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Ken Lay has died (heart attack)
Reuters | 7/5/06

Posted on 07/05/2006 7:03:35 AM PDT by ElRushbo

cause of death unknown


TOPICS: Breaking News; Business/Economy
KEYWORDS: arkancide; assasination; criminal; crook; cultureofcorruption; damncrook; enron; enronlist; heartattack; howconvenient; immoralbastard; karma; kenlay; kennethlay; kennyboy; obituary; quietforevermore; rovianplot; thedamned; theultimatepardon; thief; wasgoingtosqueal
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To: CFC__VRWC

Remind your brother-in-law that it was Bill Clinton who gave all the perks to Ken Lay - not Bush. And .. when the story broke, it was Lieberman who said he was going to start hearings and take Bush down. However, as soon as the hearings started, Lieberman discovered all roads led back to Clinton and the hearings were quickly dropped - never to be heard of again.


151 posted on 07/05/2006 7:44:59 AM PDT by CyberAnt (Drive-By Media: Fake news, fake documents, fake polls)
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To: ElRushbo

Ken Lay. May he RIP. Amen.


152 posted on 07/05/2006 7:45:27 AM PDT by tioga
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To: ElRushbo

Was Claudine Longet in the neighborhood?????


153 posted on 07/05/2006 7:45:31 AM PDT by joey'smom
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To: brownsfan; SoFloFreeper

Agree as well, but they also shouldn't be multi-millionaires on his ill-gotten gains.


154 posted on 07/05/2006 7:45:34 AM PDT by FreedomPoster (Guns themselves are fairly robust; their chief enemies are rust and politicians) (NRA)
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To: ElRushbo

Well, he was the captain of the ship ... but the XO (Skilling) probably more at fault about Enron's sinking!


155 posted on 07/05/2006 7:45:36 AM PDT by meandog (If I were to draw the odious Islamic prophet Muhammad, he would have horns, a tail, and a pitchfork!)
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To: Tigercap

I know it and you know it but it wont stop the DUmmies from wild speculation and flat out BS.

I cant even access their board now because its apparently so busy


156 posted on 07/05/2006 7:45:43 AM PDT by mylife (The roar of the masses could be farts)
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To: mtbopfuyn

"He won't be enjoying his annunities now."

What do nuns have to do with this?


157 posted on 07/05/2006 7:46:04 AM PDT by MineralMan (non-evangelical atheist)
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To: wideawake

Agree that you shouldn't put all your money into your company's stock, but the employees were hung out to dry when Lay and his cohorts were dumping their stock at the end, but the employees were not allowed to sell theirs.


158 posted on 07/05/2006 7:46:04 AM PDT by Inspectorette
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To: romanesq
"Find the stash and seize it all. Let RICO find it."

It's going to be very difficult for the government to take assets that are so well protected by the law. This will be an interesting case.

159 posted on 07/05/2006 7:46:06 AM PDT by TommyDale (Stop the Nifongery!)
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To: wideawake

"There are rapists and child molesters walking around free in this country - people need to get some sense of moral proportion."

A rapist or child molester destroys one or a handful of lives, which is terrible.

A guy who calmly defrauds his company, employees, and stockholders of billions destroys thousands.

As with a molestation or rape, the victim lives; but their lives are thrown into chaos, their futures ruined.

Now some outside guy, like me (although I had no stake in Enron) who bought some shares might have had a chance to bail out. The employees, though, were locked out of any chance to escape by transferring their 401k assets.

Those people were ****ed by Ken Lay. I don't want to in any way trivialize the horror of rape or molestation victims but IMO the "only fraud" treatment of white collar crime is 100% off target; the white-collar criminal just savages his victims from afar.


160 posted on 07/05/2006 7:46:24 AM PDT by No.6 (www.fourthfightergroup.com)
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To: deport
Heart gave out? I suspect that Lay arranged for this to happen for understandable reasons. Didn't take meds, engaged in risky behavior, etc. Just do everything the opposite of what you're told to do to avoid a heart attack.

If so, he did it for his wife and children and their future financial security. And avoid the ignominy of prison. And to deny the government satisfaction (his perspective, not mine).

My next prediction is that Skilling will not go to prison, at least not any time soon. He'll flee.
161 posted on 07/05/2006 7:47:24 AM PDT by Iwo Jima ("Close the border. Then we'll talk.")
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To: olde north church

"Bugger mercy."

