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Breaking? WMD report?

Posted on 06/21/2006 2:38:38 PM PDT by Scarchin

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To: rake

Thank you!

From my keyboard to Tony Snow, I pray.


481 posted on 06/22/2006 8:07:42 AM PDT by MeanWestTexan (Many at FR would respond to Christ "Darn right, I'll cast the first stone!")
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To: Ditto
:-} Trust but verify.

Shelf Life of Iraq's Chemical Weapons

482 posted on 06/22/2006 8:08:52 AM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: GrandEagle
For example, if the world wouldn't have thrown a fit, we could have nuked Afghanistan and Iraq into oblivion. It would have save us lots of good men and women. But, it also would have cost us dearly in the eyes of the world.

Um, no. We didn't do this for one simple reason: it would have been wrong. We didn't go to war against these countries, we went to war against the ruling regimes who oppressed their own people at the point of a gun--in addition to attacking us. Indiscriminate killing of these oppressed populations would have been morally and legally wrong. We got the guys we wanted and sought to spare innocents.

483 posted on 06/22/2006 8:33:04 AM PDT by pgyanke (Christ embraces sinners; liberals embrace the sin.)
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To: jwalsh07

Good link. Thanks.


484 posted on 06/22/2006 8:42:36 AM PDT by Ditto
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To: roses of sharon
"Remember according to the left, we should have found vats, and vats, in factories of boiling WMD!

And Saddam's soldiers stirring and stirring, and upon the invasion we would BUST OPEN the doors in surprise and find them, just like in Hollywood!

. . . and we need pictures of the underground complex deep under some Iraqi mountain complete with Chicom workers in white lab coats and high tech robots walking down mile long corridors. We need pictures of 007 with his sexy love kitten standing in the munitions room. We need the public to see the chemistry room with tables of glass beakers, Bunsen burners and miles of tubing. Otherwise the sheeple with not be able to connect the dots.

485 posted on 06/22/2006 9:35:43 AM PDT by jonrick46
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To: HighWheeler; GRRRRR
Well I guess the truth is none of us armchair quarterbacks KNOWS what is behind Door Number 2. We are using our eyes to see that the package in the middle is exactly like the package on the right, and we are DEDUCING that, therefore, the center package contains sample tubes just like the package on the right does. Additionally, a good photographer and/or scientist who knows how to document evidence would set up the photo like that to show that "this is what the package looks like on the front, and this is what the package looks like and contains on the back."
486 posted on 06/22/2006 9:37:07 AM PDT by BagCamAddict (Prayers for the victims - human and animal - of Katrina and Rita)
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To: jonrick46
LOL, what an excellent visual!

Too bad this country is run by Hollywood/NYT and the DNC.

It is past time to infiltrate some so called "newsrooms", and begin the revolution.

Who would have imagined with the information age, that ONE political party, and our battlefield enemies, would have sole control over the propaganda.

We are literaly underground, and even more amazing, our MILITARY are unable to even speak to the American people, they are so far underground.

When was the last time we saw a complete presser in Prime time by our Military in Afghanistan or Iraq?????????????????

I have been calling and writing the networks for 3 years to ask to see the REGULAR briefings in full, in Prime time.

Of course that would defeat the DNC/MSM/OBL's purpose, would it not?
487 posted on 06/22/2006 9:58:12 AM PDT by roses of sharon
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To: Scarchin
Lotta folks running off at the mouth about shelf life of Iraqi chemicals and "these are old and dont work".

I have the solution. Take one of these shells and bring it to the floor of the House and Senate. Bring in a tech in radiation suit and then vote on weather these are weapons of mass destruction ....or not. Will be a house full of Demorats by themselves.

Now they are saying they are only 30% effective......I dont like those odds,either.
488 posted on 06/22/2006 10:43:45 AM PDT by halfright (--------------------------------------------Bolton/Coulter 08'--------------------------------------)
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To: GrandEagle

The United States at that time were very worried about Islamic Fundamentalist spreading throughout the Middle East. We really thought that and we were still in the Cold War dealing with the Soviets.

Did you watch Discovery Channel about the Soviet Invasion in Afghanistan. We helped Osama during the Afghan War is a fable.

CIA helped the Native Afghanistans only. The Arab Afghan Fighters which Osama tagged along with were supported by Islamic Fundies from Saudi Arabia. They did not like Westerners. They kept themselves separated from the dirty infidels. Their mission was to get rid of the Atheistic Soviets from Afghanistan but when that war was over they would come after the Westerners. Native Afghans thought the Afghan Arabs were real crazy...quick to join their 72 virgins.

