians all remember Jesus saying : he who believes in me, even though he be dead, the same shall I recommend to the father. He also spoke of the "double death" : fear HIM that can both kill and cast into hell, which is the second death. Of course we're getting into theology here, a LARGE subject...Personally I take the more tangible route of rational science as belief alone can be a slippery slope; to wit, far more people have been killed as unbelievers than all the soldiers in all the wars in history. But don't be fooled by those who say science and religion are incompatible roads to TRUTH. A famous philosopher once put it as : x and y axes on the graph. In physics we say : look at it THIS way and you see particle, look at it THAT way and you see wave. So we sometimes say "wavicle"...Again then, we have TWO bodies much like right brain/left brain(child artist proposes the idea, engineer disposes of the idea as impractical)which are different ways of processing the same data-input.


49 posted on 06/11/2006 12:16:57 AM PDT by timer
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To: Search4Truth
Would the Hindu grandparents, assuming they were decent people, be invited guests? If not, then who gets to be invited guests?

You should consult the words of God [The King James Bible] and not the words of men for your answers. There you will find the answers to all your questions.

Fair enough. Let me ask this. If you were witnessing to the Hindu granddaughter, and she asks if her deceased Hindu grandparents are doomed to Hell... what would you say to her?

50 posted on 06/11/2006 12:22:30 AM PDT by Ken H
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