I believe Jesus would disagree with you.


162 posted on 07/05/2006 7:47:26 AM PDT by MineralMan (non-evangelical atheist)
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To: Aquinasfan

Whoa. You can get in trouble mentioning #4 here on FR.


163 posted on 07/05/2006 7:47:28 AM PDT by Jedidah
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To: DCPatriot

Ouiser didn't say that. Miss Clarie did.

;-)


164 posted on 07/05/2006 7:48:20 AM PDT by kimmie7 (If they say you kick like a girl, take it as a COMPLIMENT!)
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To: Carry_Okie

"The way the California power crisis was set up has never been adequately covered."

Cliff Baxter was enrons/Lays/Skillings/Fastows point-man and mouthpiece in the goings-on in California.


165 posted on 07/05/2006 7:49:41 AM PDT by Vn_survivor_67-68
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To: kimmie7

Wasn't it orginally Alice Roosevelt Longworth (Teddy's daughter)? In fact, she supposedly had a small throw pillow with that statement embroidered on it.


166 posted on 07/05/2006 7:49:58 AM PDT by Inspectorette
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To: Iwo Jima
My next prediction is that Skilling will not go to prison, at least not any time soon. He'll flee.

If anyone will do himself in it will be Skilling.

167 posted on 07/05/2006 7:50:08 AM PDT by isthisnickcool (What is it about "illegal" you don't understand?)
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To: wideawake
"Anyone who put their life savings in Enron stock instead of diversifying his portfolio is a moron who can only blame himself for his own stupidity."

Bravo, finally someone makes this point! Although the 'cooking of the books' was criminal, the folks who did loose entire portfolios from this debacle were mostly depending on their Enron stock options for the entire retirement. That's too many eggs in one basket if you ask me.
168 posted on 07/05/2006 7:50:11 AM PDT by poobear
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To: ElRushbo

I'm sorry. I would look at pictures of him, and wonder ??why??. But I guess even the wealthy have 'their price'.

I feel bad for his wife. A double whammy for her. I wish his family peace.


169 posted on 07/05/2006 7:50:24 AM PDT by Exit148 (Founder of the Loose Change Club. Every nickle and dime counts!!)
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To: kimmie7

Bloomberg just happened to mention that Lay was nick named "Kenny Boy" by Bush


170 posted on 07/05/2006 7:50:43 AM PDT by ElRushbo (Harley Riders against Elton John)
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To: JamesP81

He was 64...or so it has been reported.


171 posted on 07/05/2006 7:50:53 AM PDT by TankerKC (Jos puede usted ver?)
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To: LibertyGrrrl
A lot of people lost their life savings

Again, anyone who puits all their savings into a single growth stock needs to have their head examined.

My ex-neighbor's brother-in-law . . .

Assuming the veracity of this story (I'm not saying you're making it up, but you have heard it third or fourth hand) it sounds like the individual under discussion had a lot of pressures in life in general.

That's no different from the person who commits suicide after being molested or raped.

You might want to ask someone who's been raped if losing money is just as bad as being raped.

172 posted on 07/05/2006 7:50:56 AM PDT by wideawake ("The nation which forgets its defenders will itself be forgotten." - Calvin Coolidge)
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To: kimmie7

;-)


173 posted on 07/05/2006 7:50:58 AM PDT by kimmie7 (Liberals embrace the sin......Christians embrace the sinner.)
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To: wideawake

We will have to disagree on this one. Your view might be different if you were one of the stockholders who lost their life savings because of the lies that Ken Lay told. Fortunately, I am not one of them.


174 posted on 07/05/2006 7:51:18 AM PDT by KevinB
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To: Inspectorette

Not a clue about that one. The only time I've ever heard that quote was in the movie "Steel Magnolias".


175 posted on 07/05/2006 7:51:52 AM PDT by kimmie7 (Liberals embrace the sin......Christians embrace the sinner.)
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To: Iwo Jima
My next prediction is that Skilling will not go to prison, at least not any time soon. He'll flee.

I have never understood why Lay and Skilling didn't flee before all hell broke lose.

176 posted on 07/05/2006 7:51:55 AM PDT by wagglebee ("We are ready for the greatest achievements in the history of freedom." -- President Bush, 1/20/05)
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To: Old Sarge

I'd guess a quiet suicide. It's been done a million times.