Afghanistan nearly lost the war because the Soviets controlled the air. If the CIA did not equiped the Native Afghans with the Silk Worm they would lost the war for sure. Afghan Arabs claimed victory.


When Saddam used the gas on the Kurds the UN really didn't do much. UN didn't put sanctions against Iraq because Iraq and Iran both had chemical weapons.

UN Resolution 620:

http://www.au.af.mil/au/awc/awcgate/un/res0620.htm

In the United States, Congress wanted to put sanctions against Iraq in 1988 but Saddams Regime owed too much money and claimed his government didn't do it.

Interesting articles from this period and Saddam's complaints.

http://www.ubikcentral.com/2003/09/iraq_reporting_.html

This is from Renewal America...

"On 8 September 1988 the Senate passed the "Prevention of Genocide Act of 1988" which would render Iraq ineligible to receive U.S. loans, military and non military aid, credits, credit guarantees and any item subject to export controls. This law would make the importation of oil into the United States illegal. The bill did not pass the House because the Reagan administration launched a lobbying campaign to prevent its passage in the House. Apparently, other agendas were more important to the U. S. government than those pesky human rights violations. [2]"

http://www.renewamerica.us/columns/spingola/050728

This is from Wikipedia for easy reading...


"Following the war, however, there were moves within the Congress of the United States to isolate Iraq diplomatically and economically over concerns about human rights violations, its dramatic military build-up, and hostility to Israel. Specifically, the Senate in 1988 unanimously passed the "Prevention of Genocide Act of 1988," which imposed sanctions on Iraq. The legislation passed. [10]"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_war


489 posted on 06/22/2006 10:50:33 AM PDT by Milligan
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To: Milligan

Correction:

The United States at that time were very worried about Islamic Fundamentalist spreading throughout the Middle East. We really thought that and we were still in the Cold War dealing with the Soviets.

We were worried Iranian Islamic Revolution would spread throughout the Middle East.


490 posted on 06/22/2006 11:20:23 AM PDT by Milligan
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To: cleveland gop

"---What took so long. We've been at war for 3 1/2 years. It's about time we see some results!!!"

Everything Classified? Investigate where did the chemicals come from...like France, Germany or Russian? Don't chemcials have "markers"? Checking out sources in Gitmo?


491 posted on 06/22/2006 11:31:37 AM PDT by Milligan
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To: Milligan
We helped Osama during the Afghan War is a fable.
True, but then I don't believe I said that. Our primary support I believe was with the Northern alliance, who's leader (can't remember his name) was killed a while back.

Afghanistan nearly lost the war because the Soviets controlled the air. If the CIA did not equiped the Native Afghans with the Silk Worm they would lost the war for sure.
Although not very familiar with the Silk Worm, I understood it to be a ground to ground, cruse type missile. Pretty much useless against an aircraft. The items supplied by the CIA were a stinger type of some sort, ground to air missile.
Your information seems to match my understanding in this area. Soviet air power was hammering them pretty hard.

Look, I certainly didn't intend to stir up a hornets nest here. There are official government positions, then there are marketed government positions, there are subversive operations, then there are actual implementation of actions. All of which can, and sometimes do, have different motives.
What we did or didn't do was not even the point of my original post. The point was that we knew these things were there, we knew he had used them, and we were sure he didn't destroy them.
Finding them is fabulous news since they can't now be used against us. I just don't think it is the "smoking gun" we need to shut everyone up. Finding something that was secretly done would be. It is just an opinion, thats all. You can take that, and a buck and a quarter and get you a cup of coffee.

Cordially,
GE
492 posted on 06/22/2006 11:45:56 AM PDT by GrandEagle
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To: roses of sharon
This is one TOP SECRET I can report to my FR friends: We are winning the war in Iraq.

This information cannot be voiced by the military. My Marine nephew cannot call home and tell his parents that Iraq is going fantastic. He mentioned that they will cut off your phone call for anything suggestive in its content. I suppose it's a tactic to keep the terrorist guessing. However, the Main Stream Media knows that they can play the other side when the truth of the matter cannot be refuted. And they know that playing the other side with such an advantage can erode the public's support for the war. They will play this game with the blessing of the DemonRATs. However, they do not realize that this game they play could have disastrous consequences for the country. It already is causing the deaths of our sons and daughters in uniform.

493 posted on 06/22/2006 12:59:27 PM PDT by jonrick46
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To: GrandEagle
They had a fairly substantial arsenal but fortunately (due to some quick thinking engineers) the new F-15's they had were useless.

Iran never had F-15s (although they did have F-14s). The F-14s weren't useless, either (even after their supplies of Phoenix missiles ran low the F-14s were very useful in an AEW role due to their unusually powerful AWG-9 radar).

Iraq had a fairly substantial collection of Soviet arms, but the USSR didn't trust Saddam either, so they held back the really good stuff;

Iraq had T-72Ms (with local infrastructure for manufacturing of spare parts such as gun barrels) and MiG-29s. Granted, they had far greater numbers of inferior equipment (Type 59/69 tanks and J-6/7s from China) but this was a local decision to go with quantity over quality, not any attempt by the Soviet Union to "hold back the really good stuff".

At the time it was probably a good idea too; but sometimes our affairs backfire like they did in Afghanistan. Hopefully you won't deny that we armed them, that also is common knowledge

This is a red herring; the fact that we armed rebels in Afghanistan has nothing to do with the fact that we didn't arm Iraq. And while it is "common knowledge", it too is often deliberately distorted into supporting made-up "facts" (like assertions that bin Laden was a CIA employee).

I'll admit that I did expect a bit of a negative response, but nothing like what I got. Certainly FReepers do better homework than this.

One would hope so, but the "we armed Iraq" myth has been repeated so long that even some Freepers believe it. But the assertion is false; the US didn't give chemical weapons technology (or sell any other weapons) to Iraq. Such assertions have been made in the media, so it is excusable that you might think so, but all those assertions (including a "secret" NSDD which leftists claimed showed such support but has since been declassified and shows the exact opposite) have been proven to be false. Unfortunately, the fact that it is false doesn't keep it from being repeated over and over again.

494 posted on 06/22/2006 2:50:39 PM PDT by Technogeeb
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To: Technogeeb
Iran never had F-15s (although they did have F-14s).
I've been corrected: (and properly chastised)
The post trail
#436 #441 #445 #451 #456
495 posted on 06/22/2006 2:59:28 PM PDT by GrandEagle
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To: GrandEagle
I've been corrected: (and properly chastised) The post trail #436 #441 #445 #451 #456

Sorry about that; didn't notice those (hadn't read them yet) when I was posting.

496 posted on 06/22/2006 3:05:51 PM PDT by Technogeeb
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To: GrandEagle

Your right Eagle it was stinger missiles.


497 posted on 06/22/2006 3:10:45 PM PDT by Milligan
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To: Milligan
Afghanistan nearly lost the war because the Soviets controlled the air. If the CIA did not equiped the Native Afghans with the Silk Worm

Minor correction; the SilkWorm is a Chinese copy of the old Soviet SS-N-2 "Styx" anti-ship missile (and sold to anyone who wants to buy them, including Iraq and Iran). The CIA was equipping the Afghanis with Stingers, which are a small, man portable anti-aircraft missile.

498 posted on 06/22/2006 3:13:11 PM PDT by Technogeeb
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To: Technogeeb
Sorry about that; didn't notice those (hadn't read them yet) when I was posting
No problem. It has been a while and I got confused because of the Iranian guys that went to school with me on the F15 avionics and weapon systems.
I'm not sure why they were there now, but as another poster pointed out, the radars were either the same or similar. I'm very familiar with the 15, but only know public stuff on the 14 - same as anyone else.
I suppose they also could have been there for the AIM-9 and AIM-7 schools too.
Anyway, they didn't seem particularly smart back then and if I remember correctly, they were all "connected" with prominent families back in Iran or they couldn't come to the US. They never studied and the instructors were irritated because they couldn't flunk them because of the politics involved.
Personable people alright, just not too interested in learning.
Somewhere in the house I've got some Iranian paper currency with a couple of their names written in Arabic on it.

Anyway, I'm still smarting a bit from the lashing I got, but then a good lashing is good every now and then.

Have a great evening
GE
499 posted on 06/22/2006 3:18:53 PM PDT by GrandEagle
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To: Milligan
Your right Eagle it was stinger missiles.
No problem my FRiend - Especially after my F14-F15 mixup!

Cordially,
GE
500 posted on 06/22/2006 3:22:22 PM PDT by GrandEagle
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