177 posted on 07/05/2006 7:52:22 AM PDT by beyond the sea (Scientists Are Itching to Blame Poison Ivy's Effect on Global Warming)
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To: Always Right

How right you are!!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x1569034


178 posted on 07/05/2006 7:52:50 AM PDT by proudmilitarymrs (It's not immigration, it's an invasion!)
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To: isthisnickcool

I disagree. Skilling doesn't love anyone the way Ken Lay loved his wife (as I see it).


179 posted on 07/05/2006 7:53:04 AM PDT by Iwo Jima ("Close the border. Then we'll talk.")
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To: OldFriend

"....left Enron with billions of expenses and no hope of recovering those expenses."

OPIC


180 posted on 07/05/2006 7:53:17 AM PDT by Vn_survivor_67-68
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To: LibertyGrrrl

Honestly, I can't muster too much sympathy for a person committing suicide, irrespective of the reasons. Not talking about the family; obviously, they deserve all the sympathy.

Did this guy really think his family was better off without him, or did he just decide he didn't care to stick around and find out?


181 posted on 07/05/2006 7:53:24 AM PDT by 1L
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To: ElRushbo

Did someone mention DU and conspiracy theories? Here's the latest:

hughee99 (1000+ posts) Wed Jul-05-06 10:17 AM
Response to Reply #21
26. Could it possibly be faked?
Edited on Wed Jul-05-06 10:18 AM by hughee99
Kenny Boy could be sitting on a beach in 2 weeks with his $$ and no one will be looking for him. Though I guess if you wanted to fake your death, heart attack wouldn't be the way to go.


182 posted on 07/05/2006 7:53:29 AM PDT by NRA1995 (Zarqawi died, liberals cried....)
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To: wideawake
Anyone who put their life savings in Enron stock instead of diversifying his portfolio is a moron who can only blame himself for his own stupidity.

On behalf of the employees, may I request that you exempt them from the moron designation? They had no choice in the matter as far as their 401k was concerned. The entire employer contribution component was in Enron stock and they couldn't sell it until they were 50 years old even if they left the company. That created an retiremement portfolio oveweighted in Enron whether they liked it or not.

183 posted on 07/05/2006 7:53:52 AM PDT by freespirited (A liberal is a person haunted by fear that someone, somewhere does not require government assistance)
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To: Inspectorette

She did indeed. :)


184 posted on 07/05/2006 7:54:39 AM PDT by linda_22003
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To: FormerACLUmember
I didn't see what you said here on # 10, but I agree. See post # 177.

I'm very familiar with some police reports and other reports that avoid the suicide angle for various reasons, mostly because of an agreement. It's cool.

185 posted on 07/05/2006 7:54:39 AM PDT by beyond the sea (Scientists Are Itching to Blame Poison Ivy's Effect on Global Warming)
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To: wideawake
Ken Lay did not destroy many lives - he destroyed one life: his own.

Obviously you didn't work for Enron amd you weren't there. The employees could not take the money out of Enron stock to diversify it. A company rule which coincidentally did not apply to the ones making the rule (the execs).

186 posted on 07/05/2006 7:54:44 AM PDT by BipolarBob (Yes I backed over the vampire, but I swear I looked in my rearview mirror.)
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To: genxer
If i remember correctly its 2 years in force for suicide to be covered.

It's 2 years by state law in most (all?) states.

187 posted on 07/05/2006 7:55:10 AM PDT by Gondring (If "Conservatives" now want to "conserve" our Constitution away, then I must be a Preservative!)
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To: No.6
A guy who calmly defrauds his company, employees, and stockholders of billions destroys thousands.

Please. Complete hyperbole.

I've lost a job because a boss of mine made some stupid decisions. It didn't ruin my life - I found another job.

I've also lost substantial money in the markets due to fraud at companies I invested in (Tyco, anyone?) - but that didn't ruin my life either.

If losing a job or losing money ruins your life, then you're not made of very stern stuff.

Money is replaceable and jobs are replaceable.

Comparing that to what a rape victim goes through is just silly.

188 posted on 07/05/2006 7:56:30 AM PDT by wideawake ("The nation which forgets its defenders will itself be forgotten." - Calvin Coolidge)
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To: ElRushbo

Sympathies to his family. I'm sure that the stresses induced by the failure of Enron, his arrest, trial and conviction all served to hasten his departure from this earth.

Hopefully, he can finally go to his rest.


189 posted on 07/05/2006 7:56:35 AM PDT by DustyMoment (FloriDUH - proud inventors of pregnant/hanging chads and judicide!!)
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To: ElRushbo

Oh no, that's terrible. Prayers go out to his loved ones.


190 posted on 07/05/2006 7:57:12 AM PDT by NRA2BFree (NEVER ARGUE WITH IDIOTS!!! THEY*LL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL AND BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE!!!!)
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To: NRA1995

Do you think the NYT would publish a photo of a dead Ken Lay similiar to the photos released by the government of Abu Musab al-Zarqawi -- I bet they would.


191 posted on 07/05/2006 7:58:27 AM PDT by ElRushbo (Harley Riders against Elton John)
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To: KevinB

Lay and his cohorts, by fraud, presented a fake financially "healthy" company, to deceive and bilk investors. The scheme was unprecedented and beyond illegal and the audit company, too, exists no more. This is no different than setting up a fake bank and inviting depositors, to steal their money. While he could ask for eternal forgiveness from the Messiah, he didn't accidentally step in to this.


192 posted on 07/05/2006 7:58:32 AM PDT by F15Eagle (1 John 5:4-5, 1 John 4:15, John 11:25, John 14:6, 1 Tim 2:5, John 3:17-18, John 20:31, 1 John 5:13)
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To: Vn_survivor_67-68
If you want to read more about how the power crisis was engineered, and by whom, consider this lengthy post. The NRDC is the big player, a principal backer of both Gray Davis and Arnold Schwarzenegger.

The first law of politics: Nothing big and bad goes on for very long unless both sides are dirty.

193 posted on 07/05/2006 7:59:29 AM PDT by Carry_Okie (There are people in power who are truly evil.)
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To: shalom aleichem
Your web site shows Ken Lay to have contributed a great deal more to the Republicans then to Dems. I read before Enron had a near split on donations to both parties. That is interesting.
194 posted on 07/05/2006 7:59:46 AM PDT by Steve Van Doorn (*in my best Eric cartman voice* “I love you guys”)
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To: CFC__VRWC

To tell you the truth, I wouldn't be surprised if this was Arkancide. Remember who was President when Enron's crimes were happening!


195 posted on 07/05/2006 7:59:51 AM PDT by thoughtomator (Famous last words: "what does Ibtz mean?")
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To: wagglebee
They didn't flee for the same reason that they did the actions which led to the need to flee: they thought that they were the smartest guys in the room (any room) and could get away with anything. They could talk or intimidate anybody into anything. They were masters of the universe.

Skilling is the consummate conniver and thinks long range. He would have had an escape plan if escape became necessary -- fake ID & passport, money in foreign banks, residence in another country, etc.

You can see by the look on his face that he doesn't anticipate going to prison and thinks that he hasn't lost yet, this is just round one.
196 posted on 07/05/2006 8:01:08 AM PDT by Iwo Jima ("Close the border. Then we'll talk.")
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To: ElRushbo

Good riddance to bad rubbish.


197 posted on 07/05/2006 8:01:10 AM PDT by Truth-The Anti Spin
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To: VegasCowboy

I agree- that's what "Consipiracy of Fools" led me to believe also, however, these CEO's job is to keep the other captains under their tow and to keep them honest- after they let Fastow in the cookie jar the first time, it was game over.

God keep his family and their remaining holdings.

OT: Otherwise, I'd still be attending Astros games at Enron Field ( although i LOVE Minute Maid Park... )
It's better and more comfortable than BOTH stadiums in New York !


198 posted on 07/05/2006 8:01:34 AM PDT by foldspace (Tom Delay is NOT a criminal)
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To: JFC
"Why does Drudge always give reports and not make sure they are correct.

Because his business is sensationalized gossip. Real news reporting is an afterthought and coincidence for Matt.
199 posted on 07/05/2006 8:01:41 AM PDT by Liberty Valance (Keep a simple manner for a happy life)
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To: Inspectorette
Lay and his cohorts were dumping their stock at the end, but the employees were not allowed to sell theirs

Employees were allowed to sell their vested shares, same as management.

Lay actually did not sell 5 million shares he owned - he sold less than 12% of his holdings.

He apparently went into the bankruptcy still believing in Enron stock, since he had sold so little of his vast holdings.

200 posted on 07/05/2006 8:01:49 AM PDT by wideawake ("The nation which forgets its defenders will itself be forgotten." - Calvin Coolidge)
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